IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 14 April 2015   (all times are UTC)

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05:55
<marmstrong6471>
Hi. anyone else having issues creating an ltsp-pnp server? I made an ubuntu and a mint one two weeks ago, and now I cannot make a pnp server of any kind. they all seem to be missing the vmlinuz files.
06:01
i saw the bug info about missing files being placed in /var/lib but mine are not there, or in any folder i can find. Any suggestions on where to look next?
06:45
<alkisg>
marmstrong6471: do you have /boot mounted on a different partition?
06:46
Also, which mint version?
06:51
<marmstrong6471>
i used mint 17 the first time and succeeded. i have tried mint 16 and 17 since then with the same missing files. I have not changed my /boot location.
06:52
i am using VMs being managed on proxmox, and i also used a physical machine with the same results.
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06:59
<alkisg>
marmstrong6471: I can check with vnc if you like, type this:
07:00
sudo apt-get install x11vnc; x11vnc -connect srv1-dide.ioa.sch.gr
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07:05
<suriya>
hi
07:05
<alkisg>
Hello
07:05
<marmstrong6471>
well, i restored my machine to try again while i was waiting, i need to reinstall ltsp server and such first.
07:05
<suriya>
Which Linux flavor is best for LTSP ?
07:06
<alkisg>
My answer is a bit biased, but I'd say Debian and Ubuntu
07:06
<suriya>
Okay alkisg
07:07
What is the best server config for 30 clients ?
07:07
<alkisg>
Tell us the client specs, cpu and ram
07:09
Do they have e.g. 1 GB RAM and 1 GHz processor?
07:09
<suriya>
Yes more than that . Am checking with them meanwhile
07:09
<alkisg>
!ltsp-pnp
07:09
<ltsp>
ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
07:09
<alkisg>
That's a good option then ^
07:15
<suriya>
Clent has 4GB RAM with Dual core 4th Gen
07:16
<alkisg>
That will also make a good server then :D
07:17
Try ltsp-pnp
07:17
Do you know if they have nvidia cards?
07:19
<suriya>
I checked with my 2 laptops . Server has 8GB RAM and I5 processcor with ubuntu 14.04 and client has 2GB RAM with Core 2 duo processor
07:19
but it was very slow
07:21
<alkisg>
suriya: did you try fat or thin clients?
07:21
Thin clients are indeed slow
07:21
<suriya>
Thin clients
07:21
<alkisg>
ltsp-pnp automatically uses fat whenever possible
07:21
So it's as fast as local installations
07:21
<suriya>
Oh ok .
07:21
<marmstrong6471>
alkisg: my apt-get install isn't finding sites. i need to restart everything. be back in a minute.
07:21
<suriya>
Can you share the steps link
07:21
<alkisg>
!ltsp-pnp
07:21
<ltsp>
ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
07:22
<alkisg>
That's the ltsp-pnp how-to
07:22
You can also check this, later on:
07:22
!lan-benchmark
07:22
<ltsp>
lan-benchmark: If you have a mixed-speed network (gigabit server<=>switch connection, and 100 Mbits/sec clients<=>switch connections), then you might suffer from the !flow-control issue. To benchmark your LAN with epoptes, see http://www.epoptes.org/documentation/lan-benchmark
07:22
<suriya>
Ok
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07:29
<marmstrong6471>
well alkisg, fate is against me tonight. my network cant find us.archive.ubuntu.com so i cant install anything right now.
07:30
I have to be up in four hours so I'm going to bed. Thanks for the offer, I will try again tomorrow if you have time.
07:30
<alkisg>
Bye! :)
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07:31
<suriya>
alkisg - Am already setup the ltsp . Now i can i try ltsp-pnp method ?
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07:31
<alkisg>
suriya: yes, but you'd have to remove the things that are not needed
07:31
E.g. sudo mv /opt/ltsp /opt/ltsp-no-pnp
07:32
...Otherwise the /opt/ltsp/i386 chroot will be preferred in ltsp-update-kernels, over the /
07:33
And be careful not to try to use both isc-dhcp _and_ dnsmasq...
07:34
<suriya>
Ok Will try it out
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08:56
<george_>
godmorning
08:56
i have a question
08:57
is motherboard asus z97 compatiblr with ubuntu ltsp ?
