IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 21 May 2012   (all times are UTC)

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07:17
<Fuzai>
I'm trying to use ssh -X from a thin client session to export a running app back to the session. What is the trick to do this?
07:17
i'm trying to run gkrellm from my router and have it come up on my thinclient session
07:20
<alkisg>
Can you explain with a bit more detail what you're trying to do?
07:21
<Fuzai>
I use ltsp 5 thin clients in a small office setting and the one on my desk i'm trying to make gkrellm appear thats running on my router through a X11 tunnel
07:23
<alkisg>
Your router is a PC running X-windows?
07:23
<Fuzai>
kinda
07:23
<alkisg>
So, is there anything ltsp-related in your question?
07:23
<Fuzai>
it is a debian linux machine that has gkrellm installed and working
07:23
<alkisg>
(except that you're using a thin client, but does that matter anywhere?)
07:23
<Fuzai>
well yes, ltsp is denying ssh socket that is normally setup with -X
07:24
normally this works without a hitch, i use it all over the place
07:25
<alkisg>
Which command are you trying? LTSP doesn't have any particular code to deny any connections, it just sets xauthority locally to the thin client
07:25
So whatever you run from inside the session should just work with X
07:26
<Fuzai>
gkrellm is all
07:26
<alkisg>
So you run: ssh -X router gkrellm ?
07:26
<Fuzai>
basically
07:26
<alkisg>
And what's the error message?
07:26
<Fuzai>
cant open display
07:26
X11 forwarding request failed on channel 0
07:27
<alkisg>
And you run this from a normal thin client session?
07:27
<Fuzai>
yep
07:27
<alkisg>
What's the output of `echo $DISPLAY` before running the ssh command?
07:27
<Fuzai>
i'll play with it some more
07:27
<alkisg>
LTSP doesn't have any code related to denying connections such as these
07:28
<Fuzai>
well it looks like
07:28
display is showing the thin clients ip
07:28
172.20.0.25:7.0
07:28
<alkisg>
Nice, and after ssh -X router; echo $DISPLAY ?
07:28
<Fuzai>
which isn't anywhere near my server which is statically set on 202
07:28
that was after ssh -X router echo $DISPLAY
07:28
<alkisg>
And before that?
07:28
<Fuzai>
same thing
07:29
<alkisg>
Wait, don't combine the 2 commands
07:29
Otherwise shell evaluates it before the ssh command
07:29
Run ssh -X router
07:29
<Fuzai>
so my question is how do i tell the xhost on the thin client to allow the connection from someone different the terminal server?
07:29
<alkisg>
And _then_ run echo $DISPLAY
07:29
ssh -X should have taken care of that
07:29
<Fuzai>
nothing
07:29
on the router $DISPLAY is blank
07:30
<alkisg>
So, `ssh -X router` doesn't set $DISPLAY
07:30
Any warnings in ~/.xsession-errors?
07:30
<Fuzai>
-X in ssh's man page says it's supposed to enable 11 forwarding
07:30
<alkisg>
Yup
07:31
<Fuzai>
so how do i set the xhost on the thin client to allow
07:31
because I can manually set the $DISPLAY line, but it still isn't allowing it
07:39
<alkisg>
Fuzai: my point is that you shouldn't have to, something else is wrong in your setup
07:39
From a thin client I can ssh -X to another machine without having to do anything at all manually
07:39
<Fuzai>
hrm
07:40
<alkisg>
You're not trying to use localapps, right?
07:40
<Fuzai>
no
07:40
i know where i'm logged in
07:40
<alkisg>
What did you set LDM_DIRECTX to?
07:40
<Fuzai>
i know where i installed it, from which repo
07:40
<alkisg>
True or the default false?
07:41
<Fuzai>
that's the encrypted tunnel to the server right?
