IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 1 January 2008   (all times are UTC)

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00:06
<chupacabra>
happy new year 6 mins late
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01:39
<Solv>
just installed kubuntu from alternate cd, and setup ltsp...and come across a strange problem...when the thin client logs in, the upper left corner has a 'barcode' block about 50x50 that stays for about 5 minutes...it is on all the clients...some have different monitors...i have specified the X settings in the lts.conf file (in the new location)...any suggestions?
01:42
<chupacabra>
nothing personal but it is in the docs
01:45
<Solv>
chupacabra: which docs? ubuntu or ltsp? cause i searched for it and came up with nothing
01:47
<chupacabra>
i thought i saw a threwad on ltsp. mebby wrong
01:47
<Solv>
so do you have a link? or a possible suggestion for a fix?
01:47
<chupacabra>
having too much fun
01:47
<Solv>
awesome
01:50
thanks for the help bro
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04:06
<mwright1>
hello
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04:19
<latarsk1>
Hi all
04:19
anyone tried fixing ltsp 5 on Centos 5.X ?
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04:33
<latarsk1>
anyone tried fixing ltsp 5 on Centos 5.X ?
04:34
<rcy>
latarsk1: what is broken?
04:36
<latarsk1>
Im getting some error , its seems related to mounting deamon : mountd: bad path in mount request from x.x
04:36
.x.x: "/opt/ubuntu...
04:45
<mwright1>
you have native ltsp packages for Centos 5.x?
04:46
<latarsk1>
mwright1: no. Im using the ubuntu 6.10 packages
04:47
Im using this one http://ltsp.mirrors.tds.net/pub/ltsp/ltsp-5.0/ltsp_ubuntu_6.10_i386-2.tar.bz2
04:50
<mwright1>
larsk1 can you get sound to work?
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04:52
<latarsk1>
mwright1: dude I can't get the freaking server working. I doubt sound works without the f$#ing OS
04:53
mwright1: what are u running ? os, ltsp ver?
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05:07
<mwright1>
we're running the old ltsp 4 with fedora 7
05:07
I recommend you go ubuntu gutsy if you haven't got any major reason to be on fedora
05:07
or centos
05:10
<latarsk1>
mwright1: reasons ? support. preference
05:11
ltsp 4.2 with centos 5.X work in under 5 minutes. but I want ltsp 5
05:11
on centoass
05:16
<mwright1>
why do you want 5
05:16
the only advantage is sound
05:16
and if you can't get htat -- then what is the point
05:16
if you can -- goto ubuntu
05:16
I am stuck on fedora atm so we are stuffed
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05:17
<latarsk1>
ubuntu is way too slow
05:18
mwright1: the only advantage is sound , You speak from experience ?
05:19
fedora ? which version ? ltsp 4.2 ?
05:19
sound isnt much of a problem even in 4.2.
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05:22
<latarsk1>
loading snd drivers isnt much of a problem either.
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07:46
<daya>
hi all,
07:47
anyone know how to change the themes for ltsp client, in ldm
07:47
I am trying to change the language,
07:47
that is seen in the desktop in client, such as for reboot, shutdown etc
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08:30
<Drakeweb>
blimey, it's quiet in here today.
08:31
anyone able to help with thin client sound problems?
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09:21
<PerfDave>
Is there a good reason for Debian Etch's ltsp-server package to depend on the kernel NFS server? I'm having problems with clients hanging and thought that trying nfs-user-server might be useful.
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10:58
<Q-FUNK>
PerfDave: not that I know of. that sounds like one of vagrant's own preferences.
11:00
<PerfDave>
Fair enough, it's mildly annoying :)
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16:17
<AzMoo>
Hey, if I want to use LTSP for a terminal server, can I use any "thin client" solution that's on the market, or do I need to get something specific like I saw on http://www.disklessworkstations.com/ ?
16:19
<vagrantc>
AzMoo: you should be able to use any computer that does PXE boot or is able to use etherboot
16:20
well, and i386 computer
16:21
<PerfDave>
Does it have to be i386?
