IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 29 June 2009   (all times are UTC)

00:07fotanus has quit IRC
00:11fotanus has joined #ltsp
01:02alkisg has joined #ltsp
01:59tarzeau has joined #ltsp
01:59
<tarzeau>
good morning
01:59
how can i set SendCoreEvents options to false in the mouse settings with lts.conf ?
02:37l0C0 has joined #ltsp
03:26phantom has quit IRC
03:28phantom has joined #ltsp
03:32otavio has quit IRC
03:45leio_ has joined #ltsp
03:51phantom has quit IRC
03:59markit has joined #ltsp
04:00
<markit>
hi, I've ltsp5 and I connect with rdesktop to win2003. rdesktop -f -k it 192.168.1.2 -r disk:usb=/mnt/usbdevice. The problem is that the client mounts correctly usb pendrive, I see a sort of "shared usb device" in COmputer Resources, but I can't see usb content, nor write to it. Any clue?
04:01leio has quit IRC
04:06phantom has joined #ltsp
04:13leio_ is now known as leio
04:15
<markit>
is LOCAL_STORAGE = Y needed?
04:18
<alkisg>
markit: LOCAL_STORAGE is deprecated, the new directive is LOCALDEV, and it defaults to True. So no, it isn't needed.
04:18
<markit>
sigh :(
04:19
can't find anything useful with google
04:19
it should "just work", but it does not
04:19
alkisg: do you have any experience to this regard?
04:20
<alkisg>
markit: it's been a long time since I used rdesktop, I don't remember the details
04:21mikkel has joined #ltsp
04:21
<alkisg>
markit: have a look at the logs, googling for: rdesktop usb stick site:nubae.com
04:21
<markit>
teh problem could be about permission, but how can I know what user is ltsp considering, since I don't login in ltsp?
04:23
<alkisg>
markit: I think Gadi says some things here, it this log: http://www.nubae.com/logs/archived/ltsp.log.01Nov2007
04:23
<markit>
thin client logs seem ok, I've following this guide: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebugLocalDev and I see the device recognized
04:23
<alkisg>
E.g. <Gadi> SCREEN_02          = "rdesktop -a 16 -k fr -f -d GLOBAL -r sound:local -r disk:USB=/tmp/drives -r disk:drives=/Drives"
04:24
If you don't find your way from the logs, then try to come back again later, the devs usually hang out here later on
04:25
<markit>
alkisg: thanks, problem is also that many doc I find is outdated, so I get more and more confused
04:32pmatulis has joined #ltsp
05:07leio_ has joined #ltsp
05:09leio has quit IRC
05:39alkisg1 has joined #ltsp
05:45alkisg has quit IRC
05:48alkisg1 is now known as alkisg
05:50fotanus has quit IRC
05:50pmatulis has quit IRC
05:56lucascoala has joined #ltsp
05:58lucascoala has quit IRC
06:30marcosmamorim has left #LTSP
06:31phantom has quit IRC
06:34phantom has joined #ltsp
06:41otavio has joined #ltsp
06:50BCM43 has joined #ltsp
06:50
<BCM43>
Has anybody used imacs as terminals?
07:03
<markit>
btw, /mnt is read only... so I wonder how -r disk:usb=/mnt/usbdevice could work
07:03
no one with a clue about usb pen and ltsp with rdesktop?
07:03
I'm trying to change in /tmp/usbdevice now, but don't know how things are handled
07:05
<BCM43>
markit: does not seem like a very busy channel. Or is it simply too early in the morning?
07:06
<markit>
no idea, sorry
07:07
but is really silent... probabli later will be better
07:08
<l0C0>
has anyone here used gpxe with LTSP?
07:12
<tarzeau>
05:09 < tarzeau> how can i set SendCoreEvents options to false in the mouse settings with lts.conf ?
07:13BCM43 has quit IRC
07:15
<_UsUrPeR_>
test
07:18ogra__ has joined #ltsp
07:18ogra_ has quit IRC
07:20
<alkisg>
l0C0: I've been using gPXE extensively with LTSP...
07:20ogra__ is now known as ogra_
07:20
<l0C0>
alkisg: fantastic, maybe you can help me
07:20
<alkisg>
I can try... what's your problem?
07:20* _UsUrPeR_ emerges from the ether
07:20
<l0C0>
in a gpxe script, I download the kernel and initrd from a webserver
07:21
<_UsUrPeR_>
good morning all!
07:21
<l0C0>
and then I boot, but it only boots into a basic shell
07:21
I presume there's something that I'm missing
07:22
<_UsUrPeR_>
l0C0: seems like X windows is crashing. What Client and Operating system are you running?
07:22
<l0C0>
it's Ubuntu
07:22
<alkisg>
l0C0: after the kernel is booted, a program named ipconfig tries to get an ip for the os to boot. That ip is different from the pxe one.
07:22
<l0C0>
ah right
07:22
<alkisg>
l0C0: so, do you have a dhcp server around that can point your client to the correct server?
07:23
<l0C0>
I don't, I don't have access to the DHCP server, which is the reason I need gPXE
07:24
<alkisg>
l0C0: then try putting "IPAPPEND 3" in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default to make it keep the pxe-stage IP.
07:24
l0C0: detailed instructions here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP#Adjusting%20pxelinux.cfg/default
07:25
<l0C0>
then will I have to do something to get that into the vmlinuz kernel image
07:25
?
07:25
<alkisg>
No no
07:26
It goes like this: gpxe => pxelinux => kernel
07:26
<l0C0>
ah right
07:26
<alkisg>
But pxelinux reads this file, and appends the IP as a kernel parameter
07:26pmatulis has joined #ltsp
07:26
<alkisg>
So you don't have to modify anything other than this pxelinux.cfg/default configuration file
07:26
<l0C0>
I've just been attempting to grab the kernel, and then the initrd, bypassing the pxelinux
07:26
<alkisg>
Ah
07:26pmatulis has quit IRC
07:26
<alkisg>
There's another way, then
07:27
<l0C0>
so instead of doing: kernel http://....
07:27
initrd http://....
07:27
<alkisg>
You can put the kernel parameter yourself in the vmlinuz command line
07:27
<l0C0>
ah right
07:27pmatulis has joined #ltsp
07:27
<ogra_>
neither will work if rootserver isnt coming from dhcp
07:27
<alkisg>
No no keep your script, let me tell you what you need to add
07:27
ogra_, why not? I've been using that with no problems
07:28
<ogra_>
you likely need to point to the right nbd server
07:28phantom has quit IRC
07:28
<alkisg>
OK let me tell him the parameter first...
07:28
<ogra_>
dnsmasq forwards rootserver, no ?
