IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 24 May 2011   (all times are UTC)

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03:26* Hyperbyte is installing Edubuntu
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04:31Nick change: andy -> andygraybeal
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05:33
<mgariepy>
good morning everyone
05:36
<andygraybeal>
morrninging!!
05:38
<dead_root>
mornin
05:38
<andygraybeal>
:)
05:38
yay for coffee!!!
05:39
<mgariepy>
coffee is a life saver ! :)
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05:55* Hyperbyte doesn't drink coffee
05:55* Hyperbyte could really use some today though
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06:11
<andygraybeal>
:)
06:22
<Hyperbyte>
Why does every new distro I try have to disappoint on first install?
06:23
<dead_root>
try gentoo
06:23
<Hyperbyte>
Clean installation of Edubuntu 11.04, I configure proxy, run "apt-get update" and it says "Encountered a section with no Package: header"
06:23
Very useful error, too.
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09:17
<Hyperbyte>
How do I install software in the client chroot on Edubuntu?
09:18
I tried chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 and running apt-get, but it failed with a bunch of "Failed to fetch http://ftpmaster.internal/ubuntu/pool/main/...<package>" errors
09:18
Could this have something to do with proxy settings?
09:19
Hrm, without proxy setting it hangs on "Connecting to ftpmaster.internal"... what is this ftpmaster.internal anyways? :)
09:36
<abeehc>
i imagine it's an apt-proxy box?
09:36
can you resolve it?
09:36
<Hyperbyte>
apt-proxy box?
09:36
You'll have to a bit more verbose I'm afraid, this is my first time using Edubuntu.
09:37
<abeehc>
i don't know that it really has anything to do with edubuntu
09:37
did you not setup this machine?
09:37
<Hyperbyte>
I've used Redhat/Fedora for about twelve years now, but I'm still finding some parts of Edubuntu a bit try'ey. ;-)
09:37
<abeehc>
if you change your sources file to the official severs, it'll likely work
09:38
so that ftpmaster.internal should be coming for /etc/apt/sources.list
09:38
<Hyperbyte>
Okay... why would the LTSP client chroot default to ftpmaster.internal though?
09:38
<abeehc>
and you'd want to replace that address with archive.ubuntu.com or something like that..backup f8irst maybe
09:38
i thought it copies the host system file, you'll find both are using the same addresses
09:38
i'm nto sure though
09:39
<Hyperbyte>
Okay, well thanks - will look into it and will report back in a bit. :)
09:39
<abeehc>
/opt/ltsp/arch/etc/apt/source.list vs /etc/apt/sources.list
09:39
i imagine, a sysadmin set that address on purpose, so to minimize bandwitdh usage by the package manager
09:39
and perhaps you have dns issues still
09:39
gl though
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09:47
<Hyperbyte>
This is a clean install though, and I don't have DNS issues and never had. :)
09:48
The sources.list is a good tip though, will see what's in there soon.
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10:24
<Hyperbyte>
It's not working. I copied the sources.list from the main system, but now it says "Unable to locate package <package name>" for about everything package I can think of
10:25
The ones that do work (like thunderbird) have "unmet dependancies"
10:27
Hrm, after deleting /var/lib/apt/lists/* and doing dpkg --configure -a it works
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11:13
<Hyperbyte>
Hey alkisg!
11:13
<alkisg>
Hi Hyperbyte, what's up?
11:13
<Hyperbyte>
I'm currently working overtime, making a switch to Edubuntu
11:13
I screwed myself over with Fedora, to the point where I got sick of it.
11:13
Sunday I fixed all my display driver issues by upgrading to Fedora 14, then LTSP sound stopped working and our softphone was incompatible with newer Gnome libraries it turns out...
11:14
<alkisg>
Ouch. But why would edubuntu help there?
11:14
<Hyperbyte>
I restored a backup from before sunday, but somehow our softphone never worked again...
11:14
Today none of the phones worked here... except mine. Spent whole day answering phone, now I'm working overtime to get rid of Fedora.
11:15
Edubuntu helps, because it doesn't have these problems. And it has sflphone in it's repositories, unlike Fedora.
11:15
Plus it doesn't have these display or sound driver problems.
11:15
I also find it has much better community than Fedora. :-)
11:16
I like Edubuntu so far. Everything goes a lot smoother, although I've had some beginners trouble, but that's normal I guess.
11:16
<alkisg>
True, at least here in #ltsp
11:16
All ok now?
11:16
<Hyperbyte>
Oh, everybody here in #ltsp is great! :-)
11:16
So far, so good.
11:17
Right now I'm busy migrating all my custom settings and gconf mandatory stuff over from one server to another.
11:17
Luckily we always have a spare server in the rack here... just for events like this.
11:17
So if this doesn't work I can spent tomorrow answering phones too if needed, and continue afterwards. But I plan to get this fixed, if it takes me 'till the morning light. :-D
11:18* alkisg passes Hyperbyte a galon of coffee...
11:18
<Hyperbyte>
Hahah
11:18
Had it
11:18
Well, not coffee, but caffeine. =)
11:19
I'm happy though with this. LTSP under Edubuntu seems to be much more robuust, and lots faster (especially in bootup)
11:19
<alkisg>
Which edubuntu? 10.10?