09:04
<suriya>
Does the board has PXE boot ?
09:04
have you tried LTSP ?
09:09
<vsuojanen>
motherboard should not cause any issues in ltsp setup because installing cost of any client hardware should be minimum. just plug it in your ltsp network and try if it works
09:12
if it doesn't work it's not to blame the motherboard. just get and install a new network card
09:15
if you haven't already done it, you should check the concept of the project from ltsp.org
09:21
<george_>
the problem is that i dont have the mobo and i wonder if it is working with ubuntu
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09:54
<vsuojanen>
ltsp project enables us to use thin client computing with any distro. find answer in google 'ubuntu asus z97' and ask further on ubuntu channel
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17:47
<vagrantc>
gbaman: did you need to make a custom kernel for pinet with the rpi2 ?
17:47* vagrantc is trying to use the kernel from raspbian.org mirrors
17:48
<vagrantc>
it seems like it's completely ignoring the intramfs
17:55
ah, this would explain it: [ 1.470198] Unpacking initramfs...
17:55
[ 1.473664] Initramfs unpacking failed: junk in compressed archive
17:55
probably doesn't like the compresion type used.
17:57
hrm. the kernel config lists all the typical compression methods...
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18:16
<vagrantc>
gbaman: seemed like it was an overlapping ram issue
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18:49
<gbaman>
vagrantc: weird.. Nope, I use the stock one from Raspbian
18:51
PiNet uses the kernel from linux-image-3.18.0-trunk-rpi2 for Pi2
18:52
Has a slightly custom initramfs with the patched ltsp file for overlayfs support
18:52
But nothing else out of the ordinary.
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18:53
<vagrantc>
gbaman: got past that part :)
18:54
<gbaman>
:)
18:54
<vagrantc>
now it seems like it won't do dhcp...
18:54
<gbaman>
..
18:54
Ahh, now someone has reported that as an issue, only a single person while piles of others have been fine
18:54
<vagrantc>
looks like it has aufs support in the kernel... will try that
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18:55
<gbaman>
Have been unable to track down the issue
18:56
https://github.com/PiNet/PiNet/issues/10
18:58
<vagrantc>
i'm not even seeing ipconfig
18:58
makes me suspect it's the in-kernel dhcp client
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18:59
<vagrantc>
IPv6: ADDRCONF(NETDEV_CHANGE): eth0: link becomes ready
18:59
DHCP request for ...
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19:05
<gbaman>
Always possible is an issue with the kernel?
19:06
Would explain it
19:06* vagrantc is starting to suspect firewalling
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19:07
<gbaman>
What, on the server?
19:07
<vagrantc>
well, on the host machine for the virtual server
19:07
<gbaman>
Ah
19:07
<vagrantc>
i tend to have a complicated network configuration
19:07
<gbaman>
:)
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19:10
<vagrantc>
ok... that was it, maybe.
19:10
and now we're back to no aufs support in the 3.18 kernel
19:11
<gbaman>
Yeah
19:11
Thought we had had that discussion ages ago :)
19:11
<vagrantc>
we did, and i fixed it in upstream ltsp :)
19:12
so i need to pull in those overlay(fs) patches for the initramfs scripts
19:12
and NFS won't work.
19:12
<gbaman>
They are included in my initramfs
19:13
And are included in the PiNet SD card folder
19:19* vagrantc is testing debian with the raspbian.org kernel.
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19:25
<gbaman>
vagrantc: ?
19:25
As in from normal debian repos?
19:26
<vagrantc>
yes
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19:27
<vagrantc>
only component from raspbian is the pseudo-bootloader pseudo-firmware and the kernel
19:29
Begin: Running /scripts/nfs-bottom ... done.
19:29
Begin: Running /scripts/init-bottom ... [ 8.595220] overlayfs: filesystem of lowerdir is not supported
19:29
mount: mounting overlay on /root failed: Invalid argument
19:29
progress!
19:32
<gbaman>
:)
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19:40
<gbaman>
vagrantc: did you get normal PiNet working btw?
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20:04
<vagrantc>
gbaman: still haven't tried yet, sorry :(
20:06
<gbaman>
:(
20:07
<vagrantc>
whee! debian armhf LTSP on the rpi2!