07:28
<alkisg>
No need for a dhcp server with gpxe
07:29* alkisg is looking for the ip=x:x:x: parameter..
07:29
<l0C0>
hehe
07:29
<ogra_>
right, but the client needs the right info, eles you end up at busybox
07:29
<alkisg>
it gets the rootserver from the ip parameter
07:29
<ogra_>
ah
07:30
<l0C0>
would it be better going through the pxelinux.0 image if I want to do load-balancing?
07:30
<alkisg>
l0C0: http://codtech.com/wiki/index.php/Ipconfig#interface_spec_long_form
07:30
ip=<client-ip>:<server-ip>:<gw-ip>:<netmask>:<hostname>:<device>:<autoconf>
07:30phantom has joined #ltsp
07:30
<l0C0>
where do I put that?
07:30
<alkisg>
So you'd have to put: kernel vmlinuz ip=192.168.0.13:192.168.0.10:192.168.0.1:255.255.255.0:client13:eth0:none
07:31
<l0C0>
ah great
07:31
<alkisg>
l0C0: are all your clients going to use gpxe?
07:31
ogra_, the server-ip is what ipconfig gets as the rootserver
07:31
<l0C0>
yes
07:31
remote clients will be using nz
07:32
nx even
07:32
currently I have a thinstation + nx setup, but it's far from ideal
07:32
<ogra_>
right, i guessed that much, as long as it ends up as ROOTSERVER in initramfs that will work
07:32
thats the var name ltsp_nbd uses
07:32
<alkisg>
l0C0: yes, pxelinux allows for a little customization without scripting
07:33
<l0C0>
if I was to go about using pxelinux.0, how would I do it?
07:33
<alkisg>
kernel pxelinux.0
07:33
and IPAPPEND 3 in pxelinux.cfg/default
07:33
<l0C0>
I tried that, but doesn't it need to download the pxelinux.cfg/ directory at some point?
07:34
(I'm using http not tftp)
07:34
<alkisg>
That's gpxelinux.0 for you then :)
07:35
...and you'll also lose getting lts.conf - it doesn't support http
07:35
So you'll have to put it to the chroot if you need to change it
07:35
<l0C0>
ah, how do I make that (I just generated the image in ubuntu)
07:36
<alkisg>
I haven't used gpxelinux. I think it's still in beta, but it works. I guess you'd have to download it from its site. Ask at #etherboot, its developer (hpa) hangs there
07:37
<l0C0>
yeah, it's been quiet today in there :/
07:38
<alkisg>
Heh. I guess it's still early for some timezones
07:38
<l0C0>
yeah
07:38
<alkisg>
Try the kernel ip parameter first, and when you succeed you can look at gpxelinux.0...
07:38xBowser has joined #ltsp
07:39
<l0C0>
am doing :)
07:39
<xBowser>
Seems I am becoming a regular visitor here.
07:40
<l0C0>
what shall I put for autoconf?
07:40
<alkisg>
none
07:41
(03:30:43 μμ) alkisg: So you'd have to put: kernel vmlinuz ip=192.168.0.13:192.168.0.10:192.168.0.1:255.255.255.0:client13:eth0:none
07:42
<l0C0>
eth0 not net0?
07:43
<alkisg>
eth, the kernel is loaded. net is for gpxe :)
07:43
<l0C0>
ah right
07:44
oh of course, these are kernel parameters
07:44
<xBowser>
Does anybody else have the problem of processes not terminating after users logout?
07:44
<l0C0>
and root=100?
07:44
<alkisg>
Hm? what's that?
07:45
<l0C0>
it asked to define the root parameter at some point
07:45
<alkisg>
I don't know. Try without it for starters.
07:45
<l0C0>
ok
07:53hanthana has joined #ltsp
07:55
<l0C0>
ah ok, now it's having problems connecting to the server
07:56
<alkisg>
port forwarding, firewalls etc...
07:56
Ah, you mean while logging on?
07:56
<l0C0>
while booting
07:56
apart from port 22, what else does it need?
07:57
<alkisg>
I think nbd is in 9572
07:58
<ogra>
no
07:58
2000
07:58
<alkisg>
Ah yes 9572 is the nbd swap
07:58
<ogra>
right
07:58
<l0C0>
so 9572 and 2000?
07:59
<markit>
I've plugged the usb stick, I can see the device label in win2003 (rdesktop) but can't see any file
07:59
any clue?
07:59
I've tried -r disk:usbstick=/var/run/drives to archieve this
08:02xBowser has left #ltsp
08:02evilx has joined #LTSP
08:03lucascoala has joined #ltsp
08:07
<sbalneav>
Morning all
08:09The_Code has joined #ltsp
08:17Gadi has joined #ltsp
08:18
<rjune_wrk>
!s
08:18
<ltspbot>
rjune_wrk: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:24
<sbalneav>
Morning rjune_wrk
08:26
<markit>
I'm wondering if local device can be accessed if I use rdesktop...
08:29ogra has quit IRC
08:29
<sbalneav>
markit: Not sure. I wrote localdev support, but only for Linux. Hang around for Gadi, I think he did some work with getting it to go under rdesktop.
08:30* Gadi waves
08:30
<Gadi>
markit: do this: install ltspfs in the chroot
08:30
then, update the chroot
08:31
then, set your rdesktop command to: rdesktop -r disk:drives=/media/root ....
08:31
and reboot the thin client
08:31
(this presumes Ubuntu 9.04
08:31
<sbalneav>
Gadi: I'm just finishing off the xrandr bits for the docs.
08:31
<Gadi>
)
08:31
sbalneav: cool
08:31
<sbalneav>
I'm editing uup that email you sent to the list.
08:32
Within the next hour or so, I should have a new version of the docs and manpage up.
08:32
<Gadi>
awesome
08:32
how's the land down under (me) ?
08:32
:)
08:33
<sbalneav>
We need to come up with a protocol for us to *STOP* adding parameters to lts-parameters.txt, and start just adding them to the lts.conf.xml file so we'll keep the lts.conf.5 manpage up to date.
08:33ogra has joined #ltsp
08:33
<sbalneav>
Good. Excellent conference.
08:33
And, the docs should be (close to) back in sync with LTSP.
08:34
<Gadi>
are the docs versioned?
08:34
<sbalneav>
yes.
08:35
there's a bzr branch on launchpad.
08:35
<Gadi>
do the docs have a section on "how do I know what version I have" ?
08:35
<sbalneav>
lp:~ltsp-docwriters/ltsp/ltsp-docs-trunk
08:35
<Gadi>
right
08:35
I dont mean versioned for the authors
08:35
I mean versioned for the users
08:36
so, they know that it applies to LTSP version blah blah blah
08:36
<sbalneav>
They're upstream docs.
