IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 22 May 2014   (all times are UTC)

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01:20
<fu1five>
hello
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14:19
<santos>
question
14:20
is there a way to prompt a user to change his password
14:20
after its creation
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14:22
<santos>
like you insert all students and then let then write ther own password
14:22
<gvy>
santos, http://lmgtfy.com/?q=is+there+a+way+to+prompt+a+linux+user+to+change+his+password
14:23* gvy . o O ( cyberciti is relevant as usual )
14:23
<santos>
heheheheehehehehe so funny hehehehehehehehehehehe
14:23
heheheheheheehehehe
14:23
thanks man
14:23
<gvy>
welcome man :-)
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14:36
<Kanito>
Hi
14:36
I have installed an LTSP 5 over Centos 6.5
14:37
(I have installed a lot of LTSP 4.2, but is my first LTSP 5)
14:37
It have an wear behavior with mouse
14:38
screen seems to be 3 or 4 inches at left of where it appears
14:38
when I put the mouse pinter 3 or 4 inches to the left, it works
14:39
and mouse want not to go to the top right of the screen
14:39
it stops 2 or 3 inches from the right margin
14:39
when I log in the session it works fine
14:39
but if I log in a Windows 2008R2 via xfreerdp... it happens again
14:41
I dont know how to google it!!!, How you can name this strange behavior? mouse out of sync?
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15:10
<gbaman>
hey vagrantc, been trying to get Raspi-LTSP working on Ubuntu (14.04)
15:11
was all going well http://pastebin.com/u5g24Kjn
15:11
till boom chroot: failed to run command ‘locale-gen’: No such file or directory
15:11
<vagrantc>
until one day...
15:12
locale-gen should be run inside the chroot ...
15:12
<gbaman>
root@andrew-14:/# locale-gen
15:12
bash: locale-gen: command not found
15:12
this is inside chroot btw
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15:13
<gbaman>
the issue only occurs when building on Ubuntu
15:13
<santos>
whats the latest ltsp version for ubuntu?
15:13
<vagrantc>
you might need to specify VENDOR=Debian
15:13
on the commandline
15:14
i.e. VENDOR=Debian ltsp-build-client ...
15:14
<gbaman>
am using PPA version
15:14
<vagrantc>
doesn't matter
15:14
<gbaman>
was answering your initial question
15:14
shouldnt LTSP set that?
15:14
seeing as I am setting DIST to Wheezy?
15:15
<vagrantc>
it can't, the logic for what to do is inside the vendor code
15:15
<gbaman>
ok, will try with that
15:15
<vagrantc>
so it's running the codepath for ubuntu...
15:18
<gbaman>
having VENDOR=Debian in front of the code shouldn't break anything when actually run on Debian right?
15:23
<vagrantc>
no, should be fine
15:24
you might have issues if run on Fedora or something
15:24
debian and ubuntu are fairly compatible, but other distros may be a bit too far off to expect it to work
15:24
<gbaman>
I am not supported Fedora!
15:24
Sticking with Debian and Ubuntu..
15:28
ahha! I: Configuring locales...
15:28
and it crashed
15:28
was going so well...
15:28
404 on the Raspbian repo??
15:29
wasnt expecting that
15:29
http://pastebin.com/Xm8EmLHh
15:32
so it is expecting wheezy-updates
15:32
which does not exist
15:33
<vagrantc>
you'll want --updates-mirror none ... if i remember correctly
15:35
gbaman: another idea would be to ship a pre-built raspbian image
15:35
<gbaman>
why is that not thrown up with Debian though?
15:35
<vagrantc>
gbaman: then you could just drop it on whatever server they wanted
15:35
gbaman: that is an interesting question...
15:36
<gbaman>
It isnt really that complicated once they are running my software
15:36
but is getting to that stage is the current complicated bit
15:36
<vagrantc>
the code probably chose not to use an updates-mirror?
15:36
<gbaman>
I want them to build the OS, don't want to be maintaining one
15:36
<vagrantc>
sure, just figured i'd suggest another option
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15:37
<gbaman>
so UPDATE_MIRROR=none in the config file?
15:37
<santos>
hello I just did a clean install in edubuntu 12.04 of ltsp
15:37
<vagrantc>
you gonna make me look at the code? :P
15:37
<santos>
keep getting version 3.2
15:37
?