16:23
<vagrantc>
technically, no.
16:23
with ltsp5, any architecture supported by the host distro should work.
16:24
i.e. if ubuntu supports an architecture, you should be able to run ubuntu's ltsp5 with that architecture
16:24
<PerfDave>
Why does it have to be supported by the host distro?
16:24
<vagrantc>
because ltsp5 is built *from* the host distro
16:24
<PerfDave>
Surely the host just passes the files to the client to be executed
16:25
Hmm, seems like that's introducing an unnecessary restriction.
16:25
<vagrantc>
!muekow
16:25
<ltspbot>
vagrantc: "muekow" is MueKow represents the future of LTSP. Using the packages available in the distribution, an LTSP client is build locally, and supported by the distribution. You can see the future at: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/MueKow
16:25
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: there's the reasons why it switched in that direction
16:26
you can of course build the environment on a distro that supports the architecture and copy to another...
16:26
but the theory is that LTSP is just a few scripts on top of an existing distribution
16:26
<PerfDave>
*nods* I'm liking the Debian packages.
16:27
Not quite as easy to use as the xen-tools scripts but not far off
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16:27
<vagrantc>
yeah, although xen-tools does some stupid things i've been meaning to file bug reports about
16:28
i'd like to work on common tools for all the chroot-building environments.... so that xen-tools, debian-live, ltsp, etc. could all share more code
16:28
<PerfDave>
Heh, all you need is some dynamic binary translator like QuickTransit to do cross-arch package installations :)
16:29
<vagrantc>
"all you need"
16:29
patches accepted for cross-architecture :P
16:30
<PerfDave>
I'm pretty sure that the author of xen-tools would be amenable to working on sharing common build/bootstrap code with LTSP and other projects.
16:35
<AzMoo>
vagrantc: That's awesome, thanks.
16:36
<PerfDave>
I'm looking at setting up an LTSP cluster, and I was going to use Etch and its packages because I don't think I'll have a lot of time for hands-on administration; is LTSP 5 so much better than 4 that I really want to use nonstandard packages or run on something other than Debian?
16:38
<johnny>
you won't find as much support here for 4.2
16:39
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: ltsp5 is part of debian
16:39
PerfDave: so ltsp5 uses debian packages to provide ltsp
16:39
PerfDave: or do i totally miss what you mean?
16:40
PerfDave: i.e. debian ltsp5 is far more standard than ltsp, in other words
16:40
<PerfDave>
vagrantc: There's not a direct mapping between the Debian package version and LTSP version. I thought that Debian Etch's LTSP packages were based on LTSP 4 rather than LTSP 5.
16:41
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: the ltsp-utils packages are ltsp 4.x, and the ltsp-server packages are ltsp5
16:41
PerfDave: ltsp-server*, ltsp-client*, ldm are all ltsp5
16:42
<PerfDave>
vagrantc: Ah, OK
16:42
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: and they are, unfortunately, incompatible
16:42
<PerfDave>
Oh, I've got both ltsp-server and ltsp-utils installed.
16:42
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: the version actually in etch is arguably not a *complete* ltsp5 implementation, but it's got the core functionality.
16:42
(sound support and local device support is weak, for example)
16:42
!debian
16:42
<ltspbot>
vagrantc: "debian" is is a GNU/Linux based operating system that makes an excellent LTSP server. You can find it at http://www.debian.org. for information about LTSP on debian see http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP
16:42
<vagrantc>
there's more information there ^^
16:43
though not a lot
16:43
<PerfDave>
BUm, local sound and local device support are both kinda critical for my needs.
16:43
<johnny>
local devices mostly work in ubuntu, i know that.. so debain can't be too far off :)
16:44
altho i'm missing the "unmount" option
16:44
<PerfDave>
Looks like I'll need the extra packages mentioned at http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto
16:44
<vagrantc>
PerfDave: sound and local devices work with backported ltsp packages ...
