IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 27 July 2010   (all times are UTC)

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04:51
<intelliant>
hi!
04:52
wanted some help about ltsp-cluster installation with openldap auth
04:56
Have installed it following this guide - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSP-Cluster with the root and the app server as VMs
04:59
there is no mention of how to configure openldap clients for the cluster, but guess it should be same as any one of these - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LDAPClientAuthentication or https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/OpenLDAP_NFS_SSL - which one of these should be used?
04:59
any one recently experienced on lucid ?
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06:03
<dekelev>
guys, how can I add device driver to support my thin clients graphic card. I have the driver but if I chroot into /opt/ltsp/i386 and run modprobe I get error about missing file: /lib/modules/2.6.32-24-generic/modules.dep --- I do have this file in /lib/modules/2.6.32-23-generic/
06:07
well, I totally missed this doc: https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
06:07
I'll try it
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06:45
<intelliant>
found these last pieces - http://nroussi.blogspot.com/2010/05/ltsp-cluster-with-ubuntu-1004-lucid.html , http://www.mail-archive.com/edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com/msg05684.html , https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2010-May/006247.html . Any updates shall be most welcome as I am up against THE WALL :)
06:46
may be stgraber can throw some light on it.
06:47
meanwhile trying to get things working with kiwi-ltsp
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08:28
<muppis>
alkisg, you have wrote add-ppa.sh ?
08:29
<alkisg>
muppis: yes, for limited repositories: http://ts.sch.gr/repo/add-ppa.sh
08:29
E.g. wget http://ts.sch.gr/repo/add-ppa.sh -O /tmp/add-ppa.sh
08:29
sh /tmp/add-ppa.sh stgraber
08:29
==> that adds stgraber's repository. Which repository do you need?
08:30
(for karmic+, add-apt-repository is also available)
08:30
<muppis>
I think it is ts.sch.gr which fixes TC's shutdown?
08:30
<alkisg>
Yes
08:31
muppis: which distro/version? lucid?
08:31
<muppis>
I'm adding to installation-documentation so I like to keep it simple.
08:31
Lucid.
08:31
<alkisg>
Then you just need this: sudo add-apt-repository ppa:ts.sch.gr && sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade
08:31
(add-ppa.sh is for older ubuntu versions which do not have add-apt-repository)
08:32
<muppis>
apt-add-repository, actually. ;)
08:33
Ok, there's both.
08:33
<alkisg>
The apt-add-repository is a symlink, the proper name is add-apt-repository
08:33
<muppis>
Yes. Thank you, didn't notice that command before.
08:34
<alkisg>
np
08:39
<muppis>
I planning to use LTSP in my home for HTPC -environment, but then I thought if I had to make local installation for wlan then it is same install whole system locally..
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08:42
<alkisg>
You mean you want to boot ltsp over wireless?
08:44
<muppis>
Yes.
08:44
I got Broadcom -based wireless in all machines..
08:45
<alkisg>
Does gpxe support those?
08:45
<muppis>
Nope.
08:45
<alkisg>
So you need a kernel locally?
08:45
<muppis>
It seems so.
08:46
<alkisg>
http://www.etherboot.org/wiki/wirelessboot
08:46
Those would make it a little simpler
08:46
So anyway now you need a local kernel + patched initrd
08:48
<muppis>
And Broadcom ain't helping things.
08:54
I got suggestion from my wife to get lan in every room (except kitchen and bathrooms, funny..), so things gets easier then. We just bought a house and we're repairing it.
08:59
<alkisg>
Yeah we did that too
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09:05
<redbaritone>
Does one have to add users to the chroot? What's the most common way of adding accounts so that you can log into your own account through the client?
09:07
<alkisg>
Users are added on the server, e.g. with adduser or users-admin etc etc
09:07
Just like if it was just a normal workstation
09:07
<redbaritone>
What would cause this to NOT work?
09:07
(I've tried it.)
09:10
<alkisg>
distro/version?
09:15
<redbaritone>
Sorry. Lucid Edubuntu. Up-to-date with updated sources.
09:16
I tried to add a couple of users without passwords, and when it tried to access them, it said user id unknown.
09:17
<alkisg>
I don't think ssh will work without a password. Try to add passwords.
09:17
<redbaritone>
Could it be related to a Grub error I'm getting? When I reboot the client, it comes up with a Grub error dealing with an unknown userid just before showing the login prompt.
