IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 31 August 2008   (all times are UTC)

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02:53
<paase>
moin,
02:55
I need help, my thinclient hav' a ATI Grafikcard, but it isn't load, looks like VESA
02:56
<Ryan52>
so you want to force it to use a certain driver?
02:56
you can set XSERVER in your lts.conf
02:57
<paase>
@ubuntu7.10 lts.con in /opt/ltsp or in /var/tftpboo/......
02:57
<Ryan52>
I haven't a clue
02:58
updatedb && locate lts.conf
02:58
<paase>
XSERVER=ati ?
03:00
<Ryan52>
ya.
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03:01
<paase>
lts.conf in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/ and /usr/share/edubuntu-artwork/lts.conf and /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
03:01
<Ryan52>
it's in 2 of the places. nice. :|
03:03
<paase>
[00:0b:6a:87:88:85]
03:03
XSERVER=ati
03:08
man,, my english is so teribal, how can i see is the module loaded
03:09
lsmod | grep ati shows nothing
03:09
<Nubae1>
stgraber: I've installed edubuntu-docs
03:09
what should it be installing exactly and where?
03:11
<Ryan52>
paase: thats not the kernel module
03:11
paase: thats the xorg driver
03:11
paase: so look in X logs, I guess...
03:13
<Nubae1>
paase: actually, to update in realtime without having to redo the image, edit a file called lts.conf under /var/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/
03:13
and put the lines Ryan52 mentioned
03:14
that should be /var/lib/tftpboot/.....
03:15
<paase>
ok, i've edited both in /opt/ltsp and in /var/lib/tftpb.... in Xorg.log is nothing about ati
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03:15
<Nubae1>
u checking local xorg
03:15
on the thin client itself?
03:16
<paase>
who is the xorg.log on client?
03:16
<Nubae1>
the lts.conf file must have [default] as the first line followed by carriage return
03:16
or will not work
03:16
just one of those things
03:17
under default put xserver=<x-driver-u-want>
03:17
u just need to resst
03:17
restart thin client
03:18
to make sure its being loaded... search the docs for how to set a second screen as terminal, so u can then login and check the logs
03:19
also, disable from /var/lib/tftpboot/..../pxelinux.cfg/default the lines that say quiet and splash
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03:19
<Nubae1>
should give u more info as the terminal loads uo
03:19
up
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03:19
<paase>
the pxe..conf is verbose, there is a small error before X starting
03:20* Nubae1 goes to get cigarettes
03:20
<Nubae1>
what error?
03:20
<paase>
@tty1 is module-detect i think is for the soundcard
03:23
c u later
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03:54
<johnny>
hmm.. who's about?
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07:19
<higgo>
hi all
07:20
anyone out there, can help out with a noob ltsp q?
07:22
hello????
07:23
<laga>
just ask
07:24
<higgo>
thanks
07:24
Problem: Client gets it ip... starts to boot fine and then hangs while booting
07:24
I am wondering if there is a log file I can look at... and/or any suggestions.
07:26
It hangs on the splash screen... Ubuntu 8.04
07:27
<laga>
remove "quiet splash" in /var/lib/tftpboot/*/pxelinuc.xfg
07:27
remove "quiet splash" in /var/lib/tftpboot/*/pxelinux.cfg
07:28
<higgo>
thanks... will give that a go, much appreciated.... But on a general note, does the server log the activity anywhere?
07:28
<laga>
look around in /var/log, eg /var/log/daemon.log
07:29
<higgo>
thanks... had a look through /var/log but didn't check daemon
07:46
hmmm.... I tried that still with no success, After booting for a while, processes starting, it seemed like it was about to start x and then presented with a blank screen... flashing cursor only :(, could it be that in the server I have a nvidia card installed, and it's compiled into the kernel and when the client boots it's trying to use those display drivers?
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08:27
<petre>
warren, ping
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09:32
<warren>
petre: pong
09:33
<petre>
in the README, do we still need the step of deleting the link to the README from /etc/skel?