16:45
PerfDave: yeah, that :)
16:45
the only major drawback to the backported packages is that the background on the login manager doesn't get displayed properly sometimes, as far as i can tell
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16:45
<vagrantc>
though arguably that's not major :)
16:46
<PerfDave>
Hmm, think I'll set up a Xen guest as an LTSP server with these backported packages :)
16:46
<johnny>
it was easy enough for me to just use virtualbox than figuring out xen
16:47
<vagrantc>
it's only a small handful of packages... although i tend to update them after the version in sid seems to be reasonably stable
16:47
<PerfDave>
johnny: I already have half a dozen Xen VMs on my desktop for various purposes, means I don't have to faff about to start from scratch :)
16:47
<johnny>
aha
16:47
cool
16:48
that's helpful
16:48
<PerfDave>
Most of them only have 64Mb of RAM, they use up fewer system resources than Firefox ;)
16:48* vagrantc is a big fan of virtualization
16:49
<PerfDave>
vagrantc: Yeah, I was thinking about having LTSP clients boot Xen-enabled kernels and start up their own guests, but I really couldn't think of a situation where that might be useful.
16:50
I think I was just having one of those "WHOA VIRTUALISATION EVERYWHERE" moments.
16:51
<vagrantc>
heh
16:51
i've tried it before as well
16:51
i don't remember what my use case really was, though
16:52
oh, i think i wanted to do anonymous logins on the local machine, but have users with accounts go to a login server
16:55* AzMoo hugs his VI3 solution.
16:55
<PerfDave>
Well, I think I'm going to keep working on getting my laptop working as an LTSP client, with local audio & devices. Then I should be able to roll that out at the social centre as an LTSP solution.
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19:12
<Solv>
i can't figure out how to change the resolution in the ldm login mananger...i have setup lts.conf files, and the resolution is good once logged in (1024x768) but ldm gives me something like 1200x800 and it looks horrible....any ideas?
19:16
<vagrantc>
X_MODE_0=1024x768
19:16
in lts.conf
19:16
you may need to use ip address or mac address, not hostnames
19:19
<Solv>
vagrantc: cheers
19:19
<sutula>
vagrantc: (since you're around), I'm getting bit by some bug where logins lock up if the wrong password is typed. This on 5.0.39 (Etch backports). Is there a workaround, or this a known problem. (I thought I saw discussion here a few weeks back.)
19:22
<vagrantc>
sutula: i've maybe seen it also ...
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19:25
<Solv_>
vagrantc: i actually already have that option set...with optional modelines as well...i thought it was just X_MODE i had set..not X_MODE_0
19:26
so yeah, problem still occurs
19:26
<vagrantc>
Solv_: which distro? i don't think modelines are supported in ltsp5 in ubuntu or debian
19:26
<Solv_>
yeah kubuntu
19:27
<vagrantc>
X_MODE_[0-2]
19:27
<sutula>
vagrantc: drat...my TODO list is full for tonight...I was hoping not to try to debug this one :)
19:27
<Solv_>
actually having heaps of problems...this is just one...i moved from fedora 5 with ltsp 4.1....and so far it isn't running as quickly or as well...
19:27
vagrantc: okay i'll give that a go
19:28
<vagrantc>
well, X_MODE_0, X_MODE_1 and X_MODE_2 ... i think those should be supported, but i'm not positive with ubuntu
19:28
<Solv_>
btw...the lts.conf file says i sohuld now use /var/lib/tftpboot/opt/ltsp/i386/lts.conf.....is that right....cause all the documentation as the old location of /opt/ltsp/i386
19:28
<vagrantc>
Solv_: yes, on ubuntu they moved lts.conf ...
