IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 30 May 2007   (all times are UTC)

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03:36
<vagrantc>
heh. non of the windows computers at the hostal i'm at can browse the web.
03:37* vagrantc grabs some live CDs
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05:13
<vagrantc>
so, dynamically generating debian/control is pretty easy.
05:13
i don't know why we didn't do it years ago.
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06:33
<ogra>
vagrantc, rich and i are going over the spec priorities oin #edubuntu
06:33
thought you might join the discussion :)
06:34
jammcq, you too if youre awake and willing indeed
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06:55
<vagrantc>
http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/vagrant-ltsp-controlgen
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07:20* highvoltage eats a kit-kat and wonders why dtrask is so quiet
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07:49
<cliebow>
highvoltage:that is a switch when dtrask is quiet..
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08:06
<cliebow>
bill_c!!!!
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08:42
<Blinny>
jammcq: I have a question about the boxes at disklessworkstations - Do any/all of them use an accelerated xserver straight out of the box? (I see one needs an add-on package)
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08:48
<ace_suares>
hi there...
08:48
!seen Gadi
08:48
<ltspbot`>
ace_suares: Gadi was last seen in #ltsp 18 hours, 58 minutes, and 10 seconds ago: <Gadi> heh, grazie!
08:48
<jammcq>
Blinny: umm, not sure
08:48
<ace_suares>
hi jammcq !
08:48
<jammcq>
the t-1220 is the current one we're pushing, and it's gonna use the vesa driver by default
08:48
<ace_suares>
ogra tells me to look for Gadi for a patch to LDM...
08:49
it's kind of the holy grail I think... :-)
08:49
ping Gadi
08:49
<ogra>
jammcq, but works great with https://help.ubuntu.com/community/OpenChrome
08:50
<Gadi>
ace_suares: pong
08:50
<ace_suares>
Gadi: Hi !
08:50
<ogra>
Gadi, you had a proper patch that applied to feisty for the LDM_DIRECTX stuff
08:50
<ace_suares>
Gadi: Ogra tells me you have a patch for LDM to strip away X encryption... ?
08:50
<ogra>
ace_suares would love to test that
08:50
<jammcq>
ogra: yeah, but that needs to be installed. And, when you install that, it replaces the normal via driver, which might cause problems for other thin clients
08:50
<ogra>
jammcq, indeed
08:50
<jammcq>
so, it may not be the perfect solution
08:51
<Gadi>
sure - you can either grab from launchpad or I can send/pastebot the patch
08:51
<ogra>
jammcq, but i was planning to have at least a package for gutsy, so people can install it in the chroot
08:51
<Gadi>
whichever
08:51
<ace_suares>
Gadi; launchpad is fine, where ?
08:51* vagrantc has a branch
08:51
<jammcq>
ogra: it would be great if it wasn't a replacement for 'via', but instead an additional driver so they could both exist at the same time
08:51
<ogra>
jammcq, as i was planning to pull things like the amd driver to main :)
08:51
<Gadi>
https://code.launchpad.net/~gideon/ltsp/gadi-ldm-mods-ltsp
08:52
<ogra>
jammcq, i think that doesnt work by design :/ thats why openchrome isnt packaged at all
08:52* vagrantc nudged and nudged and nudged Gadi to put up a bzr branch
08:52
<Gadi>
you can just pull the ldm script out of there and replace your original
08:52
<ace_suares>
Gadi: I will try.
08:52
<Gadi>
vagrantc: see, and they still ask for just the patch :)
08:53
ace_suares: after you replace it, set: LDM_DIRECTX=True
08:53
in lts.conf
08:53
<ace_suares>
Gadi: Okay. And I like bzr !
08:53
<vagrantc>
Gadi: i'll probably try and split your patch into three
08:53
<ogra>
Gadi, for a user who already has a running feisty its easier to apply a five line patch to get X uinencrypted
08:53
<Gadi>
ace_suares: that makes one of us :)
08:53* ace_suares blushes... need to apt-get bzr :-)
08:53* ogra hopes Gadi has split it already
08:53* Gadi goes back to work...
08:54* ace_suares thanx Gadi
08:54
<ogra>
DIRECTX has nothing to do with autologin, so they should be separate :)
08:54
<Gadi>
ogra: I welcome your patches of my patches
08:54
:)
08:54* vagrantc will re-patch
08:55
<vagrantc>
522 Gideon Romm 2007-05-21
08:55
modified ldm
08:55
heh.
08:55
<ogra>
heh
08:55
descriptive :)
08:55
<vagrantc>
it's better than "changed something"
08:56
<ogra>
lol, indeed
08:56
<ace_suares>
or 'cleaned up some mess'
08:56
<ogra>
50% better :)
08:56
<ace_suares>
or 'just testing' ;-)
08:56
<Blinny>
jammcq: Oh. I thought you were disklessworkstations.com
08:57
<jammcq>
Blinny: I am, but i'm not the guy who handles the hardware
08:57
<Blinny>
Ah.
08:57
<ogra>
Blinny, the 150 is more happy with 16bit but uses the via driver just fine and the 170 is fine as well
08:57
<jammcq>
but... the 150 is no longer available
08:58
<ogra>
for the t-1220 you need the openchrome driver but the vesa mode is the fastes i've ever seen, there is not much speedup in using openchrome ...
08:58
(openchrome gives you xv and stuff though)
08:58
<Blinny>
I'm just worried about hanging a lot of vesa clients off this server.
08:58
<jammcq>
Blinny: how many is "a lot" ?
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08:59
<Blinny>
jammcq: Fortunately it will slowly grow. The potential is ~35
08:59
<ogra>
well, the vesa driver puts the load on the client anyway ...
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08:59
<ogra>
not on the server
08:59
<Blinny>
Oh?
09:00
<jammcq>
the server won't know the difference
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09:00
<Blinny>
Awesome. Thanks guys.
09:01
<ogra>
i dont even think it did that in XDMCP ... but for sure with ldm its impossible that the client driver puts load on the server
09:01
by design
09:01
<Blinny>
This is K12LTSP. I'm not using LDM
09:01
<jammcq>
the load is between the Xserver and the graphics card
09:01
<Blinny>
Cool. And the Xserver is the client, right?
09:01
<jammcq>
the Xclient doesn't know the difference
09:01
it's just talking X protocol
09:01
<ogra>
jammcq, right, i wasnt sure if there is a difference in XDMCP with that
09:02
<jammcq>
the Xserver is the *driver* for the video card, and it's running on the thin client
09:02
the Xserver talks X11 protocol on one side, and manipulates hardware registers on the other side
09:02
<Blinny>
Cool.