08:36
they should track current upstream verson.
08:36
<Gadi>
right. and upstream has versions
08:36
<sbalneav>
Really?
08:36
<Gadi>
:)
08:36
lol
08:36
<ogra>
we should just get rid of versioning
08:37
<Gadi>
If you could have it print the version number on the docs when they are generated, that would be perfect
08:37
is all Im saying
08:37
<sbalneav>
Last I checked, ltsp-trunk's just a constant moving target :)
08:37
<ogra>
yeah, its way to confusing to have versions
08:37
we should have beer instead of versions
08:37
thats my longstanding opinion
08:37
<sbalneav>
Gadi: I'll add it to the todo AFTER all the freaking parameters are documented. :)
08:37
<Gadi>
mmm... beer control
08:38
sbalneav: thx
08:38
<ogra>
cd ./glass && merge ../beer && commit -m'mmmm'
08:39
<sbalneav>
so when I push up this version, if all LTSP developers could have a quick shufty at the docs and see if we're missing any params.
08:39
<Gadi>
security hole found in glass... beer dribbles down ogra's chin
08:39
<sbalneav>
Some of them aren't nicely described, but it would be nice if they were at least all there.
08:39
<ogra>
ouch ... seems i need to apply a patch :)
08:40
<Gadi>
vagrantc reverts ogra's patch and the beer continues to leak out
08:40
*sigh*
08:40
<ogra>
evil !
08:40
<Gadi>
:)
08:40* ogra commits cork
08:42CAN-o-SPAM has joined #ltsp
08:43xBowser has joined #ltsp
08:43elisboa has joined #ltsp
08:43
<xBowser>
Hello. Does anybody know how I could execute a script on my LTSP server at user logout?
08:55jammcq has joined #ltsp
08:55
<jammcq>
good morning #ltsp
08:56
<l0C0>
good afternoon jammcq
08:56
<sbalneav>
!j
08:56
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "j" is jammcq!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:57
<jammcq>
Scotty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:57
hey l0C0
08:58dorimar has joined #ltsp
09:00mikkel has quit IRC
09:00
<sbalneav>
!docs
09:00
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "docs" is For the most current documentation, see http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
09:02
<xBowser>
Is there any solution to the problem of users processes not being killed after logout?
09:03
<markit>
Gadi: I'm back
09:04
I've done as you suggested, is installed by default by debian 5.0
09:04
I've had a look at the udev and mount script though
09:04
seems they need a LDM_SOCKET
09:05
if I plug the usb pen, I see it in dmsg
09:05bobby_C has joined #ltsp
09:06
<Gadi>
markit: its not by deafult in the chroot
09:07
only ltspfsd is in the chroot by default
09:07
not ltspfs
09:07
<sbalneav>
Okiedoke.
09:08
I've updated the docs. The PDF's in the usual place, or, via bzr
09:08
If everyone could take a quick look, and make sure we're not missing any params, that'd be greatly appreciated.
09:09bieb has joined #ltsp
09:09
<Gadi>
sbalneav: I dont think this is correct:
09:09
LDM_SESSIONdepreciated, use LDM_XSESSION
09:10
LDM_SESSION is used to force the choice of session from LDM, as opposed to LDM_XSESSION which is used to change the entire command that LDM runs
09:10
(I believe)
09:10
<sbalneav>
OK
09:12
<Gadi>
There are definitely parts that are dangerous for upstream docs to have - like "Setting up LDAP"
09:12
<sbalneav>
Gadi: Fixed.
09:13
Gadi: I agree. They were contributed by someone. My view's the same as yours, they should be "distro docs", i.e. down in the edubuntu handbook.
09:13
<Gadi>
In fact, all of Chapter 21
09:13
:)
09:14
<sbalneav>
They're there as a placeholder for the moment. I'm also kickstarting the edubuntu handbook as well, so when I get that back into shape, those "sysadminy" things will move out of the ltsp manual, and into that.
09:15
but for the moment, I don't want to lose them, so I've just been ignoring them.
09:15
that's why they're relegated to the butt-end of the document :)
09:15
<Gadi>
Chapter 29
09:15
yeah, I see that
09:16
Then, the follow up question is whether user-contributed "Tips and Tricks" should just be in the wiki
09:16
rather than the docs
09:16
<sbalneav>
I suspect so
09:17
Ultimately, the docs should JUST be about ltsp specifics, and be distro-neutral.
09:17
<Gadi>
right - that way it is really current and easier to manage
09:18
<markit>
Gadi: you are right, only ltspfsd
09:18
<Gadi>
all in all, tho, awesome job
09:18
<sbalneav>
I'd even go so far as to say the installing on (debian|fedora|etc) chapter should be reduced to "please consult your distro's docs on installing the LTSP packages on your distro"
09:18
<Gadi>
markit: our approach to local devices for RDP connections from the client is to use ltspfs as the "automounter"
09:18
<markit>
Gadi: what do you mean with "update chroot"?
09:19
<Gadi>
markit: sorry - I assumed Ubuntu, you are on debian NFS, right?
09:19
<markit>
Gadi: debian lenny
09:19
yes, I suppose uses nfs (is something I can check?)
09:19
<Gadi>
markit: then simply install ltspfs in the chroot and reboot the client
09:20
<markit>
ok, thanks, I try imediatly
09:20
<Gadi>
no need to update the image because you don't use one :)
09:20
but, change thee rdesktop line to: rdesktop -r disk:drives=/media/root ....
09:20
<markit>
really /media/root?
09:21
<Gadi>
yup
09:21
hopefully, you will see all local drives appear as folders under My Computer > drives on <workstation_hostname>
09:22
ltspfs by default mounts things in /media/$USER
09:22
and rdesktop runs as root
09:22
hence, /media/root
09:22
<markit>
and disk:drivers and not something like disk:usb ?
09:23
<Gadi>
the syntax is: disk:<share_name>=<path>
09:23
so, whatever you name the share is what will appear in Windows under My Computer
09:24
"usb" would be a misnomer, because cdrom, floppies, and other disks would appear there as folders as well
09:24
but, whatever turns you on
09:24
:)
09:25
<markit>
mmm it tries to install fuse, and complains grep: /proc/mounts: No such file or directory
09:25elisboa has quit IRC
09:25
<Gadi>
chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
09:25
<markit>
yes, done
09:25
<Gadi>
mount -t proc proc /proc
09:26
apt-get install ltspfs
09:26
umount /proc
09:26
exit
09:26
<sbalneav>
Gadi: The "Enabling dual monitors" section should (now) really be handled by the xrandr section, right?