09:18
Okay, I'll try that, thanks.
09:22
If I have one account for a group of people (first graders, for example), will there a conflict dealing with shared resources? Is this a common way of doing things?
09:22
The younger kids (Kindergarteners and First graders, probably) will have trouble logging in.
09:27
<alkisg>
redbaritone: use a different account per pc, it won't work with the same account for all
09:27
!lts.conf
09:27
<ltspbot`>
alkisg: "lts.conf" :: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
09:27
<alkisg>
redbaritone: see the lts.conf man page for a way to enable automatic login for younger children
09:27
(either completely automatic, with a button click (without password), or timed login)
09:28
LDM_USERNAME, LDM_PASSWORD, LDM_GUESTLOGIN, LDM_AUTOLOGIN etc
09:28
<redbaritone>
Thanks alkisg. That's what I needed.
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09:39
<muppis>
Do I remember correctly that installation sets IP for eth1 automatically to 192.168.0.254 ?
09:40
<Appiah>
Ubuntu Alterante LTSP install?
09:40
<alkisg>
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/390155
09:41
<puck1>
OK I am rebuilding my Ubuntu LTSP nestwork in conjunction with moving to 10.04 Currently I have everything 75 clients 4 LTSP servers and 1 NFS server all on one network seperated by switches. This way I can put any client on any server. All the LTSP servers have a seperate direct connection to the NFS server. I am considering seperating clients into groups and putting them behind specific LTSP servers to segment and possibly reduce the load on the network. Ca
09:42
<alkisg>
...and possibly reduce the load on the network. Ca ==> it was cut-off there
09:42
<puck1>
... Can anyone comment on either setup? Any help is truely appreciated.
09:43
<alkisg>
Are specific users always seated to specific workstations?
09:43
<muppis>
Appiah, yes.
09:44
<puck1>
No, but I will still have the users home folders shared through NFS
09:44
<alkisg>
How do you manage user accounts? LDAP?
09:45
<puck1>
Actuall I cheat. Any changes to user accounts have to be made on one machine then the passwd group and shadow files are automatically copied to the others.
09:46
<alkisg>
ltsp-cluster would be a "proper" solution for multiple ltsp servers, but ok, cheating is also convenient sometimes. :)
09:47
<puck1>
scripts are wonderful things:-D
09:48
<alkisg>
How do you do load balancing? A script that randomly selects a server on boot?
09:48
or from dhcpd.conf ?
09:50
<puck1>
No right now any one client is mapped to a specific server via DHCP. I can change the DHCP config if I need to move the client with out moving any cables. If I go to seperating the clients into groups I can do this but I don't know if it matters.
09:52
<alkisg>
I'd try to prefer the ltsp server which is on the same switch, to avoid backbone traffic (if I understood your topology correctly). Other than that, it sounds good to me...
09:53
<puck1>
If I went the ltsp-cluster route I would need to change to a flat network though ... right?
09:53* alkisg has no idea about ltsp-cluster so he gets silent :)
09:55
<puck1>
What about the connection to the NFS server, right now I have a crossover cable from each app server to the NFS server. This is not scaleable past the four Gig NICS I can put in the NFS server. Have you tried NIC bonding vs direct connect?
09:59
<alkisg>
Are they PCI?
09:59
<puck1>
PCI-E
10:00
<alkisg>
Yeah that would work. I tried with 4x100mbps pci nics, with netperf I got 375mbps, pretty close to a full 4x speed.
10:00
*I tried bonding, that is
10:01
<muppis>
Hmm... Bonding can be done with regular nic's?
10:01
<alkisg>
Yup
10:02
<muppis>
Nice one.
10:02
<puck1>
Do you have any experience with NFS? I really think this has always been my problem as far as speed and system "freezes"
10:02
<alkisg>
I had a problem with lockd not starting, which caused the clients to freeze while logging in
10:03
So now I'm using "nolock" on my fat clients to overcome this
10:03
But for our low-budgets schools, it's always ltsp server == nfs server, we never use separate servers..
10:03
(and the teacher is also working on the server :))
10:04
Others here might have more experience.
