IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 29 May 2012   (all times are UTC)

00:01
<vagrantc>
alright, ltsp-config dnsmasq is working, as long as there isn't a conflicting file already present.
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00:03
<rhorstkoetter>
vagrantc: just in case you need it at some point in time. the solution seems to be http://www.linfo.org/etc_skel.html - I remembered /etc/skel from knoppix times and will now play with it
00:04
seems to me that setting up one user and then copy the configuration to /etc/skel should provide the very same desktop to user 2,3,4,5
00:04
<vagrantc>
rhorstkoetter: /etc/skell only applies to newly created users ...
00:05
rhorstkoetter: if you decide you want different defaults at some later date, you'll have to change all the existing users mannually
00:05
<rhorstkoetter>
in ubuntu there even is a separate skeleton for the guest user account and that would imply that one may even provide several different skeletons for certain groups of users and with some scripting that may solve the "new users" issues
00:05
vagrantc: that's true
00:06
<vagrantc>
also, many configurations embed usernames in their configuration, so you can't simply copy a template user :(
00:06
<rhorstkoetter>
I try to be optimistic :p better a solution for new users but existing ones vs no solution for new+existing users
00:06
<vagrantc>
gconf and dconf both support global configuration
00:07
both are varyingly obtuse to use, but it's "the right way"
00:07
<rhorstkoetter>
thinking about it, you're right
00:07
just found out the right way to customize upstart jobs
00:07
one step forward
00:08
it's /etc/init/<service>.override
00:09
survives an update vs editing the default /etc/init/<service>.conf
00:09
adios network-manager ;)
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01:11
<vagrantc>
well, we might just see ltsp 5.4.x in debian this week.
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04:49
<alkisg>
'morning all
04:51* muppis yawns... Morning. :)
04:53
<muppis>
Slept only abou 5 hrs.. Long day at work yesterday.
05:04
<elias_a>
muppis: G'day.
05:06
<muppis>
elias_a, can't say day yet. Just turned Moccamaster on. :)
05:07
<elias_a>
muppis: well - in that case you will wake up in 4 minutes...
05:07
<muppis>
Hope so.
05:08
<elias_a>
Moccamaster, the Rolls Royce of coffee makers brews a full pot on 4 minutes :)
05:09
<muppis>
I know, but I'm sure that waking up part..
05:09
<elias_a>
That's why the brand is sure in teacher's rooms :)
05:09
muppis: Try to start your brain cells.
05:10
I have got them workin already. All three of them :P
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05:59
<mealstrom>
good morning
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06:59
<mealstrom>
hi, some one is using home direcories with nfs and rpc.idmapd? i dont know what guid should be on client \ server \ nfsserver to mounts properly
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07:06
<alkisg>
Yey, fixed the autogen.sh localapps/missing bug, building debian's LTSP in my PPA now...
07:06
<stratis>
alkisg kalimera xreiazome ta fota soy
07:06
<alkisg>
stratis: hello, let's go private
07:07
<muppis>
Oh dear..
07:07
<alkisg>
stratis: a new tab should now be opened on top of your browser, let's talk there
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08:01
<alkisg>
Cool, debian's ltsp built and installed successfully on Ubuntu, on to testing it... :)
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08:21
<alkisg>
...and, successful boot + login (after a few minor manual fixes that I'll commit today). Yey, ltsp-pnp is now upstream!
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08:44
<mealstrom>
how to speed up heavy application start on thin clients (12.04)?
08:45
any optimizations?
08:48
<muppis>
Localapp or normal at server?
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10:01
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: apt-get source ltsp-docs :)
10:01
lts.conf is generated from .xml docbook source
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10:04* Hyperbyte gives alkisg a confused look
10:04
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: lts.conf is part of the ltsp-docs package
10:04
If you get the package source, you'll see that it's not a plain text file but it's genereated from a Makefile
10:04
<Hyperbyte>
This is about lts.conf documentation, not about the lts.conf configuration file itself?
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10:04
<alkisg>
Yup
10:05
I.e. the `man lts.conf` manpage
10:05
<Hyperbyte>
Oh!
10:05
I thought someone had come up with the brilliant plan to migrate lts.conf into xml format.
10:05
<alkisg>
...brilliant? Are you nuts? Would you expect people to edit .xml files to configure ltsp? :P
10:06
Nah, I think that the next plan is to move the configuration in /etc/lts.conf.d as plain (shell) text files
10:06
<Hyperbyte>
... the Greek do have sarcasm, do they? :P
10:06
<alkisg>
...we invented it but personally I'm a bit slow :P
10:07
<Hyperbyte>
Ever since I've made a mandatory gconf profile with locked toolbars, applets, desktop, etc, I get chills down my spine when I see 'xml'
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10:18
<ogra_>
alkisg, uuuh, dropping getltscfg ?
10:18
<alkisg>
ogra_: hehe, only in the long term plans
10:18
<ogra_>
(the last remaining bit of code from ltsp4)
10:18
<alkisg>
For now we don't even touch it to remove the requirement for a [Default] section, or the syntax error about empty sections ;)
10:19
It's holy code ;)
10:19
<ogra_>
hha
10:19
*haha
10:19
<alkisg>
The server may send shell-sourceable files to each client, so in that case there wouldn't be need for getltscfg -a (which e.g. doesn't exist in the initramfs)
10:20
<ogra_>
yeah
10:20
<alkisg>
And getltscfg-cluster could then be merged as well
10:20* ogra_ likes shell config.d style setups :)
10:20
<alkisg>
And we already have a daemon (ldminfod), so why not reuse it for everything...
10:21
<ogra_>
btw, the next UDS is 100% confirmed to be in europe
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10:21
<ogra_>
so BTS in maine will be tricky
10:21
at least for all ubuntuers
10:22* alkisg probably can't make it to either events, my last chance was in the previous UDS and I missed it :(
10:22
<alkisg>
debconfs only in the future, which are in the summer (vacations)
10:22
<ogra_>
well, we could have BTS in greece :)
10:22
<alkisg>
Yey!