11:19
<Hyperbyte>
The one you recommended
11:19
11.04
11:19
<alkisg>
Ah because of the display driver problems, ok
11:20
<Hyperbyte>
Noticed some weird things with it, like on setup it asked me if I wanted Unity, I said "no" and it installed it anyways, even made it default
11:20
Heh
11:20
<alkisg>
You can make it go faster on boot by reenabling nbd compression in /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf
11:20
I haven't tried edubuntu 11.04 yet so I don't know about the installer details
11:20
<Hyperbyte>
I could just hash out that line?
11:21
Curious though that compression actually makes it go faster? You'd expect slower?
11:21
<dubkat>
question...
11:21
i have a x64 server serving x32 thin clients
11:21
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: yup just hush it out, it'll take effect after the next ltsp-update-image
11:22
<dubkat>
so how do i "easily" install 32bit firefox / chromium?
11:22
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: compression x2.5 times means 2.5 times less network traffict => faster
11:22
dubkat: where, on the server or the chroot?
11:22
<dubkat>
cuz apt doesn't seem to have an --arch override, and dpkg doesn't seem to fetch packages
11:22
alkisg: isn't the chroot / the server all the same?
11:22
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, even on a gigabit network?
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11:24
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: usually yes, because e.g. 10 clients will be booting at once, so each client only gets 100 mbps at that time
11:24
dubkat: no, it's not the same. Are you trying to install firefox as a localapp?
11:24
<dubkat>
yes
11:24
<alkisg>
If not, then you don't need 32 bit firefox
11:24
<dubkat>
on a 1ghz attom
11:24
atom thin client
11:24
<alkisg>
If yes, then you should just install firefox on the chroot
11:24
You don't need to care about the arch there
11:24
You just chroot and run apt-get install inside it
11:25
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg: 284 MB instead of 667 MB... nice. :) Should be 4 seconds less on bootup, assuming it fetches the whole image when it boots.
11:25
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: nope, it only fetches the sectors it needs each time
11:25
But that's byte, not bit
11:27
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, okay. One more question. How do I change default locale to nl_NL for all users?
11:27
Preferably without using the GUI tool, because in there all languages are greyed out except "English"
11:27
I did install the language packs by the way
11:28
<dubkat>
alkisg: i'm sorry, maybe i'm not understanding
11:28
how can a 32bit processor run a 64bit local app
11:29
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat: they won't. When you type 'chroot /opt/ltps/i386/', you get a prompt where / = /opt/ltsp/i386/
11:29
So if apt-get checks what type of architecture is installed on /, it'll see the i386 arch and install 32-bit apps
11:29
<dubkat>
ooooh!
11:29
sneaky
11:30
<Hyperbyte>
That's what 'chroot' does... 'change root' I believe
11:30
When you 'chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/' you get a prompt which basically makes the client installation as the parent system...
11:30
<dubkat>
yeah, i just wasn't following your logic. sorry, been a long week :)
11:30
<Hyperbyte>
Do your stuff there, then 'exit' to back to the normal root and run ltsp-update-image --arch i386
11:31
<dubkat>
got all these employees starting tomorrow and will be using these, so i'm trying to put some finishing touches on :)
11:31
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: the correct way would be to use --locale in ltsp-build-client. But now, change $CHROOT/etc/default/locale. And also run `sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 dpkg-reconfigure console-setup` if you want a different keyboard layout
11:31
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg: the Dutch use American keyboard layout. :)
11:31
<alkisg>
OK, just the locale then
11:31
I thought you had weird umlauts and such
11:32
<Hyperbyte>
I believe IBM at one point created a special Dutch keyboard layout and everyone was like "wait a second, where are all my characters gone?!" because everybody was so used to US... it didn't survive. :)
11:32
We do, but Dutch people remember things like alt+0235 for e-umlaut and stuff...
11:32
Or we pick US international, which allows people to type "e to get e-umlaut
11:33
Anyway, that's besides the point, but a nice bit of trivia regardless I thought. :)
11:33
<dubkat>
Get:1 http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ natty/main libffi5 i386 3.0.9-3ubuntu1 [15.7 kB]
11:33
brilliiant
11:33* dubkat hugs you all
11:33
<Hyperbyte>
:)
11:33
alkisg... /etc/default/locale has LANG=C... ?
11:33
What's C?
11:33
<dubkat>
i have been wracking my brain out on how to do this
11:33
C = System
11:33
<Hyperbyte>
Ah
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11:34
<dubkat>
don't use it
11:34
<Hyperbyte>
So I could as well change it in /etc/default/locale on the server?
11:34
lol, ok
11:34
It's gone!
11:34
<dubkat>
what country are you trying to set?
11:34
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: check /etc/default/locale on your server, what does it have?
11:34
<dubkat>
^^
11:34
was just typing that
11:34
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg: en_US
11:34
dubkat: nl_NL
11:34
:)
11:34
<alkisg>
OK, use that then
11:35
<Hyperbyte>
I did. Okay.