09:02
<ogra>
the only thing an x driver could slow down would be the boot ... if the driver itself is several 100 MB big ;)
09:03
<jammcq>
heh
09:03
<Blinny>
I see the bold red 'requires' text on the site but I have to ask - Could I use the 1225e just fine without the openchrome addition?
09:03
<Gadi>
ogra: quick question: if ltspfsd runs with '-a' option, why set the DISPLAY environment and create the xauth stuff in ltspfsmounter?
09:03
or is that left over from XDMCP
09:03
<ogra>
Gadi, for X :) that code is older than ltspfs
09:03
<Blinny>
meaning, using vesa?
09:03
<Gadi>
ok
09:03
just checkin
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09:04
<ogra>
Gadi, somehow debian belived it speeds up the login :)
09:04
its a patch from pere
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09:04
<sbalneav>
Morning all
09:04
<ogra>
yo sbalneav
09:05
!s
09:05
<ltspbot`>
ogra: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
09:05
<jammcq>
!s
09:05
<ltspbot`>
jammcq: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
09:05
<sbalneav>
heh, I liked the ldm-impovements emails I got this morning
09:06
<ogra>
sbalneav, you will get more
09:06
<sbalneav>
ogra -> approver riched
09:06
riched -> approver ogra
09:06
<ogra>
i'm setting priorities the next days
09:06
<sbalneav>
ogra -> approver riched
09:06
<ogra>
yes, i was trying something
09:06
i somehow cant set the prio
09:06
not even as approver
09:06
need to find out why
09:07
sbalneav, we plan to assign specs to people next meeting
09:07
so if you want to implement some be there at the edubuntu meeting :)
09:08
<ace_suares>
ogra, vagrantc, Gadi: this seems to make a *huge* difference!
09:09
<ogra>
ace_suares, :)
09:09
tahts what i expected :)
09:09
<ace_suares>
(in a positive way). Mouse is not sluggish anymore. I will test further, tough.
09:09
<vagrantc>
LDM creating an xauth file did, in fact, speed up login by about 20 seconds on debian.
09:09
<Gadi>
ace_suares: :)
09:09
<ace_suares>
ogra you the man !
09:09
<ogra>
ace_suares, nope, Gadi is ;)
09:09
<ace_suares>
gadi too, of course. I just rpelaced the whole ldm scriptfile, that was okay
09:10
<ogra>
vagrantc, i never saw that speedup on ubuntu
09:10* ace_suares thinks ogra and gadi and vagrantc and all of you are great!
09:10
<vagrantc>
ogra: i don't care. :P
09:10
<ogra>
vagrantc, could that be from a time where debian used xfree ?
09:10
i think the breezy version still did
09:10
<ace_suares>
hi scotty :-)
09:10
<vagrantc>
ogra: i know for an absolute fact it delayed login by an unacceptible amount of time, and it fixed the problem :P
09:10
<ogra>
vagrantc, great then :)
09:11
<vagrantc>
ogra: yeah, i don't know if it's still the case. although we'll need xauth stuff for localapps anyways
09:11
<ogra>
right
09:11
<vagrantc>
or wait, Gadi was talking about ltspfs
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09:11
<ogra>
we dont need it for ltspfs (and never will)
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09:12
<vagrantc>
it looks like ltspfsmounter sets DISPLAY
09:12
hard-coded, no less.
09:13
<ogra>
yeah, but it doesnt need it iirc
09:13
ltspfs complains if DISPLAY is empty
09:13
<pere>
ogra: and it did speed up the boot, as xdebconfigurator is faster than the xorg postinst, and uses debconf a lot less.
09:13
<ogra>
its just to get rid of the complaint
09:13
pere, we were talking about xauth
09:14
not about the config
09:14
(which will die this relöease anywhay i hope)
09:14
xorg 7.3 wont need a config :)
09:14
<vagrantc>
it would be nice to not use debconf at all.
09:14
<ogra>
vagrantc, it makes sense in places ...
09:15
but i agree we should move all debconf usage abhind the ldm start :)
09:15
*behind
09:15
and replace it where it needs to be run befoore
09:16
<vagrantc>
ideally, sure.
09:16
<pere>
ogra: good to hear. about time xorg worked without config. It was the killer feature in xfree86. (The feature commited just after the project killed itself. :)
09:16
<ogra>
the new x configurator in ubuntu will change a lot alongside with xorg 7.3 the config stuff should be able to just go away
09:16
<ace_suares>
gadi just saves my *ss here... winxp is workable now ! thx, I'll get back to you.
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09:19* ogra takes a break
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09:19
<vagrantc>
Gadi: directx probably doesn't work across NAT, does it?
09:19
<Gadi>
no
09:20
hence my desire to have a switch to tunnel localdev as well
09:20
so, its either tunneled or direct
09:20
<vagrantc>
that would be nice
09:20
<Gadi>
its on my todo list, no worries
09:21
<vagrantc>
Gadi: you leave a lot of fingerprints in your code :P
09:21
<Gadi>
tunneling is most useful when you are going across subnets, which if you are doing anyway, you should expect some performance hit
09:22
that was the first time I left fingerprints - because otherwise I tend to be forgotten in the sands of time
09:23
<ace_suares>
ogra: how can it be that win98 with win4lin sported 30 sessions without no problem, and winxp needs this ldm patch ???
09:23
<vagrantc>
Gadi: if you leave fingerprints, you also need to leave copyright notices and licensing terms...
09:23
<Gadi>
dude, they're patches
09:23
I have no control over those
09:23
it's GPL
09:23
or did you not read the GPL? ;)
09:24
<vagrantc>
i read the GPL now and again ...
09:26
<Gadi>
but, ur right, I should have patched the copyright file in bzr, too
09:26
tho, who knows what gets merged? ;)
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09:27
<vagrantc>
well, i'm breaking up the patches ... directx is really easy to split out
09:27
<Gadi>
they all are
09:27
they're simple patches
09:27
<vagrantc>
it's true.
09:28
<ace_suares>
ogra, gadi, vagrantc: http://win4lin.com/smf/index.php?topic=6429.0
09:28
is there a place I can add this to a wiki ?
09:29
<vagrantc>
Gadi: the autologin stuff is the more intrusive ... i'll do that last
09:30
<Gadi>
ace_suares: don't forget to tell folks how to switch it on
09:30
LDM_DIRECTX
09:31* jammcq is just waiting for the microsoft trademark lawyers to knock on his door
09:32
<Gadi>
heh, its ur door now, buddy
09:32
;)
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09:32
<jammcq>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Directx
09:33* vagrantc stares at all the tabs
09:33
<sbalneav>
yeah, DIRECTX
09:33
If I might suggest LDM_NOXENCRYPT?