10:23
<ogra_>
you should talk to jim and scott about it
10:23
<alkisg>
I'll bring the chicks!
10:23
<ogra_>
haha
10:23
<alkisg>
Where in Europe (the UDS)? Has it been decided?
10:23* ogra_ wouldnt mind to be in greece in november instead of cold and snowy maine :)
10:24
<ogra_>
it isnt finalized so i cant talk about it
10:24
<alkisg>
Nah if you're coming to greece it has to be in the summer, LTSP BTS and with swimming suits :)
10:24
OK
10:24* alkisg proposed Crete, nicest beaches and bars, and modest prices
10:25* ogra_ only knows the greek north, cant judge about crete ...
10:27
<ogra_>
i had a dog that was picked up on the naxos beach for 18 years though :)
10:28
<alkisg>
Hehe did you manage to teach him german?
10:28* alkisg knows dogs that know more german than him :P
10:30
<ogra_>
no, but her poyfriend taught her ;)
10:30
*boy
10:30
she has born me the nicest greek/german hybrid puppies ;)
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11:10
<mealstrom>
how to speed up heavy application start on thin clients (not local apps, clients are old machines 12.04) ? any optimizarions ?
11:11
<Hyperbyte>
mealstrom, you asked that before, and muppis asked you a follow-up question for more information. I haven't seen your answer to that question yet.
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11:12
<Hyperbyte>
Wait stop hold the presses.
11:12
BTS in Europe?
11:14
<ogra_>
Hyperbyte, as a suggestion, yes
11:15
since many of us cant come if UDS is in europe (which it wasnt in the past for the oct/nov UDS)
11:20
<sha>
hi, I'm building LTSP on Ubuntu 12.04 and have a problem with the kernel commandline which is always generated when updating ltsp-client: everytime i have to manually edit /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default and set the missing IP in "nbdroot=:ltsp_i386". any hints how to define nbd server's ip so that the generated commandline is working without the need for manually editing?
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11:23
<alkisg>
sha: put BOOTPROMPT_OPTS="quiet splash nbdroot etc etc" in $CHROOT/etc/ltsp/update-image.conf and then run sudo chroot $CHROOT /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels
11:23
!bootprompt_opts
11:23
<ltsp>
alkisg: Error: "bootprompt_opts" is not a valid command.
11:23
<alkisg>
!BOOTPROMPT_OPTS
11:23
<ltsp>
alkisg: Error: "BOOTPROMPT_OPTS" is not a valid command.
11:23
<sha>
alkisg: BOOTPROMPT_OPTS overrides the whole commandline?
11:23
<alkisg>
sha: most of it, except for the vmlinuz ro initrd part
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11:25
<alkisg>
!learn BOOTPROMPT_OPTS as To define a different command line for your clients, put BOOTPROMPT_OPTS="root=/dev/nbd0 init=/sbin/init-ltsp quiet splash plymouth:force-splash vt.handoff=7" in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ltsp/update-kernels.conf, and run sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels; sudo ltsp-update-kernels
11:25
<ltsp>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
11:25
<alkisg>
!BOOTPROMPT_OPTS
11:25
<ltsp>
alkisg: BOOTPROMPT_OPTS: To define a different command line for your clients, put BOOTPROMPT_OPTS="root=/dev/nbd0 init=/sbin/init-ltsp quiet splash plymouth:force-splash vt.handoff=7" in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ltsp/update-kernels.conf, and run sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels; sudo ltsp-update-kernels
11:25
<sha>
ok thank you, i'll give it a try... i saw bootprompt_opts somewhere, but thought i'd then have nbdroot twice in the generated commandline
11:30
<mealstrom>
Hyperbyte: i said that with out local apps. On server side .
11:30
<sha>
omg i didn't realize the parameters are already defined in the file... i thought it's for specifying additional parameters
11:30
alkisg: thank you very much
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11:31
<alkisg>
np
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11:32
<iku_>
hii
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11:32
<iku_>
someone here?
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11:33
<iku_>
i have not solved problem with ltsp booting with nfs
11:33
<sha>
alkisg: but honestly i don't understand the 'sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels' part ... besides, i don't have /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels. is 'sudo ltsp-update-kernels' not sufficient?
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11:35
<sha>
... that was wrong
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11:35
<iku_>
u have to update the kernel in chroot when u modify an kernel behaviour.
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11:36
<sha>
got it, thanks again.
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11:37
<alkisg>
!ltsp-pnp
11:37
<ltsp`>
alkisg: ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is a beta-quality alternative to ltsp-server, which focuses on ease of maintainance (no chroots involved!) and speed rather than tight security. More info: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
11:37
<iku_>
someone can boot an nfs exported filessyetem without the error on line 47 /etc/hosts no writable?
11:38
<alkisg>
!ltsp-pnp
11:38
<ltsp`>
alkisg: ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is a beta-quality alternative to ltsp-server, which focuses on ease of maintainance (no chroots involved!) and speed rather than tight security. More info: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
11:38
<alkisg>
!forget ltsp-pnp
11:38
!learn ltsp-pnp as ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
11:38
!ltsp-pnp
11:38
iku_: distro/version?
11:38
<ltsp`>
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
11:38
alkisg: The operation succeeded.
11:38
alkisg: ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
11:39
<iku_>
ltsp 5.2 ubuntu 10.04
11:39
<alkisg>
iku_: and you switched to NFS? Ubuntu uses NBD by default...
11:42
<Hyperbyte>
mealstrom, so basically, an application starts slow on the server?
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11:43
<iku__>
sry blue screen :P
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11:43
<iku__>
yes, uses nbd by default
11:44
but i thnik is more easy to managa chroot than build an image every time you make any change
11:45
<ogra_>
do you make changes that often ?
11:45
<iku__>
also when i build the clients image, ltsp do an perfect server image
11:46
<ogra_>
after your initial setup ?