09:34
Is it in there so that the fedora user gets it upon bootup?
09:36
<warren>
oh, since we will be installing it with a RPM, it would be
09:36
rpm -e packagename
09:36
<petre>
won't that remove the README entirely?
09:37
<warren>
yes
09:38
we can say "if you don't need this anymore, rpm -e"
09:38
<petre>
is the fedora user created at boot time? Is that why the link is in /etc/skel in the first place?
09:42
<warren>
fedora user exists only in runtime of the live image
09:42
not after the live image is installed
09:43
<petre>
right; I'm just trying to understand why the link exists in /etc/skel in the first place
09:44
<warren>
ah
09:44
/etc/skel contains stuff that is copied to a user's homedir when it is created.
09:44
so that's the only way we can make this appear on the Desktop
09:44
I can make the doc RPM remove itself from /usr/share/* and /etc/skel during removal.
09:45
<petre>
so, the fedora user IS created when the live image is booted, right?
09:46
I think we ought to keep the readme, perhaps for root
09:46
but I haven't done a full install to disk yet
09:47
I just dislike the idea of throwing away any documentation for the user
09:47
<warren>
well, after the user has done this process, what is left?
09:47
is this document still useful?
09:48
<petre>
I think so.
09:48
<warren>
petre: I suppose they don't need to uninstall the document. They could instead rm /etc/skel/Desktop/Whatever Name.desktop to prevent it from appearing on the desktops of all users.
09:48
<petre>
right, I'll just leave that step in then.
09:49
so, the fedora user is created when the image boots the first time?
09:52
<warren>
yes
09:52
but
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09:52
<warren>
there is no fedora user after install
09:52
<petre>
the install is just a regular install plus the ltsp bits, right?
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09:58
<warren>
yes
09:59
petre: and the /opt/ltsp/i386 that is built during creation of the live image
10:00
In other news
10:01
We have come to an agreement to purchase k12linux.* at an undisclosed price.
10:01
Fedora Art team is working on a few possibilities for a new K12Linux logo and LDM theme.
10:01
<petre>
cool!
10:01
<warren>
I've seen hand drawn mockups
10:01
the list will see a few options soon
10:05
let's see
10:05
other news...
10:05
November 6th is the next hackfest in Maine
10:06
<petre>
November 6? woohoo! Much easier for me to make!
10:06
<warren>
Eric Harrison and I are going to Japan for October 18th
10:06
<petre>
also, hotel is cheaper
10:06
<warren>
yes, cheaper
10:06
although transportation to get there kind of sucks
10:06
lots and lots of driving
10:06
<petre>
that's the case no matter the date
10:07
I think it's only 2-3 hours from Bangor, right?
10:07
<warren>
something like that
10:07
I'm driving up from BOS
10:07
because I live near BOS
10:08
<petre>
oh, right; when you mentioned Eric, my frame of reference shifted to the west coast
10:09
<jammcq>
it's only about 50 minutes from Bangor
10:09
3hrs from portland ME
10:09
5 hrs from boston
10:09
<petre>
jammcq, will you drive from MI?
10:09
<jammcq>
not sure yet
10:09
i've gone it a couple times
10:10
<warren>
how long is the drive from MI?
10:10
<jammcq>
from home to SW Harbor is something like 12 hrs
10:10
<warren>
hmm you know what
10:10
<jammcq>
but I have a customer in rochester NY that I can stop at
10:10
<warren>
I didn't ask for a budget for this November hackfest
10:10
hmm
10:10
<jammcq>
budget?
10:10
how much budget do you need?
10:11
<warren>
only a few hundred
10:11
I just realized I forgot. Like they will give it to me.
10:11
Likely
10:12
<petre>
has the hotel been notified?
10:13
<jammcq>
petre: yeah, we haven't confirmed the exact dates, but they know we're coming
10:14
<petre>
well, Nov. 6 is a much better weekend for me than Oct. 30
10:15
<warren>
i'm glad it is after the general election
10:15
I'll be done partying after the huge Green party victory.