10:05
<puck1>
My users are High school administration and also teachers and serveral labs. The labs do alot of gimp and video editing while most of the rest is OO and firefox. I need to try to eliminate the idea of system slowness for the admin so they like the ltsp idea better. Any pointers on what to start tunning so they see very little 3 to 15 second delays. Right now this happens serveral times a day
10:08
<alkisg>
Client specs? (cpu/ram)
10:09
<puck1>
most of the clients are NTS thin clients 800Mhz / 512mb ram
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10:11
<puck1>
My users are High school administration and also teachers and serveral labs. The labs do alot of gimp and video editing while most of the rest is OO and firefox. I need to try to eliminate the idea of system slowness for the admin so they like the ltsp idea better. Any pointers on what to start tunning so they see very little of the 3 to 30 second delays. Right now this happens serveral times a day which is really causing some frustration... :'(
10:12
sorry about the double post. That was supposed to be in an email not here.
10:13
<alkisg>
Check also any dns problems
10:14
<dekelev>
hi alkisg. do you if one can ssh from the server to the client ?
10:14
<puck1>
the "freeze" almost hangs everything. No response to keyboard but the mouse moves but will not click
10:14
<dekelev>
I need to see lspci | grep VGA, but screen is all distorted on the thin client
10:15
<alkisg>
dekelev: try SCREEN_02=shell in lts.conf
10:15
That will prevent it from starting X, so no distortion should happen...
10:15
<dekelev>
so it will open on xterm ?
10:16
<alkisg>
puck1: I had the same symptoms with lockd. Read about nolock, maybe you'll decide that you also don't want nfs locks.
10:16
<dekelev>
thx
10:16
<alkisg>
dekelev: no, it will give you an old-style console, no X at all
10:16
<dekelev>
sorry, that's what I ment. thx
10:22
alkisg: thin client now shows an empty black screen after loading
10:22
weird stuff
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10:30
<alkisg>
dekelev: try also replacing "quiet splash" with "nomodeset" in pxelinux.cfg/default
10:30
<dekelev>
ok, I'll try that, thx
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10:37
<dekelev>
still opens a distorted login screen
10:37
<alkisg>
It shouldn't
10:37
<puck1>
alkisg If I see this correctly the nolock option will disable the file locking on all files. This may work on a users home folder but not on our shared folders. I can seperate the nfs mounts but should this improve the performance to users home folders?
10:37
<alkisg>
dekelev: can you paste your lts.conf to pastebin?
10:38
<dekelev>
now, I have only this line: SYSLOG_HOST=server
10:38
<alkisg>
puck1: in my minimal experience, my clients stopped freezing with that. But that's about all I know about nfs, so I can't give good advice on that.
10:39
dekelev: put this:
10:39
[Default]
10:39
SCREEN_07=shell
10:39
...and see if you still have the problem
10:39
<puck1>
thx I give it a try
10:39
<dekelev>
ok
10:39
<alkisg>
But *keep* the nomodeset in pxelinux.cfg/default
10:39
<dekelev>
ok
10:45
alkisg: now it opens a black screen but still distorted. when I run command it seems like it reacting but I can't read anything
10:45
maybe it's the screen?
10:46
<alkisg>
dekelev: when it boots, do you see letters?
10:46
(before it finishes booting)
10:47
<dekelev>
yeh, when pxe boot loads, gets IP and load pxelinux - It show letters
10:47
<alkisg>
E.g. can you enter the bios?
10:47
<dekelev>
but after that - all distorted
10:47
yeh
10:47
<alkisg>
OK, then it's a graphics card driver problem
10:47
(or something like that)
10:47
What do you have now in pxelinux.cfg/default ?
10:48
<dekelev>
append ro initrd=initrd.img nomodeset nbdport=2001
10:49
<alkisg>
Urm, you have 2 chroots?
10:49
Why the 2001 there?
10:50
Anyway, can you try with a different client (before resorting to installing ssh on the chroot etc)?
10:50
<dekelev>
I tried a laptop and it wasn't distorted
10:51
I use 2001 port in nbd-server/config & /etc/inetd.conf
10:52
<alkisg>
Give it a last try before installing ssh: put "break=init" right next to "nomodeset"
10:52
If you see a shell there, you can chroot and run lspci
10:53
<dekelev>
say I find a driver, all I need is to put it inside /opt/ltsp/i386 and call it's exact path from lts.conf (MODULE_01=...), ltsp-update-image and that's it ?