09:34
<Gadi>
well, that rolls off the tongue
09:34
;)
09:34* sbalneav blows a raspberry at gadi :)
09:34
<Gadi>
hehe
09:34
<jammcq>
sure, noxen crypt
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09:35
<Gadi>
hey, sbalneav, does ltspfs also make a call to xauth?
09:35
<sbalneav>
Yes it does.
09:35
<Gadi>
ah...
09:35
eso si que es
09:36
<ace_suares>
updated: http://win4lin.com/smf/index.php?topic=6429.0
09:37
<Gadi>
sbalneav: is there a bypass flag for that?
09:41
<ace_suares>
gotta go now. Will try to find out how to enable sound (on qemu+winxp) later. bye
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09:44
<Q-FUNK>
is burgundavia gone or currently Burgwork ?
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09:52
<vagrantc>
Gadi: wasn't LDM_SERVER my idea? :P
09:52
<Gadi>
I dont think so
09:52
:P
09:52
but, we can share it if you like
09:52
:)
09:53
<vagrantc>
well, you asked for the feature, but i actually do recall the one-line patch i posted
09:53
<Gadi>
ah, this is true
09:53
I remember that
09:53
<vagrantc>
if you take no offense, i'll leave the fingerprints out of that commit ...
09:53
but thank you in the commit message
09:54
<Gadi>
np
09:55
hey, do you know how in python to use call(command) and then direct any output from command's children on stderr to /dev/null?
09:55
can I simply add '2>/dev/null' to the command?
09:56
<vagrantc>
no idea
09:56
fire up an interpreter and find out :P
09:57
Gadi: are you attached to LDM_DIRECTX ... or would simply DIRECTX or DIRECT_X be ok?
09:58
<Gadi>
I suppose that would solve the trademark issues
09:58
;)
09:58
<vagrantc>
oh
09:58
heh
09:59
<Gadi>
tho, now that its been posted to the world, we could do: LDM_DIRECTX or LDM_DIRECT_X
09:59
<vagrantc>
Gadi: or what about simple LDM_DIRECT ?
09:59* Gadi shrugs
09:59
<Gadi>
no, keep the X in there
09:59
<vagrantc>
LDM_WITH_NO_CUMBERSOME_ENCRYPTION
09:59
Gadi: why do you want the X ?
09:59
<Gadi>
because we may want to use LDM_DIRECT for a master switch at some point
10:00
that un-tunnels everything
10:00
vs. tunneling everything
10:00
<vagrantc>
got it
10:00
<Gadi>
remember, its more than just encryption
10:00
its tunneling
10:01
<vagrantc>
are there any situations where you would want LDM's X session to be direct but not other things?
10:01
or vice-versa ?
10:01
<ogra>
ace_suares, if you give it a bit more positive title (like "trading security for speed in ubuntu ltsp" for example :) ) you can add it to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP
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10:02* vagrantc notices the clock
10:03
<vagrantc>
Gadi: i'll just leave it with what you've got.
10:04
<Gadi>
vagrantc: yes - for example, you may want the encryption for X, but not tunnel sound
10:04* vagrantc forgets half of the ldm_directx merge and remembers to use uncommit :)
10:04
<Gadi>
as is the current situation
10:04
<ogra>
i would call it LDM_IS_TOTALLY_INSECURE_AND_I_KNOW_THAT
10:04
<Gadi>
heh
10:04
<vagrantc>
ogra: but it's actually not TOTALLY insecure, just mostly.
10:04
<Gadi>
now, that's positive
10:04
;)
10:05
<ogra>
vagrantc, indeed, its a hige impürovemnent over XDMCP, but still
10:05
<Gadi>
how about, LDM_TRUSTED
10:05
;)
10:05
<ogra>
dont do onlinebanking with it :)
10:05lambda_ has quit IRC
10:05
<vagrantc>
LDM_INSECURE
10:05
<ogra>
yeah
10:05
<Gadi>
ah, but alas, security is a spectrum, is it not?
10:06
lol
10:06
<ogra>
LDM_DROP_SECURITY
10:06
<vagrantc>
LDM_FORGET_ABOUT_SECURITY
10:06
<Gadi>
why not: LDM_IMPROVE_PERFORMANCE
10:06
;)
10:06
<vagrantc>
LDM_SIGNIFICANTLY_LESS_SECURE
10:06
<highvoltage>
LDM_BOOT_T2100_IN_10_SECONDS
10:06
<vagrantc>
LDM_IMPROVE_SPEED_AT_COST_IN_SECURITY
10:06
<ogra>
LDM_MEDIOCRE_SECURITY
10:07
<highvoltage>
I think vagrantc has a winner
10:07
<vagrantc>
LDM_PRETTY_INSECURE
10:07
<ogra>
highvoltage, it doesnt speed up the boot in any way ;)
10:07
<vagrantc>
LDM_MOSTLY_INSECURE
10:07
there, i'm dont!
10:07
done, even.
10:08
<ogra>
LDM_XDMCP ?
10:08
<vagrantc>
ogra: do you object to LDM_DIRECTX
10:08MoL0ToV has quit IRC
10:08
<vagrantc>
ogra: it's not really XDMCP
10:08
<ogra>
vagrantc, well, its quite confusing for win users
10:08
but apart from that it describes what it does
10:09
<vagrantc>
hrm.
10:09tiagovaz has quit IRC
10:09
<ogra>
LDM_UNENCRYPTED would probably be an option
10:11
<Gadi>
but, there's also the tunneling
10:11
thats why I did "DIRECTX"
10:11
<vagrantc>
part of the session is actualy encrypted
10:12
<Gadi>
maybe: LDM_UNTUNNELED
10:12
or some such
10:12* vagrantc hopes for a good such
10:12
<Gadi>
but, to me, the tunneling aspect is just as important as the encryption
10:12* vagrantc merged LDM_SERVER directly into vagran-ltsp-mainline
10:13
<Gadi>
LDM_X_OVER_SSH = False
10:13
;)
10:13
<ogra>
nah
10:13
<Gadi>
LDM_NOXPROXY
10:13
<ogra>
we wannabe positive in our configs :P
10:13
thats better :)
10:14
<vagrantc>
LDM_NO_X_PROXY ...
10:14
hrm.
10:14
<Gadi>
or: LDM_NO_X_OVER_SSH
10:14
<ogra>
way to many underscores :)
10:14
<vagrantc>
LDM_DIRECT_X11
10:15
<ogra>
thats good
10:15
<Gadi>
LDM_X = "direct"
10:15
LDM_X = "ssh"
10:15
(default)
10:15
<vagrantc>
oooh.
10:15
<ogra>
nah, boolean is better
10:15
unless we plan millions of nifty other transports
10:16
which i doubt
10:17
<[ALX]>
Hello everybody. I'm using LTSP with some diskless stations running a clipper application over DOSEMU, but this application uses the f11 and ALT+F10 keys and they are not working. Has anyone had this problem and know how to work around it?