09:26
<markit>
I've issued a apt-get update... hold on
09:26
<Gadi>
sbalneav: depends on the driver
09:27
ideally, yes
09:27
<markit>
Gadi: is all this stuff documented somewhere? I've wasted all day looking for those info
09:27
<Gadi>
markit: prolly not - sbalneav is working hard on it
09:27
:)
09:27
<sbalneav>
Do you have a handy "xrandr dual monitor" example?
09:27
<markit>
udev requires a mounted sysfs, not started. failed!
09:28
<Gadi>
markit: try: export LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS=False
09:28
<jammcq>
sbalneav: dude, we're gonna be leaving in about 20 minutes
09:28
<Gadi>
apt-get install ltspfs
09:28
<markit>
the same
09:29
<Gadi>
ok, then: mount -t sysfs sysfs /sys
09:29
apt-get install ltspfs
09:29
<sbalneav>
jammcq: ok
09:29
takes me 30 seconds to shut down.
09:30
<markit>
Gadi: seems ok, except a warning like (I translate from italian) Impossible write a log, openpty() failed (is /dev/pts mounted?)
09:30
<Gadi>
thats fine
09:30
umount /sys
09:30
umount /proc
09:30
exit
09:31
<markit>
ok, just reboot the client then?
09:31
<Gadi>
yeah
09:31* markit crosses his fingers
09:32
<Gadi>
sbalneav: I *think* as long as monitors are plugged in and on, it should try to automagically do multihead
09:32
honestly, it has been a while since I tried it
09:32
<markit>
I will have also to share usb - client -connected printers... is that so hard also?
09:33
<Gadi>
markit: enormously
09:33
<bieb>
what disk space alotments should I make for an LTSP server? 250gb hard drive? or will I need more space. I will have <20 clients
09:33
<Gadi>
:)
09:33
<sbalneav>
Gadi: ok, thanks.
09:33
<rjune_wrk>
bieb: how many users do you have?
09:33
<markit>
Gadi: tell me is a joke
09:33
<rjune_wrk>
bieb: How much space will they need?
09:34
<Gadi>
markit: I am kidding
09:34
<sbalneav>
bieb: Well, if each of the users wants to store 1TB of data, it won't be enough. :)
09:34
<rjune_wrk>
If you're doing basic use stuff, you can probably get away with < 1G per user
09:34
<markit>
I've logged, I se "drivers on ltsp", but if I enter is empty
09:34
<Gadi>
but... you should be aware that LTSP by default supports only one type of printing on the client - JetDirect printing
09:34
<bieb>
rjune_wrk: @400... these are going into a lab, so I dont think we are giving them storage space
09:34
<Gadi>
markit: did you do: /media/root ?
09:34
for the path?
09:34
<bieb>
they don't currently have storage space on the Windows server
09:35
<markit>
SCREEN_08 = "rdesktop -f -k it 192.168.1.2 -r disk:drivers=/media/root"
09:35
<Gadi>
and the usb stick is plugged in?
09:35
<markit>
yes
09:35
<Gadi>
ok, can you switch to a shell on the client and see if /media/root was created?
09:35
<markit>
sure, let me do it
09:35
<sbalneav>
Ok heading out.
09:35
see you all later.
09:36
<bieb>
later sbalneav
09:36* Gadi waves
09:36* bieb waves
09:36
<markit>
Gadi: /media is empty
09:36
<Gadi>
aha!
09:37
can you do: mount
09:37
<markit>
and mount | grep sd is empty also
09:37
<Gadi>
how about: mount|grep ltspfs
09:37
<markit>
empty also
09:37
<Gadi>
dpkg -l ltspfs
09:38
<markit>
installed, 0.5.3-3 version
09:39
<Gadi>
ah - I think the version is too old
09:39jammcq has quit IRC
09:39
<markit>
Gadi: urgh
09:39
<Gadi>
can you enable the updates repository in the chroot?
09:40
<markit>
I've tried to install ltsp for sid, but failed in ltsp creation due to dependencies problems
09:40
Gadi: what do you mean? if I have /etc/apt/soruces? they are there
09:40* Gadi knows not the ways of debian - vagrantc knows best
09:40
<Gadi>
maybe it is in backports?
09:40
or testing?
09:41
I dunno
09:41
<markit>
Gadi: mmm probably testing, hope not to fire a dependency storm
09:41
<Gadi>
If you can hang on until vagrantc gets here
09:41
<markit>
let me check
09:41
<Gadi>
he maintains the packages
09:41
<markit>
do you know what is the correct version to look for?
09:42
<Gadi>
well, newest upstream is 0.5.12
09:43
not sure what the last package vagrantc pushed to the debian repos was
09:43
You may be able to get just the ltspfs and ltspfsd packages for that version and install them in the chroot
09:43
<markit>
0.5.12-1 in sid, let me try to install it
09:44
do I have to install both updated?
09:44
<Gadi>
it would be safest to
09:45
<markit>
ok, do I have to reboot ltsp server or anything except the client?
09:45
<Gadi>
nope
09:45
just the client
09:46
<bieb>
rjune_wrk: is there a calculation for memory in ltsp? ie.. 256mb for each client?
09:46
<rjune_wrk>
RAM on the server? probably
09:46
I don't know what it is currently
09:46
used to be 50MB / client would do you alright
09:47
<bieb>
do you have a rule of thumb for your server?
09:47
<rjune_wrk>
now it might be 128MB or even 256MB, I'm just not sure
09:48
<bieb>
is more better when it comes to RAM? should I use PAE to get over 4gb in my server?
09:48
<markit>
Gadi: nothing new... nor in /media
09:49
<rjune_wrk>
bieb: 256MB/user with 250 users == 64000MB RAM.
09:50
<markit>
Gadi: dmesg sees sda1 correctly
09:50
<bieb>
rjune_wrk: would it be per user? or per client?
09:50
<rjune_wrk>
RAM is per client
09:50
I've not done this in a while, so my knowledge is dated
09:51
<Gadi>
markit: 1 sec
09:51
<markit>
Gadi: sure, thanks a lot
09:52
<bieb>
rjune_wrk: no prob... I appreciate the info
09:53
<Gadi>
markit: sorry - 3 conversations at once :)
09:53
<markit>
Gadi: no proble, drop the other 2 ;P (joking)
09:53
<Gadi>
markit: hehe
09:54
markit: cat /var/run/ltspfs_fstab
09:54
does that have an entry for your usb?