10:16
<petre>
yes, I get my wife back after the election, she's gone a lot in the weeks right beforehand
10:17
warren, what's in Japan, besides the Japanese I mean
10:17
?
10:19
<warren>
petre: launch of a pilot project, potentially 20k thin clients
10:19
<petre>
wow
10:19
<Nubae>
20k thin clients... niiice
10:19
<petre>
in schools? or public? or business?
10:20
<warren>
yes.
10:20
mostly schools
10:20
some public places
10:20
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=444552
10:20
<Nubae>
thats really good news, anywhere one can follow the progress?
10:20
<warren>
Aside from that other stuff, I really hope we can fix this bug before the release of K12Linux.
10:21
Nubae: not really, and this is a tiny deployment compared to Debian LTSP in Spain, hundreds of thousands.
10:21
Nubae: there are already a few thousand scattered around America
10:21
<Nubae>
eh.... where in Spain? As I live there
10:22
I've done a tiny rollout in comparison, 200 thin clients... but its been sort of a pilot, leading to other stuff
10:22
<warren>
Sadly the people responsible for that component are uninterested in working on it.
10:22
<Nubae>
in Southern Spain
10:22
<warren>
Nubae: hmm.... I don't know the details too well. vagrant knows.
10:23
<Nubae>
warren: I've started ripping apart the old edubuntu handbook and making it OS independent
10:23
<warren>
are you working with that ltsp doc team?
10:23
a new launchpad group was created
10:23
<Nubae>
not to difficult, but would need some help on the fedora specifics
10:23
<warren>
people interested to work on it should probably talk with each other
10:23
do you actually use fedora?
10:23
<Nubae>
well, so far I found no action
10:24
so just went ahead and am working without launchpad
10:24
yes... am responsible for part of XS server
10:24
for the xos
10:24
not LTSP unfortunately... but know fedora 7 and 9 quite well as a consequence
10:25
^^ XS server = OLPC
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10:25
<Nubae>
anyway, I started looking for an official way to publish something in terms of documentation via launchpad
10:26
but its a mess...
10:26
theres edubuntu cookbook, handbook, ltsp docs
10:26
also, I haven't seen ANY action in terms of documentation for months... but correct me if I'm wrong and point me in the right direction please
10:27
<warren>
um..
10:27
are you on ltsp-developer list?
10:27
you might want to ask
10:27
<petre>
jammcq, you mentioned a few years ago that someone was working on a dead trees book for ltsp; was that the TuxLab folks in South Africa or someone else?
10:28
<warren>
Nubae: there is no suitable thing going on, you might need to JUST DO IT
10:28
<Nubae>
ah... one question... does Red Hat offer paid support for LTSP?
10:28
<warren>
Nubae: no.
10:28
<Nubae>
thats what I´m doing
10:28
once its done, Ill upload and we can always merge with other stuff if it exists
10:28
but thzis needs doing now
10:28
at least for my project
10:29
hmm... what about Novell?
10:29
is it just Canonical?
10:29
<warren>
Nubae: could you please ask this stuff later? we're trying to do our fedora meeting.
10:29
<Nubae>
ok, sorry...
10:29* Nubae shuts up :-()
10:30
<warren>
So is anyone aware of other bugs we need to fix to make Fedora LTSP5 fully in parity with Ubuntu?
10:31
<petre>
sound still doesn't work on my Dell Latitude clients, but I haven't looked at the problem for a few weeks
10:32
I can't remember if Ubuntu has the same problem or not
10:32
I mention it just as a heads up on some sound chips not being automatically recognized
10:33
<warren>
I have seen a few sound chips where it didn't work
10:34
petre: does plain fedora sound work on that box?
10:34
petre: sound not working would be kernel bugs, not LTSP
10:34
<petre>
on the Latitude? I think so
10:35
had to twiddle a bit in ltsp 4.2 to get it to work
10:36
sbalneaves & gadi helped me with that a year or two ago
10:36
<warren>
I'd hate to disappoint, but when I say "bugs" I pretty much exclude individual chip problems
10:36
I'm talking about problems that effect everyone
10:36
what you are describing is most definitely a problem with the kernel itself
10:37
<petre>
right, and since I haven't done the necessary homework on the problem I hesitate to bring it up, but just thought I'd mention it
10:37
<warren>
OK, I need to get back to work.