10:17
<vagrantc>
LDM_X11_FORWARDING=false
10:17
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: What window manager are you using?
10:18
<ogra>
vagrantc, sounds good as well, but a bit long
10:18
<vagrantc>
LDM_X11_FORWARD
10:18
<ogra>
yep
10:18
better
10:18
<[ALX]>
I forgot to mention. I don't use X window
10:18
<vagrantc>
Gadi: LDM_X11_FORWARD ?
10:19
<Gadi>
well, it is a negative
10:19
<ogra>
you could drop 11
10:19
<vagrantc>
now it sounds dumb.
10:19
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: So, is dosemu running on the server, or on the thin client itself?
10:19
<Gadi>
but, if thats ok
10:19
<vagrantc>
we've talked abou this too long. everything sounds stupid.
10:19
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav] on the server
10:20
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: And you're using what to get to the server? Telnet?
10:20
<vagrantc>
the ssh man page calls it "X11 forwarding"
10:20
LDM_X_FORWARDING=true/false (default true)
10:20
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav]yes, telnet
10:21
<vagrantc>
X_FORWARD doesn't sound right to me, even though FORWARDING seems too long
10:21
<ogra>
Gadi, indeed, its ok, i was joking ...
10:22
<Gadi>
ah, my German humor's a bit rusty ;)
10:22
<sbalneav>
It may be that you may need to change your default TERM environment variable. Does it work on the server console?
10:22
<Gadi>
all I remember is glockenspiel
10:22
<ogra>
i'm just not happy if we use descriptive settings (which need explicit documentation) over boolean
10:22
as long as we can catch stuff with a boolean, we should do it
10:23
<Gadi>
agreed
10:23
<sbalneav>
ogra: farfegnugen
10:23
<ogra>
lol
10:23
<vagrantc>
LDM_TOOK_TOO_LONG_TO_DECIDE_ON_A_GOOD_VARIABLE_NAME
10:24
<ogra>
vagrantc, perfect
10:24* ogra looks at the column size in the ltsp-parameters file ...
10:24
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: It may be that you may need to change your default TERM environment variable. Does it work on the server console?
10:24
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav]It doesn't work on the server console. On the diskless, the clipper app uses the f5 key also, this one works fine.
10:25* ogra adds an "only edit this file on widescreen displays!" disclaimer at the top
10:25
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: So, it doesn't work on the server console?
10:25
<vagrantc>
ogra: yeah, it's a bit cumbersome
10:26
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav]no, it doesn't
10:26
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: So, that's not really an LTSP problem, is it?
10:26
You've got a dosemu problem.
10:27
<vagrantc>
well, i'm going to leave it as LDM_DIRECTX for now ...
10:27
though my favorite so far is LDM_X_FORWARDING
10:28
really, that doesn't make any sense unless you read ssh man pages, though.
10:28
LDM_X_ENCRYPTION ?
10:28
<ogra>
hmm
10:28
<vagrantc>
LDM does tunneling by it's very nature
10:28
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav]I have to agree with you. I just thought maybe someone could have had this problem and could give me a tip. Thank you anyway. Sorry to bother you.
10:28
<ogra>
sounds good as well
10:29
<Gadi>
LDM_NO_X_OVER_SSH
10:29
<vagrantc>
too many underscores
10:29
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: Not at all, just wanted to point you in the right direction
10:29
<Gadi>
or LDM_X_OVER_SSH
10:29
<ogra>
Gadi, fan of underscores ?
10:29
<vagrantc>
with short bits in between
10:29
Gadi: that looks pretty good
10:29
<sbalneav>
[ALX]: Not sure if there's a dosemu channel. There may be a mailing list you could ask on.
10:29
<ogra>
i like LDM_X_ENCRYPTION most
10:29
<Gadi>
I keep the underscore maker's kids in college ;)
10:30
I dont
10:30
<vagrantc>
or ...
10:30
<Gadi>
its not descriptive
10:30
<vagrantc>
LDM_ENCRYPT_X
10:30
<[ALX]>
[sbalneav]Ok. Thanks again
10:30
<Gadi>
it only describes one aspect of what you are changing
10:30
<sbalneav>
oooh
10:30
I like that one.
10:30
<vagrantc>
Gadi: ssh is only descriptive to those who know what it is
10:30
<Gadi>
LDM_TUNNEL_X
10:30
<ogra>
sbalneav, which one ?
10:30* jammcq prefers SSH instead of ENCRYPT
10:30
<vagrantc>
encryption is an english word
10:30
<sbalneav>
LDM_ENCRYPT_X
10:30[ALX] has left #ltsp
10:31* ogra teands to agree with vagrantc about SSH
10:31
<vagrantc>
LDM_NO_SPELLCHECK
10:31
<sbalneav>
How about LDM_SECURE_X
10:31
<jammcq>
heh
10:31
<Gadi>
TUNNEL is english ;)
10:31
<jammcq>
it's SSH
10:31vanya has quit IRC
10:31
<jammcq>
youa re either USING SSH or NOT USING SSH
10:31
<ogra>
sbalneav, LDM_INSECURE_X then :)
10:31
<Blinny>
LDM_BUNCHA_XORS
10:31
oh wait, buncha is pseudo-english
10:31
<vagrantc>
ok. we just need a table of valid values :)
10:32
<sbalneav>
jammcq: We're using ssh for now. Maybe in a year we'll be using ssl :)
10:32
<jammcq>
who's to say we won't come up with another method of doing secure X?
10:32
maybe X over SSL
10:32
<sbalneav>
bingo
10:32
<jammcq>
then what does 'ENCRYPT' mean?
10:32
<sbalneav>
LDM_SECURE_X would cover that
10:32
<vagrantc>
i kind of like LDM_SECURE_X=false because you really can't complaint
10:32
<jammcq>
it's no longer telling us whether it's SSH or not
10:32
<ogra>
well, we're not talking about the current encryprted method, do we ?
10:32
<vagrantc>
complain
10:32
<jammcq>
but..... the fix gadi created is to use or NOT use SSH
10:32
so why not call it like it is
10:33
<ogra>
we're talking about the unencrypted one ;)
10:33
<vagrantc>
jammcq: because it's stil lusing ssh
10:33
<jammcq>
we're talking about using SSH or not using SSH
10:33
only to launch it
10:33
<ogra>
LDM_DROP_SECURITY :)
10:33
<jammcq>
it's not using SSH to tunnel the traffic
10:33
<sbalneav>
You know, while I'm following this debate, I'm not coding. :) Let me know what to call the variable.