11:35
<dubkat>
so you should have nl_NL.UTF-8 in there somewhere
11:35
<Hyperbyte>
Yeah, I do, in both /etc/default/locale files
11:35
Okay... now if you guys don't mind I'd like to fire the next question... :)
11:36
Sorry if I seem overzealous, but you guys are shaving hours off my working through the night figuring everything out at the moment. :D
11:37
<dubkat>
they did the same for me
11:37
<Hyperbyte>
I accidentally typed 'ltsp-build-client' instead of update-image... now I have some parts of an amd64 chroot, which I want to remove.
11:37
<dubkat>
fyi, i did something totally horrible last night
11:37
ive had Gentoo on my desktop happily for years
11:37
<Hyperbyte>
I get errors on deleting proc..
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11:39
<dubkat>
i tried to remove kde, and install gnome3 (i was bored with kde4, and their broken email client and crap) anyway, i installed ubuntu 11.04
11:39* dubkat hangs his head in shame
11:39
<dubkat>
oh, jumped the track. i broke m ygentoo system and just iddn't feel like recompiling *
11:40
i already miss it, i hate ubuntu's init system
11:40
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: ouch, you tried to delete the chroot with $CHROOT/proc mounted
11:40
<dubkat>
but unity is pretty
11:40
<alkisg>
I'd reboot the server and then retry to delete the chroot
11:41
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, actually, there was nothing in mount regarding proc on chroot... there still isn't.
11:41
<alkisg>
But that's just me being cautious, you might want to just unmount it
11:41
<Hyperbyte>
But I'll reboot if that fixes it, no problemo.
11:41
It's not mounted, that's the weirdness.. only proc on host is mounted, not in chroot.. and still I can't delete.. it's not a symlink either.. it's... weird
11:41
But alas, I reboot. :D
11:42
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: if you chroot and then cat /proc/mounts, you'll see it
11:42
<Hyperbyte>
Oh, they don't show up in parent mount list?
11:43
Hah, it's gone! :)
11:43* Hyperbyte is really liking Edubuntu so far.
11:43
<Hyperbyte>
LTSP is just more polished. :)
11:43
<alkisg>
There's something weird about mounts and chroot, and I ended up to "see/unmount from the chroot I did the mount"
11:45
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, oh yeah... how about flash? Is it included with Edubuntu by default?
11:45
Or in repositories?
11:45
<alkisg>
I think it prompts you on installation?
11:45
If not, you can just install it from the repositories
11:45
<Hyperbyte>
It asked about MP3, not Flash I think
11:45
<alkisg>
Or install the whole "ubuntu-restricted" package, which also contains java
11:46
And some other codecs
11:46
ubuntu-restricted-extras
11:46
<Hyperbyte>
:)
11:46
Okay. What's the most recent and correct documentation for lts.conf?
11:47
The /topic?
11:47
<alkisg>
(1) man lts.conf,
11:47
and (2) the .pdf from the /topic
11:47
<Hyperbyte>
Okay, because there's no manpage for lts.conf... probably some package missing
11:47
<alkisg>
ltsp-docs
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11:48
<alkisg>
So either sudo apt-get install ltsp-docs, or visit http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
11:48
<Hyperbyte>
Yep, got it.
11:48
Okay. In man lts.conf it says LOCAL_APPS is False by default. I don't have it in the config file, but ltsp-localapps still works. ?
11:48
<dubkat>
cd
11:48
fail
11:49
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: if you see below it also says it's true by default :)
11:49
It's a bug in the man page
11:49
<Hyperbyte>
Ahh, okay
11:50
<alkisg>
The most significant setting is LDM_DIRECTX, if it's ok for your environment security-wise, it speeds things up a lot
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11:52
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, yeah, got that. I'm missing the NFS configuration in the manpage.
11:52
For mounting home directories via NFS
11:52
<alkisg>
Thin clients or fat clients?
11:53
Or localapps?
11:53
<Hyperbyte>
Localapps
11:54
<alkisg>
And why do you want nfs instead of the default sshfs?
11:54
<Hyperbyte>
My terminal server mounts /home/ via NFS from a file server. I'd like the clients to mount it from the fileserver directly as well, rather than via the terminal server
11:55
Although I guess it doesn't matter much, but if there's an easy config setting for it (and I thought there was?) that'd be useful to set as well
11:55
<alkisg>
I've written 2 lines about NFS_HOME in https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients#NFS_HOME - if you don't manage it, just shout... :)
11:56
<Hyperbyte>
mhm... I guess it's not worth the trouble. There's only small application with 1 config file that runs locally
11:56
Should be ok...
11:57
Because I'd also have to configure idmapd on the clients since I'm using NFS4
11:57* Hyperbyte resists.
11:57
<Hyperbyte>
Good info though!
11:59
root@terminaltest:~# cat /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/default/locale
11:59
LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8"
11:59
Gnome is still English though
11:59
<alkisg>
That's the chroot language, not the session language
11:59
The session is on the server
12:00
<Hyperbyte>
root@terminaltest:~# cat /etc/default/locale
12:00
LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8"
12:00
I did 'em both. Does it require a restart to go into effect?
12:00
Or could there be something wrong with the language packs?
12:00
<alkisg>
Server restart, yeah
12:00
<Hyperbyte>
Ahh
12:00* Hyperbyte restarts
12:01
<alkisg>
To check the language packs, run gnome-language-selector
12:02
<Hyperbyte>
That's System -> Language, right?