09:54
<markit>
yes, I see the label of the usb in that
09:55
<Gadi>
ok, thats good
09:55
<markit>
'/dev/sda1 /var/run/drivers/MENARDI vfat defaults,utf8 0 0'
09:56
<Gadi>
on the shell, what happens when you do:
09:56
export USER=root
09:56
<markit>
shell of the thin client? (where I've logged as root)
09:56
<Gadi>
/usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter /var/run/drivers/MENARDI add
09:57
(and are you sure it is "drivers" and not "drives"?
09:57
)
09:57
<markit>
you are right, drives
09:58
Cannot open X display
09:59
<Gadi>
export DISPLAY=:8
09:59
and do it again
09:59markit has quit IRC
09:59markit has joined #ltsp
10:01
<markit>
is the channel still alive?
10:01
I've got the feeling of having lost connection...
10:01
<Gadi>
alive and well
10:02
<markit>
maybe I was disconnected in some way, I got welcome message from freenode server again
10:02
Gadi: if you wrote to me something I can have lost
10:02
(after I reported error message)
10:03
<Gadi>
(10:58:50 AM) Gadi: export DISPLAY=:8
10:03
(10:58:55 AM) Gadi: and do it again
10:04
<markit>
the error now is "Couldn't read LTSPFS_TOKEN atom.
10:04
<Gadi>
hmm
10:04
are you ssh'd into the client?
10:04
<markit>
no, client does not seem to have sshd
10:05
<Gadi>
unset SSH_CONNECTION
10:05
<markit>
I've a console near me, and I have to copy manually
10:05
<Gadi>
just to be safe
10:05
and run it again
10:05
if you get the same thing, please:
10:05
dpkg -l ltspfsd
10:05
and make sure ltspfsd is the newer version
10:06
<markit>
ltspfs ltspfsd ltspfsd-core are 0.5.12-1
10:06
(I'm logged in thin client console as root... is it ok?)
10:06
<Gadi>
yeah
10:07
hmm...
10:08phantom has quit IRC
10:08
<markit>
I can try to rdesktop to an XP pc, instead of win2003
10:09bieb has quit IRC
10:09
<Gadi>
(sorry - ph call)
10:09bieb has joined #ltsp
10:09
<markit>
np, I hold on
10:10
<Gadi>
markit: try this:
10:10
on the server, edit:
10:11
/opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/ltsp-init-common
10:11phantom has joined #ltsp
10:11
<Gadi>
(I think thats where the file is)
10:11
<markit>
yes, there is that file
10:12
<Gadi>
and where is calls, "/usr/bin/ltspfsd" change it to: "/usr/bin/ltspfsd -a"
10:12
then, reboot the client
10:12staffencasa has joined #ltsp
10:13staffencasa has quit IRC
10:15staffencasa has joined #ltsp
10:15
<markit>
still empty :(
10:23
Gadi: no more hope, I suppose...
10:23alkisg has quit IRC
10:26alkisg has joined #ltsp
10:27
<markit>
btw, following a tip I've found in internet, I set the chroot root password... isn't that rdesktop supposes root with a specific password to run as root?
10:36
<Gadi>
sorry - ph call again
10:37
<markit>
Gadi: I've mistyped drives / drivers in lts.conf also... hope it that the problem (in case you should bit me )
10:38
no, did not solved :(
10:39
(reding carefully, is just a label, so could not have been a problem)
10:42
<Gadi>
get a shell again, and type: /usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter /var/run/drivers/MENARDI add
10:42
er, /usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter /var/run/drives/MENARDI add
10:42
somethings weird
10:45
<markit>
I've got the atom error and
10:45
suid mount failed: [Errno 39] Directory not empty: '/tmp/.root-ltspfs'
10:49
Gadi: in 30 minutes I have to go home... I could take home the server and a client, if you are in irc 3 hours since now, and you still have some energy to devote to this desperate fight
10:49
if not, I save the effort to bring home this heavy hardware :)
10:49
<Gadi>
hehe - well, better than me, vagrantc might be in by then
10:49
<markit>
ok, I will risk
10:49
<Gadi>
he is our resident debian guy
10:50
<markit>
we tested this solution with thinkstation and worked, so assumed would have be good with ltsp also
10:50
I have to install this ltsp server saturday... and I'm really scared
10:50
<Gadi>
well, rdesktop is not really maintained in LTSP
10:50
all the focus is on LDM and Linux
10:50l0C0 has quit IRC
10:50
<Gadi>
are you deploying a Linux desktop too?
10:50
or only Windows?
10:51
<markit>
I know is a weird thing (M$ crap), but unfortunatly they still dominate the desktop in our offices
10:51
well, first step is provide windows only, then if they also will migrate to openoffice, try to provide some GNU/Linux workstation
10:51
is a sort of "troyan horse"
10:51
:)
10:52
<Gadi>
we'll make it work for you
10:52
no worries
10:52
:)
10:52
it just may involve a bit more work than "out of the box"
10:52
<markit>
I'm sure you are kind enough, is just I'm sad that my collegues have put 3 win2003 server running in some hours, and I'm hanging since this morning with GNU/Linux
10:53
so I'm in a bad mood right now, lol
10:53
<Gadi>
well, if they were trying to connect their windows PCs to a Linux server, they would be in a bad mood too
10:53
:)
10:53
<markit>
hehehe, is what I told them
10:54
but is not the way customers are asking for
10:54
unfortunatly
10:54
Gadi: so thanks A LOT, see you later, I hope
10:54
<Gadi>
cu
10:54
<markit>
bye (you've been really kind)
10:54markit has quit IRC
11:09Gadi has left #ltsp
11:14elisboa has joined #ltsp
11:19pmatulis has quit IRC
11:21litlebuda has joined #ltsp
11:30mbeierl1 has joined #ltsp
11:33joqueza has joined #ltsp
11:41fotanus has joined #ltsp
11:52litlebuda has quit IRC
12:00fotanus has quit IRC
12:03fotanus has joined #ltsp
12:04mbeierl1 has left #ltsp
12:06alkisg has quit IRC
12:09alkisg has joined #ltsp
12:24elisboa has quit IRC
12:27Haruchai has joined #ltsp
12:28
<Haruchai>
anyone able to help with a diskless workstation 1520 pxe? the device doesn't post
12:29
green light on unit goes on when depressed - then goes out
12:30
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Haruchai: you need to email rma@DisklessWorkstations.com
12:32
<Haruchai>
ok thanks CoS
12:32bobby_C has quit IRC
12:35
<ogra>
CAN-o-SPAM, what are you doing to your hardware so that it can get depressed ?
