IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 16 February 2014   (all times are UTC)

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00:55
<anivair>
dmrc says ubuntu. trying default
01:04
no dice on that either. Which means that somewhere my default login session is set as ubuntu-2d?
01:05
hrm ....
01:05
I recall once a long time ago having to disable hardware acceleration due to some crappy thin clients
01:05
I don't know where that happened, though
01:38
maybe I can just delete all the old garbage and start fresh? Any easy way to do this?
01:39
it used to be about deleting the dconf and gnome files, but I don't know if that works any more
01:47
nevermind, I'm wrong. I just created a brand new user and it's also getting that error
01:51
has to be something in the ltsp defaults?
01:52
boom
01:52
in lts.conf
02:15
okay ... I commented out everything in lts.conf, which seemed to work well till everything was unside down and reversed
02:15
hrm ...
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11:40
<burnedbrainZ>
hello o/
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15:17
<anivair>
Anyone know what the default lts.conf looks like? Mine was trying to call ubuntu-2d, which is wrong, but I don't know what to put in there either
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16:35
<anivair>
Okay .... slowly improving. System is coming up and I see my background, but I get no desktop interface
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16:50
<anivair>
Yeah, still no desktops. backgrounds galore, but no desktops
16:50
very odd
16:50
Any ideas?
16:53
I'm trying hard not to default back to my old production server, though I guess it's nice to know I can if I have to
17:01
<alkisg1>
!gnome-classic
17:01
<ltsp_>
gnome-classic: To select gnome-classic as your default session, install the gnome-session-fallback package, and put this line in your lts.conf: LDM_SESSION="gnome-session --session=gnome-classic"
17:02
<anivair>
I'll give it a shot, thanks
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17:17
<anivair>
"failed ot load session "gnome=classic"
17:17
that pretty much happens no matter what I put in there
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17:17
<anivair>
er, gnome-classic
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17:31
<anivair>
I think i'm officially baffled. I do have gnome-session-fallback installed just fine
17:31
but apparently it doesn't agre
17:31
agree
17:36
apparently the correct input was gnome-fallback, not gnome-classic. up and running now
17:36
<Hyperbyte>
ls /usr/share/xsessions/
17:37
That's all available sessions.
17:37
<anivair>
thanks!
17:37
I see those
17:38
I suppose I should have been clever enough to try hnome
17:38
anyone know if fallback is less hardware intensive? I may just stick with it, since it seems to be working fine
17:38
<Hyperbyte>
Don't know, but I'm using fallback.
17:39* Hyperbyte really dislikes Unity
17:44
<alkisg1>
It's much less hardware intensive
17:44
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg1, how about your schools?
17:44
What's the desktop of choice?
17:45
<alkisg1>
We give them live CDs that have gnome-fallback preinstalled, and a matching lts.conf to select it
17:45
So they never even see unity :)
17:45
<Hyperbyte>
Nor Gnome 3
17:45
<alkisg1>
Right. They're not suitable for LTSP.
17:46
(and personally I wouldn't use them outside of ltsp either)
17:48
<Hyperbyte>
I'd use either Gnome fallback or MATE
17:48
Not sure which is better choice.
17:49
alkisg1, you tried Gnome 3.8 yet?
17:50
<alkisg1>
When we selected gnome-fallback, mate wasn't really ready yet, and it wasn't clear that gnome-fallback was going to die sometime in the future
17:50
So now I think gnome-flashback might only be good for 14.04 and it might die after that
17:51
So after that (or maybe even _for_ 14.04) mate might be a good choice, we'll see
17:51
<Hyperbyte>
Have you tried Gnome 3.8, though?
17:51
<alkisg1>
Gnome-flashback in 14.04 is using gnome 3.8, yes
17:51
But maybe you're talking about gnome-shell instead?
17:52
<Hyperbyte>
Mainly, the Gnome 3.8 classic mode.
17:52
<alkisg1>
That requires acceleration,doesn't it?
17:52
<Hyperbyte>
Not sure?
17:52
<alkisg1>
It's just not as flashy... but still won't work for thin clients... right?
17:52
<Hyperbyte>
I haven't tried it.