12:02
<alkisg>
Yup
12:02
<Hyperbyte>
Because it had 'Dutch' greyed out
12:02
It was in the list though
12:02
It had all options greyed out though, probably should've sudo'd it.
12:03
<alkisg>
No, use the "add/remove" button below the list
12:04
<Hyperbyte>
mhm...
12:04
<alkisg>
"Install / Remove Languages..."
12:04
<Hyperbyte>
Dutch! :)
12:04
Wait no. That's not Dutch.
12:05
Gnome language selector has all options greyed out though
12:05
As in, all. Except 'Close' and 'Help'
12:06
I can change regional settings, but there "Apply system wide" is greyed out as well
12:07
The applications that have Dutch locale installed are Dutch at the moment though. Only Gnome stays English.
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12:22
<dubkat>
crap
12:22
so i got firefox installed in the chroot. yaaay
12:22
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, congrats! :)
12:22
<dubkat>
but i cant get online, but i'm quite sure i have nat setup
12:22
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, get an xterm on the client, try 'host www.google.com' and if that works 'ping www.google.com'
12:23
(so ltsp-localapps xterm)
12:24
<dubkat>
negative
12:25
<Hyperbyte>
'host' doesn't work?
12:26
<dubkat>
no, i don't have bind-tools installed, so i tried ping -c3 www.google.com
12:26
and that didn't work
12:26
<Hyperbyte>
Does ping 66.102.13.99 work?
12:26
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: are you running gnome-language-selector locally on the server, or from a thin client?
12:26
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, server
12:26
Well no
12:26
From a thin client, on the server
12:26
<dubkat>
no, ping <ip> didn't work either
12:26
--- 66.102.13.99 ping statistics ---
12:26
2 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 1007ms
12:26
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, then you don't have NAT set up. :)
12:27
<dubkat>
Chain POSTROUTING (policy ACCEPT 1342 packets, 83671 bytes)
12:27
pkts bytes target prot opt in out source destination
12:27
244 17968 MASQUERADE all -- * * 10.0.0.0/16 0.0.0.0/0
12:27
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: policykit has some glitches in its settings, maybe it affects gnome-language-selector too, can you try vnc'ing on the server?
12:27
<dubkat>
it's been so long since ive done this
12:27
isnt that enough?
12:27
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, or your thin client doesn't have a default gateway configured. Type 'ip route show', see if it has default route via your router
12:27
<alkisg>
Or try running it with sudo...
12:27
<dubkat>
dreidy@ltsp5:~$ ip route show
12:27
10.0.0.0/24 dev eth0 proto kernel scope link src 10.0.0.5
12:27
default via 10.0.0.1 dev eth0
12:27
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, 10.0.0.1 is your router?
12:28
<dubkat>
10.0.0.1 is the "server" which i have configured (i thought) to act as a nat for the clients as well
12:28
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, can't VNC to the server, but what the heck, I'll just walk the 20 meters. :)
12:28
<alkisg>
Heh
12:29
dubkat: try this: sudo -i
12:29
iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -j MASQUERADE
12:29
echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
12:29
<Hyperbyte>
(on the server)
12:30
<dubkat>
i already have that...
12:30
298 21311 MASQUERADE all -- * * 10.0.0.0/16 0.0.0.0/0
12:30
cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward
12:30
1
12:32
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, nuts
12:32
On the server it works
12:32
But
12:32
Actually Gnome was in Dutch as well. :O
12:32
<alkisg>
Haha
12:32
<Hyperbyte>
Anyway, since 'Dutch' WAS still greyed out as option, and English was selected, and Gnome was Dutch (huh?)
12:33
I decided to remove Dutch
12:33
And reinstall it
12:33
And now it won't let me reinstall it, because it finds the packages unverified?
12:33
<dubkat>
hrm... amd i missing something obvious here?
12:33
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, try pinging 10.0.0.1 from the client
12:34
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: from the console, try: sudo apt-get install language-pack-nl
12:35
If it complains about unverified packages, put the output to pastebin
12:35
<dubkat>
64 bytes from 10.0.0.1: icmp_req=1 ttl=64 time=0.201 ms
12:35
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, well, with apt-get I can tell it to ignore unverified packages.
12:35
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: well you shouldn't *have* to
12:35
<Hyperbyte>
But I think the problem is that with apt-get install language-pack-nl it doesn't install the extras
12:36
<alkisg>
So if it complains, let's see why
12:36
<Hyperbyte>
Like gimp-language-nl, openoffice-language-nl
12:36
Gnome language selector actually gave an error about it
12:36
<alkisg>
Paste it
12:37
<Hyperbyte>
But wait. Because now I'm doing exactly what I did before and it didn't work.
12:38
Before I installed language-pack-nl... and when I ran the language selector on the server, it complained about packages missing for Dutch and that it couldn't those
12:38
Ah, what the heck
12:38
I can just copy-paste the list of packages into apt-get and install them anyways
12:38* Hyperbyte applies head to desk
12:38
<alkisg>
If it complains, you might need to run apt-get update
12:38
*about missing packages
12:39
If it complains about unverified packages, there's something wrong there
12:41
<Hyperbyte>
It said it's from unverified source
12:41
Probably means third-party translation team
12:42
Either way, in GUI it said "can't install, unverified source"
12:42
In terminal it asked "unverified source, install anyway?"