10:53
<alkisg>
If not, install ssh to the chroot and unlock the root password
10:53
I don't think a driver is needed
10:53
It should be a KMS regression
10:53
So some parameter to disable KMS or a newer kernel or something like that
10:53
<dekelev>
let me test this break-init
10:54
ok
10:54
thx a lot
11:33
<intelliant>
(3:21:52 PM) Intelliant: hi!
11:33
(3:22:39 PM) Intelliant: wanted some help about ltsp-cluster installation with openldap auth
11:33
(3:26:25 PM) Intelliant: Have installed it following this guide - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSP-Cluster with the root and the app server as VMs
11:33
(3:28:54 PM) Intelliant: there is no mention of how to configure openldap clients for the cluster, but guess it should be same as any one of these - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LDAPClientAuthentication or https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/OpenLDAP_NFS_SSL - which one of these should be used?
11:33
(3:29:09 PM) Intelliant: any one recently experienced on lucid ?ed the room.
11:33
(5:15:25 PM) Intelliant: found these last pieces - http://nroussi.blogspot.com/2010/05/ltsp-cluster-with-ubuntu-1004-lucid.html , http://www.mail-archive.com/edubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com/msg05684.html , https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2010-May/006247.html . Any updates shall be most welcome as I am up against THE WALL :)
11:34
aliksg, any thoughts on the above ^^
11:34
?
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12:10
<Appiah>
whats the problem intelliant ?
12:10
is the client auth not working?
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12:19
<intelliant>
Appiah, yes I am unable to configure the client-auth
12:19
<Appiah>
what does auth.log say?
12:19
<intelliant>
I have openldap on a centos server
12:20
getent passwd does not return any of the users form the ldap db
12:20
slapd on centos
12:20
and ldap-client on ubuntu
12:20
I have scrapped that installation
12:21
am redoing it
12:21
can you suggest which is the correct link to follow?
12:23
<Appiah>
I dont see how this is really a LTSP issue
12:23
if your having problems configuring a client to auth to your server
12:23
do you got any other working ldapclient?
12:23
against the same server
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12:56
<intelliant>
I have managed to get clients to auth against the server sans ldap
12:57
Appiah, I agree it is not purely an ltsp issue, but an ldap-client issue
12:57
but if addressed it will make the howto and the ltsp-cluster solution on ubuntu complete
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13:06
<intelliant>
Appiah, opensuse ldapclient is working fine
13:07
It worked like a breeze with default configuration
13:07
seems like there may be some issue with configuring ldapclient on ubuntu or in the method employed by me.
13:09
<Appiah>
so what does your auth.log say?
13:09
can you pastebin the nsswitch.conf?
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13:19
<intelliant>
Appiah, too late for me now today
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13:20
<intelliant>
will do tomorrow as per progress
13:20
thanks for now
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14:23
<cliebow>
Its Gadi!!!!!
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15:04
<denisesball>
hey guys, on ubuntu 10.04. did some updates today and when i logout i cant log back in without rebooting the whole terminal. anybody else experiencing this?
15:04
<muppis>
Did you update chroot also?
15:05
<denisesball>
nope, actually i did not
15:05
should i?
15:05
ltsp-update-image?
15:05
<Appiah>
yes
15:06
<johnny>
that's not enough
15:06
did you update to ubuntu 10.04?
15:06
or upgrades within 10.04
15:06
<denisesball>
upgrades within
15:06
<johnny>
then you shouldn't have to update your chroot
15:06
<denisesball>
i didnt think i had to
15:06
<johnny>
probably a bug of some sort, you'll have to look at the logs
15:07
does it always work after rebooting?
15:07
rebooting once
15:07
<denisesball>
sitting at the login screen says "verifying password" forever
15:07
<johnny>
or do you have to reboot each time?
15:07
<denisesball>
log in, log out, try loggin back in, hangs at verifying password, reboot terminal, login
15:07
<johnny>
then you'll hae to look at your logs
15:08
<denisesball>
any log in particular? i have a bunch of people on this server
15:11
<johnny>
you've been around here enough...
15:11
guess which log is related to logging in..
15:11
over ssh
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15:18
<denisesball>
well of course i just tried to replicate it and i couldnt
15:18
AFTER i did ltsp-update-image though
15:20
so maybe it did do that
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19:03
<john--__>
hi
19:03
anyone home?
19:03
<ananke>
nope
19:04
<john--__>
ha
19:05
im looking at ltsp. what kind or environment do you run it in? what do you use it for?