12:42
<Haruchai>
call it funny names and make fun of it's mother
12:43
<joqueza>
lol
12:48bobby_C has joined #ltsp
12:50pmatulis has joined #ltsp
12:54xBowser has left #ltsp
13:02treyh has joined #ltsp
13:02
<treyh>
hi everyone
13:02
!seen Gadi
13:02
<ltspbot>
treyh: Gadi was last seen in #ltsp 2 hours, 8 minutes, and 31 seconds ago: <Gadi> cu
13:22michael1 has quit IRC
13:35din_os has joined #ltsp
13:40spectra has joined #ltsp
13:53treyh has quit IRC
13:59treyh has joined #ltsp
13:59
<treyh>
hey guys
13:59
i found this bug in ubuntu
13:59
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/klibc/+bug/175324
13:59
there is a patch, but not sure if I should apply it or not
13:59
it fits my situation perfectly
14:06lucascoala has quit IRC
14:11
<treyh>
anyone around?
14:12
<alkisg>
treyh: distro/version?
14:12
<treyh>
alkisg: ubuntu/intrepid
14:13
i just tried update zlibc, to see if that helps
14:13
<alkisg>
Ah, no go. I thought I'd suggest you that you tried udhcpc instead of ipconfig, but the support for it begun in Jaunty
14:13
You mean klibc?
14:13
<treyh>
!!!!
14:13
<ltspbot>
treyh: Error: "!!!" is not a valid command.
14:13
<treyh>
yes
14:13
i am running Jaunty, that was a typo mistake on my part!
14:14
<alkisg>
OK then, you could try with udhcpc. But, really, you use a dhcp relay agent?
14:14
<treyh>
My dhcp server is a windows 2003 server
14:14
<alkisg>
...and?
14:15
<treyh>
so basically i just disable dhcp on the ltsp server and let windows do the rest
14:15
<alkisg>
So you don't have a relay agent... so that patch doesn't apply for you...
14:15
<treyh>
whats a relay agent?
14:16
<alkisg>
Something that "tunnels" dhcp requests from some network to another network
14:16
<treyh>
oh gotcha
14:16
<alkisg>
OK, forget about that patch. Did you modify your windows server to provide the correct next-server and boot filename options?
14:17
<treyh>
yes
14:17
and 99% of the clients work
14:17
have two different models of two different manuf's that won't work
14:18
<alkisg>
Did you try changing NICs, if that's possible?
14:18
<treyh>
I worked with Gadi on it, he seemed to think it was a driver issue but and we tested a few things but I had to go and haven't got a chance to talk to him again
14:18
alkisg: yes originally use an onboard then disabled it and went for 3com, which killed his idea it might be a driver problem
14:19
Gadi, had me change pxelinux.cfg/default and put a some kind of break in there, and then type ipconfig on the terminal to see if it would pull dhcp and it did
14:19
<alkisg>
What's the error message? how do they stop/hang?
14:19
<treyh>
it says
14:19
ip-config: no response after 60 secs - giving up
14:19
here it is pasted
14:19
IP-Config: no response after 60 secs - giving up
14:19
/init: .: line 1: can't open /tmp/net-eth0.conf
14:19
[ 125.154111] Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init!
14:19
[ 125.154241] Dumping ftrace buffer:
14:19
[ 125.154325] (ftrace buffer empty)
14:20
<alkisg>
Yeah ok. So, you're sure that when you put break=init, and ran ipconfig eth0, that it indeed got a dhcp address?
14:20
Without changing nics or anything?
14:20
<treyh>
yes and i can verify really quick but i am 100% positive
14:21
<alkisg>
OK, you're near the PC? Can you try something?
14:21
<treyh>
yes it's right next to me, do not have the break=init turned on right now though
14:21
<alkisg>
No need - I just want to see if it'll boot with IPAPPEND 3
14:22
<treyh>
k what do i need to change
14:22
<alkisg>
Can you pastebin your pxelinux.cfg/default ?
14:22
<treyh>
sure sec
14:23
DEFAULT vmlinuz ro initrd=initrd.img
14:23
thats the right directory right? /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg
14:23
<alkisg>
OK, put another line in it, so that it says:
14:23
DEFAULT vmlinuz ro initrd=initrd.img
14:23
IPAPPEND 3
14:23
Save it and reboot this client that has the problem
14:24
<treyh>
k rebooting now
14:24elisboa has joined #ltsp
14:26
<treyh>
ok
14:26
<alkisg>
It worked?
14:27
<treyh>
it came up, got an ip and etc.
14:27
and now says filename: at the bottom
14:27
rootserver: 172.16.20.1 rootpath:
14:27
wait
14:27
it kept going finally
14:27
it worked
14:27
you are the bomb lol
14:27
but
14:27
it didn't read the lts.conf i have setup
14:28
<alkisg>
Yeah ok that can be fixed.
14:28
<treyh>
went straight to the ldm
14:28
<alkisg>
To fix the lts.conf problem, do: sudo ln -s ltsp/i386/lts.conf /var/lib/tftpboot/lts.conf
14:28
<treyh>
k
14:29
k did that, now reboot?
14:29
<alkisg>
Yes, the client
14:29
<treyh>
rebooting now
14:30
<bieb>
I am looking at disklessworkstations.com.. what is the diff between etherboot and PXE? there is at $10 price difference, but I wasnt sure why.
14:31
<alkisg>
treyh: with IPAPPEND 3 ipconfig doesn't ask for an IP address; it reuses the one that the dhcp assigned for the PXE stage. That's why it worked now, because no dhcp was involved.
14:31
<treyh>
interesting
14:31
<alkisg>
treyh: If that's not a problem for you, you can keep working like this; if it is, you may limit it for only those 2 PCs that have the problem
14:32
....and, you may also install udhcpc in the chroot, perhaps this will also fix your problem
14:32
<treyh>
alkisg: that fixed the problem
14:33
I'll just leave it like this, it's fine
14:33
<alkisg>
treyh: ok, here are the steps to have as a reference: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP#Adjusting%20pxelinux.cfg/default
14:33
treyh: also do the lines that say about "The pxelinux.cfg/default file may get overriden by the ltsp-update-kernels command. To make it keep its contents, run: "
14:34litlebuda has joined #ltsp
14:34
<alkisg>
bieb: etherboot = the older version of gpxe. In standard ltsp configurations, any of them will do.
14:35
gpxe supports some more advanced stuff like http booting etc, which you probably won't need for ltsp
14:35
<bieb>
alkisg: ltsp pxe boot is better way to go if buying new?
14:36
<alkisg>
bieb: pxe is a little more standards compliant than the older etherboot - but again, usually it doesn't make any difference at all
14:39din_os has quit IRC
14:40
<bieb>
cool
14:40Vonoff has joined #ltsp
14:40
<Vonoff>
hi
14:41
I wonder whats the advantage of ssh'ing into the server and use the apps from there instead of staying in the chroot environment?
