IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 31 August 2012   (all times are UTC)

00:01vagrantc has left IRC (vagrantc!~vagrant@freegeek/vagrantc, Quit: leaving)
00:03markit has left IRC (markit!~marco@88-149-177-66.v4.ngi.it, )
00:06ogra_ has left IRC (ogra_!~ogra@ubuntu/member/ogra, Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
00:06ogra_ has joined IRC (ogra_!~ogra@p5098ed03.dip0.t-ipconnect.de)
00:12Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
00:20Parker955 is now known as Parker955_Away
00:24Parker955_Away is now known as Parker955
00:24andygraybeal_ has joined IRC (andygraybeal_!~andy@h230.214.213.151.dynamic.ip.windstream.net)
00:27Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)
00:36Parker955 is now known as Parker955_Away
00:43Parker955_Away is now known as Parker955
00:53sha_ has left IRC (sha_!~sha@g231161151.adsl.alicedsl.de, *.net *.split)
00:53sutula has left IRC (sutula!sutula@nat/hp/x-oialajncvrtmdxal, *.net *.split)
00:57sha_ has joined IRC (sha_!~sha@g231161151.adsl.alicedsl.de)
00:57sutula has joined IRC (sutula!sutula@nat/hp/x-oialajncvrtmdxal)
01:31highvoltage has left IRC (highvoltage!~highvolta@ubuntu/member/highvoltage, Remote host closed the connection)
01:59highvoltage has joined IRC (highvoltage!~highvolta@ubuntu/member/highvoltage)
02:13andygraybeal_ has left IRC (andygraybeal_!~andy@h230.214.213.151.dynamic.ip.windstream.net, Quit: Ex-Chat)
03:55sha has joined IRC (sha!~sha@e177166160.adsl.alicedsl.de)
03:56sha_ has left IRC (sha_!~sha@g231161151.adsl.alicedsl.de, Read error: Operation timed out)
04:12Parker955 is now known as Parker955_Away
04:15staffencasa has left IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu, Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
04:19staffencasa has joined IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu)
05:06Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
05:17ltspuser_03 has joined IRC (ltspuser_03!4c59bc89@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.89.188.137)
05:17ricotz has joined IRC (ricotz!~rico@p5B2AA865.dip.t-dialin.net)
05:17ricotz has joined IRC (ricotz!~rico@unaffiliated/ricotz)
05:18bauerski has joined IRC (bauerski!~witekb@frodo.psp.opole.pl)
05:27Bootless has joined IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
05:56ltspuser_03 has left IRC (ltspuser_03!4c59bc89@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.89.188.137, Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
06:31
<Bootless>
hey guys, sorry to annoy you with this but i still have the problem that my root server from my ltsp cluster does not choose an appserver. instead the root server choose himself. does anyone know where i have to change something? i googled the whole time but cannot find it. thanks in advance
06:51
<Hyperbyte>
Bootless, I think people genuinely want to help you (I know I do), but not many people in here are LTSP-Cluster wizards. Patience will be more important than usual in this case. ;-)
06:52bobby_C has joined IRC (bobby_C!~bobby@85-124-22-227.teleworker.xdsl-line.inode.at)
06:55
<Bootless>
Hyperbyte: thanks for your answer and yes i know this it is just that i don't know if someone new joined which could have knowledge about it. because of this i wrote it again :). but i will try to put me in more patience ;)
06:57
<Hyperbyte>
Oh, I don't think anyone minds you repeating the question. I'm just saying, you know... it might take a while. :)
06:57
Meanwhile, try reading manual about config files, and make sure you don't have syntax errors or anything that's crazy in your config files.
06:58
Comma's in wrong places, no "quotes" where they should be, etc
06:58
Also, there might be some clues in the /var/log/syslog on the server. Maybe some error messages appear when a client logs in.
07:08
<Bootless>
not exactly a error message just that the client is using the root server ip as appserver. i will just look through everything again :)
07:09
or i think about rebuilding the cluster in virtualbox to test it
07:29ricotz has left IRC (ricotz!~rico@unaffiliated/ricotz, Quit: Ex-Chat)
08:15Bootless has left IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net, Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
08:18Bootless has joined IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
08:29Bootless1 has joined IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
08:31Bootless has left IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net, Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
08:33markit has joined IRC (markit!~marco@88.149.177.66)
08:34Bootless1 has left IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net, Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
08:38Pecker has left IRC (Pecker!~irc@67-61-36-10.cpe.cableone.net, Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
08:39asmok has joined IRC (asmok!~asmok@cs78145191.pp.htv.fi)
08:39Pecker has joined IRC (Pecker!~irc@67-61-36-10.cpe.cableone.net)
08:41Bootless has joined IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
08:42Bootless has left IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
08:42
<asmok>
how to install ltsp-pnp offline with Lubuntu 12.04.1? Clone installation with Clonezilla? Or make own installation CD? What you do? Anybody using own installation-CD?