10:33
<jammcq>
X_OVER_SSH
10:33
<sbalneav>
:)
10:33
<jammcq>
it's SOOOOOOOOOOO simple
10:34
<vagrantc>
to those who know what SSH is
10:34
<ogra>
right
10:34
<Gadi>
those who dont will use a GUI
10:34
<jammcq>
but it's USING SSH for criss sakes
10:34
<Gadi>
in which you can call it whatever you like
10:34
<ogra>
its totally unimportant what the encrypted tunnel uses if we want to describe an unencrypted method
10:34
<Gadi>
or, you can add a comment to the default lts.conf
10:34
<vagrantc>
well, i've said my bit.
10:35
<ogra>
LDM_CIPHER_NONE :P
10:35
<jammcq>
I say 'X_OVER_SSH', with a default of 'Y' (or True, or Yes, or whatever way you want)
10:35
<Gadi>
im with jammcq - variables should describe what they do technically, comments or GUIs should dumb it down
10:35
<ogra>
to make it totally descriptive to everyone :P
10:36* vagrantc can't wait to implement LDM's tls backend
10:36
<vagrantc>
X_OVER_TLS_AND_OR_SSL
10:36* ogra starts to prefer keepin the current LDM_DIRECTX
10:36* jammcq is going out drinking for lunch, who wants to come?
10:36
<ogra>
probably with an extra underscore
10:37
<vagrantc>
it's still siesta time!
10:37* vagrantc should go out and drink away this cold
10:37efra has joined #ltsp
10:37
<ogra>
vagrantc, lots of wine help :)
10:37
<vagrantc>
XUNDERSCOREOVERUNDERSCORESSH
10:37
<ogra>
heh
10:38* jammcq is making an official motion to call the option 'X_OVER_SSH' with a default of 'Y'. Show whether you agree or disagree with a +1 or -1
10:38* vagrantc stands aside
10:38
<vagrantc>
with prejudice (-0.5)
10:38
<ogra>
-1
10:38
sbalneav, ?
10:38
<jammcq>
+1
10:38
<ogra>
Gadi, ?
10:39
<jammcq>
I guess they are already meeting me at the bar
10:39
<Gadi>
thats: LDM_X_OVER_SSH, right?
10:39
<vagrantc>
where all *real* decisions happen anyways
10:39
<jammcq>
umm, sure, if you want 'LDM_' in front, I could handle that
10:39
<Gadi>
agreed
10:39* jammcq is making an official motion to call the option 'LDM_X_OVER_SSH' with a default of 'Y'. Show whether you agree or disagree with a +1 or -1
10:39
<jammcq>
+1
10:39
<ogra>
Gadi, "'X_OVER_SSH' with a default of 'Y'"
10:39
<Gadi>
+1
10:40
<vagrantc>
-1
10:40
too cumbersome
10:40
<ogra>
ok, up to scottie then
10:40
<jammcq>
pfffff
10:40
like you'll be typing it in every day !!!!!!!!!!
10:40
<Gadi>
what a crew...
10:40
;)
10:40
<ogra>
jammcq, no, but we need to explain it to useers during support
10:40* vagrantc has typed far too mand underscores in one day
10:40* jammcq senses the beginning of the end
10:41
<jammcq>
pretty soon the committees take over, and then death sets in
10:41
<vagrantc>
overall, i don't care.
10:41
i haven't seen any new ideas, i see the validity in most of them.
10:41
<ogra>
well, lets go with the authors intention and keep away from comitees ?
10:42
and just merge the patch ?
10:42
<vagrantc>
done.
10:42
<ogra>
good :)
10:42
<Gadi>
lol
10:42
<vagrantc>
i'd have to change more code if we change the variable name ... since it users python directx variables all over the place
10:42
<ogra>
best way to burn 1h developer time ?
10:42
go to #ltsp :)
10:42* vagrantc was working the whole time
10:43
<jammcq>
just forward me your addresses, so I know where to send the Microsoft trademark lawyers
10:43
<ogra>
haha
10:43
<vagrantc>
jammcq: gadi included his address all over the place.
10:43
that is a valid point. ungh.
10:43
<ogra>
*g*
10:43
nah
10:43
come on
10:43
its a descriptive config option in a file
10:44
<jammcq>
well, when given a choice to bait the other guys, or not, i'd choose to NOT
10:44
<ogra>
no lawyer would be able to sue you
10:44
<vagrantc>
not true
10:44
the threat of a lawsuit can be more damaging than the lawsuit itself
10:44
<jammcq>
he doesn't need to actually win
10:44
<vagrantc>
SLAPP suits suck.
10:44
<ogra>
we could change it immediately :)
10:44
<jammcq>
either way, we lose
10:45
<ogra>
i'm not worried
10:45
<vagrantc>
ogra: except we'd have to change all the docs
10:45* vagrantc doesn't even have a clue what M$ directx is
10:45
<ogra>
*if* an MS lawyer would *accidentially* look into lts.conf docs, yes ...
10:46
<jammcq>
google my friend, google.
10:46
<ogra>
vagrantc, like SDL for openGL on windows
10:46sepski has joined #ltsp
10:46
<ogra>
its a top level multimedia lib
10:46* vagrantc suffers acronymitis
10:47
<jammcq>
an inflamation of the acronym ?
10:47
neato
10:47
<vagrantc>
i think that's what some of the variable naming was all about
10:47
<ogra>
vagrantc, an easy access multimedia programming API ... easy enough VB programmers can understand it
10:47muh2000 has quit IRC
10:48* vagrantc notes the continued use of acronyms
10:48* vagrantc understands more this time, though
10:48
<ogra>
i'm working on my expression :)
10:48
<jammcq>
ogra: trying to make it more "regular" ?
10:49
<ogra>
heh
10:49
<vagrantc>
Gadi: i think i'll put off merging the autologin code for another day
10:50
<Gadi>
heh, too tiring?
10:50
<ogra>
i think we should check it with the new design sbalneav made for the wrapper
10:50
<Gadi>
hopefully those vars are more agreeable
10:50
;)
10:50
<ogra>
there mioght be easier and cleaner ways with that, not sure
10:50
<vagrantc>
ah hell. i'll just do a throwaway branch
10:51
<ogra>
it would have to get ported to C anyway
10:52
the new design opens so many new opportunities :)
10:52
sbalneav, we shouldnt forget to look into full .dmrc support now thats possible ...
10:53
<sbalneav>
sure
10:53
First let me get what we've got converted :) :) :)
10:53
<ogra>
indeed :)
10:54lambda_ has joined #ltsp
10:54
<sbalneav>
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
10:54
HAHAHAHAHAH
10:54
YAYAYAYAYAYAYAYA
10:55
Booheah
10:55
got it going
10:55
wheeeeee
10:55
oin$ ./a.out
10:55
scbal@127.0.0.1's password:
10:55
Linux oin 2.6.20-16-generic #2 SMP Wed May 23 01:46:23 UTC 2007 i686
10:55
The programs included with the Ubuntu system are free software;
10:55
the exact distribution terms for each program are described in the
10:55
individual files in /usr/share/doc/*/copyright.