10:38
well.. first food
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11:08
<jammcq>
petre: which model latitude are you having trouble with?
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13:04
<petre>
jammcq, I've got a few different models, mostly C600 I think
13:04
P3s, 600-900mhz
13:04
<jammcq>
hmm
13:05
i've got a D630 that's been nothing but trouble
13:06
but that's not using LTSP. just trying to use ubuntu-hardy in general
13:06
<petre>
as I recall from 4.2, the kernel recognized it, but then there was a file in etc/ that mislabeled it pci wise
13:06
(which is probably so vague a description as to be useless)
13:06
<jammcq>
yeah, my problem is I need my laptop for work, I don't have a lot of troubleshooting time
13:06
<warren>
I don't knmow about 4.2
13:06
but modern fedora relies entirely on kernel
13:06
nothing in /etc
13:07
<petre>
yeah, 4.2 was a custom kernel for the clients, so to speak
13:07
<jammcq>
but even out in portland, when I booted fedora on my laptop, it had strange bhaviour
13:08
so yesterday, I went back to Gutsy and so far, it's back to working normally
13:08
problem is, it takes a long time to move into a laptop setup, getting all the packages installed and configured just the way you want it
13:08
<warren>
I dunno, we are really close to the upstream kernel
13:08
Oh
13:09
<petre>
I run Hardy at work but find it is less stable overall than gutsy
13:09
<warren>
Debian/Ubuntu uses weird non-upstream means to detect X stuff
13:09
<jammcq>
I suspect it's X things, not kernel
13:09
<warren>
I don't know if their kernel does something different
13:09
<jammcq>
so, I'll hang back a release and check out intrepid when it's released
13:09
or maybe fedora 10
13:10
<warren>
I'm sure both will be equally bad
13:10
or good
13:10
or both
13:10
<petre>
warren, do you know when the next rhel is due out?
13:10
<warren>
petre: not my department
13:10
<jammcq>
i'm pretty sure it's not a hardware problem, cuz my daughter has exactly the same laptop and I swapped harddrives, and the problem followed
13:10
<warren>
you can kind of guess based upon the past releases?
13:11
<petre>
right, but I can't remember when 5 came out
13:11
<warren>
what device has trouble?
13:11
<jammcq>
video and mouse
13:11
<warren>
might be related to almost none of the RH engineers having Dell
13:11
because Dell makes terrible machines
13:11
<jammcq>
video locks up
13:11
i've always loved my dells
13:11
<warren>
we're pretty much exclusively IBM/Lenovo
13:12
<petre>
I've had decent luck with Dells
13:12
<warren>
newer Dell laptops are less bad
13:12
<petre>
When I worked at Nextel we ran RHEL on Compaqs tho, company standard
13:12
<warren>
but they were freaking disasters back at my previous job
13:12
<jammcq>
this one is like 9 months old
13:12
<warren>
we had hundreds of them in three models across 6 years
13:12
NONE of them were reliable
13:12
we had to ship dozens of them back every month
13:13
<jammcq>
my experience before this one has been VERY bood
13:13
<petre>
we had a problem with some Dell servers years ago, so the CIO banned them from the data center
13:13
<jammcq>
and my servers are all dell
13:13
and i'm quite happy with them
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13:13
<petre>
but I've always had good luck with Dells
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13:14
<petre>
seem less proprietary than Compaqs
13:14
wireless linux on Compaq laptops never seems to work
13:15
<warren>
oh yes, Compaqs were worse.
13:16
<petre>
last three laptops I've bought have been Toshibas, seem to work well
13:16
Intel chips, so wireless and video work, not as flashy perhaps as nvidea chips, but no proprietary drivers needed
13:17
<stgraber>
hmm, most of newer HP Compaq are 100% intel and certified for Linux
13:17
<petre>
including laptops?