11:46
<iku__>
in testing enviroment yes
11:46
<ogra_>
no,i8 mean in production
11:46
<iku__>
sry for my english
11:46
<ogra_>
once you have set up all clients bits to support your HW there is really no reason to update the image
11:47
<iku__>
yes, but the image that ltsp builds do a copy of the server i thought is better chroot clients
11:48
<ogra_>
how do you mean "a copy of the server" ?
11:48
the image is rolled from the chroot in /opt
11:48
that has (and shouldnt have) no server bits
11:49
<iku__>
no chroot dont any server service
11:49
<ogra_>
right and the image is built from there
11:50
so i dont understand what you mean by "the image that ltsp builds do a copy of the server"
11:50
<Hyperbyte>
ogra_, I think he might be talking about ltsp-pnp.
11:51
<iku__>
no
11:51
<alkisg>
ltsp-pnp isn't published yet
11:51
<ogra_>
Hyperbyte, ah, i havent looked at that yet
11:51
<alkisg>
iku__: when you login with LTSP, you are at your server
11:51
That's why you see the server applications
11:51
<Hyperbyte>
Ah.
11:51
<alkisg>
It's not different if you use NFS
11:51
(or nx, or vnc)
11:51
<Hyperbyte>
vnc++
11:51
<alkisg>
iku__: please read the LTSP docs to learn about how LTSP works
11:51
!docs
11:51
<ltsp`>
alkisg: docs: For the most current documentation, see https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
11:52
<ogra_>
iku__, imagine the thin clients (and their image/chroot) as a tool that just enables an additional kbd/mouse/monitor of your server
11:52
<sha>
i really think i miss some documentation which i couldn't find yet... for example, ltspfs. i'm trying to use an usb-stick with ltspfs and lxde, so far i found /usr/share/doc/ltspfs/examples/notify ... according to some archived mails i found with google i should put that script in /opt/ltsp/<arch>/etc/ltspfs/mounter.d/ , but nothing happens. is this the correct path?
11:52
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, vnc is so awesome over internet. Yesterday I remote controlled our music playout system from our broadcast location, for seven hours, over 3G. Performance was superb, and I used up about 150 MB bandwith doing so.
11:52
<ogra_>
the *session* after login is actually running on the server
11:52
<iku__>
then why i cant login with a user in the chroot?
11:53
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: nx is waaaaaay better than vnc :)
11:53
<ogra_>
iku__, the chroot has no users enabled, it is just for getting the thin client HW to act as extensions of the server
11:53
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, how much bandwith does it use for seven hours remote controlling? :)
11:53
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: I haven't measured, but I guess less than half of what vnc uses
11:54
iku__: a quick way to get the idea is to imagine ltsp clients like "windows 98" machines that use remote desktop to connect to your "windows 2008" ltsp server.
11:55
<iku__>
i think i understand u
11:57
ok
11:59
then for use chroot's without login in the server(like remote desktop), how i do to log a client in the chroot's? i tested to create a differents users....build a kiosk(that create a user "ltspkiosk" on chroot) but anything work
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12:00
<ogra_>
iku__, you want to run a full diskless desktop on the client instead of remotely logging in to the server ?
12:01
<iku__>
yesss
12:01
kmaybe my enclish expression isnt good sry :P
12:01
<alkisg>
iku__: please explain why, so that we can help you better
12:02
<iku__>
ok
12:02
i will try my better
12:03
i want to run client desktops that can connect with a citrix xenapp
12:03
i thought ltsp will be an interesting idea
12:04
<alkisg>
Can you connect to a citrix xenapp from a normal (non-ltsp) ubuntu installation?
12:05
<iku__>
yes
12:05
the only thing u have to do is install citrix reciever
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12:06
<iku__>
and have acces to that citrix xenapp
12:06
<alkisg>
Then just install the citrix receiver in your ltsp server
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12:07
<alkisg>
When you're more familiar with LTSP, you may be able to create a "screen script" for citrix xenapp so that you don't have to login to the ltsp server first
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12:08
<iku__>
i have already do it, i install citrix reciever on the chroot's
12:10
but im not able to log a client without be in the server (like remote dektop)
12:10
i dont want that :P
12:12
<alkisg>
You need to learn more about LTSP before you can make a screen script that does what you want
12:12
<mealstrom>
Hyperbyte: sory for late answers. but yes. applications starts slowly on server. Im using this architect: NAS server - > nfsmount home to ltsp server -> thin clients.
12:12
<alkisg>
It's not hard, but you need to learn about how LTSP works and also a bit of shell programming
12:13
<iku__>
ok thanks for help
12:14
<ogra_>
once you have such a script it would be good to get it included in the code though :)
12:14
<iku__>
yes....of course
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12:14
<alkisg>
We already have screen scripts for xfreerdp, rdesktop etc that connect to windows 2008 servers without login first
12:15
But noone has made a citrix xenapp script yet
12:16
<Guest89113>
Hi, i'm running a Debian LTSP-Server. My client is a neoware ca2 thin client. My problem is that the graphic jerks hard. on other clients i don't have this problem. I'm confused, because I thought the graphic processing occurs oh the host
12:17
<alkisg>
What does "jerks hard" mean exactly?
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12:19
<ogra_>
it makes the monitors jump ?
12:19
:)
12:20
<Hyperbyte>
mealstrom, and I assume if you log in using the monitor and keyboard attached to the server, the applications also start slow?
12:21
<Guest89113>
@alkisg : for example when I click on a button, the actions follows with some delay
12:22
no, on the server it runs perfect
12:22
<alkisg>
!directx
12:22
<ltsp`>
alkisg: directx: If you want to turn off encryption to the workstation, which will speed up performance at the cost of security, you need to specify LDM_DIRECTX=True in your lts.conf file. Type !docs in IRC to get a link to the current documentation
12:23
<alkisg>
Guest89113: try that to see if it improves things for you ^
12:23
<Guest89113>
oh okay, thank you!
12:23
<iku__>
!docs
12:23
<ltsp`>
iku__: docs: For the most current documentation, see https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
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12:24
<ogra_>
iku__, in most distros there also exists an ltsp-docs package
12:25
<Guest89113>
will try that. so, security encryption needs performance of the client CPU?