15:37
<vagrantc>
santos: what do you mean by version 3.2 ?
15:38
<santos>
I think I made the wrong question
15:38
<gbaman>
anything stand out to you wrong with this vagrantc? http://pastebin.com/iTF8paRL
15:38
<vagrantc>
gbaman: oh, probably on debian wheezy it didn't yet support the updates-mirror code ... i might have introduced that in newer LTSP versions
15:38
<santos>
please how do I check what ltsp version aam running?
15:38
<vagrantc>
santos: ltsp-info
15:38
!pastebin | echo santos
15:38
<ltsp>
santos pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
15:39
<vagrantc>
santos: be sure to use a pastebin.
15:39
<santos>
got it
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15:40
<gbaman>
building again, 3rd time lucky?
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15:50
<santos>
is there a way to force user to change password
15:50
?
15:51
if I use chage user is denied in ltsp
15:51
<gbaman>
with LDM, not that I know of?
15:51
vagrantc: any idea?
15:52
<championofcyrodi>
maybe you could try http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/rhel-debian-force-users-to-change-passwords/ and have them switch to tty1 when logging in the first time.
15:52
<gbaman>
sigh, vagrantc it ignored the item in the config file
15:52
same error
15:53
<santos>
how to do that champion?
15:53
<championofcyrodi>
sudo chage -d 0 <user>
15:53
<santos>
the last part
15:53
<championofcyrodi>
^that should expire their password
15:53
then Ctrl + Alt + F1
15:53
at the login screen
15:53
<santos>
I have tried the the command chage
15:54
but when try to loggin it will fail
15:54
ooook
15:54
130 students
15:54
ummm
15:55
there must be an automatic way of doing it
15:55
<vagrantc>
santos: it's currently broken
15:55
<santos>
like a pop up
15:55
<vagrantc>
santos: using password expiry
15:55
<santos>
got it
15:55
<vagrantc>
that's one of the big reasons we need to get development on ltsp6 working
15:55
having a real pam stack
15:55
<santos>
need donations?
15:56
<championofcyrodi>
to make all users change password, you could dump all users to a text file, then using bash, loop through each user and use the command
15:56
<santos>
I am working in a project with ltsp if I get that I can donate some money
15:56
<vagrantc>
santos: i've definitely been wondering if a bouty system for ltsp6 wouldn't be a good idea ... but i have mixed feelings
15:57
<championofcyrodi>
just rub some money on the screen. It works for pro athletes when they are broken.
15:58
<santos>
let me know
15:58
heheheheheehe joke day today
16:00
<gbaman>
does the ltsp-build-client config file support different options?
16:01
oh wait
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16:01
<vagrantc>
you sure you got the variable correct?
16:01
<gbaman>
isnt UPDATE_MIRROR.. UPDATES_MIRROR :D
16:08
<santos>
recommended local apps for a schoo enviroment ???
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16:13
<santos>
firefox,chrome
16:13
vlc
16:14
thin clients are 2 Gb RAM
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16:20
<gbaman>
2gb is plenty for a thin clinet santos
16:20
<santos>
so local apps for a school. whch you recommend
16:21
server is an 8Gb
16:21
quad
16:25
<gbaman>
vagrantc: It is now building, seems happy, just getting this a lot http://pastebin.com/whg8PUmC
16:25
santos look at edubuntu
16:26
has piles of awesome educational apps
16:26
http://www.edubuntu.org/screenshots
16:26
<santos>
I want to know what apps are good to use as local apps
16:27
<gbaman>
ohh, sorry. No idea
16:29
<santos>
just installed gnome terminal in the chroot
16:29
just get a black screen
16:29
???
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16:40
<josh_m>
Hi. I'm trying to debug a ldm problem. I get the login screen but ldm restarts when I try to log in. Classic "no response, restarting" message
16:40
So, I'm thinking this has to be ssh related, right?
16:41
But I can't figure out exactly what's going on with SSH here.