10:55
Ubuntu comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY, to the extent permitted by
10:55
applicable law.
10:55
Last login: Wed May 30 10:51:15 2007 from localhost
10:55
<jammcq>
sbalneav: you doing the happy dance?
10:55
<sbalneav>
scbal@oin:~$
10:55
exit
10:55
logout
10:55
Connection to 127.0.0.1 closed.
10:55
That was completely scripted ssh
10:55
in C
10:56
Logged in, waited 15 seconds, logged out
10:56
Sexy.
10:56
Now I'm rollin.
10:58muh2000 has joined #ltsp
10:58
<vagrantc>
Gadi: your autologin code is impossible because of your use of tabs :P
10:59
<Gadi>
hey - im new to python
10:59
<vagrantc>
mixing tabs and spaces is evil.
10:59
<Gadi>
i was thinking everything was tabs
10:59* jammcq prefers spaces
10:59
<Gadi>
then, found some places with spaces and some with tabs
10:59* Gadi prefers spaces too
10:59
<Gadi>
just didnt know if it would work the same
10:59
:)
10:59
<vagrantc>
what we agreed on, long long ago, was four spaces.
10:59
<Gadi>
I found no fault with curly braces
11:00
<vagrantc>
but it's not been consistant throughout
11:04* ogra dances
11:04
<ogra>
sbalneav, great news :D
11:04
<vagrantc>
we have this problem where some of the code is indented 8 spaces, and some 4.
11:05
and then adding tabs into the mix... evil ensues.
11:05
<Gadi>
vagrantc: just keep the indents consistent, as python interprets them
11:05
<vagrantc>
you can't just search and replace tabs ... it has to be done manually...
11:05
Gadi: yeah, but *i* have a hell of a time interpreting it :P
11:05
<Gadi>
lo siento
11:06
<vagrantc>
esta bien
11:09
Gadi: you're not the first person
11:09* vagrantc glares at ogra
11:09
<ogra>
vagrantc, i fixed my vimrc ages ago
11:10
<vagrantc>
ogra: i'm very glad for that. :)
11:11
<ogra>
there is still code i didnt touch thats unfixed
11:11tiagovaz has joined #ltsp
11:11
<ogra>
i.e. TCM has still a lot broken indention in it
11:12
pete never touched my code but only added his
11:12* ogra just had the worst instant noodle thing in his life ...
11:13
<ogra>
was supposed to be duck ... tasted like hot coke with chilli
11:13
<Q-FUNK>
yuck!
11:13
hot yuck
11:13
<ogra>
heh
11:16
<vagrantc>
Gadi: why a password in lts.conf rather than an ssh key ?
11:17
Gadi: for ldm autologin?
11:17
<Gadi>
vagrantc: equally insecure, and some might find it easier
11:17
<vagrantc>
fair enough.
11:17
<Gadi>
we can add LDM_KEY as an option, too
11:17
<vagrantc>
well, not equally insecure, but not much more secure
11:18
<Gadi>
whats the diff between putting a private key in lts.conf vs a private password?
11:18pere is now known as pere_away
11:19
<ogra-classmat1>
beyond acessing it over unencryted nfs you mean ?
11:19
<vagrantc>
a tiny bit of obscurity ... everyone knows what a password is. not everyone knows how to access a private key.
11:19
the key wouldn't be readable to non-root users who didn't think to grab it over NFS
11:20
<ogra-classmat1>
well, its very ugly, but we could have an ldm user in the server and scp a key at runtime
11:20
(for an autologin user)
11:21
<vagrantc>
how do you scp without a password or a key ?
11:21
<ogra-classmat1>
hmm, actually thne we would have to supply the ldm users password
11:21Lumiere is now known as jstraw
11:21
<vagrantc>
it's also easier to restrict what an ssh key can do than it is with a password ... you can tie it down to a specific action more easily.
11:22
enough ranting, time to finish the merge and write a little more code :)
11:22
<ogra-classmat1>
yeah, i'm also in favor of the key solution
11:22
<vagrantc>
much harder for the admin to set up, though.
11:22
that's how sdm worked
11:22
<ogra-classmat1>
nit if we make it easy for him :)
11:22
*not
11:23
<vagrantc>
ogra: true true
11:23
<ogra-classmat1>
its up to us to code it right
11:24
<vagrantc>
we'd need to write scripts to generate the keys and populate the user's authorized_keys files
11:24ogra-classmat1 is now known as ogra-classmate
11:24
<Gadi>
it doesnt hurt to keep the password option
11:24
and augment it
11:24
<vagrantc>
right
11:25
<Gadi>
if you are setting up an email garden for an hour, you may not care much if it gets hacked
11:25
;)
11:26
<ogra-classmate>
well, for ubuntu it needs to be secure enough that i can get it past the security team
11:26
not sure what they will say
11:28
<Gadi>
its an option
11:29
that is disabled by default
11:29Avatara has quit IRC
11:32* vagrantc looks at the old USER@SERVER patches that ogra never liked
11:33
<ogra-classmate>
user@server patches?
11:33
<vagrantc>
to select the server in LDM, specify username@server at the login screen
11:35
<ogra-classmate>
well, we'll get a proper menu now, no?
11:35
<vagrantc>
allegedl
11:35
y
11:36
<ogra-classmate>
just seeing your mail about the control files, did you look at debian/rules bzr-release ? thats what im using to build the ubuntu sourcepackages
11:36
<Gadi>
speaking of which, please remember a flag to disable a server menu
11:36
if one is introduced
11:36
<ogra-classmate>
why ?
11:36
it should be automatic
11:37
<Gadi>
because as an admin, I may not want my users picking servers
11:37
thats why
11:37
<vagrantc>
ogra: i've seen it, yes.
11:37
<ogra-classmate>
well, you would have to define the possible servers
11:37
<vagrantc>
ogra-classmate: guess we could put the controlgen stuff in there
11:37
<Gadi>
oh, ok
11:37
<ogra-classmate>
since you need their keys
11:37
<vagrantc>
ogra-classmate: or, as a dependency of bzr-release
11:38
<Gadi>
i thought you were still on a zeroconf kick
11:38
<ogra-classmate>
we'll have an easy script to set it up, but its still up to the admin
11:38
<vagrantc>
if no servers are defined, a menu should not be displayed
11:38
<ogra-classmate>
Gadi: zeroconf is the futuree, but even then we'd give the admin control over it
11:38
<Gadi>
vagrantc: 0 or 1
11:39
<ogra-classmate>
not even the code should be loaded
11:39
<vagrantc>
Gadi: right, if 1 or less servers are defined
11:39
no menu
11:40
if number.servers >= 1 : display.server.menu=false
11:40
if it makes sense to display the menu, display it
11:44
http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/ldm-autologin
11:45PMantis has joined #LTSP
11:46Q-FUNK has quit IRC
11:49jsgotangco has quit IRC
11:56nf1 has joined #ltsp
11:57* vagrantc finally respects the wrist break
11:59lambda_ has quit IRC
12:02
<vagrantc>
so ...