17:53
<alkisg1>
I think it does, and it's using llvmpipe as a software fallback when true acceleration isn't available
17:53
Which is completely unusable in VMs and in thin clients
17:54
<Hyperbyte>
So what's gnome-flashback (as opposed to gnome-fallback?)?
17:54
<alkisg1>
Just a new name
17:54
For the same thing
17:54
<Hyperbyte>
Because I've read numerous times that gnome-fallback would be removed from 3.8. flashback is it's replacement?
17:55
<alkisg1>
I didn't understand all the news involved there
17:55
<anivair>
sounds like when I upgrade to the next lts I'll be installing mate, then. thanks for the heads up
17:56
TBH, keeping up with *nix news is not a significant part of my day anymore
17:56
<alkisg1>
gnome-fallback was going to get dropped, highvoltage and some others took over its maintainance, and it's still being maintained and is compatible with 3.8 and they want to make it compatible with 3.10 too
17:56
<anivair>
so you think it will stick around for a while or will mate be a better bet going forward?
17:56
<alkisg1>
It's not really developed anymore though, it's just in maintainance mode
17:56
<anivair>
(ultimately my end goal is just ot change stuff as infrequently as possible)
17:56
ahh
17:57
<alkisg1>
I don't know which DE will be best for LTSPers in the future...
17:57
XFCE will always be an option
17:58
<Hyperbyte>
Mate == Gnome 2.
17:58
<alkisg1>
LXDE with razorqt is switching to Qt, I don't know if the result there will be good enough
17:58
KDE has issues over the network
17:58
<Hyperbyte>
Gnome fallback/flashback == Gnome 3 with Gnome 2 functionality & looks
17:58
Both are comparable I think, anivair... question is, which one will be maintained longer?
17:59
<anivair>
true
17:59
<alkisg1>
Some ubuntu-ers claim that Unity 8 will work without 3d and will use little resources, but I don't trust canonical developed programs much, they are all about innovation and not about support, which is what we need
17:59
<vagrantc>
oh wow.
17:59
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg1, I'm very eager for Gnome Documents from 3.8. Editing Google Docs documents from outside a web browser would be awesome.
17:59
<vagrantc>
LXDE is the one desktop that currently supports reboot/shutdown on ltsp natively
17:59
<anivair>
well, Alkisg1 is right, the best bet for long term support will probably always be xfce
17:59
<alkisg1>
gnome2 with gdk was very fast on thin clients
17:59
<anivair>
I might implement that in my next build
18:00
<alkisg1>
newer gnome2 versions and now gnome3 use cairo and that's very slow on many many graphics cards because it's using software rendering for many driver functions that are not widely available
18:00
So the best desktop I've seen up to now was gnome 2 up to the version of ubuntu 10.04
18:01
From then on, it's been getting slower and more buggy for the usual old clients we use...
18:01
<Hyperbyte>
Maybe I should install LXDE at the radio station
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18:02
<vagrantc>
LXDE has worked well as a lightweight desktop for LTSP ... but they're switching to QT?
18:03
<alkisg>
I want to go though as little changes as possible... so if gnome-flashback is in a working state in 14.04, I'll stick to that, and re-evaluate in 16.04 (or jessie/jessie+1) the available desktops
18:03
vagrantc: yes, and merging with razor-qt
18:03
<anivair>
(OT: I've been trying to figure out why my mouse was misbehaving all weekend. I just discovered that it's because there's a second mouse plugged in that was hidden in a drawer all this time. #win)
18:03
<alkisg>
Haha
18:04
Well, at least the init system battle is over now... let's hope the DE battle will be better at some point in the future
18:05
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, it is? What init system is Ubuntu 14.04 using?
18:05
<alkisg>
I think upstart, but that's only because they don't have time yet to switch to systemd
18:06
systemd won the debian battle, and shuttleworth said ubuntu will eventually follow, and is already dropping upstart etc
18:08
<Hyperbyte>
Yay!
18:08
systemd would be awesome for LTSP too I bet.
18:08
<alkisg>
I think it'll introduce a lot of new bugs
18:09
Like e.g. now with logind where fat client users are not considered "active"
18:09
So they can't mount usb sticks etc
18:09
But we'll fix them, np, it's just good that we won't have to support multiple init systems
18:12
<anivair>
debian usually leads that charge
18:13
regardless of what canonical thinks
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