16:41
I started SSHd in debug mode on the server and I never see a connection from the TC
16:43
And, naturally logging in and asking the question in IRC is all it took for me to discover the problem
16:44
:) ltd.conf had SERVER=hostname which resulted in a malformed /etc/hosts entry
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16:55
<gbaman>
hmm, vagrantc there is something up with the locales
16:55
<vagrantc>
ok
16:56
<championofcyrodi>
santos: with thin clients, i find it best to use the web browser as localapp
16:56
<vagrantc>
ubuntu and debian do locales quite differently, so that's not much surprise
16:56
<gbaman>
http://pastebin.com/h8W8Zczr
16:57
that was from inside the chroot
16:57
<championofcyrodi>
Basically, anything that uses graphics, i run locally
16:57
<santos>
office?
16:57
got it
16:57
<championofcyrodi>
libreoffice should be fine running remote
16:58
<vagrantc>
gbaman: grep -E ^[a-z] /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen
16:58
<gbaman>
nothign
16:59
*nothing
16:59
<vagrantc>
yup
16:59
gbaman: sudo ltsp-chroot dpkg-reconfigure locales
16:59
you need to specify the locales you want, since it can't inherrit it from your ubuntu server.
17:00
gbaman: ltsp-build-client --locale
17:01
gbaman: ltsp-build-client --locale en_GB.UTF8
17:01
gbaman: or LOCALE in ltsp-build-client.conf
17:01
you could even have ltsp-build-client.conf run some shell code to detect the value
17:02
<gbaman>
keep in mind, whatever we do, has to support debian and ubuntu..
17:03
I am assuming using locale=en_GB.UTF8 in config file shouldnt break debian?
17:03
although, we could just check the OS..
17:06
<vagrantc>
LOCALE, but sure.
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17:07
<vagrantc>
gbaman: some things may end up being incompatible.
17:07
gbaman: you'll have to handle that in your code.
17:08* alkisg waves
17:08
<gbaman>
i am thinking will just check in the code if is ubuntu or debian
17:09
<vagrantc>
gbaman: so far, i don't think i've suggested anything that would be incompatible
17:09
<gbaman>
ok?
17:09
<alkisg>
santos: for school environments, and with 2 GB RAM on the clients, fat clients are the best:
17:09
!ltsp-pnp
17:09
<ltsp>
ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
17:10
<gbaman>
for locales
17:10
<santos>
let me check that
17:10
<alkisg>
santos: read also the page about fatclients for general info, but don't follow the instructions there, ltsp-pnp is easier...
17:10
!fatclients
17:10
<ltsp>
fatclients: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
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17:20
<Ark74>
vagrantc, so if i find details on the locals, first rebuild the locales on the server then, specify the desired locale when building the chroot image?
17:21
<gbaman>
Ark74: you are having locales issues too?
17:21
<Ark74>
just one app
17:21
a kde one
17:22
when using it as a localapp, it showed as english when i'm using spanish
17:22
<vagrantc>
Ark74: i don't know your situation enough to say if it's relevent
17:22
<alkisg>
Ark74: what distribution?
17:22
<Ark74>
Ubuntu 12.04
17:23
<alkisg>
Install language-pack-kde-es to the chroot
17:23
<Ark74>
i did, but since i'm using a ppa i never made a lot of noise
17:23
about it
17:24
but if rebuilding the image could help. i'll give it a second try
17:24
<alkisg>
You can easily check if translations are working:
17:24
sudo ltsp-chroot
17:24
<vagrantc>
in some ways the ppa is better supported on ubuntu
17:24
<alkisg>
gettext -d application "english text"
17:25
<vagrantc>
figuring out what "application" is can by tricky sometimes
17:25
<alkisg>
It's the name of the .mo file
17:25
dpkg -S application => gives you the package name
17:25
dpkg -L application | grep mo => gives you the translation domain
17:26
<Ark74>
dpkg -d kolourpaint4 "what goes here?"
17:26
<alkisg>
Ark74: also try with kde-l10n-es
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17:27
<alkisg>
Yeah for colourpaint we're using kde-l10n-el here, you just need -es there
17:27
<Ark74>
ok, i'll try
17:27
<alkisg>
Any text that kolourpaint has
17:27
A menu, a dialog...
17:27
<Ark74>
ohhh
17:27
it will search for it?
17:28
<alkisg>
It will translate it using your locale
17:28
<Ark74>
or give an output matching that text?