08:44
I need ltsp-pnp but it is PPA right now or is it already included in 12.04.1 release? Should I wait and use 12.10 Edubuntu DVD or Alternate CD?
08:47Bootless1 has joined IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net)
08:48Pecker has left IRC (Pecker!~irc@67-61-36-10.cpe.cableone.net, Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
08:50
<markit>
asmok: you should wait mr. alkisg that is the main -pnp developer
08:51
asmok: and don't know if here is the answer https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
08:52
<asmok>
markit: i wait for Alkis, i maybe need lots of offline installations for ltsp-pnp/fat client, that's the problem to me,i think
08:53
markit: and with Lubuntu/Xubuntu, too
09:03
<markit>
asmok: can't you prepare a -pnp image and then just copy to "n" targhet machines?
09:12
<asmok>
markit: i had used Clonezilla for whole hd - you mean something like installation server - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PXEInstallServer
09:16hays_ has left IRC (hays_!~quassel@unaffiliated/hays, Read error: Connection reset by peer)
09:17hays has joined IRC (hays!~quassel@unaffiliated/hays)
09:24staffencasa has left IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu, Ping timeout: 244 seconds)
09:27
<asmok>
markit: well, i think there is no Lubuntu 12.04.1 release, just Lubuntu 12.10 alpha-3, hmm...
09:28staffencasa has joined IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu)
09:28
<markit>
asmok: I use kubuntu, only problem was that 12.04.1 release is 703MB, can't be fitten in a normal CD
09:29
<asmok>
markit: ok
09:32
markit: Xubuntu has 12.04.1 Alternate, but i prefer more Lubuntu desktop
09:36Da-Geek has joined IRC (Da-Geek!~Da-Geek@exch.imparando.com)
09:41
<Hyperbyte>
asmok, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AptGet/Offline/Repository
09:42
<asmok>
Hyperbyte: ok, i check that, too
09:42
<Hyperbyte>
Then you can take the Ubuntu repository with your on a USB stick, although the installation disk probably already has a repository
09:42
I know ltsp-buil-client has a command to choose a custom repository to fetch packages from, but I don't remember what it is.
09:42
<asmok>
Hyperbyte: ok
09:43
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg can give you details, but this should get you at least familiar with the concept. :)
09:44
<asmok>
Hyperbyte: do you know is ltsp-pnp included in 12.04.1? Or should we wait for 12.10, new release, not updated old one?
09:45
<Hyperbyte>
asmok, ltsp-pnp is seperately developed from ltsp for now
09:45
It isn't yet included in the main LTSP branch
09:45
!ltsp-pnp
09:45
<ltsp>
ltsp-pnp: ltsp-pnp is an alternative (upstream) method to maintain LTSP installations for thin and fat clients that doesn't involve chroots: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ltsp-pnp
09:46
<asmok>
Hyperbyte: ok, i use it now like that way
09:47
<Hyperbyte>
Still, you shouldn't dismiss markit's idea so quickly either. If you are doing similar installations on similar enough hardware, you can just make a harddisk image
09:48
Then you just install one system with the basic settings useful for all your installations, make a harddisk image, and then copy that harddisk image to every server you're installing
09:48
Will save you lots of time.
09:49
<asmok>
Hyperbyte: ok, i need that in some point i think (saving time and tweaking)
09:50
<markit>
Hyperbyte: I'm going to evaluate to drop dnsmasq and go for tftpd-hpa and isc-dhcp-server, but what about dns caching? What do you use? Is dnsmasq good for that or better replace it as well?
09:51
<Hyperbyte>
markit, I don't use any of it. Or at least not on the LTSP server. Here at my dayjob at the touroperator, I have a seperate network server, which firewalls the entire network and does dhcp, dns server/cache, ntp (etc) for the entire network
09:52
Same at the radiostation I volunteer at, but there we also virtualize the LTSP server, so it does even less.
09:52
LTSP server does tftp-hpa, but dns cache/dhcp are all disabled on the LTSP servers.
09:52
<asmok>
markit: i think dnsmasq is very good when you have separate classroom in almost jungle situation (mine case), but if you anything more complex go for real dhcp-server
09:54
<Hyperbyte>
Right. :) I use isc dhcp server on the network servers, and bind for dns server/cache.
09:59
<asmok>
i have to go now, but i know Alkis will read my question: how to install ltps-pnp offline/is it included to 12.04.1? Bye now
09:59asmok has left IRC (asmok!~asmok@cs78145191.pp.htv.fi, Quit: Lähdössä)
10:00baptiste has left IRC (baptiste!baptiste@paul-sud.asso.ups-tlse.fr, Read error: Operation timed out)
10:02
<markit>
am I blind, but don't find in the doc how to setup dhcp and tftp?