12:42
So there, they're installed.
12:42
Yet in the Gnome language selector, every language besides 'English' is greyed out. :S
12:43
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: take a pause and check the "unverified source" problem
12:43
Did it say that with language-pack-nl?
12:43
If so, what's the output of `apt-cache policy language-pack-nl` ?
12:44
<Hyperbyte>
http://secondary.recreatie-zorg.nl/jan/output.txt
12:45
I actually believe the problem is that client isn't listening to /etc/default/locale
12:45
Because it's not using my Dutch LDM translation either, and I did feed it the Dutch ldm.mo file
12:46
<alkisg>
That would be another problem, but I wonder why you're getting the warning about unverified source. What's the output of this?
12:46
sudo apt-key list | grep Ubuntu
12:46
<Hyperbyte>
uid Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
12:46
uid Ubuntu CD Image Automatic Signing Key <cdimage@ubuntu.com>
12:46
uid Ubuntu Extras Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
12:47
<alkisg>
Hmm, I wonder if it's a temporary problem with the us mirror...
12:47
Anyway. Did you run ltsp-update-image after changing $CHROOT/etc/default/locale?
12:47
<vagrantc>
so ... i log into our fine new ubuntu lucid application server from our long-standing functional debian lenny thin clients ...
12:48
and some of them work fine ... and others ... the screen gets a bunch of lines all over it
12:48
and the mouse cursor freezes ...
12:48
compiz?
12:48
<alkisg>
Try nomodeset, I've seen such problems with plymouth
12:48
But I thought they were solved...
12:49
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, I did yes.
12:49
<vagrantc>
alkisg: they're not running a version the uses modesetting
12:49
alkisg: the thin-clients are pre-modesetting
12:50
<alkisg>
Hmmm no idea then... yeah try disabling compiz, maybe it'll help
12:51
<vagrantc>
!compiz
12:51* vagrantc pouts
12:51
<vagrantc>
hah!
12:51
i found it on a cached posting of #ltsp logs on nubae.com
12:52
<alkisg>
sudo gconftool-2 --direct --config-source xml:readwrite:/etc/gconf/gconf.xml.mandatory --type string --set /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager metacity
12:52
Heh, logs beat me :)
12:52
<vagrantc>
is there any way to check?
12:52
if it's already set?
12:52
<alkisg>
xdpyinfo |grep -i composite
12:52
=> that's when it's set, and
12:53
ps -ef|grep compiz ... or metacity should tell you if it's running
12:53
Ah to check the gconf key?
12:53
cat /etc/gconf/gconf.xml.mandatory/%gconf-tree.xml
12:53
Or gconftool-2 again...
12:55
<vagrantc>
looks like it wasn't set
12:56
<mgariepy>
$ gconftool-2 --get /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanagercompiz
12:56
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: so if you run ltsp-localapps xterm to get a local shell, and then cat /etc/default/locale, you see LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8" ?
12:57
Hyperbyte: also, try setting LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8" in lts.conf, that should affect ldm
12:57
<Hyperbyte>
Yessir.
12:57
I was just thinking the latter as well
12:58* Hyperbyte reboots client
12:59
<Hyperbyte>
Heh, nope, still no lcuk
12:59
And no luck either.
12:59
<alkisg>
How did you put the ldm translations to the chroot?
12:59
<Hyperbyte>
Copied ldm.mo file
12:59
<alkisg>
Where?
12:59
<Hyperbyte>
Although I didn't check if LDM was Dutch
12:59
Moment.
13:00
Nope, LDM not Dutch
13:00
- /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/locale/nl/LC_MESSAGES/ldm.mo
13:00
<alkisg>
http://packages.ubuntu.com/natty/i386/ldm/filelist
13:01
No nl translation there...
13:01bobby_C (~bobby@85-124-22-227.teleworker.xdsl-line.inode.at) joined #ltsp.
13:01
<Hyperbyte>
No, I made it myself.
13:01
I actually submitted it to the ltsp-devel mailing list, but it hasn't been included yet
13:01
<dubkat>
dreidy@ltsp5:~$ ping www.google.com
13:01
PING www.l.google.com (74.125.225.52) 56(84) bytes of data.
13:01
64 bytes from 74.125.225.52: icmp_req=1 ttl=54 time=32.4 ms
13:01
fixed it \o/
13:02
<Hyperbyte>
Yay. :)
13:03
alkisg, my Dutch ldm.mo worked fine on Fedora. I'm still convinced something in the client chroot is setting en_US as default
13:03
<alkisg>
LANG in lts.conf should work though
13:04
<Hyperbyte>
It doesn't listen to LANG in lts.conf, nor LDM_LANGUAGE, nor to /etc/default/locale
13:04
<alkisg>
In the local terminal, can you run: getltscfg -a
13:04
And see if you indeed get LANG etc?
13:05Gadi (romm@ool-18bbe47a.static.optonline.net) left #ltsp.
13:05
<Hyperbyte>
Yep, it's there
13:05
It's in 'export' as well
13:05
<alkisg>
LDM_LANGUAGE=>that's the gnome session language
13:05
LANG=>that's the ldm language
13:05
<Hyperbyte>
I set them both, just to be sure. :P
13:05
In Fedora it worked once I added export LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8" to /etc/profile
13:05
Worth a try?