12:25
<ogra_>
on both sides, yes
12:27
<Guest89113>
thanks:)
12:27
<ogra_>
what kind of clients are that (HW specs)
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12:28
<Guest89113>
CPU: VIA 800 MHz, RAM: 64 MB 133 Mhz
12:29
10/100Mbit Network
12:29
<ogra_>
uuuh, 64M is pretty low
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12:30
<Guest89113>
is there a way to optimize something?
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12:31
<ogra_>
you can cut down functionallity and use a lighter desktop etc
12:31
<mealstrom>
Hyperbyte: cant do that. ill try to run them via vnc. thank for idea
12:31
<ogra_>
i think alkisg runs 64M thin clients, he should be able to help once he is back
12:32
<Guest89113>
all right
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13:07
<Guest89113>
is there a forum where I can post my question? the german one isn't up to date
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13:41
<alkisg>
Sweet... I counted 10 minutes for Ubuntu installation, and another 10 for `ltsp-update-image --cleanup /` to create the fat image with all the server apps etc. Sending a mail to the ltsp-discuss list...
13:43
<markit>
alkisg: do you mean it is slow?
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13:43* markit spends usually much more to install kubuntu
13:43
<alkisg>
markit: no, I mean that you can setup an LTSP lab in 20 minutes, which is very fast and cool
13:43
<markit>
ah, ok :))
13:44
<alkisg>
On faster servers (I just have a 3 year old laptop) it should be even faster
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13:45
<markit>
it takes a lot of time to grab packages from internet, I install a lot of additional (educational) programs. Yes, I've setup apt-cache-ng now to ease the pain (and works fine!)
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13:50
<alkisg>
Fortunately ltsp-pnp does not require internet connectivity, it just reuses the server disk contents
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14:00
<markit>
alkisg: I've just discovered https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp something to have a look at, or there are important things unfinished so better wait a bit longer?
14:00
<alkisg>
markit: I've just tested it and found no problems,
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14:00
<alkisg>
so while it might not be 100% ready for production yet, without testing it would never be :)
14:00
<markit>
good, I was curious about it, but did not wanted to waste your time asking a step by step guide... but since you already wrote it... :)
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15:05
<mealstrom1>
how to check if ltsp_localapps_whitelist is working? or just localapps loads on client machine ?
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15:07
<Hyperbyte>
mealstrom:
15:08
!localxterm
15:08
<ltsp`>
Hyperbyte: localxterm: Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually run on the server. However, if in a client you run 'ltsp-localapps xterm', a local xterm will open, and any commands that you enter there will be executed locally on the client.
15:08
<Hyperbyte>
!forget localxterm
15:08
<ltsp`>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
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15:09
<Hyperbyte>
!learn localxterm as Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually run on the server, not on the client itself. If you want to open programs on a client, you can type 'ltsp-localapps <program>' in a run dialog or in a terminal. For example, 'ltsp-localapps xterm' to open a terminal running locally on the client.
15:09
<ltsp`>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
15:09
<Hyperbyte>
!forget localxterm
15:09
<ltsp`>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
15:10
<Hyperbyte>
!learn localxterm as Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually runs on the server, not on the client itself. If you want to open a program on the client locally, you can type 'ltsp-localapps <program>' in a run dialog or in a terminal. For example, 'ltsp-localapps xterm' to open a terminal running on the client.
15:10
<ltsp`>
Hyperbyte: The operation succeeded.
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15:14
<mealstrom>
Hyperbyte: tnx. ive find out. forget to set up LOCAL_APPS_MENU
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15:16
<epoptes_user9>
Hello! I need help with epoptes!... I have an LTSP network (3 pcs) and at the same time a regular network with 18 pc, the problem is that i dont know how
15:16
to connect them
15:16
with epoptes
15:16
any suggesstions???
15:17
I am new with this
15:17
topic
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15:24
<bieb>
have an odd one.. new install of 12.04.. was able to login this morning prior to doing some work on cups/setting up our printers. After running ltsp-update-image, I can't login. When I tail syslog http://pastebin.com/1W8Yu9L9
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15:34
<markit>
epoptes_user7: have you raed the install instruction carefully?
15:34
epoptes_user7: ah, you want to connect the other pc... mmm
15:34
epoptes_user7: both on the same lan?
15:35
ltsp and "regular" PC are on the same network?
15:35
ltsp server I mean
15:37
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i see a few cleanup.d commits ... is it basically working?
15:38
<bieb>
have an odd one.. new install of 12.04.. was able to login this morning prior to doing some work on cups/setting up our printers. After running ltsp-update-image, I can't login. When I tail syslog http://pastebin.com/1W8Yu9L9
15:44
<vagrantc>
alkisg: won't have a chance to test today, just curious
15:44
it's been fun playing tag-team on ltsp-trunk lately :)
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16:49
<servercbe>
Hello, I am using a core i3, 6Gb RAM, 400 Gb Rom, Edubuntu 12.04 running with LTSP and conected to an other LAN (not LTSP) BUT!, I cant connect the other PC to my server
16:49
What should I do?
16:50
I was following the step on epoptes.org...
16:50
Any help????
16:50
Please
16:51
hello???????
16:51
hello?
16:52
anybody there?
16:53
no body?
16:58
<muppis>
Hold your horses. Describe more you issue then someone can and will help you.
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18:09
<markit>
mmm kubuntu 12.04, I've removed networkmanager, set etc/network/interfaces, then I reboot, connectivity is ok but lasts only for 2-3 minutes, then does not work anymore even if interface is up
18:09
don't know if is a virtualization problem (KVM guest) or a 12.04 strange bug
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18:30
<bieb>
have an odd one.. new install of 12.04.. was able to login this morning prior to doing some work on cups/setting up our printers. After running ltsp-update-image, I can't login. When I tail syslog http://pastebin.com/1W8Yu9L9
18:30
<alkisg>
vagrantc: hi, sorry I was AFK. Yup, up an working fine here! :)
18:30
!ltsp-pnp
18:30
<ltsp`>
alkisg: ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
18:31
<alkisg>
vagrantc: we need to ship the lts.conf example
18:31
And also I changed 2 lines in debian/rules so that I bypass the autogen/missing problem:
18:32
<bieb>
hmmm an alternative ltsp huh?