17:28
<alkisg>
For example:
17:28
https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/kolourpaint/+pots/kolourpaint/es/+translate
17:28
gettext -d kolourpaint4 'Paint Program for KDE'
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17:28
<alkisg>
It should say: Programa de pintura para KDE
17:30
<Ark74>
ohh, there are always new stuff to write down and learn :)
17:30
thanks
17:39
<alkisg>
In my chroot: gettext -d kolourpaint 'Paint Program for KDE'
17:39
Πρόγραμμα ζωγραφικής για το KDE
17:43
<Ark74>
i'll check it on my test network
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18:37
<gbaman>
vagrantc: that didnt fix it btw
18:37
http://pastebin.com/7Kr1krMd
18:38
and the config file used to generate it http://pastebin.com/FdK3gEAW
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19:04
<gbaman>
actually, might be fixed
19:05
scratch that
19:06
is still broke
19:06
any ideas vagrantc?
19:07
<vagrantc>
gbaman: fix ubuntu's locale handling in LTSP?
19:07
<alkisg>
Locales end in UTF-8, not UTF8
19:07
<vagrantc>
gbaman: is it actually causing problems?
19:08
gbaman: or is it just noisy?
19:08
<gbaman>
noisy :)
19:08
and wasnt there on Debian
19:08
<vagrantc>
don't worry about it.
19:08
<gbaman>
when something complains that much...
19:09
<alkisg>
Are those messages before or after the locales get installed?
19:10
Because, before locales get installed, if you have LANG/LANGUAGE set to some locale that isn't installed, the warnings are expected...
19:10
<gbaman>
alkisg: it is after it should be installed
19:10
<vagrantc>
gbaman: LANG=C ltsp-build-client
19:11
gbaman: that'll "fix" the issue.
19:11
or LC_ALL=C ...
19:11
<gbaman>
is it the right way though or a quick fix
19:11
?
19:11
<vagrantc>
the right way is to install debian on debian :P
19:11
<gbaman>
:D
19:12
<alkisg>
gbaman: so if you run ltsp-chroot now, and try to install something, you're still getting perl messages about the locale?
19:12
<vagrantc>
gbaman: like alkisg said, there's probably a typo in what you're setting for the locale.
19:12
<gbaman>
yes alkisg
19:12
<alkisg>
gbaman: env | grep ^L
19:12
<gbaman>
LOCALE=en_GB.UTF8
19:12
<alkisg>
locale -a
19:12
<vagrantc>
grep ^[a-z] /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen
19:13
<alkisg>
gbaman: did you read what I wrote about UTF8 above?
19:13
<gbaman>
sigh...
19:13
<alkisg>
(10:07:29 μμ) alkisg: Locales end in UTF-8, not UTF8
19:13
<gbaman>
time to try again building the OS :)
19:13
<alkisg>
gbaman: first, try to chroot without getting warnings
19:13
Once you have that part, then go on to running ltsp-build-client again
19:15humbert has left IRC (humbert!~Edgar@31.163.201.104, Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
19:15
<gbaman>
checked /etc/locale.gen, is en_GB.UTF-8
19:15
if i uncomment it and regen the locales it is happy
19:16
time to rebuild
19:16
<vagrantc>
your software going to be used outside of en_GB ? :P
19:17
<gbaman>
hmm
19:17
is there a way I can grab it from ubuntu?
19:17
although I am sure 99% of users will be english
19:18
that 1% could get annoyed :D
19:21
can just grab from $LANG
19:21
sorted
19:23
sorted LOCALE=$LANG
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19:25
<vagrantc>
if LANG is set
19:31
<alkisg>
install)
19:31
if [ -z "$LOCALE" ]; then
19:31
LOCALE="$LANG"
19:31
fi
19:31
That code is already there
19:31
So just don't set locale...
19:32
<Ark74>
sorry, to ask about this here, you can just skip the question
19:33
how do you set a l10n file to a kde program?
19:33
(manually)
19:33
<vagrantc>
alkisg: not on Debian
19:34
<Ark74>
there are 422 people at #kde and no answer
19:35
<alkisg>
vagrantc: isn't gbaman talking about ubuntu chroots now?
19:35
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it's an ubuntu server installing raspbian using the Debian vendor plugins...
19:35
<alkisg>
Ah
19:35
<vagrantc>
a real mongrel :)
19:35
<alkisg>
(10:33:09 μμ) Ark74: how do you set a l10n file to a kde program? ==> re-phrase, I didn't understand the question
19:36
<vagrantc>
Ark74: you want to update the translation files?