07:41
<alkisg>
Yes
07:41
<Fuzai>
it's false right now
07:41
<alkisg>
Are you sure? Your DISPLAY then should be localhost:11 or something
07:41
<Fuzai>
it's not encrypted right now
07:41
<alkisg>
So it's true
07:42
Not false
07:42
<Fuzai>
which ever setting that would be
07:42
<alkisg>
Try without LDM_DIRECTX=True
07:42
I.e. remove it from your lts.conf and reboot your client
07:45
<awilliams>
hey guys, how is ltsp-land today?
07:46
<alkisg>
Hello
07:46
<Fuzai>
xauth
07:46
xauth was missing on the router
07:48
there we go good to go
07:49
<alkisg>
Nice
08:09
<Fuzai>
has anyone done a large scale deployment with ssh tunneled clients yet? Does anyone have any tricks to making flash video faster?
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08:14
<VectorX>
in contrast to distributed computing, what would you call LTSP ?
08:14
since now there is only one computer trying to solve all the problems
08:14
<Fuzai>
cool
08:15
<muppis>
VectorX, centralized.
08:20
<alkisg>
!flash
08:20
<ltsp`>
alkisg: flash: Yes, flash sucks. Make sure you have LDM_DIRECTX=True in your lts.conf file, or if it's just youtube you're after, try some flash replacing plugin like https://addons.mozilla.org/el/firefox/addon/161869/ (per user installation, gecko-mediaplayer is also needed).
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08:21
<alkisg>
Fuzai: ^ ...and also localapps or fat clients
08:23
<muppis>
alkisg, about Youtube, there is possibility also to use HTML5 video in present Firefox, but I haven't tested how it works over lan.
08:23
http://www.youtube.com/html5
08:23
<alkisg>
muppis: in firefox it still eats the same cpu as flash
08:24
<Fuzai>
gb ethernet i can watch justin.tv in standard def not a problem
08:24
<alkisg>
In google-chrome they have a better codec so it uses less cpu
08:24
<Fuzai>
100mbit doesn't normally hold up i just installed that gecko bit, i'm going to try again
08:24
<alkisg>
And since it doesn't use XVideo, it's also the same problem with the bandwidth
08:24
<muppis>
Ok.
08:24
<Fuzai>
i find that google-chrome my scroll wheel doesn't work right
08:24
<alkisg>
muppis: while with the *mplayer plugins, it uses XV and it needs _much_ less cpu and bandwidth
08:24
<Fuzai>
firefox and everything else it does
08:25
woow
08:26
<muppis>
alkisg, does those work with everywhere where flash video is used?
08:26
<alkisg>
muppis: nope, and sometimes they have other problems too
08:26
<Fuzai>
I have to make sure it works for my clients
08:26
sometimes they have to see multimedia sites
08:26
<alkisg>
(e.g. updates in youtube breaking it until it's updated, or having to download the whole video instead of streaming it live etc)
08:27
Fuzai: did you also check the localapps/fat clients idea?
08:27
<Fuzai>
yes
08:27
<alkisg>
That's usually much better if you have good enough clients
08:27
<Fuzai>
i started with wanting to use raspberry pi's as the thinclient
08:27
but they don't have enough power
08:27
<alkisg>
cubox is much better I think
08:27
<Fuzai>
so i moved to a dualcore atom 2gb client
08:28
<alkisg>
With so much power, then go for localapps or fats
08:28
<Fuzai>
Why when there is so much more server side resources available
08:29
<alkisg>
Because 1 hd video requires more than 1 gbps of bandwidth
08:29
Multiply that with your number of clients
08:29
<Fuzai>
even standard def?
08:29
<alkisg>
width * height * color depth * number of frames per second, do the math for the video you care about
08:30
<Fuzai>
Ok so it really is like that
08:30
<alkisg>
Where width and height are the view screen dimensions, not the video dimensions
08:30
So for 1920x1080 clients, watching small videos in youtube _fullscreen_ is a no-go for thin clients
08:30
<Fuzai>
What about thin clients with that resolution in general
08:31
are they going to use more bandwidth to render the screen?