10:03
I've found only a "quick install" that is "next next next" without explaination (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall)
10:07
<Hyperbyte>
markit, tftp should be a matter of installing and enabling tftp-hpa service
10:07
As for dhcp and dns, you won't find much how-to's for them specific to LTSP, because those are not specific to LTSP. :-)
10:07
You can find an example dhcpd.conf here /usr/share/doc/ltsp-server/examples/dhcpd.conf
10:07
<markit>
Hyperbyte: yep, I'm doing a ltsp-server-standanlone install in a snapshot of a virtual machine and digging the config files created
10:08
<Hyperbyte>
But that dhcpd.conf seems a bit wrong
10:08
<markit>
neverless a "how to install" page should be present
10:08
<Hyperbyte>
markit, well, why don't you write one?
10:08baptiste has joined IRC (baptiste!baptiste@paul-sud.asso.ups-tlse.fr)
10:08
<markit>
the one in /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf ?
10:08
<Hyperbyte>
http://wiki.ltsp.org/
10:08
<markit>
Hyperbyte: only once I've learned how to do ;P
10:08
<Hyperbyte>
I'll hold you to that!
10:08
<markit>
lol
10:09
<Hyperbyte>
Seriously!
10:09
These are the two options needed in dhcpd.conf:
10:09
next-server 192.168.100.2;
10:09
filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0";
10:09
(the strange characters in the middle are tabs - not sure if you see them, but my terminal doesn't display them)
10:10
<markit>
I've no "next server", but I have to bind dhcp to the "client side" interface
10:10
<Hyperbyte>
next-server specifies LTSP server IP, filename specifies TFTP filename
10:10
markit, see the manpage for dhcpd.conf, or look up isc-dhcp-server documentation.
10:10
<markit>
AH!
10:11
<Hyperbyte>
By default isc's dhcpd listens only on interfaces specified in dhcpd.conf.
10:11
<markit>
in the examples I've seen, next-server is commented out
10:11
<Hyperbyte>
But these are things not LTSP related. :)
10:11
markit, yeah, that's why I said 'it seems wrong'
10:11
But I -think- it's only necessary if your DHCP server and TFTP server are not the same machine.
10:12
'next-server' probably optionally specifies the other server that the next request (the tftp) should go to
10:59bobby_C has left IRC (bobby_C!~bobby@85-124-22-227.teleworker.xdsl-line.inode.at, Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
11:06Da-Geek has left IRC (Da-Geek!~Da-Geek@exch.imparando.com, Read error: Connection reset by peer)
11:06Gremble has joined IRC (Gremble!~Ben@cpc10-aztw24-2-0-cust114.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)
11:15ltspuser_80 has left IRC (ltspuser_80!d031d602@gateway/web/freenode/ip.208.49.214.2, Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
11:15Gremble has left IRC (Gremble!~Ben@cpc10-aztw24-2-0-cust114.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com, Quit: I Leave)
11:24komunista has joined IRC (komunista!~slavko@adsl-195-168-234-074.dynamic.nextra.sk)
11:46alexqwesa has left IRC (alexqwesa!~alex@alexo-veto.broker.freenet6.net, Remote host closed the connection)
11:46alexqwesa has joined IRC (alexqwesa!~alex@alexo-veto.broker.freenet6.net)
11:56alexqwesa_ has joined IRC (alexqwesa_!~alex@109.172.12.47)
11:56alexqwesa has left IRC (alexqwesa!~alex@alexo-veto.broker.freenet6.net, Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
11:58[GuS] has joined IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@213-117-16-190.fibertel.com.ar)
11:58[GuS] has joined IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@unaffiliated/gus/x-663402)
12:10ltspuser_03 has joined IRC (ltspuser_03!be7af013@gateway/web/freenode/ip.190.122.240.19)
12:11
<ltspuser_03>
Hi everybody
12:11
i've asked for a umask problem 2 days ago
12:12
<muppis>
!qwebirc
12:12
<ltsp>
qwebirc: If you're planning to join this IRC channel via web multiple times, it might be a good idea to set some username by typing e.g. "/nick john123", so that channel members can identify you and remember your use case / previous questions etc
12:12
<ltspuser_03>
i could fix it
12:12
so i want to share the fix
12:12
<muppis>
Feel free.
12:13
<ltspuser_03>
i had to modify /etc/pam.d/sshd and add the line "session optional pam_umask.so umask=0002", then reload ssh server
12:13
it fixed the problem ! :D
12:13
thanks for the help!
12:14
the modifications on /etc/profile didn't fix the problem, because ubuntu 12.04 use pam_umask to set the umask
12:15
so you have to apply the umask on the files related with the kind of login in /etc/pam.d/
12:16
in my case it was on /etc/pam.d/sshd
12:16
thanks
12:16
bye!