19:36
<Ark74>
nope, the program is not using any translation file, even when they exist
19:37
<alkisg>
Ark74: sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
19:37
env|grep ^L
19:37
gettext -d kolourpaint 'Paint Program for KDE'
19:37
What's the output of those?
19:39
<Ark74>
kolourpaint is fine now, i'm stuck at kdenlive
19:39
let me get the output
19:40
<gbaman>
alkisg: am trying to port to ubuntu as it is just way easier to use for a beginner
19:41
and weirdly it didnt like "LOCALE=$LANG" in the config file... "error: Bad entry 'en_GB.UTF-8 ' "
19:41
am wondering about the space there seems to be at the end?
19:41
<alkisg>
Not all config files are shell files
19:42
They don't all support $VARs
19:42
<gbaman>
well, that wasnt actually in the config file
19:42
it replaced it when it was writing the config file
19:43
which i had forgotten..
19:43
let me check it
19:44
the actual config file has "LOCALE=en_GB.UTF-8"
19:44
well, without speech marks
19:44
<Ark74>
alkisg, http://paste.ubuntu.com/7502763/
19:45
<alkisg>
Ark74: and, when does it _not_ use the translations?
19:45
<Ark74>
on screen
19:46
<alkisg>
Thin client?
19:46
<Ark74>
nor server :(
19:46
i see the file
19:46
but it's not using it
19:46
<alkisg>
Run kdenlive from a terminal, and, before running it, check the env|grep ^L output again
19:46
<Ark74>
any translation for that matter
19:47
<alkisg>
or the gettext line
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19:50
<Ark74>
it is using LANG=es_MX.UTF-8
19:51
the l10n file is here: /usr/share/locale/es/LC_MESSAGES/kdenlive.mo
19:51
<alkisg>
strace -e trace=file kdenlive 2>&1 | grep LC_MESSAGES
19:53
It does sound like a code issue though...
19:54
<Ark74>
yeah, here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7502791/
19:56
it's looking on some directories, i'll check that
19:58
the esiest would be create symbolic links to the files it looks for
19:58
right?
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20:06
<gbaman>
weird
20:06
http://pastebin.com/57YTc0et
20:06
they all are set?
20:06
yet still throwing errors?
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20:12
<Ark74>
alkisg, vagrantc muchas gracias :) now i have to figure this out
20:13
<alkisg>
Ark74: access("/usr/share/locale/es/LC_MESSAGES/kdenlive.mo", R_OK) = 0 ==> it finds the file
20:14
<Ark74>
mmm, then it may be one of the many files that it claims is missing
20:15
<alkisg>
No that's normal, it's looking in many places until it finds it
20:15
gbaman: and you're sure you have the en_GB locale installed?
20:16
<Ark74>
then is code related, i pressume
20:16
<alkisg>
gbaman: i.e., language-pack-en-base
20:17
<gbaman>
alkisg: that an apt package?
20:17
<alkisg>
It's a package that you can install with apt, yes
20:17
<gbaman>
apparently not with Raspbian...
20:17
weird..
20:17
<alkisg>
Ah
20:17
<gbaman>
root@andrew-Ubuntu-14:/# apt-cache search language-pack
20:17
inkscape - vector-based drawing program
20:17
<alkisg>
sorry I keep forgeting it's only the server that's ubuntu
20:18
<gbaman>
haha, yes
20:18
<alkisg>
gbaman: what's the output of `locale -a` ?
20:19
<gbaman>
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/12c9561819c78023fe30
20:19
<alkisg>
So, you don't have any locale configured
20:19
<gbaman>
looks like you are right alkisg
20:20
when it was generating them i got error: Bad entry 'en_GB.UTF-8 '
20:23
the config file for ltsp-build-client was
20:23
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/e1aefd52ac219593c144
20:24
<alkisg>
Again, UTF-8, not UTF8
20:25
<vagrantc>
gbaman: you misspelled en_GB.UTF-8 again
20:25
<gbaman>
oops, wrong server
20:25
<Ark74>
alkisg, then since kdenlive finds the .mo file, gettext can translate the line, but for other reason the application won't handle the trasnlations
20:25
<gbaman>
have 2 servers running sshing into both :)
20:26
<alkisg>
Ark74: yes, for example it might not be calling the correct gettext domain function
20:26
<gbaman>
ok, here is the locale -a of correct server
20:26
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/193cf543bbcb978b1ff2
20:26
<vagrantc>
grep -E ^[a-z] /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen
20:26
<alkisg>
And the output of `locale` there?