19:28
<Solv_>
okay good....i have it in both places anyway
19:30
does anyone here use kubuntu? i can't seem to find gtk in the repos...and i want to run the thin client manager but it crashes, i assume because i don't have gtk (i have the gtk2+ engines...but i think that's just for themes)
19:32* sutula sees #kubuntu in channel list with 326 users...suggests asking there
19:33
<johnny>
you have gtk+
19:33
<Solv_>
sutula: yeah okay..sorry....btw vagrantc that worked...taking away the modelines
19:33
<johnny>
most likely
19:34
<Solv_>
johnny: well thin client manager crashes and the output seems to be that it can't draw the gtk windows
19:34
<johnny>
it should have pulled in the deps
19:34
tcm barely works for me on regular ubuntu
19:34
even with gtk
19:34
i wouldn't trust that software
19:35
<Solv_>
well...i went through the steps to use gdm instead of ldm....and what's scary is that ldm is still the default manager...hmm
19:35
i thought i would have at least broken it
19:36
<johnny>
using gdm? lol
19:36
ldm is the way to go
19:36* johnny doesn't understand the things people do their ltsp setups...
19:39
<Solv_>
how is ldm the way to go?
19:39
<johnny>
because it was written for ltsp
19:39
they wouldn't have written it if gdm was the proper way
19:40
<Solv_>
if you put in too simple a password when you setup a new user...the add user manager doesn't tell you about it...and then when you try and login in via ldm as a thin client it prompots you to make a new one...and if you do but it's too simple...it doesn't notify you
19:40
it just keeps asking you to verify the password!
19:40
and what about a face chooser?
19:40
<johnny>
that's a kubuntu bug
19:40
err kde bug
19:40
<Solv_>
ah
19:41
<johnny>
i know i make too simple password in gnome's user manager
19:41
<Solv_>
drives me nuts
19:41
<johnny>
it tells me it is too simple
19:41
you could adjust the the requirements somehow
19:41
i didn't even know ldm would even prompt to make a new user.. never seen that
19:41
face browser.. definitely in devel tho
19:41
<Solv_>
is there another add user manager you know of...the kde one doesn't even ask you to confirm the password...and it has bugs when adding groups...they don't show up untila restart etc etc
19:41
<johnny>
uhmmm.. do it via cli?
19:41
i stick with gnome ubuntu, because it is most tested
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19:42
<Solv_>
yeah, but i'm setting this system up for someone who is new to linux...
19:42
<johnny>
gnome ubuntu is best for them anyways prolly
19:42
<Solv_>
and they have to admin it
19:42
<johnny>
if they wnt the quickest help
19:42
<Solv_>
yeah...okay...i like kubuntu for the end user side of things...specially those who are used to windoze....
19:42
<johnny>
sounds buggy :)
19:42
<Solv_>
it is
19:43
<johnny>
gnome is plenty simple for windows users
19:43
we use it for public terminals
19:43
<Solv_>
i had kde in fedora 5 with ltsp 4.1 and it was good...the only thing better so far about kbuntu ltsp 5 is sound works =)
19:43
<johnny>
i've been here 6 months, i've yet to have a person
19:43
have a problem navigating it
19:43
they don't even know it's linux
19:43
they just use it
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19:43
<johnny>
ltsp 4.1 is dead tho
19:43
<Solv_>
so have you heard of any other guis? doesn't redhat have their own one or something?>
19:44
<johnny>
i think so
19:44
<Solv_>
sorry i meant add user guis
19:44
<johnny>
but i'd hope they'd phase it out
19:44
i don't even know it's its available in ubuntu at all
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19:44
<johnny>
apt-cache search --names-only system-config
19:44
try that
19:44
<Solv_>
yeah, i guess not hey
19:44* johnny isn't it even at his ubuntu box
19:44
<johnny>
i know ubuntu uses the system-config-printer
19:44
that's all i know of tho
19:45
the stock gnome one is nice enough for most people
19:45
who don't use crazy ldap setups
19:45
or anything
19:45
<Solv_>
yeah the gnome one is alright...maybe i'll get that...what's it called?
19:45
<johnny>
it'll pull in almost the entire gnome stack
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19:47
<Solv_>
good...maybe i can move to gnome then =)
19:49
so would it be gnome-system-tools or gnome-control-centre?
19:50
<johnny>
control-center
19:51
<Solv_>
sweet...while someone is still talking to me, i have another question...when you first login, there is a box in the top left corner about 50x50 that is orange and black...looks like barcodes...it stays there for aobut 5 minutes...ever heard of this before?