12:17PhoenixSTF has joined IRC (PhoenixSTF!~rudi@193.136.242.251)
12:28ltspuser_03 has left IRC (ltspuser_03!be7af013@gateway/web/freenode/ip.190.122.240.19, Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
12:30
<Hyperbyte>
!learn umask as <john123> i had to modify /etc/pam.d/sshd and add the line "session optional pam_umask.so umask=0002", then reload ssh server
12:30
<ltsp>
The operation succeeded.
12:30
<Hyperbyte>
Nice of him to share the fix. :-)
12:32[GuS] has left IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@unaffiliated/gus/x-663402, Remote host closed the connection)
12:38Pecker has joined IRC (Pecker!~irc@67-61-36-10.cpe.cableone.net)
12:38
<Bootless1>
does someone know how to fix this message: Cannot retrieve node 'mocltsp11', error:<type 'exceptions.IOError'> ? i can ping the hotsname and it is in the /etc/hosts
12:52komunista has left IRC (komunista!~slavko@adsl-195-168-234-074.dynamic.nextra.sk, Quit: Leaving.)
12:54adrianorg_ has joined IRC (adrianorg_!~adrianorg@186.213.158.108)
12:58adrianorg__ has left IRC (adrianorg__!~adrianorg@201.22.231.233, Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
13:03dead_inside has joined IRC (dead_inside!~dead_insi@76.75.3.174)
13:04bauerski has left IRC (bauerski!~witekb@frodo.psp.opole.pl, Quit: Leaving.)
13:27Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)
13:42Bootless1 has left IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@yath1870.cronon.net, Read error: Connection reset by peer)
13:59krumpli has joined IRC (krumpli!~krumpli@catv-80-99-20-126.catv.broadband.hu)
14:00
<krumpli>
hi, i am using edubuntu and there is a problem with ltsp booting: I get the message pxe32: tftp open timeout. what is wrong?
14:20ricotz has joined IRC (ricotz!~rico@p5B2AADF3.dip.t-dialin.net)
14:20ricotz has joined IRC (ricotz!~rico@unaffiliated/ricotz)
14:20
<markit>
I'm on a FAT client, with the same user that is a sudoer and that can be sudo in the server, I can't become sudo in that client
14:20
it asks the password but says is wrong
14:21
is there something that prevents the autentication?
14:25
<muppis>
Yes, /etc/shadow does not contain passwords by default.
14:26
And I mean in client.
14:26
<markit>
muppis: ah, I see, I thought that there were a mechanism to route authentication to the server
14:26
<PhoenixSTF>
is It possible to have fat and Thin Client setup on one server?
14:27
<markit>
PhoenixSTF: sure, fat client setup works for thin as well
14:28
you have a parameter to choose with client will be fat and wich thin based on their RAM
14:28
or you can force with mac address client by client
14:28
PhoenixSTF: i.e. FAT_RAM_THRESHOLD=800
14:28
every client with >= 800MB ram will boot as fat
14:28
<muppis>
markit, if use ldap you can use that as that mechanism.
14:29
<markit>
muppis: I see... I'm too ignorant for that, does not matter at the moment, thanks for the clarification
14:30
<muppis>
markit, or if you need only one user to use sudo, just copy that users hash to chroot's shadow.
14:30
<PhoenixSTF>
markit, ty ^^ i will try and set up a server under kvm
14:32[GuS] has joined IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@213-117-16-190.fibertel.com.ar)
14:32[GuS] has joined IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@unaffiliated/gus/x-663402)
14:32
<PhoenixSTF>
markit, but under ubuntu or edubuntu is usualy ltsp-cluster, so same thing?
14:34
<muppis>
markit, or generate own one for it. Or enable passwordless sudo for that account, which is not wise if not private enviroment.
14:34staffencasa has left IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu, Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
14:38staffencasa has joined IRC (staffencasa!~staffenca@8-220.ptpg.oregonstate.edu)
14:39Pecker has left IRC (Pecker!~irc@67-61-36-10.cpe.cableone.net, Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
14:41
<highvoltage>
PhoenixSTF: yes, they use the exact same packages
14:57mealstrom has left IRC (mealstrom!~mealstrom@46.63.71.254, Quit: Leaving.)
15:27Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
15:33alkisg has joined IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg)
15:38krumpli has left IRC (krumpli!~krumpli@catv-80-99-20-126.catv.broadband.hu, Quit: Távozom)
15:41Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)
15:46
<alkisg>
!forget qwebirc
15:46
<ltsp>
The operation succeeded.