20:26
<gbaman>
wait a sec
20:27
<vagrantc>
locale displays differently.
20:27
<gbaman>
probably should ltsp-chroot, that would be smart
20:27
<vagrantc>
.utf8 vs. .UTF-8
20:27
<alkisg>
Most libs/apps can handle both utf8 and UTF-8
20:28
<gbaman>
locale http://pastebin.com/rf2DJaJN
20:28
<Ark74>
ok, thanks
20:28
<alkisg>
There was some discussion about which of them is more correct, I don't think there was concensus
20:28
<vagrantc>
gbaman: ltsp-chroot dpkg -l locales
20:28
<gbaman>
build config file https://gist.github.com/anonymous/92ff6035648443da135b
20:28
<alkisg>
gbaman: also try: LANG=en_GB.utf8 locale
20:29
<gbaman>
vagrantc: https://gist.github.com/anonymous/c08e209002d908dbface
20:29
<vagrantc>
gbaman: grep -E ^[a-z] /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen
20:29
?
20:29
<gbaman>
alkisg: https://gist.github.com/anonymous/3d200f6f4a53cbcf7545
20:30
<alkisg>
gbaman: and all those pastebins are from inside the chroot?
20:30
<gbaman>
yes
20:30
root@andrew-14:/# grep -E ^[a-z] /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen
20:30
/bin/grep: /opt/ltsp/armhf/etc/locale.gen: No such file or directory
20:30
haha
20:30
which of course wont work
20:30
from inside the chroot
20:30
<vagrantc>
no, you'll have to use your powers
20:31
<gbaman>
root@andrew-14:/# grep -E ^[a-z] etc/locale.gen
20:31
en_GB.UTF-8
20:31
<vagrantc>
en_US.UTF-8 UTF-8
20:31
is what it should say
20:31
<gbaman>
I am in UK?
20:31
<alkisg>
en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8
20:31
<vagrantc>
again, use your powers of substitution
20:31
<gbaman>
ok?
20:31
<alkisg>
There's a second UTF-8 there
20:32
Then, run locale-gen again
20:32
<vagrantc>
yeah, the encoding is both part of the locale, and a second column for the encoding
20:33
<gbaman>
so I should actually have LOCALE=en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8 ?
20:33
<vagrantc>
the /etc/locale.gen syntax may have changed...
20:33
no
20:33
<gbaman>
in the ltsp-build-client config file?
20:33
<vagrantc>
i think you've discovered a bug in the ltsp-build-client plugins
20:34
<gbaman>
yay? :)
20:35
<vagrantc>
i'll dig in and verify for sure
20:35
<alkisg>
echo "$LOCALE" >> $ROOT/etc/locale.gen
20:35
Maybe using sed would be better?
20:36
I.e. uncommenting the existing line of the locale...
20:36
gbaman: first, manually edit /etc/locale.gen
20:36
<vagrantc>
alkisg: if there is an existing lie
20:36
line
20:36
<alkisg>
Put this there: en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8
20:36
With the second UTF-8
20:37
Then run locale-gen
20:37
Then run locale
20:37
If it works now, we're more certain it's a bug that needs to be fixed...
20:38
<gbaman>
error: Bad entry 'en_GB.UTF-8 '
20:38
hmm
20:38
wait
20:38
scratch that
20:38
is happy now
20:39
https://gist.github.com/anonymous/5ae93db96afb6516f0f5
20:39
of course, right at the end from the ltsp-build-client en_GB.UTF-8
20:40
meaning I could just put en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8 in the ltsp-build-client config file
20:41
<alkisg>
vagrantc: it might be better to grep the line from SUPPORTED, then add it to locale.gen, but only if it doesn't already exist
20:41
<vagrantc>
alkisg: for it to work properly it needs to be there before the files exist.
20:41
well, to minimize the noise.
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20:41
<gbaman>
vagrantc: if this is a bug in LTSP, am assuming a fix would take ages to filter through?