18:32
<alkisg>
vagrantc: [ ! -f client/localapps/missing ] || $(MAKE) -C client/localapps clean
18:32
[ ! -f client/nbd-proxy/missing ] || $(MAKE) -C client/nbd-proxy clean
18:32
bieb: just another method to maintain ltsp, it doesn't involve different tools...
18:34
vagrantc: and, some other packaging-related notes: pulseaudio dependency, create /opt/ltsp from postinst or from debian/dirs, recommend: ltsp-docs, and in the default ldm theme the label is too small and the greek translation of "Password" doesn't fit
18:35
Other than those I saw no problems; I wasn't able to reproduce the userdel problem
18:35
<bieb>
alkisg: so if I am making crossover available.. it would be installed prior to the ltsp install?
18:36
<alkisg>
bieb: it doesn't matter, if you add software later on you can just re-run ltsp-update-image --cleanup /, it only takes about 10 minutes
18:37
<bieb>
alkisg: interesting.. as you can see I am having an image issue, just trying to see if this might make my life easier
18:38
<vagrantc>
alkisg: not so sure that's the appropriate workaround for the missing makefiles.
18:38
<alkisg>
bieb: sorry I didn't read about your problem, so I don't know if ltsp-pnp will make your life easier or not
18:38
vagrantc: it probably isn't; I just did it so that I can tell launchpad to build from trunk + your packaging without uploading anything
18:38
But it shouldn't be much worse than checking for the Makefile...
18:38
<bieb>
alkisg: you can take a look at the pastebin.. its only about 8 lines from syslog
18:38
:D
18:39
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i wonder if i have the logic reversed.
18:39
alkisg: it should only call the makefile if it's present...
18:39
<alkisg>
vagrantc: maybe the makefile is present and "missing" isn't...
18:40
<bieb>
alkisg: other than working on cups/printer setup.. I locked home dirs (chmod 770) so that students can't access other student's home dir
18:42
<mnevans>
Hello LTSP world. I am having trouble with displays: ubuntu 12.04 LTS.
18:43
The login screen seems to be stretched across an imaginary second display, so that you can't actually see the typing of userid and password.
18:43
My lts.conf is here: http://pastebin.com/bTFntcy8
18:43
<alkisg>
bieb: if you're talking about the nbd-disconnect error, that's normal, the client just mounts the image to see if a newer version is available, so that it prompts the user for a reboot
18:44
<mnevans>
my xorg.conf is here: http://pastebin.com/aTYj14kc
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18:45
<mnevans>
Displays are connected with vga connectors, amd hudson e350 APUs, 1920x1080 native screen resolution.
18:45
<alkisg>
mnevans: you don't need a xorg.conf to specify the driver, you can just use XSERVER=fglrx
18:45
mnevans: first, login, then run xrandr, and paste the output to pastebin
18:45
<bieb>
alkisg: when I try to login as a user, it seems to authenticate.. the login box goes away, leaving the login background, with the clock looking loader.. screen flashes black.. then drops right back to login prompt
18:45
<mnevans>
@alkisg (my hero), would that explain the phantom display?
18:46
<alkisg>
mnevans: no, that's a common ldm bug, and it can be solved with XRANDR_* lts.conf commands
18:46
<mnevans>
...I'll give it a try.
18:46
<alkisg>
bieb: sounds like an X failure then, e.g. compiz, unity-3d, nvidia drivers in the server, nomodeset, etc etc
18:46yalu has left IRC (yalu!~yalu@230.45-200-80.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be, Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
18:47
<bieb>
alkisg: just odd since I could login fine at 7:30.. then after working on cups and doing update image.. no longer able to login
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18:51
<mnevans>
@alkisg, this is not just a problem with ldm; it hoses any attempt to use lxde, for instance, as any prompt or window appears on the imaginary display, which is impossible to see.
18:51
<alkisg>
mnevans: yes, please paste the output of xrandr
18:56
<mnevans>
@alkisg, thanks, here is output from the console, which works fine: http://pastebin.com/HbrJ1NAN
18:57
<alkisg>
mnevans: the output of xrandr on the problematic client is needed, is that not possible toi get?
18:58
<bieb>
alkisg: is there a way for me to capture the screen when it goes black for the brief couple seconds to see if there is an error there? I have tried to hit "pause" on the keyboard to see if it would allow me any time to read the text
18:58
<mnevans>
Here is xrandr output from a terminal with the phantom display problem (fixed by choosing "mirrored" in Settings> Displays: http://pastebin.com/ArHxwGGm
18:59
I am okay on a 1440x990 display; not okay on the 1920x1080 22" display, okay on a 19: display running 4:3 aspect (the first pastebin I sent).
18:59
<alkisg>
mnevans: XRANDR_MODE_0="1920x1080", XRANDR_OUTPUT_0="DIsplayPort-0", XRANDR_MODE_1="1920x1080 --same-as DisplayPort0", XRANDR_OUTPUT_1="VGA-0"
19:00
Under a [mac:address] lts.conf section
19:00
<mnevans>
@alkisg, thanks, I can try that... let me see...
19:00
<alkisg>
bieb: tail the user's ~/.xsession-errors
19:00
mnevans: I missed a "-" at the last DisplayPort0
19:01
Don't forget to put it
19:02
<bieb>
tail -50 hbieber/.xsession-errors
19:02
<mnevans>
Alkisg: Thanks! got it. Will reboot the thin client now and see what happens.
19:02
<bieb>
lol
19:02
too many windows
19:05
alkisg: about how many lines would I need for a session? there is no time stamp on the lines in that file
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19:06
<bieb>
alkisg: If I try to login as a new user, the /.xsession-errors file is not created
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19:18
<bieb>
alkisg: I am able to login now.. it was permissions on the /home dir..