08:31
<alkisg>
Of course
08:31
<Fuzai>
So fat clients really are the only way to go if you want to scale
08:31
<alkisg>
Unless you have multiple servers and arrange them in cluster etc
08:32
E.g with ltsp-cluster there were deployments with many thousand clients
08:32
<Fuzai>
i was planning on using dual xeon 5600's with quad gbe
08:32
how many clients do you think i can get away with side by side just browsing the internet?
08:32
64 gb ram
08:32
<alkisg>
Without any local apps, and with encryption?
08:33
<Fuzai>
yea no encryption and using thinclients with a central server
08:33
to me localapps sounds like fat clients
08:33
<alkisg>
You do know that localapps and fat clients are still diskless and served by the same server, right?
08:33
It's just a different LTSP mode, nothing related to local installations
08:34
<Fuzai>
is there a difference between local apps and fat clients or do you mean local apps just because everything about a fat client is locally executed?
08:34
<alkisg>
There are 3 different modes that ltsp supports
08:34
thin clients, thin clients with localapps, and fat clients
08:34
Please read the docs for details
08:34
<Fuzai>
i know the first and the third
08:34
<alkisg>
All of them diskless
08:34
<Fuzai>
can you elaborate on the 2nd
08:35
<alkisg>
It's like thin clients except that you install e.g. firefox and flash in the chroot to solve the problems we're talking about
08:35
<Fuzai>
Hehe, ok unless you have a link i'm going to go read
08:35
thank you
08:35
<alkisg>
It's in the IRC topic
08:36
<Fuzai>
http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LocalApps
08:36
the first link about local apps doesn't get very far
08:37
<alkisg>
Type "/topic" in your irc client to see the channel topic
08:37
<Fuzai>
I just did
08:37
<alkisg>
There's a pdf there that you should read
08:37
<Fuzai>
and took the last link
08:38
<alkisg>
http://sourceforge.net/projects/ltsp/files/Docs-Admin-Guide/LTSPManual.pdf/download
08:38
<Fuzai>
thank you
08:40
<alkisg>
!fatclients
08:40
<ltsp`>
alkisg: fatclients: You may find some info about the Ubuntu/LTSP implementation of fat clients at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients
08:40
<alkisg>
Fuzai: and that's ^ a bit of documentation about LTSP fat clients
08:40
<Fuzai>
thank you
08:40
<alkisg>
It's relatively new so it's not in the .pdf
08:40
<Fuzai>
i've been looking for something just like your first link for a while
08:42
<Hyperbyte>
Good morning campers! :)
08:43
<alkisg>
Hi Hyperbyte, any new troubles with 12.04 today? :P :D
08:45
<Hyperbyte>
Yessir. :)
08:45
But that's not really with 12.04, I think.
08:45
My Samba with LDAP authentication stopped working
08:48
<Fuzai>
if I run firefox as a local apps does this mean I get DRI access too? what about vdpau offloading with flash?
08:49
<alkisg>
Yes you can arrange all that
08:49
<Fuzai>
Oh sweet, you just gave me a tool to blow everyones mind
08:50
so if I install quake 3 as a local app it should fire correctly if the os is configured right on the thin client?
08:50
<alkisg>
Yup
08:50
<Fuzai>
Oh my, what have you guys done
08:50
:)
08:51
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, oh, I have also noticed that screen resolution detection goes a bit less okay in 12.04
08:51
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: that would be xorg, nothing related to ltsp, correct?
08:51
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, probably, yeah. :) Just throwing it out here, fyi.
08:51
<alkisg>
For which graphics card?
08:52
<Fuzai>
be right back
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08:52
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, Intel GMA
08:53
<alkisg>
Hyperbyte: are you talking about the reverse screens etc problem, where in ldm everything is ok and the problem is after login?
08:56
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, well that happens too.. but also when I attach one 4:3 screen, and one 16:10 screen, they're both put in 4:3 resolutions
08:58
<alkisg>
I had that for ages with intel gma, it doesn't sound new...