14:47treyh has quit IRC
14:53Lns has joined #ltsp
15:06markit has joined #ltsp
15:08
<markit>
looking for Gedi or Vagrant... need help on ltsp5 debian and rdesktop and local devices (usb)
15:08
seems they are not here atm... anyone has been able to make local devices work with rdesktop?
15:16elisboa_ has joined #ltsp
15:17elisboa has quit IRC
15:17elisboa_ has quit IRC
15:17elisboa has joined #ltsp
15:18pmatulis has quit IRC
15:25The_Code has quit IRC
15:46alkisg has quit IRC
15:52joqueza has quit IRC
15:52CAN-o-SPAM has quit IRC
16:21spectra has quit IRC
17:04Egyptian[Home]1 has quit IRC
17:04Egyptian[Home] has joined #ltsp
17:05bieb has left #ltsp
17:06
<markit>
anyone able to make local devices work with rdesktop?
17:08
<Ryan52>
markit: there is no point in asking again, we heard you 2 hours ago, and there's nobody new who has joined here.
17:19
<markit>
Ryan52: there are at least 2 new people, and someone could have been busy/distracted and have missed the question
17:20
don't think that asking after 2 hours in a quiet channel can be so annoying, don't you? :)
17:21
<Ryan52>
no, there aren't any new people. they were both here when you asked, look closely.
17:24vagrantc has joined #ltsp
17:25
<Ryan52>
markit: ok, now you should ask again. :)
17:26
<markit>
hi vagrantc, I really need your help :)
17:26
gedi told me you could help
17:26
I've debian lenny ltsp package, and trying to use local usb device (memory stick) in rdesktop
17:27
gedi suggested rdesktop -r disk:drives=/media/root
17:27
and to install ltspfs in chroot
17:27
but can't have device mounted
17:27
any clue?
17:28fotanus has quit IRC
17:29
<vagrantc>
markit: you'll need the ltspfs and ltspfsd packages from debian squeeze for that to work
17:30
<markit>
debian squeeze? I've got from debian sid to have them uptodate
17:30
<vagrantc>
markit: i haven't had good luck with it, though- device removal and insertion don't usually get registered ...
17:30
<markit>
what is " debian squeeze"?
17:30
argh :(
17:30
<vagrantc>
markit: lenny = stable, squeeze = testing, sid = unstable
17:30
etch = oldstable
17:31
<markit>
are those from sid still good, or have to be testing?
17:31
<vagrantc>
same version is in sid and squeeze right now
17:31
<markit>
0.5.12-1
17:31
if I try to manually mount the device I get an error
17:32
"Couldn't read LTSPFS_TOKEN atom
17:32
(with /usr/sbin/ltspfsmounter /var/run/drivers/MENARDI add)
17:32
cat /var/run/ltspfs_fstab shows /dev/sda1 /var/run/drivers/MENARDI vfat defaults,utf8 0 0
17:33
<vagrantc>
markit: output of mount: | grep MENARDI
17:34
<markit>
let me cehck (I've to jump to the thin client console)
17:34
nothing
17:35
in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/ltsp-init-common gedi has told me to change
17:35
"/usr/bin/ltspfsd" change it to: "/usr/bin/ltspfsd -a"
17:36
btw, I've had to set root password in chroot... is it ok or could interfere with ltsp client with rdesktop ?
17:36
gedi told me that is run as "root" user from a ltsp point of view... (just wondering)
17:38
<vagrantc>
to troubleshoot, shouldn't be a problem running as root
17:39
<markit>
wondering if having set a passwrod to root is a problem.. maybe should be "blank" instead or don't know...
17:40
I'm trying to make it work all day long... I'm really depressed
17:41
<Lns>
markit, there's no issue (besides potential security) to have a root password in your chroot
17:42
<vagrantc>
markit: i fought with the local mounting support for ltspfs for many days, and never got it working.
17:42
i've never figured out how to get it to work...
17:43
the only thing i haven't tried yet is setting the server up to use nbd+squashfs+aufs like ubuntu does ...
17:43
<markit>
vagrantc: oh, sorry, I understood that you were the one that was able to make it work
17:44
so let's say that I'd better try something else, like thinkstation ?
17:44
because if no one has been able so far, sure will not be me, since I'm not an expert
17:44
<vagrantc>
allegedly they have it working with ubuntu
17:44
<Lns>
markit, sorry, does the localdev work in straight linux?
17:44
<markit>
with special tricks? or just "out of the box"?
17:45
Lns: probably if I login with ldm, since there is a "mount script" for that, but never tried
17:45
<vagrantc>
markit: probably worth trying, just in case there's something amiss with the device itself
17:46
<markit>
Lns: sure dmesg shows the usb device
17:46
<vagrantc>
make sure it works with the "normal" way ltspfs works before trying experimental ways.
17:47
<markit>
vagrantc: mm so I should install some desktop manager in ltsp ?
17:47
<vagrantc>
markit: ldm should already be installed.
17:48
<markit>
ldm is, but if I login I go to nowhere, of course
17:48
<vagrantc>
markit: where's nowhere?
17:48
<markit>
after entering username and password in ldm
17:49hanthana_ has joined #ltsp
17:49
<markit>
screen becomes black, and then I've ldm login again
17:49
<Lns>
isn't there at least an xterm available or something?
17:49
<markit>
no
17:49japerry_cat has quit IRC
17:50
<vagrantc>
markit: install ltsp-server-standalone on a server, which should ensure that everything works...
17:50
markit: then you should be able to log in to that server
17:50japerry has joined #ltsp
17:51
<markit>
since I use dnsmasq,I installed only the "lite" version
17:51
I will try
17:52pmatulis has joined #ltsp
17:52
<vagrantc>
dnsmasq should be an option for ltsp-server-standalone
17:52
<markit>
I'm too tired and depressed to try now, is since 9am that I'm fighting, and is 1am here now
17:52
an option? don't think that that package has it inside
17:52
what do you mean as "option"?
17:53
<vagrantc>
it could have dhcp3-server or dnsmasq installed ...
17:53
though that might only be for the newer ltsp-server-standalone packages...
17:54
the version in lenny should allow dnsmasq as an alternative to dhcp3-server ...
17:54
<markit>
how can I choose when installing the package?
17:54
<vagrantc>
apt-get install dnsmasq ltsp-server-standalone
17:55
<markit>
in any case, I'm not able to troubleshooting and find workarounds, and the 2 most skilled person (you and gedi) have not succesfully had it working
17:55
<vagrantc>
if you've already got it installed and working, it shouldn't make any difference.
17:55
i *thought* gadi had it working on ubuntu...