12:02* vagrantc contemplates merging ltsp-directx into vagrant-ltsp-mainline
12:03
<moquist>
where is the NFS root option in menuconfig?
12:04* vagrantc hasn't built a kernel in ... years
12:08Patina has quit IRC
12:09
<ace_suares>
vagrantc: are you making a patch for LDM_UNDIRECT_X now, and should I wait with updating the wiki ?
12:10
<vagrantc>
ace_suares: well, i've split out the three features into separate branches
12:13
<ace_suares>
bzr branches ?
12:13cyberorg has quit IRC
12:14
<vagrantc>
yes
12:14
<moquist>
vagrantc: Ahh - while we're making feature requests, we need to be able to have blank passwords without hacking LDM, or the greeter, or whatever.
12:14
<ace_suares>
cool, so I wait a couple of hrs.
12:14
<vagrantc>
ace_suares: well, they're already up
12:15
ace_suares: it's just gadi's code without some of the other features thrown in
12:15
moquist: well, that's between pam, ssh and you :P
12:16
<moquist>
vagrantc: the greeter in feisty kicks out blank passwords immediately
12:16fernando1 has quit IRC
12:16
<vagrantc>
moquist: oh.
12:17
<moquist>
vagrantc: In order to have blank passwords, I added a line to the greeter that said "if the password is blank, pretend they actually typed 'secret'", and then I set all the passwords to 'secret'.
12:17
<ace_suares>
http://www.xpunlimited.nl/faq/index.php?action=artikel&cat=5&id=68
12:18* ogra-classmate finally decided to answer the ubuntu feature request mail on ltsp-developer
12:20
<moquist>
FWIW, in menuconfig you can just type '/' and then search for the option you're looking for.
12:20* moquist just learned this
12:21Patina has joined #ltsp
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12:23
<vagrantc>
moquist: so... why exactly do you need blank passwords?
12:23
<ogra-classmate>
moquist: zes, its using less as reader
12:23
*yes even
12:23
<ace_suares>
vagrantc: where ?
12:24
<vagrantc>
ace_suares: i posted them to this channel earlier
12:24
<moquist>
vagrantc: It's a training facility and passwords are a benefit-free nuisance.
12:24
<ace_suares>
ah. I was away.
12:24
http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/ldm-autologin = empty
12:25
<vagrantc>
ace_suares: it's a bzr branch, not a web-browseable repository
12:25
<ogra-classmate>
ace_suares: new bzr branches dont show web contents
12:25
<moquist>
vagrantc: More importantly ;), the boss said "K12LTSP can have blank passwords. I guess Edubuntu doesn't have the features we want yet..."
12:25
<vagrantc>
bzr get http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/ltsp-directx
12:25
moquist: right.
12:27bill_c has quit IRC
12:27* vagrantc finds it hard to introduce a bug as a feature
12:28
<vagrantc>
moquist: what about ssh keys ?
12:28
moquist: if you could configure an ssh key, would that be good enough?
12:29
<ogra-classmate>
vagrantc: hey as a *security* feature :)
12:29
<vagrantc>
well, i'm just trying to turn a bad idea into a less bad one :)
12:30
<ogra-classmate>
an idea would also be to fix it ... hmm
12:31
<vagrantc>
ogra-classmate: you mean break an obviously intentional security decision
12:31
<moquist>
vagrantc: that would be fine, but it should be easy to do. (as easy as setting a blank password)
12:31* ogra-classmate thinks he heard of people doing that :)
12:31
<vagrantc>
moquist: what do you have to do to set a blank password?
12:32
<moquist>
Seriously, in some environments there are good reasons for engaging in what would otherwise be very bad security decisions. I don't think my boss is wrong to want blank passwords in this one instance.
12:32
<ogra-classmate>
you dont set one during user creation
12:32
<moquist>
vagrantc: er, I'm not sure what the "right" way may be, but I blank out the field in /etc/shadow. :p
12:33
<vagrantc>
moquist: i'm just trying to guage how "easy" it is now, so i can guage what i'm trying to re-implement
12:33
<ogra-classmate>
re ?
12:34
i dont think that was ever there
12:34
<vagrantc>
works in sdm
12:34
<moquist>
vagrantc: I just asked my co-worker who did this on FC6, and the answer is 'passwd -fu <username>'
12:34
<vagrantc>
ltsp and ldm all feel like re-implementing to me :P
12:34
<ogra-classmate>
oh, i thought you talked about ldm
12:34* moquist loves that option
12:35
<ogra-classmate>
force unset ?
12:35
(guessed)
12:36
hm
12:36
\whats -f ?
12:36
<vagrantc>
moquist: ok, so a command would have to essentially run with a username and an option or two ?
12:36
<moquist>
vagrantc: Yep. (ideally)
12:37
<vagrantc>
shouldn't be too hard...
12:37
<moquist>
vagrantc: But as a starting point, the greeter could just allow blank passwords...
12:37
<vagrantc>
ogra-classmate: think that'll fly with ubuntu's security team?
12:37
<moquist>
vagrantc: GDM allows blank passwords, so I should hope so!
12:38
<ogra-classmate>
if you have to dliberately enable it, it will
12:38
<moquist>
vagrantc: It could be an LDM config option.
12:38
ogra-classmate: right
12:38* vagrantc refuses to get into another variable naming debate today
12:38
<ogra-classmate>
lol
12:41* vagrantc needs to make some dinner
12:42
<vagrantc>
ogra-classmate: you think the LDM_DIRECTX stuff is should be merged into mainline?
12:42
<ogra-classmate>
yep
12:42
asap
12:42
i merged mainline but somehow LP is still taking its time
12:42
<vagrantc>
merged it with what?
12:43* vagrantc hopes we aren't working on the same stuff at the same time
12:43
<ogra-classmate>
merged with your merge branch
12:43
i'll then branch off the gutsy branch off that
12:44
<vagrantc>
what about the autologin stuff ?