20:42
<vagrantc>
gbaman: that will likely cause other issues
20:42
gbaman: in ltsp-build-client? if you're using the PPA, it's probably as fast as alkisg is willing to upload it
20:43
though, why did it work "correctly" when run on a debian system?
20:43
<gbaman>
..
20:43
because it just imports it from parent OS?
20:43
<vagrantc>
right.
20:44
it just copies /etc/locale.gen from the server...
20:44
<gbaman>
yeah?
20:44
<vagrantc>
so it's a well-hidden bug on Debian
20:44
<gbaman>
yeah
20:44
<vagrantc>
it only is triggered if you try to set the locale settings using --locale or LOCALE=
20:45
<alkisg>
vagrantc: shouldn't LANG be set to C before "locales" get installed?
20:45
<vagrantc>
gbaman: but you can't work around it by setting LOCALE="foo_BAR.UTF-8 UTF-8" as that will do other things.
20:46
this is such a corner-case...
20:47
<gbaman>
i was using LOCALE= vagrantc
20:48
<vagrantc>
when what?
20:48
<gbaman>
You were asking if --locale or LOCALE= ?
20:48
<vagrantc>
i was stating that is what triggers the bug.
20:48
<gbaman>
ah
20:49
<vagrantc>
the locales handling code in Debian works as long as the server's /etc/locale.gen is correct. Ubuntu doesn't have /etc/locale.gen.
20:50
but if you specify --locale=foo_BAR or use LOCALE=foo_BAR it breaks.
20:50
<alkisg>
vagrantc: I think LOCALE="en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8" will actually work
20:50
<vagrantc>
because it puts an invalid entry into the chroot's /etc/locale.gen
20:50
<alkisg>
export LANG=$(echo "$LOCALE" | awk '{print $1}')
20:50
That line seems to expect locale to have the second UTF-8 there
20:50
<vagrantc>
true enough, i guess.
20:51
why ugly code.
20:51
what ugly code.
20:51
<gbaman>
so that is the answer for now?
20:51
<alkisg>
gbaman: so, when trying again, try with LOCALE="en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8"
20:51
<vagrantc>
gbaman: looks so.
20:51
<gbaman>
ok alkisg, will run a build, should take about 20 mins
20:51
<vagrantc>
i wrote that in 2006.
20:52
i think i was trying to support non-UTF-8 locales ... as at the time, they were still supported in Debian.
20:53
gbaman: you caching the downloaded packages?
20:53
<gbaman>
nope
20:53* vagrantc hands gbaman approx or apt-cacher-ng or squid-deb-proxy or ...
20:53
<gbaman>
haha
20:53
yes, yes
20:53
I doubt it would save much time really
20:53
<vagrantc>
local mirror?
20:54
<alkisg>
...or --mount-package-cache mount package cache dir from server
20:54
<vagrantc>
that one too
20:54
<gbaman>
which is ubuntu
20:54
and amd64
20:54
not arm
20:54
<alkisg>
It doesn't matter, it's just a folder to be kept
20:54
<vagrantc>
would still work, it's just "apt-get clean" would purge them...
20:55
or autoclean
20:55
<gbaman>
building now
20:55
lets see if it complains
20:56
if i use LOCALE="en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8" is it going to break tomorrow?
20:58
<vagrantc>
should be fine.
20:58* vagrantc will try to fix so LOCALE="en_GB.UTF-8" will work
20:59
<gbaman>
:)
20:59
thanks
20:59
<vagrantc>
i guess Debian still technically supports some non-UTF-8 locales...
20:59
<gbaman>
but will anyone ever be using them vagrantc?
21:00
<alkisg>
vagrantc: Ubuntu's using LOCALE without the second UTF-8 part, i.e. like LANG
21:00
<vagrantc>
alkisg: yes, i know.
21:01
also, it only supports setting a single locale...
21:02
UTF-8 locales will either end in .utf8 or .UTF-8 ... usually.
21:02
although there are some native UTF-8 locales that don't specify .UTF-8 ...
21:03
<alkisg>
Because that's the default for them
21:03
locale.gen and SUPPORTED map from LANG to charset...
21:04
<vagrantc>
does Ubuntu have /usr/share/i18n/SUPPORTED ?
21:04
could just continue to require the whole line...