19:21
<mnevans>
Alkisg, I want to send you flowers - adding the xrandr information did the trick! Thank you. Althought I can't quite make out how you figured to do that.
19:21
<alkisg>
Haha, you're welcome :)
19:22
<mnevans>
I guess it was magic?
19:24
<alkisg>
It's just the proper xrandr commands to do the "mirror" that you did from gnome
19:25
<bieb>
how do I change programs in the unity launcher and push it aout to the clients?
19:26
<mnevans>
OK, I kind of see... Although I can't see why the "mirror" switch worked in the first place!
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19:29
<mnevans>
Over and out, thanks to you all, I very much appreciate this community!
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19:34dan__ is now known as Guest13235
19:34
<mealstrom>
hi, how does LOCAL_APPS_MENU=TRUE with LOCAL_APPS=TRUE works? say ive got skype installed in chroot and on server(12.04 both Ubuntus). When i run skype from Applications->internet->skype -- it starts on server, if i run it via ltsp-localapps `which skype` - it starts on ltsp-client host machine and all is ok.
19:36
<Guest13235>
Hello all :) today i changed from a 306m to x3650. and installed a new 10.04 LTSP on the 3650. it worked like a charm, and the one client that i currently uses boots as it i supposed to do. then i updated (and updated, and updated) so that i now have 12.04. i builded a new image, updated ssh, and updated image. restarted. but. the client dosent get past the boot splash screen. it does get ip, and so on.
19:36Guest13235 is now known as JensenDan
19:37
<JensenDan>
what to do now? :)
19:38
<alkisg>
!quiet-splash
19:38
<ltsp`>
alkisg: quiet-splash: to disable the splash screen in Ubuntu, in order to see any boot error messages, run `sudo gedit /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default` and remove quiet splash .
19:40
<JensenDan>
do i then need to update somthing?
19:40
yeah.. that dident work. so i do need to update somthing.. but what?
19:41
ofc.. that is in i386 dir.. updating image.
19:42
still showing splash?
19:44
<alkisg>
JensenDan: no, you don't need to update the image
19:44
<JensenDan>
no. i found out.. but then it has no effect.
19:45
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/951526
19:45
hitting esc has the same effect.. it shows
19:46
<alkisg>
JensenDan: if you modify pxelinux.cfg/default and it has no effect, you have another problem
19:46
E.g. another tftpboot/* subdir or another server or using nfs etc
19:46
<JensenDan>
sending discover < br> sending select for 192.168.0.21 <br > recieved dhcp nak
19:47
it just rools down the screen, again and again..
19:47
what is that? :)
19:48
<alkisg>
It probably means you have another dhcp server on your network that tells the client that this IP isn't valid
19:48
<mealstrom>
dhcp protocol conversation : DISCOVER -> OFFER -> REQUEST -> ACK (nack)
19:48
<JensenDan>
that sounds right..
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19:48
<JensenDan>
i do have another dhcp... but why wasent that a prob before?
19:49
<vagrantc>
alkisg: so "ltsp-config dnsmasq" worked great, unless i had another /etc/dnsmasq.d/foo with conflicting configuration
19:49
<mealstrom>
after first client DISCOVER --> every dhcp sends offer. and who sends first -- that gets client.
19:49
<vagrantc>
JensenDan: probably dumb luck
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19:50
<vagrantc>
and luck ran out
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19:50
<alkisg>
vagrantc: yeah but I don't think we can do anything about that... Btw I also corrected the silly examples+language problem, it was a typo
19:51* alkisg frequently writes {var+:foo} instead of {var:+foo} :(
19:51
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i got it working for me :)
19:52
<mealstrom>
what script uses this vartiable (LOCAL_APPS_MENU)?
19:52JensenDan has joined IRC (JensenDan!~dan@77.68.143.223)
19:52
<alkisg>
vagrantc: so now the top problems are the userdel problem on your installation (which I can't reproduce, I wonder if it's aufs, haven't tried that yet), and the lts.conf example
19:52
<JensenDan>
disconnecting the other dhcp from the network, dosent do any diffrence.
19:53
<alkisg>
So you're still getting a NAK?
19:53
<mealstrom>
JensenDan: you can make static IP for that host
19:54
<vagrantc>
alkisg: || true works around the userdel problem... and it does seem to successfully delete the user
19:54
alkisg: ugly, for sure...
19:54* alkisg tries with aufs...
19:55
<vagrantc>
alkisg: and i couldn't reproduce it on a booted thin client... which is at least somewhat of a similar environment
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19:55
<vagrantc>
should try with ext4 as the backend read-only fs.
19:55
<alkisg>
And, whenever you have some time to play with ${build-vars}, you could remove nfs-kernel-server from a dependency on ubuntu
19:55
<vagrantc>
right
19:56
alkisg: couldn't figure out how it's implemented on a per-package basis.
19:56
<JensenDan>
yes, still that nak
19:56
<alkisg>
JensenDan: search for yet another dhcp server
19:57
<JensenDan>
i know my system, it is a local system at my home :) running 2 x3650 and 2 x345. only the ltsp one is running dhcp, and the router..
19:58
oh and 2 ds4100 storage. but they have nothing to do with this.
19:58
<alkisg>
vagrantc: works fine with aufs too... I'll try with a debian/lxde installation when you upload a package in unstable
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19:58
<alkisg>
JensenDan: edit pxelinux.cfg/default again, and put this in a new line at the end of the file:
19:58
ipappend 3
19:59
Then reboot the client. If it works, it's a dhcp problem.
20:00
<JensenDan>
still NAK
20:00
<Mip>
Hey Gang - I'm setting up a new box for use with 12.04. Where's the best place for documentation of this new version?
20:00
<alkisg>
JensenDan: put your pxelinux.cfg/default to pastebin
20:00
!pastebin
20:00
<ltsp`>
alkisg: pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
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20:00
<JensenDan>
No lease, Failing. does it says at the very top of the esc screen.
20:01
it is just a total original file, exept that line you gave me.