19:51
<johnny>
actually i have.. but it was on xfce
19:51
<Solv_>
it is there on all different terminals with different monitors
19:51
<johnny>
i don't know what causes it tho
19:52
<Solv_>
hmm...okay...i mean because it goes away it is liveable...but not ideal
19:53
okay, trying out a usb key....and i don't get a folder or icon popping up...my user is in fuse and i have the ltspfs and ltspfsd correctly installed as in the docs for ubuntu...is there a special dir or somehting they appear in?
19:54
<johnny>
they appear on my desktop in gnome
19:54
but on kde.. i think i've heard of problems
19:54
<Solv_>
oh...actually i sohudl check if localdev =y in lts.conf first
19:54
<johnny>
i heard that it is set as default in 5
19:54
so you don't have to set it..
19:54
but it's worth trying i suppose
19:54
<Solv_>
yeah i would expect that...who wouldn't want it as default
19:55
<johnny>
people who don't want folks plugging arbitrary devices in which they might load or take away data
19:55
or use unauthorized programs
19:55
etc
19:55
<vagrantc>
Solv_: /media/USERNAME/* is where the files get mounted to
19:55
<johnny>
but then they are supposed to show up on the desktop
19:55
<Solv_>
yeah but they would expect to have to make changes to lock it down so to speak
19:56
nope nothing mounted there
19:56
i will reboot the terminal and try again with the local_dev=y option
19:58
<johnny>
i had that problem, and i had to follow some instructions in the bug logged on launchpad
19:59
i don't know if the fix ever got applied
19:59
afaik it hasn't
20:00
<Solv_>
ah...okay i will search the forums
20:03
<johnny>
no
20:03
launchpad
20:05
<Solv_>
sorry that's what i meant
20:07
<vagrantc>
there's probably a line you need to comment out of /usr/bin/ltspfsmounter (something setting the display to a hard-coded value)
20:07
as well as a fix to /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ldm/rc.d/S10-delayed-mounter
20:08
where you need to add a -X to the ssh call
20:08
<johnny>
yes
20:08
that was it
20:08
yeah.. suprised no fixes released
20:08
since awhile
20:08
that was like 2 months ago
20:09
<vagrantc>
yea, those are to simple patches that really affect the functionality a lot
20:09* sutula copies the offending line 21 (which needs to be removed): env['DISPLAY'] = 'localhost:10.0'
20:09* vagrantc is missing a few keys
20:09
<johnny>
ogra has been gone a bit lately
20:09
<vagrantc>
of course, i haven't fixed it in debian either ...
20:09
<johnny>
aha
20:09
too busy with upstream stuff for the next version?
20:09
<vagrantc>
but i've been wanting to get comments on my redesign of ltspfs before fixing it
20:10
<Solv_>
i can't find anything in launchpad...can you give me a link?
20:10
<vagrantc>
i have several outstanding proposals to change it to not make multiple mountpoints
20:11
which fixes some bugs (that ubuntu worked around in gnome-vfs)
20:11
<Solv_>
i don't have /usr/bin/ltspfsmounter...i do have /usr/bin/ltspfs
20:11
don't worry
20:11
<vagrantc>
/usr/sbin ??
20:11
<Solv_>
yeha
20:11
sorry
20:12
okay so comment out line 21?
20:13
or change it to something else?
20:13
<vagrantc>
comment it out
20:15
<Solv_>
anything else needs changing?
20:15
<vagrantc>
and change "ssh -S" to "ssh -X -S" in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ldm/rc.d/S10-delayed-mounter
20:15
<Solv_>
ah
20:15
cheers
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20:16
<Solv_>
an x restart should do it?
20:18
nope...i will do a reboot
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20:26
<Solv_>
still nothing...time to debug...bbl
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21:01
<Solv>
quick question...can i use 64bit ubuntu with ltsp?
21:09
<vagrantc>
Solv: sure
21:09
you *might* have to specify ltsp-build-client --arch i386 if you want to use i386 thin clients
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21:46
<johnny>
Solv, it causes more problesm than it's worth if you want to use flashplayer
21:46
otherwise it's fine
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