13:06
<alkisg>
Try copying ldm.mo on the server /usr/share/locale/... etc
13:07
Then, run this: gettext -d ldm 'Password'
13:07
Do you see Dutch?
13:07
<Hyperbyte>
Yep
13:08
Putting the export lines in /etc/profile did nothing by the way
13:08* Hyperbyte is confused.
13:09
<alkisg>
Can you get a root shell on the client?
13:09
E.g. with SCREEN_02=shell?
13:09
<Hyperbyte>
Sure
13:09
One moment, need to set root password and configure
13:10* Hyperbyte reboots client
13:10
<alkisg>
tr '\0' '\n' < /proc/$(pidof ldm)/environ | grep LANG
13:11
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ClientTroubleshooting#Using a shell SCREEN
13:13
<Hyperbyte>
Heh
13:13
LANG=nl_NL.UTF-8
13:14
I don't get it. :S
13:15
<alkisg>
It might be an ldm regression then... is anyone succesfully using a localized version of ldm in natty?
13:15
Or, try setting one of the existing languages (see the file list in the link above)
13:15
<Hyperbyte>
Well, Gnome is also still English
13:15
<alkisg>
That's a different story
13:15
<Hyperbyte>
I could live with LDM being English, but Gnome is gonna be a problem
13:17
<alkisg>
The user that you're logging in with, does he have a ~/.dmrc file?
13:17
<Hyperbyte>
Yep.
13:17
Language=nl_NL, Layout=us
13:17
This user had a Dutch Gnome in Fedora by the way
13:18
<alkisg>
Try moving that file
13:19
<Hyperbyte>
Luck!
13:19
:)
13:19
This I would've never figured out.
13:19
<alkisg>
Maybe the problem was the nl_NL, without the UTF-8 extension
13:19
<Hyperbyte>
Fan-tas-tic.
13:19
<alkisg>
Let's go to the ldm problem now
13:19
<Hyperbyte>
:)
13:19
Okay
13:19
<alkisg>
Try another language, e.g. german
13:20
<Hyperbyte>
In /etc/default/locale?
13:20
<alkisg>
LANG=xxx in lts.conf
13:20
<Hyperbyte>
Should I clean /etc/default/locale, or doesn't it matter?
13:20
<alkisg>
I don't think it matters
13:20
<Hyperbyte>
Okay
13:20
<alkisg>
Try it once, and verify it with: tr '\0' '\n' < /proc/$(pidof ldm)/environ | grep LANG
13:22
Hey, the debian installer provides for a separate /home! Cool!
13:22
<Hyperbyte>
It's set
13:22
<alkisg>
Which lang did you try?
13:22
<Hyperbyte>
de_DE.UTF-8... LDM is English should
13:22
Perhaps remove the .UTF-8?
13:23
Wait. Idea.
13:23
I think I figured it out. If I did, you may smack me on the head.
13:24
No, that wasn't it.
13:24
I had "quotes" around it, but that didn't matter.
13:25
Hrm
13:26
I've just tried LANG=nl_NL, LANG=nl_NL.UTF-8, LANG="nl_NL" and LANG="nl_NL.UTF-8"
13:26
<alkisg>
The next step I'd take would be to make a shell wrapper to replace ldm with this:
13:26
exec strace -e trace=file ldm.original "$@" 2>&1 | grep ldm.mo >> /tmp/ldm-problems
13:27
You can do this from the root account locally on the client, no need to run ltsp-update-image
13:27
Just enter a wrong pass on ldm, and it's restarted, and the shell script would be used
13:27
(assuming you're familiar with scripts...)
13:27
<vagrantc>
seems like compiz was my lucid problem
13:28
<alkisg>
We should put it in the ltsp conflicts: list :P
13:28* andygraybeal stamps on compiz repeatedly
13:28
<vagrantc>
alkisg: well, you can have an LTSP server that's also a desktop, so a strict conflicts isn't a good idea
13:28
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, I think what I'm gonna do is leave this for now
13:28
We can come back to it later though.
13:29
English LDM I can live with, as long as the rest works for tomorrow.
13:29
<alkisg>
vagrantc: nah I was just joking, when it works it's actually faster for ltsp clients
13:29
Hyperbyte: ok
13:29
<Hyperbyte>
Been at this for 14.5 hours straight now, hope to finish all this in an hour or so.
13:29
Else I have a feeling it's gonna go horribly wrong.
13:34
(with me)
13:35
<highvoltage>
Hyperbyte: ouch!
13:36
<Hyperbyte>
highvoltage, yeah... I implemented LTSP with Fedora... tested it thoroughly (four months with different hardware)... one slight problem that I didn't pick up on
13:36
Unlucky me, it was a slight problem with some kernel modules that are incompatible with DLWS LTSP clients... the clients we just installed ten of
13:36
<andygraybeal>
DLWS ?
13:36
<Hyperbyte>
Diskless Workstations
13:36
<andygraybeal>
ah
13:37
<Hyperbyte>
I went to 'fix' the kernel modules, but since I have zero experience with these things, it went from bad to worse.
13:37
OpenOffice didn't work today, our softphones didn't work.