13:18
<stgraber>
only thing that's not Intel in my current lappy is the video card that's ATI but that's because I asked for it :)
13:18
my previous lappy (NX7400) was 100% intel
13:18
<petre>
how about wireless?
13:18
brb
13:18
<jammcq>
my dell is all intel
13:18
<stgraber>
intel 3945 for my previous lappy, intel 4965abgn for my current
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13:26
<petre>
warren, when you're testing the live iso, are you using some sort of virtual machine?
13:26
<warren>
petre: generally not, but it did work in one test
13:26
petre: I haven't rebuilt the ISO since Beta1 since we still haven't got fedora updates pushing yet. likely will fix that in the next day or two.
13:27
<petre>
I sometime boot it under qemu, but networking doesn't seem to work right
13:27
sometimes
13:28
<warren>
you need some manual (and not easy) configuration to make networking work in that scenario
13:30
<petre>
eth0 gets a 10.0.2.2 address, with a gw of 10.0.2.1, but nothing is connected to the machines real ethernet interfaces
13:31
so I can take screenshots, but I can't get them out of the machine :-(
13:31
have to boot from the usb stick for that
13:31
I was just looking for an easier way
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13:34
<warren>
petre: look at how ltsp-vmclient works
13:34
petre: you can use similar qemu syntax to connect the qemu to a bridge
13:34
petre: you can then scp stuff from it
13:35
<petre>
tx, I'll have a look
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15:18
<johnny>
hi
15:18
so who is really familiar with pulseaudio here?
15:19
if i have pulseaudio as started by ltsp-init-common, should i be able to be in the local console and be able to say.. play a file with mpg123 ?
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16:25
<johnny>
did somebody answer my pulse question before?
16:28
<cmoo92>
no
16:45
<johnny>
this channel is not as useful on the weekends
16:45
most people have dayjobs..
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17:18
<cmoo92>
silly people.
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23:00
<doesnotexist>
is there a documentation of ltsp in fedora?
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23:25
<cyberorg>
johnny, see the variables i required to play sound from localapp
23:25
on the ML few days back
23:29
<johnny>
huh?
23:29
i don't have a log of what i said?
23:30
<cyberorg>
" if i have pulseaudio as started by ltsp-init-common, should i be able to be in the local console and be able to say.. play a file with mpg123 ?"
23:30
<johnny>
aha
23:30
that one
23:31
that's more than a few days..
23:31* johnny uses the web interface
23:32
<johnny>
sf == slow
23:32
<cyberorg>
i think i sent a patch for that
23:32
<johnny>
a patch for sf?
23:32
lol
23:33
<cyberorg>
xrexecd.sh-audio-fix.patch
23:34
http://pastebin.com/d2e691308
23:35
<johnny>
uhmm.. i was not explicit enough
23:36
or did i not mention ?
23:36
that i was trying to do this in no way related to xrexecd
23:37
<cyberorg>
you want to play sound locally from a local console?
23:37
<johnny>
yes
23:37
well.. more so.. i was just asking if that should work
23:37
i tried, and i got permission errors..
23:37
<cyberorg>
so try "PULSE_SERVER=tcp:127.0.0.1:4713 ESPEAKER=127.0.0.1:160001 someplayer"
23:37
<johnny>
hmm..
23:38
<cyberorg>
it did not work for me without that
23:39
ogra mentioned that it should work even without it, but on my set up it doesnt
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23:42
<johnny>
cyberorg, perhaps that is because you don't have that in your local env but ubuntu does?
23:42
it seems i don't have that environment var set
23:42
<cyberorg>
johnny, yes possibly, i should add that to /etc/profile
23:43
<johnny>
well.. should the distro do it? or should ltsp, i guess that is the question
23:44
<cyberorg>
well pa setup in client is not exactly distro thing, it should work using local unix socket instead of these variables
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23:56
<johnny>
well.. distros often work around problems in upstream programs to make things easier for users iirc? :)
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