20:07
<gbaman>
:)
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20:13
<bennabiy>
vagrantc: this is interesting. I copied a chroot from a different lab, which works, and have managed to get a display to show, but it only has the resolution 640x480
20:15
vagrantc: hi btw :)
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20:21
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: some desktops save the monitor resolution settings... sometimes in really unhelpful ways
20:24
<bennabiy>
Even in a thin client environment?
20:25* vagrantc notes the unhelpful bit
20:25
<vagrantc>
most application developers don't think about thin or fat clients ...
20:26
bennabiy: it's just a hunch of something that could cause behavior like that
20:26
<bennabiy>
The odd thing is that this is from a working system at a different location, where I just tarred the i386 folder and updated the ssh keys
20:27
<vagrantc>
does the resolution with LDM look different from what logged in?
20:27
<bennabiy>
nope
20:27
<vagrantc>
ok, so it's bad all around
20:27
<bennabiy>
and when I go to shell, it is 640x480 as well
20:27
and xrandr says cant open display
20:27
<vagrantc>
identical monitor/video card combination at other site?
20:28
<bennabiy>
identical video card ( same thin clients) different monitor
20:28
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: you did successfully copy all the permissions in your tarball?
20:28
<bennabiy>
sudo tar cjpf ...
20:29
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: you'll also want to stick with numeric uid/gid rather than names, otherwise mismatches with the server can cause interesting results
20:29
<bennabiy>
yes, but in a chroot, would it not be the same?
20:29
only root etc.
20:29
<vagrantc>
i'd recommend tar --numeric-owner
20:30
bennabiy: well, when you unpack them on your server, it will reassign them according to the names not the numeric uid/gid, which can lead to mismatches
20:30
hunch #2
20:31
<bennabiy>
ah
20:32
<vagrantc>
e.g. your server1 has user/group uid/gid 125 assigned to user/group foo, while server2 has uid/gid 125 assigned to user/group bar
20:32
<bennabiy>
I guess I was just thinking that everything within the chroot was owned by root
20:32
<vagrantc>
the individual chroots will also likely be slightly out of sync on numeric id with the server, but that's not *much* of a problem since you're running commands with chroot
20:33
though it's always been a bit of a security concern
20:33
if a group in the chroot happens to be assigned differently to a group outside the chroot, someone might be able to execute or modify files they shouldn't
20:34
<bennabiy>
that is true...
20:35
what would stop someone from modifying the ltsp-build-client scripts to force that condition and gain access to the sbin stuff within the chroot?
20:37
<vagrantc>
root access on the server?
20:37
<bennabiy>
Although, I guess it always comes down to it, if someone had permissions to edit those scripts, they would have permissions to do anything anyway
20:37
yes
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20:40
<bennabiy>
so would you use --numberic-owner when you pack and unpack?
20:43
<vagrantc>
--numeric-owner ... yes.
20:43
or some other method entirey
20:43
entirely
20:43
<bennabiy>
I guess I could just rsync...
20:43
would that preserve permissions better?
20:44
or would it be the same problem?
20:44
<vagrantc>
same issue, same fix: --numeric-ids
20:45
using filesystem images instead could also work ... btrfs or ext*
20:45
(rather than squashfs, which aren't editable)
20:45
though you can actually append to squashfs, i guess ... might be worth writing something to handle squashfs updates
20:46
<bennabiy>
I have unpacked a squashfs img and then tried to update that way, but I cannot remember what happened
20:46
It was with a different system
20:47
<vagrantc>
probably doing a trick like ltsp-pnp with an aufs/overlayfs mount on top, updating the image, and regenerating it would be one way
20:47
i think it could also do partial updates by only appending the changes, but that would be more work.
20:49
<bennabiy>
I wonder what is causing the video failure with the most recent update on the LTS... both mint chroot and straight ubuntu chroot both fail on video
20:50
<vagrantc>
hrm.
20:50
<bennabiy>
but the one generated on a different system gets limited video
20:51
You going to be in NY anytime soon?
20:52
well, I am going to need to hit this more tonight or tomorrow. gotta run
20:53* bennabiy waves
21:05
<vagrantc>
bennabiy: some possibility later in the year... octoberish or something
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