13:37
My employer said I should devise a solution, any solution, by tomorrow morning if at all possible. He didn't threaten me, because he understands it's unforeseen and complicated..
13:37
<alkisg>
Backing up ltsp chroots is very easy - and should be done before major changes :D
13:37
<Hyperbyte>
But I agree that it needs a solution at all costs though.
13:37
alkisg, I did, that's the strange thing.
13:38
I even made an image of the entire server.
13:38
<alkisg>
Ouch, and rolling back didn't work as expected?
13:38
<Hyperbyte>
I believe the Fedora 14 update I did changed something in the user profiles (which aren't part of the image) that caused the whole thing to screw up
13:38
-did
13:39
Spent like sixteen hours trying to figure it out... finally had it on sunday... then it broke again for unexplained reasons on monday.
13:39
So today, in all my wisdom, I decided to deploy Edubuntu overnight.
13:39
Figured it'd be the best choice in the long run, and about the same amount of work as fixing Fedora
13:39
<highvoltage>
which DLWS clients are they, btw?
13:39
<Hyperbyte>
LTSP Term 1720
13:40
Dual-screen
13:40
<alkisg>
You're allowed to keep ldm in english then :D And also to take a week off :D
13:40
<Hyperbyte>
Which is actually what the root of the problems were... everybody has (needs) two screens...
13:40
And somehow on the second screen hardware acceleration didn't work
13:40
:S
13:40
Which caused OpenOffice to not display text or images (in menu's, popups, documents..) which means not usable on second screen
13:40
<highvoltage>
hmm, I think that's a common problem with dual-screen
13:41
<Hyperbyte>
And our softphone didn't work at all.
13:41
highvoltage, if this is your way of telling me I'm going to run into the same problems with Edubuntu in the near future, then please shoot me now.
13:41
<alkisg>
Didn't you test with the edubuntu live dvd before installing?
13:42
<highvoltage>
Hyperbyte: it's not an edubuntu problem, I think you'll run into it on whatever you'll run on that hardware. I might be mistaken though, but afaik you just can't get dual screen + 3d accelleration for both screens on that hardware
13:44
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, I did, but stupidly not with dual screens
13:44
This is not smart.
13:45
highvoltage, the thin client is listed as dual monitor capability though
13:45
highvoltage, but you're right, with a second attached it doesn't perform as expected.
13:45
It actually sets one screen to 640x480 screen resolution and the other one it keeps turned off
13:46
Even Fedora didn't do that
13:46
<alkisg>
You can set the resolutions with xrandr (both command line and in lts.conf)
13:48
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, also for tomorrow
13:48
If I can unplug one screen and everything works, then I'm happy.
13:48
They can do without second screens while I ask DisklessWorkstations how to fix this.
13:49
The LTSP Term 1720 is listed as dual-monitor capable and compatible with Ubuntu 11.04
13:49
So I'm not worried that they don't have, or won't try to find a solution for me.
13:49
It's not the kind of setback I was hoping for though, but at least for this I can get good support.
13:49drdata (~drdata@pool-173-57-189-158.dllstx.fios.verizon.net) joined #ltsp.
13:50
<alkisg>
That part won't be hard; getting acceleration on the second monitor will be harded, if the driver doesn't support it...
13:50
I imagine you can setup dual screens with just a couple of xrandr lines in lts.conf...
13:51
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, probably, but it requires a lot of extra configuration though
13:51
Since we have a whole bunch of different screens and screen sizes
13:51
<alkisg>
You should be able to use "auto" for the resolution
13:52
<Hyperbyte>
mhm, well, when it boots I see the left (DVI) screen panickingly search for compatible resolutions (on, off, on, off) during the Edubuntu logo
13:52
And when LDM starts it stays off and the right screen switches to a really low resolution
13:52
So it looks like it's doing some form of auto detection
13:53
<alkisg>
The output of "xrandr" would be handy there...
13:53
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, I really love and very much appreciate your willingness to help. And I'm definitely gonna take you up on this offer... tomorrow. :)
13:53
If I can just unplug all second screens, and everything else works
13:53
I go home. :)
13:53
<alkisg>
Sure, you've had more than enough for one day
13:54
<Hyperbyte>
I've had enough for one week I think. :D
13:55
I'm serious though, you're a fantastic fountain of knowledge. :) When it comes to LTSP at least. :)
14:00
Hrm, in Fedora you could type 'yum whatprovides */libfile.so' and it would tell you which package it's in
14:00
How is this done on Ubuntu?
14:00
<vagrantc>
dpkg -S filename
14:00vagrantc (~vagrant@75-150-46-245-Oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) left irc: Quit: leaving
14:02
<Hyperbyte>
That only works with installed packages, I'm looking for not-yet-installed ones. :)
14:02
So I know which package I should get.
14:06dead_root (~dead_root@76.75.3.174) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
14:10IOMonster (~IOMonster@unaffiliated/iomonster) left irc: Ping timeout: 258 seconds
14:11
<dubkat>
hey, so when i run the 32bit chrooted firefox, how do i make it so it can access one's home directory, so their plugins,bookmarks,etc work as expected?
14:13
<Hyperbyte>
dubkat, doesn't it do that already?