15:46
<alkisg>
!learn ltspuser as If you're planning to join this IRC channel via web multiple times, it might be a good idea to set some username by typing e.g. "/nick john123", so that channel members can identify you and remember your use case / previous questions etc
15:46
<ltsp>
The operation succeeded.
15:48
<alkisg>
asmok: ltsp-pnp is maintained upstream along with the rest of LTSP, but 12.04.1 has the same ltsp version as 12.04, so no it's not available there, it needs 12.10.
15:49
But if you're looking for completely offline installations, note that the alternate CD won't be available from 12.10 on, so the "ltsp quickinstall" wiki page is no longer valid
15:51
So for 12.04.01 you need something like clonezilla, while for 12.10 you can also do this:
15:51
(1) install the desktop CD on a machine that _is_ connected to the internet, (2) install ltsp etc, (3) copy /var/cache/apt/archives to a usb stick,
15:52
and then on the new, offline installation, (1) use the desktop CD, (2) copy /var/cache/apt/archives from the usb stick, (3) install ltsp etc
15:54
And of course there are many other ways to do it as well. E.g. I'm looking at https://wiki.edubuntu.org/DesktopTeam/Specs/Oneiric/LocalizedCDImageTools to generate our own ubuntu-desktop-greek-schools.iso here in greece with the programs we want preinstalled
15:56Bootless has joined IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@p57A258E4.dip.t-dialin.net)
15:57ltspuser_14 has joined IRC (ltspuser_14!ad4632dc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.70.50.220)
15:58
<ltspuser_14>
Hello... I'm trying to setup LTSP on Uburntu 12.04 and I'm having trouble finding a good set of directions, I found this ( https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall )
15:58
but that doesn't seem to work.
15:59
Anyone have a link to a good set of instructions?
16:01artista-frustrad has joined IRC (artista-frustrad!~fernando@189.125.205.147)
16:08Bootless1 has joined IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@p57A258E4.dip.t-dialin.net)
16:10Bootless has left IRC (Bootless!~AnDyLap@p57A258E4.dip.t-dialin.net, Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
16:13ryan has joined IRC (ryan!d170f8b2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.209.112.248.178)
16:14ryan is now known as Guest32147
16:16Guest32147 has left IRC (Guest32147!d170f8b2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.209.112.248.178, Client Quit)
16:17
<alkisg>
(06:58:41 μμ) ltspuser_14: but that doesn't seem to work. => what is the problem exactly?
16:22
<[GuS]>
knipwim: Hi! I am installing the new version of LTSP. I need to test a thin client that has a VIA Epia which i cant make it work with current LTSP-i686 (even not compiling a custom kernel for it). So, will see with i486. :D
16:43DIoX|DaZ has left IRC (DIoX|DaZ!~KaKa@server.civicclub.lt, Remote host closed the connection)
16:44DIoX|DaZ has joined IRC (DIoX|DaZ!~KaKa@server.civicclub.lt)
16:45
<markit>
alkisg: oh, welcome in the chat, I've a question for you since yesterday night, lol
16:45
alkisg: I remember I had a problem with kubuntu/kde/pulseaudio and FAT clients that you resolved long time ago
16:46
is that if the user changes PC, the pulseaudio kde interface asks about the "no more present devices"
16:46
I had the same issue yesterday night
16:46
but today, after installing pulseaudio-esound-compat, seems not the case
16:46
wondering if is just a coincidence or that package is meant to fix that kind of issue
16:47
and if not, if your fix are upstream or not or whatever related with this annoying problem
16:47* markit has also one more annoying problem... kde desktop takes 15-20 seconds to become ready after seems ready
16:48DIoX|DaZ has left IRC (DIoX|DaZ!~KaKa@server.civicclub.lt, Remote host closed the connection)
16:49DIoX|DaZ has joined IRC (DIoX|DaZ!~KaKa@server.civicclub.lt)
16:49Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Read error: Operation timed out)
16:51komunista has joined IRC (komunista!~slavko@adsl-195-168-234-074.dynamic.nextra.sk)
16:51Gremble has joined IRC (Gremble!~Ben@cpc10-aztw24-2-0-cust114.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com)
16:52
<alkisg>
markit: I think you're confusing me with someone else
16:52
I haven't been using LTSP with KDE
16:53
So I've no idea about its problems or solutions
16:56
<markit>
alkisg: ehm, you are my only source of solutions, so I dubt I confused you with someone else
16:56
<alkisg>
Well, I really haven't found any KDE solutions, since I'm not using it
16:57
<markit>
alkisg: in any case, pulseaudio should be a general problem
16:57
and also you tried long (1 year?) ago kde for some days
16:57
<alkisg>
I haven't heard any pulseaudio related problems, fat clients aren't doing anything sound-related
16:57
<markit>
and, finally, I bug you so much that... ;P
16:57
<alkisg>
It wasn't with LTSP though, just as a desktop for my daughter
16:58
<markit>
alkisg: ok, so I have to experiment further to find if that package solved the issue
16:58
<alkisg>
No it's not about bugging... I really haven't tried LTSP with KDE, except for my first installation in 2008
16:58
markit: it sounds like KDE stores the sound settings?