20:01
<alkisg>
Please paste it though
20:02
<JensenDan>
http://pastebin.com/DiURZeQH
20:02
<alkisg>
JensenDan: ok, can you also paste your /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf ?
20:03
(remove the plymouth:force-splash part too to remove the splash screen)
20:03
<JensenDan>
http://pastebin.com/Q672W8mt
20:03
okay ;)
20:04
<alkisg>
        filename "/ltsp/amd64/pxelinux.0"; ==> are you modifying amd64 or i386?
20:04
I.e. /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/amd64/pxelinux.cfg/default
20:04
<JensenDan>
modyfing? what do you mean? i did majke a new image as i386 ?
20:04
to sec
20:04
i386
20:05
<alkisg>
Right, that's the problem
20:05
<JensenDan>
i need to edit the amd64 part to i386 in dhcp conf?
20:05
<alkisg>
So either modify the correct pxelinux.cfg/default or your dhpcd.conf, depending on what you want
20:05
<JensenDan>
in filename
20:05
<alkisg>
What chroot do you have? i386 or amd64?
20:06
<JensenDan>
the server is 64. clients are mixed.. thats why i386
20:06
<alkisg>
sudo sed 's/amd64/i386/' -i /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf; sudo restart isc-dhcp-server
20:06
(or service isc-dhcp-server restart, not sure if it has an upstart job)
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20:07
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i'll also try to re-test the segfault on userdel issue after rebooting the machine ... maybe it was just a fluke
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20:08
<JensenDan>
halt on loading please wait.. and then on to busybox.
20:08
<alkisg>
cat /proc/cmdline
20:08
<JensenDan>
me?
20:08
<alkisg>
Yes
20:08
On the client
20:09
<JensenDan>
yes?
20:09
<alkisg>
...and try to write the output here
20:11
<vagrantc>
now that we've got ltsp-trunk to a reasonably workable state ... the drive for pxemenus is rekindling
20:11
<JensenDan>
ro initrd=initrd.img root=/dev/nbd0 init=/sbin/init-ltsp playmouth:force-splash vt.handoff=7 nbdroot=:ltsp_i386 BOOT_IMAGE=wmlinuz ip=192.168.0.21:192.168.0.254:192-168-0-1:255.255.255.0 bootif=01-90-fb-a6-26-62-a6
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20:12
<JensenDan>
written in hand ^ ;D
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20:12
<alkisg>
JensenDan: ok so now it's not a dhcp problem anymore
20:12
<JensenDan>
wich means? :)
20:13
<alkisg>
JensenDan: is your nbd-server up and running? ps -fC nbd-server
20:13
or, sudo netstat -nap | grep 10809
20:13
<JensenDan>
UID PID PPID C STIME TTY TIME CMD
20:13
<alkisg>
sudo service nbd-server start
20:13
vagrantc: I really think we should postpone that for wheezy+1
20:14
Or at least after wheezy is out, and you could put it in the backports
20:14
<JensenDan>
nbd-server.
20:14
was the output of the last start thing
20:14
<alkisg>
JensenDan: ok reboot the client
20:14
<JensenDan>
now it worked.
20:14
<vagrantc>
alkisg: make me cry :P
20:15
<alkisg>
vagrantc: ...we do want a proper solution for that and not a quick hack, don't we? :-/
20:15
<vagrantc>
alkisg: yes, we do.
20:15
<alkisg>
I thought feature freeze was some time ago :D
20:15
<JensenDan>
you are a good guy :) pretty nice with the gnome3 on clients.. thanks to you, but could u tell me what the problem was? those 15k sas does a pretty good job though.
20:16
<vagrantc>
alkisg: well, i'll see if i can make some incremental improvements.
20:16
<alkisg>
JensenDan: the first problem was that you needed to edit dhcpd for i386 clients on an amd64 server, and the second was that nbd-server wasn't running
20:17
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i need something that can select between amd64/pae/other and it would be nice to have that upstreamed
20:17
<JensenDan>
oh, so all in all, i was just stupid ;)
20:17
<alkisg>
vagrantc: selectable by the user with a menu, or e.g. by the sysadmin on a per-chroot basis?
20:18
<JensenDan>
is it hard to make a menu so i can choose to boot as ltsp client, or serve me an install image? that would be SO awesome!
20:18
<vagrantc>
alkisg: autodetected at boot with ifcpu64.c32
20:18
<alkisg>
Well, that's not pxelinux menus then at all :)
20:19
That should be easier, assuming that pxelinux supports it
20:19
<vagrantc>
alkisg: also, i really need to explore not relying on the deprecated vmlinuz/initrd.img symlinks ... as it may get yanked for wheezy.
20:19
<alkisg>
JensenDan: what do you mean "install image"?
20:19
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i use it all the time, but i need to figure out a way to integrate it into LTSP.
20:20
<alkisg>
vagrantc: ltsp-update-image --cleanup generates the symlinks (as /etc/kernel-img.conf doesn't contain the symlinks_in_boot stuff) with sort -frV, but does prefer the non-pae kernels
20:21
<JensenDan>
alkisg: so that i can do a pxe install, or what it is called, install other machines over the network?
20:21
<alkisg>
JensenDan: install Ubuntu? Or other OS? You can easily write pxelinux menus manually, check its wiki
20:22
<vagrantc>
alkisg: right, so you already have some code for that.
20:22
<alkisg>
vagrantc: did you get ifcpu64.c32 to work as you want it, and you didn't script it yet, or you didn't get it working at all?
20:22
<JensenDan>
i actually know a little about making the menu. but it is serving the os part. i dont know, suse, ubuntu, ipfire and so on? linux distros, i know it is almost imnpossible to serve win that way.
20:22
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it's just not scripted, i know how to use it.
20:23
alkisg: though there are several options for how it should be scripted ... design decisions.
20:23
<JensenDan>
i do have a custom menu on my 306m . but i dident know how to serve the install images ?
20:23
<vagrantc>
alkisg: for my need, i just need it to select the appropriate kernel for an i386 chroot ... but you also could select an amd64 chroot instead.