21:04
<alkisg>
$ dpkg -S /usr/share/i18n/SUPPORTED
21:04
locales: /usr/share/i18n/SUPPORTED
21:04
<vagrantc>
but that is confusing...
21:05
<alkisg>
I think you can start with LANG=C, then install locales, then use SUPPORTED
21:05
<vagrantc>
right
21:05
<alkisg>
Before locales gets installed, LANG=en_US will just produce warnings, right?
21:06
So setting it to "C" at first sounds better...
21:06
<vagrantc>
it already does that
21:07
<gbaman>
success
21:07
Generating locales (this might take a while)...
21:07
en_GB.UTF-8... done
21:07
Generation complete.
21:07
wont be certain till it finishes, but looking good
21:08
<alkisg>
vagrantc: Btw, why not special-case locales so that it's installed before the other packages? It does make sense, e.g. I'd want to see the installation errors about "package-xyz" in Greek, and I wouldn't have that if locales were installed in the same `apt-get install` line as package-xyz...
21:08
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it does.
21:08
<alkisg>
Cool
21:08
<vagrantc>
it adds it to the list of packages to install via debootstrap
21:09* alkisg stops spamming with ideas until he reads the ltsp-build-client code... which probably won't ever happen... :D
21:09
<vagrantc>
unconditionally installs locales, actually
21:09
was too complicated to avoid.
21:10
alkisg: nothing better than someone with good ideas telling you to do something you did 8 years ago :)
21:11
<alkisg>
:D
21:13
<vagrantc>
hrm.
21:14
to make this more automated is more code than i really want to dig in with...
21:16
it really does require pulling the locale out of /usr/share/i18n/SUPPORTED ... guess that's not *so* hard.
21:23
<gbaman>
vagrantc: famous last words?
21:23
:)
21:24
<alkisg>
Fun... The .mo files go anywhere in en*/LC_MESSAGES... http://paste.debian.net/101291/
21:24
<gbaman>
so in the end I am doing $LANG + UTF-8?
21:24
how ever you concatenate in BASH...
21:24
<alkisg>
"$LANG UTF-8"
21:25
<gbaman>
oh yeah...
21:25
I really do hate BASH..
21:25
especially if statements...
21:25
it is so picky
21:27
hmmm, I do need an apt-cache..
21:28
<alkisg>
Again, see what we suggested above, --mount-package-cache
21:29
<gbaman>
I am running multiple virtual machines
21:31
<alkisg>
And?
21:35
<gbaman>
each will need to download it
21:35
i frequently wipe the installs and start afresh
21:37
<vagrantc>
gbaman: how fast is your mirror? with a local cache, what normally takes me a few minutes takes seconds ...
21:38
<gbaman>
no idea how fast the raspbian mirror system is
21:39
<vagrantc>
you said it took 20 minutes to build LTSP... how uch of that is spent downloading packages? :P
21:39
apt usually tells you.
21:39
<gbaman>
it didnt give a time
21:39
<vagrantc>
granted, debootstrap doesn't, but that's a relatively small part of the downloads
21:39
<gbaman>
I am looking into setting one up now
21:40
and here is the raspbian mirror stats http://www.raspbian.org/munin/bytemark/raspbian.org/if_bond0.html
21:40
<vagrantc>
gbaman: at any rate, thanks for reporting this corner-case issue: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/revision/2563
21:41
gbaman: that tells me nothing about how fast it gets to you
21:41
<gbaman>
and how would one check that?
21:41
<vagrantc>
which i don't really need to know, it's more of a rhetorical question
21:41
apt-get -d some-big-package
21:41
er, apt-get -d install some-big-package
21:42
that'll give you a summary of the speed
21:42
the kernel package is a good start...
21:42
ltsp-chroot apt-get -d --reinstall install linux-image-3.2.0-4-rpi
21:42
<gbaman>
will play about with it tomorrow, gota go
21:42
<vagrantc>
good luck
21:43
<gbaman>
thanks for help vagrantc and alkisg
21:43gbaman has left IRC (gbaman!~gbaman@host81-130-112-2.in-addr.btopenworld.com, )
21:43
<vagrantc>
and thanks for the help! :)
21:43
i guess with that code in place, i could also just ensure that $LANG was in there, if set.
21:44
and probably use sed, like alkisg suggested...
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