16:58
So if you clear the .kde* dirs, it then works again?
16:58
<markit>
yes, seems so, I'm a kde user but don't knwo the insights
16:59
if you change hardware it asks you if you want to permanently remove old devices
16:59
<alkisg>
Generally linux, gnome etc aren't picky about hardware changes
16:59
<markit>
that is odd :(
16:59
<alkisg>
It appears that some KDE developer decided that users never change soundcards
16:59
<markit>
yes, so true
16:59
<alkisg>
So, it sounds like a regression in KDE, you should search for the setting and report it upstream
16:59
<markit>
well, in modern pc you have multiple sound devices, from analog to digital to dhmi
16:59
probably the intent is that you can configure which device use
17:00
and then it remembers your settings
17:00
<alkisg>
Yes, gnome supports that too
17:00
But if the device isn't there, it doesn't break
17:00
<markit>
nor asks about the change?
17:00
<alkisg>
Nope
17:00
At least I've never heard of such a question in gnome
17:00* markit takes note and will report a bug to KDE
17:01
<alkisg>
Gnome does report "cannot apply monitor settings" though, if you've saved your monitor settings previously
17:01
But users don't change monitor settings from within the session, so that message is rare in the ltsp world
17:01
And it's just a notification in the tray, not a dialog
17:02
<markit>
I see
17:03
also I have to figure out what is slowing so much kde "readiness" after login... very annoying
17:03
<alkisg>
If upstream KDE doesn't want to do that change, and if you find when that setting is applied and how it can be prevented from doing so, it might be possible to workaround the problem from the ltsp side
17:03
<markit>
I should learn more about kde insights, but seems to difficoult
17:03
<alkisg>
But only try that as a last resort
17:03
<markit>
sure
17:03
<alkisg>
How many seconds after login till you're ready to work?
17:04
<markit>
15-20 (P4)
17:04
<alkisg>
And on a similar standalone workstation, it's the same, or is it faster?
17:04
<markit>
btw, ltsp-server does not depend upon pulseaudio-esound-compat and xbase-clients, while ltsp-server-standalone does... is it a bug of the package?
17:04
<alkisg>
I.e. is the problem ltsp related (e.g. sshfs...) or kde related?
17:04
esound isn't used
17:05Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)
17:05
<markit>
alkisg: let me try with my laptop, that already has KDE installed so I can compare (and is much faster as cpu, but same lan speed)
17:06
<alkisg>
That won't be helpful then
17:06
It's usually CPU related
17:06
Ah, you mean as an ltsp client? Sure
17:06
<markit>
but it could also depend of the fact that I've chanded akonadi backend (mysql one produces HUGE files in each home)
17:07
<alkisg>
No idea about the KDE internals either... (or KDE in general, for the matter)
17:07
I was thinking about switching to KDE with gnome3 etc, but now that Qt has so many financial problems, I don't think it's worth switching..
17:08
For 14.04 we might look into switching to lubuntu
17:08
For now, gnome-fallback is good enough for us, but it's being removed upstream so we won't be able to use it in the future
17:10
<markit>
qt has not financial problems anymore, as far as I understand
17:10
<alkisg>
Many of its branches are closing down and developers are being fired
17:10
<markit>
and why not xubuntu, since xfce seems to gain traction?
17:11
<alkisg>
If we're going to switch, then lxde sounds better, as it has less memory requirements (so it's easier for fats), it supports international keyboard indication by default, it has the bar lower like windows xp, it doesn't have the annoying mac-os like bar at the bottom etc
17:12
Also vagrantc has been using it for a long time, so I'm sure it's ltsp friendly
17:12blakes has joined IRC (blakes!~blakes@173-11-28-9-oregon.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
17:12
<alkisg>
They even integrated support for shutting down clients from within the session, without having to logout to ldm first
17:12
<markit>
regarding memory, there is an article on xfce blog about it having only 20-30 mb requirement over lxde, but having a much richer and better user experience
17:12
but at the moment the only things that matters to me is KDE :)
17:13
<alkisg>
We're probably going to make our own lubuntu spin (custom CD) anyway then, so the preinstalled programs don't matter
17:14
With ltsp-server, sch-scripts, epoptes etc preinstalled and ready to run
17:15
<blakes>
Now running 12.04 on LTSP super great! EXCEPT.... running Firefox and Chrome as local-apps. Followed instructions and so on (lts.conf) but Firefox hangs and chromium core dumps. Any tricks?