20:23
<alkisg>
vagrantc: sounds cool... ah btw I didn't do the seperate /boot partition thing, I'm a bit worried about mount --rbind
20:24
<vagrantc>
alkisg: what about a blacklist of mountpoints not to bind-mount?
20:25
alkisg: or at least explicitly mount boot if it's a mountpoint.
20:25
<alkisg>
vagrantc: I think the easiest way would be to just tell overlayfs/aufs to use /, ro of course
20:25
No bind-mount involved
20:25
And since /tmp is excluded with ltsp-update-image.excludes, it shouldn't cause any problems
20:25
<JensenDan>
omg 1U servers making a lot of noise.. and there is SO hot in this rack :(
20:26
at least it is only the 306m there is a 1U
20:26
<vagrantc>
alkisg: but isn't that what it already does? with --bind ? or are you proposing to use --rbind ?
20:26
<alkisg>
JensenDan: you might want to use google translate on this: http://alkisg.mysch.gr/steki/index.php?topic=2828.0
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20:27
<alkisg>
vagrantc: no, I used bind to mount / to $(mktemp -d)/rofs, so that it doesn't get /proc and the other filesystems
20:27
But that's not really needed as they're excluded from the nbd image anyways
20:27
So by completely removing the mount --bind step, it should also take /boot
20:27
<JensenDan>
ehm,, by just looking at the pics i can say that this is very nice.. and the menu is a bit diff from the one i made.
20:29
<alkisg>
vagrantc: but I wonder what would happen with e.g. /dev then, would it also copy all block devices? :-/
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20:29
<JensenDan>
ehm, how do i translate a hole page?
20:29
<alkisg>
Just paste the page url
20:29
(in translate.google.com of course)
20:30
<JensenDan>
nice
20:30
<mnevans>
Alkisg: I hate to say it, but it broke again on the client that *hadn't* been giving me trouble...
20:31
<alkisg>
mnevans: did you put a [mac:address] section in lts.conf?
20:31
<mnevans>
Ubuntu 12.04 amd e350 client connected to a 1680x1050 display
20:31
Here is the lts.conf:
20:31
<alkisg>
!pastebin
20:31
<ltsp`>
alkisg: pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
20:31Mip has left IRC (Mip!~Mip@208.72.71.69, Read error: Connection reset by peer)
20:32
<mnevans>
I mean, the output of xrandr: http://pastebin.com/P7YeKaHn
20:32
<alkisg>
And the lts.conf?
20:33
(to see about the [mac:address] section)
20:33
<mnevans>
I tried to set the resolution and fix the mirroring as you showed me earlier today: http://pastebin.com/b6xhzBbw
20:34
<alkisg>
mnevans: do you actually have that comment right next to the section without a # in front of it?
20:34
<mnevans>
It keeps going to 1024 x 768 resolution.
20:35
<JensenDan>
ehm...
20:35
even on my lang (danish) i dosent get it..
20:35
where do you set the text in the menu?
20:35
<alkisg>
mnevans: DisplayPort-0 doesn't support 1680x1050, you'd need to add it
20:35
<JensenDan>
like "Booting a thin client" blabla
20:35
<mnevans>
Err, yes. Oops. Fixed now. Rebooting the thin client. (I don't think this is going to solve it.)
20:35
<alkisg>
JensenDan: see the attachments in that page
20:36
mnevans: was it working some time before?
20:36
<mnevans>
Hmm. How would I add that resolution? Using output of xrandr in lts.conf?
20:36
<JensenDan>
pictures?
20:37
<mnevans>
Yes, it was, and it seems to be intermittent. I see 1680 x 1050 resolution sometimes on ldm screen, sometimes on login, sometimes it'll spontaneously change resolution afrter login.
20:37
<alkisg>
JensenDan: no, the "default" file
20:37
<mnevans>
But not now twice.
20:38
<JensenDan>
yeah, i see that one? there is no "text"
20:38
hey
20:38
listen
20:38
iam stupid, right?
20:38
<alkisg>
JensenDan: http://alkisg.mysch.gr/steki/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2828.0;attach=1671
20:38
<JensenDan>
thats the structure of some dir's ?
20:39
oh
20:39
<alkisg>
!localxterm | echo mnevans
20:39
<ltsp`>
mnevans localxterm: Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually runs on the server, not on the client itself. If you want to open a program on the client locally, you can type 'ltsp-localapps <program>' in a run dialog or in a terminal. For example, 'ltsp-localapps xterm' to open a terminal running on the client.
20:39
<alkisg>
mnevans: from the localxterm, open /var/log/Xorg.0.log, and put it to pastebin
20:39
To see if it's a problem with EDID
20:40
<JensenDan>
KERNEL syslinux/memdisk
20:40
do i have that outof the box?
20:40
<alkisg>
JensenDan: I think you can find the rest in the pxelinux wiki, or in the #syslinux channel :)
20:40
It completely out of topic now...
20:41
<JensenDan>
all right :)
20:41
thanks btw.
20:41
:)
20:41
<alkisg>
np
20:41
<JensenDan>
ill close the rack and move over to the client :P
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20:47
<mnevans>
Alkisg: That's a big file; but here it is: http://pastebin.com/j65duhwU
20:48
If I comment out the section where I tried to set 1680x1050 resolution with DisplayPort setting in lts.conf,
20:48
I get briefly 1680x1050 on ldm and login. Then it chokes on the impossibly high refresh (146KHz?) and reverts to 1024x768.
20:49
And the client seems to want a restart. "to complete updates".
20:49
...But now it just reverted back to 1680x1050...
20:51
xrandr output: http://pastebin.com/rb4iX65B
20:51
Looks like it is at 60.0KHz.
20:58
<alkisg>
mnevans: do you want the DisplayPort-0 output device on or not?
20:58
If not, just disable it so that 1680x1050 can be used...
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22:16
<mnevans>
alkisg: I just want the client to display at 1680x1050 native resolution. Or close to that.
22:17
I see you've gone home. Time for me to do so too.
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