19:06
<Appiah>
a place where you would like terminal clients
19:07
<john--__>
well, EDU, corporate, your house
19:07
your mom's basement, etc
19:07
<Appiah>
schools and "kiosk" computers seams to be a pretty common scenario here in #ltsp
19:07
but it works for everything..
19:08
<john--__>
is it encrypted by default? years ago i believe it was using xdmcp with no encryption
19:08
<Appiah>
it uses SSH
19:11
<john--__>
does the image update enough that you can watch video?
19:11
is it better/worse than RDP to a windows machine
19:14
<alkisg>
It supports both encrypted and unencrypted traffic. It's much better than RDP, given enough bandwidth.
19:14
E.g. you can watch full screen video with 50 mbps
19:14
<Appiah>
yes you can use it to watch videos
19:25
<john--__>
how does hulu look?
19:25
or youtube?
19:26
thats kind of our litmus test
19:29
<johnny>
it comes with encryption by default, you'll have to disable it
19:30
alkisg, i still can't find a linux based virtual machine builder that does multiple isos :(
19:30
<alkisg>
Heh
19:31
johnny: vm builder? or live cd builder?
19:32
<johnny>
ultimately, it should allow me to boot from these cds but also contain portable virtualbox and keep that updated
19:33
<alkisg>
I can see why you didn't find that yet :)
19:34
<johnny>
shouldnt' such a toolbox exist?
19:34
one does for windows
19:34
i don't know if it keeps virtualbox up to date or not
19:34
but it does install it
19:34
<alkisg>
john--__: LTSP uses remote X windows. Remote X windows can show as much fps as your CPU+network can handle. Flash strains both of them, so for a full screen flash video you'd need a good cpu + a gigabit network.
19:35
<john--__>
ah
19:35
my knowledge is dated, but in the old days i thought you couldnt wrap ssh around xmdcp because it used multiple ports or udp broadcasts (or something else entirely)
19:35
what changed in recent times?
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19:37
<alkisg>
john--__: xdmcp is about logging in - LTSP normally doesn't use it, it uses its own display manager, ldm for that. After logging in, both use remote X.
19:37
xdmcp only supports unencrypted X traffic, while LTSP supports both encrypted + unencrypted
19:37* vagrantc waves from NYC
19:37
<john--__>
oh
19:37
<vagrantc>
where's gadi when you need em?
19:37
<alkisg>
You can wrap X traffic in ssh (==> ssh -X)
19:37
Hey vagrantc - he was here a while ago
19:37
<john--__>
so when people used pure xdmcp to get a remote desktop that was completely insecure
19:38
<vagrantc>
!seen gadi
19:38
<ltspbot`>
vagrantc: gadi was last seen in #ltsp 1 day, 6 hours, 40 minutes, and 51 seconds ago: <Gadi> dekelev: no - it is exported through inetd (/etc/inetd.conf)
19:38
<john--__>
so the apps are run with remotex over ssh, but the desktop is provided via xdmcp?
19:38
<alkisg>
vagrantc: he logged out 5 hours ago
19:39
john--__: no, XDMCP isn't used at all normaly. It's an option if anyone wants it, but normally it isn't used.
19:39
<john--__>
oh
19:39
<alkisg>
The apps and the desktop are the same thing
19:39
See the topic for the docs, they explain the mechanism used
19:39
<john--__>
so the thin client basically grabs enough of X via tftp that it can display most stuff r emotely?
19:39
alright, ill take a loo
19:39
<alkisg>
No, tftp is only used for the kernel
19:39
<john--__>
ook
19:40
look
19:40
<alkisg>
The disk is mounted with nfs or nbd
19:47
<john--__>
reading the docs...
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20:30
<jammcq>
hey hey friends
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20:58
<cn1109>
Hello. I just installed ubuntu 10 with ltsp. My problem is that I have a seperate dhcp server and would like to pxe boot using the new ltsp server. Any documentation or advice?
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21:03
<johnny>
cn1109, tons
21:03
a google search will help
21:03
the ubuntu wiki has lots
21:03
!dhcp
21:03
<ltspbot`>
johnny: "dhcp" :: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/DHCP
21:03
<cn1109>
johnny: I have. I'm using clearos as my dhcp server.
21:04
<johnny>
never heard of it
21:04
anyways, standard documentation will help
21:04
read that link
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