17:15
<alkisg>
blakes: ltsp-localapps xterm, then run firefox from there, then check the console output for hints
17:16
<markit>
alkisg: the first time the user logins, some .kde etc dir are created. This is about 15 seconds on local machine, 1 minute if ltsp fat client
17:16
now let me reboot and try login / readiness
17:16
<blakes>
sure did that... seriously the thing popped up a window and hung. No joy or error messages. will see if there is something in the syslog
17:16
<alkisg>
markit: try an ltsp client with a fast cpu
17:18
<blakes>
no syslog (grep -i firefox, or grep username)... doh!
17:20
<markit>
alkisg: ok, with laptop the first time I enter, as stated, takes 1 minute. But "readiness" is almost istantaneous
17:20* markit confused
17:21
<markit>
I've to run, hope to find you later and be able to narrow the issue
17:21
I'm wasting so much time with all this stuff :(
17:21
alkisg: btw, I've tried to use dnsmask only for dns caching
17:22
and isc-dhcp and tftp-hpa, work fine
17:22
thanks for the suggestion (I've some dubt about 2 parameters, I'll tell you later)
17:22
see you
17:22
<alkisg>
bb
17:22markit has left IRC (markit!~marco@88.149.177.66, )
17:23PhoenixSTF has left IRC (PhoenixSTF!~rudi@193.136.242.251, Quit: Leaving)
17:41Parker955_Away is now known as Parker955
18:14Bootless1 has left IRC (Bootless1!~AnDyLap@p57A258E4.dip.t-dialin.net, Quit: Leaving.)
18:43Parker955 is now known as Parker955_Away
19:05Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
19:12Parker955_Away is now known as Parker955
19:15ricotz has left IRC (ricotz!~rico@unaffiliated/ricotz, Quit: Ex-Chat)
19:20Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)
19:25sideffect has left IRC (sideffect!sideffect@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-brmrrwiuocluxniy, Remote host closed the connection)
19:32sideffect has joined IRC (sideffect!sideffect@gateway/shell/bshellz.net/x-nzfiaoyqkfimhoum)
19:34alkisg has left IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg, Quit: Leaving.)
19:49dsugar100 has left IRC (dsugar100!~dsugar100@columbia.tresys.com, Quit: dsugar100)
19:54[GuS] has left IRC ([GuS]!~MysT@unaffiliated/gus/x-663402, Quit: Konversation terminated!)
20:08
<ltspuser_14>
Anyone have a good link to docs on setting up LTSP on Ubuntu 12.04? I followed https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall but That doesnt' seem to have worked. I don't see that DHCP is running or that tftp is running etc... (I'm generally more of a CentOS guy than an Ubuntu guy)
20:08
Anyway, some good docs would be very helpful, I'm sure they exist, but II'm having trouble finding them.
20:11ltspuser_14 is now known as Zeut
20:19alkisg has joined IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg)
20:34bobby_C has joined IRC (bobby_C!~bobby@85-124-22-227.teleworker.xdsl-line.inode.at)
20:36Parker955 is now known as Parker955_Away
20:39telex has left IRC (telex!~telex@freeshell.de, Remote host closed the connection)
20:40telex has joined IRC (telex!~telex@freeshell.de)
20:44markit has joined IRC (markit!~marco@88-149-177-66.v4.ngi.it)
20:46
<Hyperbyte>
Zeut, there is LTSP for CentOS as well I think, but honestly Ubuntu is much better supported.
20:47
<markit>
alkisg: hi, btw I've tried something like cp a z where a is a 190MB file. With 100Mb/s nic, of course I've 23", like 8MB/s (in console it takes <=1 sec). I think that if KDE writes a lot of stuff at login, it slows down a lot
20:47Zeut has left IRC (Zeut!ad4632dc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.173.70.50.220, K-Lined)
20:47
<Hyperbyte>
With LTSP you can either use dnsmasq for tftp/dhcp/dns cache, or use tftp-....... k-lined?
20:47
Wow.
20:47
I think the Freenode web interface was just k-lined
20:47
<markit>
also I've tried to find how disable the phonon "hw changed" stuff, but if I set to "no bother me again" it just adds a lit of devices in a config file and at the end sets the flag "false", nothing global and generic
20:48
<Hyperbyte>
22:48 <erry> ooh, so that's what that button doess
20:48
Hehehe. :-)
20:49
#freenode is being flooded right now with questions about k-lines. :-D
20:49
<alkisg>
markit: well, if KDE writes many many MB at logon, I don't think there's much to do about it, other than upgrade your network to gigabit, change the DE... :)
20:49
<Hyperbyte>
Hahah
20:51
<markit>
alkisg: yes, I do think so, I'll check with wireshark / iotop
20:51dead_inside has left IRC (dead_inside!~dead_insi@76.75.3.174, Quit: Leaving...)