14:18mikkel (~mikkel@80-71-132-15.u.parknet.dk) left irc: Quit: Leaving
14:24
<dubkat>
no
14:24
i even tried to load a firefox plugin thats in my home directory, and i see nothing at all there
14:25
<alkisg>
dubkat: distro/version?
14:25
<dubkat>
ubunutu 11.04
14:26
x64 server / 32bit clients
14:26
<alkisg>
Try: ltsp-localapps xterm
14:26
On that xterm: cat /proc/mounts
14:26
And see if /home/username is mounted with sshfs
14:26
<dubkat>
dreidy@ltsp5:~$ cat /proc/mounts | grep home
14:26
dreidy@ltsp5:~$
14:27
<alkisg>
(also you can try `ls /home/username`)
14:27
Ah not sure if sshfs would show up in /proc/mounts as it uses fuse
14:27
Check with ls and with ps
14:27
<dubkat>
ls /home/<me> shows an empty directory
14:27
<alkisg>
getltscfg -a
14:27
What does this give you?
14:28
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, it gets even funnier
14:28
<dubkat>
too much to paste :)
14:28
<alkisg>
pastebin.com
14:28
<Hyperbyte>
I hope you can help me with this before you go to sleep
14:28
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: in about 5 min... shoot :)
14:28
<Hyperbyte>
With one screen, there's half a 'ghost desktop' on the second screen... plugging it in after boot doesn't turn it on
14:28
So half of the desktop (incidentally, the part with the gnome-panel) isn't visible
14:29
<dubkat>
http://pastebin.ca/2068654
14:29
<Hyperbyte>
If I have two screens, it shows only the right screen with small resolution
14:29
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: when you turn off one screen, it's still detected, did you pull out the vga cable?
14:29
<Hyperbyte>
I have xrandr
14:29
<alkisg>
Or are you trying the dual screen thing now?
14:29
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, yes, I pulled the cable out on the back of the client
14:29
Trying now.
14:29
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: ok, pastebin the output of xrandr
14:30
<Hyperbyte>
http://secondary.recreatie-zorg.nl/jan/xrandr-dual.txt
14:30
DVI doesn't turn on though, but probably because the screen doesn't support 640x480... it's a 24" monitor
14:31
I think the autodetection is wonky. With one screen plugged it actually detects correctly (or at least xrandr shows reasonable output), but no second screen
14:32
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: so if you run e.g. xrandr --output DVI1 --mode 800x600, does it work?
14:32
<Hyperbyte>
I try
14:33
<alkisg>
dubkat: ps -ef|grep sshfs (on the client), does that show anything?
14:33
(on the local xterm)
14:33
<dubkat>
no
14:34
<alkisg>
It seems that it needs debugging, not enough time to help now, wait for someone else
14:35
<Hyperbyte>
Cannot find crtc for output DVI1
14:36
<alkisg>
Fun. Yeah leave it for tomorrow as you said :)
14:36
<Hyperbyte>
Well
14:36
Problem being that with one really small resolution
14:36
Or one really big resolution with gnome panel missing
14:36
It's not gonna work. :(
14:36
<alkisg>
Ah, it's not working correctly when you only use 1 monitor?
14:36
<Hyperbyte>
No
14:37
1 screen = desktop expanding to second screen
14:37
2 screens = desktop on one screen, low resolution
14:38
This sucks.
14:39
<alkisg>
Yeah... well people here with 2 monitors did manage to make them working, but it'll be difficult to find the discussions at the logs
14:39
And Gadi's not here to help you with his xrandr magic... :-/
14:43
<Hyperbyte>
:(
14:43
I'm gonna play a bit with XRANDR lts.conf settings I guess
14:43
<alkisg>
Try the one with the 1 screen, it sounds easier for now
14:43
Login, run xrandr, see the output, and then play with XRANDR* in lts.conf
14:44
Good luck. And good night all
14:44
<Hyperbyte>
Thanks a bunch
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15:18
<Hyperbyte>
:O
15:18
I'm actually getting closer with this
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15:34
<dreidy>
hey
15:34
it's dubkat
15:34
i got a problem
15:34
plz2help
15:34
i got a problem with my clients all of a sudden, they all say they cant connect to the NBD Server
15:35
i even rebooted the darn server
15:40
15:43
<Hyperbyte>
ps aux | grep nbd-server
15:46
<dreidy>
not running
15:46
when i try to start it manually, it says "no exports"
15:46
i didn't touch any of its settings (i dont think), so im not sure why its even an issue now
15:49
also, isn't that started from inetd ?
15:49
(and that is running)
15:51
<Hyperbyte>
If it says "no exports" and then fails to start, it's a logical assumption that it starts on boot, just fails
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15:52
<Hyperbyte>
mhm
15:54
I'm sorry, I don't know.
15:54
ls /opt/ltsp/images/ ?
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16:00
<dreidy>
UGH
16:00
UUUUUUUUUUUUGH
16:00
one should not touch this stuff when they are over worked and exhausted
16:00
fixed
16:01
i totally chowned /opt/ltsp with some wacked permissions
16:01
probably typed too fast
16:01
thanks, back latter
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17:59
<dubkat>
thanks for your help
17:59
that was horrible :)
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00:00--- Wed May 25 2011