17:55
it's only on debian we haven't figured out what the issue is
17:56
<markit>
ah, I see
17:56
<vagrantc>
markit: but anyways, get some rest, and we'll go at it another time if you like. :)
17:56
<markit>
so you are aware of the issue, and trying to solve?
17:56
<vagrantc>
markit: i periodically try to get it working, and always come away frustrated.
17:57
<markit>
vagrantc: I do thank you a lot, unfortunatly I have to install a rdesktop solution for a client of the company I work for in some days time
17:57
<vagrantc>
markit: well, do what you need to do
17:57
<markit>
I suggested ltsp, but I'm in a sad situation now
17:58
<vagrantc>
markit: try ubuntu, see if it works.
17:58
<markit>
I've becoming more and more frustrated with FOSS in general, and the foss-evilempire integration is often necessary
17:58
vagrantc: ok, thanks a lot for the tip
17:58
latest stable ubuntu or 9.10?
17:59
<vagrantc>
markit: i think 9.04 should have the features you need, but i'm not positive. i work on debian :)
18:00hanthana has quit IRC
18:00fotanus has joined #ltsp
18:00
<markit>
I love debian, thanks for your work :)
18:00
<Lns>
markit, frustrated with FOSS in general?
18:01
<markit>
Lns: because many project are "half working", "badly documented", "don't find helpful people", "require you to become an expert just to archieve basic results" and so on
18:02
Lns: in the meantime I was fighting with usb local, for instance, my collegues have installed and setup 3 server with AD in replication
18:02
I've had bad experiences with zimbra also, lacking some basic features, or having strange bugs somewhere
18:02
and so on
18:02
<Lns>
markit, surely you don't get a complete view of the world by only visiting the developing countries...
18:03
<markit>
I do love free as in freedom software, but in real life-provide solution to your customers is really a trouble
18:03
<Lns>
markit, I'd have to disagree
18:03
<markit>
Lns: I would love if you can convince me that is just my mistake
18:04
<Lns>
I have many Linux-only and Linux/Windows mixed clients and there is always a way to accomplish things
18:04
<markit>
and the real situation of foss is much better than what I've experimented so far
18:04
<Lns>
If you're the "computer guy" you need to become an expert in your craft, you can't expect everyone to make a point->click interface to FOSS software, it's just not what it's all about
18:04
<markit>
Lns: probably, but you waste a lot of time that would not be wasted just paying some bucks to M$
18:04
<Lns>
heh
18:05
<vagrantc>
depends on your situation ... a lot.
18:05
<Lns>
well, if that's how you see it, then I guess maybe M$ might be the way to go?
18:05
<markit>
Lns: I care about freedom, as I told you
18:05
<Lns>
Of course, down the line you're going to be spending big bucks just keeping the house of cards from falling over
18:05
<markit>
but when I have to provide solution for living, I become very frustrated
18:06
also trying to make my friends use foss is frustrating
18:06
<Lns>
markit, i'm in the same boat as you
18:06
why do you feel the need to make friends use foss?
18:07
<markit>
because I care about them :)
18:07
my family is M$win-free
18:07
but I had a lot of troubles in making things go smooth for my children
18:07
and I had to surrender to adobe-flash, for instance
18:07
<Lns>
=p
18:08
<markit>
my father have been converted too...
18:08* Lns could share a few stories about adobe...but won't
18:08
<markit>
but just some days ago he come back home with a cd
18:08
with his medical results of a recent visit
18:08
that can be viewed only with included M$crap software...
18:08
<Lns>
?
18:08
<markit>
and he is asking me why he can't see them, if I told you that GNU is much better
18:09
<Lns>
what format?
18:09
<markit>
don't know, a proprietary one chained with that program
18:09
I suppose have been developed for local hospital
18:10
or something like that (I'm not so fluent in english to explain properly)
18:10
<Lns>
...well it's hard to blame FOSS for that. The practice of medicine should NOT be in the business of proprietary systems whatsoever.
18:10
jmho of course
18:10
<markit>
but the story is that is a constant fight
18:10
<Lns>
markit, of course it is
18:10
<markit>
if something is wrong with M$, is an accepted limit
18:10
if is wrong with FOSS, then they blame you and switch to MJ$
18:10
<Lns>
and it always will be, until people realize that such power over technology shouldn't be held by a single company
18:11
<markit>
people don't care about freedom
18:11
nor understand is a problem
18:11
gnu/linux is just cheap
18:11
not Free
18:11
also with OpenOffice you have tremendous troubles
18:11
<Lns>
I was doing a lot of reading last night and came to the conclusion that the word "Free" shouldn't even be included with open source / free software
18:12
<markit>
my feeling is that M$office updates are making it behave worse and worse with OOo
18:12
Lns: better use "Libre"?
18:12
<Lns>
markit, I look over 7 LTSP installations w/OOo, ~1400 users total...very little trouble with it
18:12
markit, I thought of "Community Developed Software"..thought that was more fitting
18:13
<markit>
Lns: don't they have to use / exchange M$office docs?
18:13
<Lns>
"Free" makes it sound cheap, "Share" makes you think shareware ( = cheap too)
18:13
markit, nope
18:13
well, yes actually
18:13
<markit>
oh, many talk about foss as "freeware" lol
18:14
I do really need sleep
18:14
<Lns>
yeah...we have to shake that off our backs...the 'free' thing just doesn't seem to work well with people that don't already know what it means
18:14
;) good night markit, come back later
18:14
<markit>
tomorrow :) 1am here,what time is it there?
18:14shogunx has quit IRC
18:15
<Lns>
I'm in california, so it's 4pm
18:15
<markit>
oh, california :)
18:15
ok, thanks to everyone, bye
18:16markit has quit IRC
18:27staffencasa has quit IRC
18:29bobby_C has quit IRC
18:56shogunx has joined #ltsp
19:09vagrantc has quit IRC
19:56fotanus has quit IRC
20:23try2free has joined #ltsp
20:25
<try2free>
hi sbalneav
20:26
do you know how to make sound using Intel Corporation 82801EB/ER? please help.
20:33lucascoala has joined #ltsp
20:42ogra_ has quit IRC
20:42ogra_ has joined #ltsp
20:43ogra has quit IRC
20:44ogra has joined #ltsp
20:46pmatulis has quit IRC
21:06try2free has quit IRC
21:06
<Lns>
oooooooooooooooooooooogra
21:24try2free has joined #ltsp
22:02vagrantc has joined #ltsp
22:17alkisg has joined #ltsp
22:22Faithful has quit IRC
23:33intelliant has joined #ltsp
23:37alkisg has quit IRC
23:54alkisg has joined #ltsp