20:51
<markit>
just to be sure is a fact of MB or some other timeouts
20:51
but since debian seems to go for xfce, you made me sad saying you are going to go to lxde ;P
20:52
<alkisg>
I'm not; I just said that for 14.04 we might investigate lxde
20:52
For 12.04 we're OK with gnome-fallback
20:52
<markit>
out of joke, I've to figure out what happens and if all that writing is needed, but I'll hardly convince developers to do different
20:53
<alkisg>
If you have local hard disks, you could also change ltsp a bit so that it uses the local disk for /home, and tell the students to use the same computer always, or rsync if they change seats
21:00
<markit>
I've to do some tests with LibreOffice speed... wondering how well FAT can scale
21:00
sure now I can use TuxMath, that is a joy :)
21:02
mmm but P4 is much much slower than my laptop
21:02
so seems is also CPU bound, or I've troubles with P4 net speed
21:02
ok, stop chatting and do serious tests :)
21:03
<alkisg>
Well, try with your laptop as the fat client
21:03
<markit>
yes, is what I did
21:04
<alkisg>
Fat clients generally behave like if the OS was installed locally, with a hard disk of speed == a bit better than the net connection, due to caching in the server side, which is faster than real hard disk seek times
21:07mgariepy has left IRC (mgariepy!mgariepy@ubuntu/member/mgariepy, Quit: Leaving)
21:07
<markit>
except of the annoying thing of pulseaudio stuff, now P4 seems fast enough... I'm confused, I'll try with another user
21:07alkisg has left IRC (alkisg!~alkisg@ubuntu/member/alkisg, Remote host closed the connection)
21:07
<markit>
seems a moving targhet, probably there is something I'm not aware of that falses the results
21:09
(I mean for the "when ready after login" stuff)
21:09
libo writer loads in 15-20 sec, not really speedy but fast enough
21:09
I think children have slower pc at home, due to antivirus and troyan running ;P
21:11
btw, how works printing from fat? I mean... each system is "independent", so where are the config for the available printers stored?
21:12
I'll config the printer on the server and flag as "shared", I suppose
21:12
but will not be present/set in client chroot, correct?
21:23artista-frustrad has left IRC (artista-frustrad!~fernando@189.125.205.147, Quit: Leaving)
21:23
<blakes>
So localapps ... Libreoffice? Scratch? java? other suggestions (besides browsers)
21:28
<warren>
blakes: only localapps that make sense IMHO are multimedia with animation and video
21:28
<Hyperbyte>
Hey Warren!
21:30
Warren: I was wondering... you said earlier you were training your replacement... I assume this is replacement at RedHat? Does that mean you're leaving RedHat?
21:31
<warren>
no, not red hat
21:31
Hyperbyte: I left red hat two years ago, I'm in grad school now
21:31
<Hyperbyte>
Oh!
21:31
I'm a bit behind. :P
21:32
So replacement for what? LTSP maintenance?
21:35brunolambert has left IRC (brunolambert!blambert@nat/revolutionlinux/x-vmbgjphuhqjzoidb, Quit: brunolambert)
21:35
<markit>
I'm checking boot with wireshark... I've a lot of "192.168.20.1 192.168.20.101 TCP 1514 [TCP segment of a reassembled PDU]", is it normal?
21:36
<warren>
Hyperbyte: pretty much, I'd like to continue, but I'm crazy busy
21:37
<Hyperbyte>
Maybe you should introduce us and the upstream developers to your replacement. :)
21:37
<markit>
windows size value of the packet... 905...
21:39komunista has left IRC (komunista!~slavko@adsl-195-168-234-074.dynamic.nextra.sk, Quit: Leaving.)
21:42highvoltage has left IRC (highvoltage!~highvolta@ubuntu/member/highvoltage, Read error: Connection reset by peer)
21:43highvoltage has joined IRC (highvoltage!~highvolta@ubuntu/member/highvoltage)
21:45
<warren>
Hyperbyte: he's been here
21:45
Hyperbyte: I don't intend on quitting entirely, he is missing a lot of skills
21:50
<markit>
seems that the client is aksing for a bigger window, but does not happen
21:51
any expert of network traffic analysis?
22:17
<Hyperbyte>
Warren, would be nice to meet him. :) I'm sure he'll learn along the way.
22:48bobby_C has left IRC (bobby_C!~bobby@85-124-22-227.teleworker.xdsl-line.inode.at, Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
23:12Phantomas has left IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas, Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
23:12stgraber has left IRC (stgraber!~stgraber@ubuntu/member/stgraber, Quit: kernel update)
23:22stgraber has joined IRC (stgraber!~stgraber@ubuntu/member/stgraber)
23:28Phantomas has joined IRC (Phantomas!~Phantomas@ubuntu/member/phantomas)