08:59
<Hyperbyte>
Oh, no, I had some issues on 11.04 as well
09:02
Still, say what you want about Gnome3, but dconf > gconf.
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17:23
<bieb>
I am installing Ubuntu 12.04 from alternate CD, ltsp install.. It says Installation step failed" you can try to run the failing item again from the menu, or skip it and choose something else. The failing step is: Select and install software. Any ideas? should I do the next step? which in the menu is Build LTSP chroot
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17:35
<bieb>
anyone awake??
17:35
<vagrantc>
awake, but don't really know ubuntu's installer support
17:36
<bieb>
vagrantc: ok.. didnt know if it was something you had seen or heard before
17:37
<vagrantc>
i think it's basically like debian-installer ... if so you could try alt-f2 to get a shell and poke around
17:37
logs in /var/log/syslog
17:37
a very limited shell, though
17:37
also log displayed on alt-f4
17:37
(installer itself on alt-f1
17:37
)
17:38
<bieb>
vagrantc: ok.. seemed odd.. it installed a bunch of packages.. then failed.. I have restarted the software install 3 times
17:38
<vagrantc>
is it installingg from the network? otherwise i'd expect the CD to be self-contained
17:39
if it's getting segfaults or kernel oopses, i'd run memtest on it for a while
17:39
<bieb>
during one of the software restarts.. I went back on the menu and configured the package manager.. I allowed it to use the network mirrors
17:40
<vagrantc>
the occasional network hiccup might mess it up a bit ... might try installing without network mirrors and then updating later.
17:41
i mean, it should generally be robust... but who knows
17:41
<bieb>
ok
17:43
<vagrantc>
presuming ubuntu has enough on the CD to do so...
17:50
<bieb>
vagrantc: when you are looking at the package manager.. it tells you the cd will give you limited install
17:50
<vagrantc>
that is plausible.
17:51
or just retry the network install
17:51
without seeing what's in the install log, i'mjust guessing in the dark here.
17:55
<bieb>
vagrantc: how do I view the last x number of lines of the syslog?
17:56
<vagrantc>
tail -n #
17:56
<bieb>
something in sptitude failed
17:59
vagrantc: what info you want me to give you? since I can't cut and paste to pastebin
18:00
<vagrantc>
what in aptitude failed?
18:03
<bieb>
I got Err http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ precise-updates/main linux-headers-3.2.0-24 all 3.2.0-24.38
18:03
Something wicked happened resolving 'us.aarchive.ubuntu.com:http' (-5 -no address associated with hostname)
18:04
vagrantc: then after that it runs a bunch of similar errors for archive and security.ubuntu..
18:06
later before it fails.. one of the lines says Unable to fetch some archives, maybe run apt-get update or try with --fix-missing?
18:06
<vagrantc>
looks like network dropped out
18:06
you couldn't resolve hostnames ... either your networking went down locally, or you couldn't contact your DNS server for some reason
18:07
<bieb>
ok
18:07
<vagrantc>
might be worth retrying from scratch
18:07
<bieb>
well at this point I can't ifconfig to see if I have ip
18:09
<vagrantc>
ip addr show
18:09
??
18:10
<bieb>
cool.. didnt know that one.. was trying ifconfig
18:10
yeah it has an IP address
18:10
<vagrantc>
can you ping something?
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18:13* vagrantc waves to alkisg
18:13
<bieb>
nothing outside.. but can inside
18:13
<alkisg>
Hi vagrantc, hi all
18:13
<bieb>
vagrantc: looks like network issue
18:13* vagrantc guessed right
18:13
<bieb>
I will restart and see if it works
18:14
<vagrantc>
worst case, see just how limited the install from CD is ...
18:14
<bieb>
ok
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21:05
<vlt>
Hello. Any idea how to remove the “Shut down …” and “Software up to date” lines in Ubuntu 12.04’s logout menu for LTSP users?
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