12:44
<ogra-classmate>
hmm, i ne4ed to move the mainline branch over to LP completely and you need cdommit rights
12:45
currently its mirroring from people.ubuntu.com
12:45
i'll make ltsp-drivers the owner so even jammcq can commit :)
12:48* ogra-classmate wonders how to manage that and keep the old branch name
12:48
<vagrantc>
we could start over
12:50
<ogra-classmate>
nah
12:51
we cant lose the branch history
12:51
mainline should be fine now, shouldnt ?
12:51
*it
12:51
<vagrantc>
if you pull vagrant-ltsp-mainline, sure :)
12:52
i gotta make some food
12:53
<ogra-classmate>
indeed, thats our new mainline
12:53
<vagrantc>
ok. pushed the LDM_SERVER and LDM_DIRECTX patches just not. still haven't pulled the ldm autologin stuff
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13:09
<Gadi>
speaking of blank passwords, did you know that: U6aMy0wojraho corresponds to a blank password?
13:09
what a world
13:10
<ogra>
yes, i did
13:10
we use it in various places on the livecd :)
13:16* Riddell learns something new (if only because that password includes one of my highlights)
13:17
<ogra-classmate>
heh
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13:49
<sbalneav>
Man, Canadians. Always so helpful.
13:49
http://keyetv.com/topstories/topstories_story_149095534.html
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14:06
<ace_suares>
hmmm... maybe bzr should show wecontents, then i could just tell people to pull of the ldm script and bingo.
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14:07
<ace_suares>
anyway, I am lost as to where to get the final ldm thingy. I'll check bank in a cople of hours, now I am gonna find sound on the winxp thing.
14:07
btw what did you think of xpunlimited ? I am gonna test it now. Just imagine: winxp-unlimited on qemu, and the the thin clients doing
14:08
rdp to that virtual server... hehe .
14:13
vagrantc:
14:13
bzr get http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/ltsp-directx
14:13
bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: http://llama.freegeek.org/~vagrant/bzr/ltsp/features/ltsp-directx/
14:14
a
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14:49
<sbalneav>
Hmm, wonder if you can do a ?
14:49
in an initialized
14:49
, err, er
14:49
like sshcmd[] = {
14:49
...
14:50
forwardx ? "-X" : " "
14:50
Guess I'll find out.
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15:51
<bill_c>
Whats the prefered version of Ubuntu to use with LTSP?
15:51
<vagrantc>
welllllll....
15:51
probably feisty 07.04
15:52
<bill_c>
cool
15:52
<vagrantc>
the version in the LTS release 06.06 is pretty outdated, and if it's a new install, no sense using 06.10
15:52
<bill_c>
yeah wasn't sure if I should go LTS or current
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15:52
<vagrantc>
if you want features like local devices and sound, go with the more recent version
15:53
there's been numerous other improvements as well.
15:53
<Gadi>
thats what Dell ships ;)
15:53
<vagrantc>
and if you want to be like dell, i guess, too.
15:53
<Gadi>
btw, ogra, kudos on making the front page of dell.com
15:54
<cliebow_>
ohhh?url?
15:54
<Gadi>
dell.com
15:54
<cliebow_>
heh
15:55
network works now that the grass is mowed..
15:55* vagrantc wonders what kind of grass
15:56
<cliebow_>
ohhh i see right under this banner...
15:56
Dell recommends Windows Vista™ Home Premium.
15:56
not "now that the grass is "smoked"
15:57
<Gadi>
ah, they changed the front page
15:57
yesterday it was all about ubuntu
15:57
<cliebow_>
8~)
15:58
i thought i was the one behind the times...
15:59
High Speed Wireless Internet for Midcoast Maine - FAQs
15:59
hoping to be warboating this summer
16:03
ma ybe it wasnt the grass..maybe it is becasue i threatened it with a serial modem
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17:00
<ace_suares>
dell.com/linux
17:02
<cliebow_>
hmm
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17:05
<str4nd>
(old!)
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18:09
<pablo_>
ive installed thin client manager package but when i open it dosnt show any clients screen , do i need to configure something to make it work?
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19:03
<ace_suares>
ping sbalneav
19:03
!seen sbalneav
19:03
<ltspbot`>
ace_suares: sbalneav was last seen in #ltsp 4 hours, 13 minutes, and 27 seconds ago: <sbalneav> Guess I'll find out.
19:04
<ace_suares>
would local devices work with qemu? It looks like a far stretch.
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19:15
<tessier_>
hmm...did ltsp 5.0 just recently come out?
19:15
And is freenx integrated into ltsp yet?
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21:00
<benplaut>
I'm writing up a grant for a 60 computer lab... ~30 are going to be thin, and ~30 are going to be laptops. Can I get login to work for both systems assuming one server? For convenience sake, it would probably be k12ltsp
21:01
and the other Q... the thins are probably going to be donated, but for the sake of getting more money out of a grant, what's a prebuilt thin that can do PXE? I saw a demo using old machines and it was pretty incredible to see the diskless boot :P
21:10
<bill_c>
www.disklessworkstations.com has several thin clients
21:10
and the nic's for turning old computer that can't pxe boot into thin clients
21:11
are the notebooks going to be used as thin clients, or used with an OS?
21:11
<benplaut>
that's what i'm trying to figure out
21:12
those will be new systems with ample power... but i don't know if logins will work unless they are thin
21:13
<bill_c>
you could always use samba as a pdc if they are going to be on windurs
21:14
<benplaut>
ok
21:14
there wont be windows, but if it works... :P
21:14
i have no idea how user accounts over a network work in linux... i've been a single user for a long time
21:15
<bill_c>
that's best, could use openldap, and configure the notebooks running linux to auth to the ldap server
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21:15
<benplaut>
ok
21:15
and would they grab their own /home on login?
21:15
or would it all be hacked together with scripts?
21:16
also, what's the preference between PXE and etherboot? clients are available for both
21:17
<bill_c>
you could mount /home wth nfs, or use pam_mount
21:18
pxe is prolly the way to go if they offer both
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21:19
<benplaut>
ok
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21:55
<sahil>
benplaut: you around?
21:55
<benplaut>
yup
21:55
<sahil>
there are these eway clients im using
21:55
which are $99
21:55
they're amazing
21:56
well i havn't gotten graphics other than vesa to work yet but im confident they will
21:56
let me grab you a link
21:56
<benplaut>
eh
21:56
not really concerned with pricing... ease it better :P
21:56
<sahil>
eh?
21:56
<benplaut>
we probably won't even end up getting the money
21:57
<sahil>
where are you setting up the lab?
21:57
or where do you want to set up the lab rather
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22:03
<sahil>
benplaut: the reason i ask is i might be able to donate some hardware
22:03
<benplaut>
hawaii... :P
22:03
<sahil>
i meant the scenario
22:03
school...ctc
22:03
<benplaut>
high school
22:03
<sahil>
public?
22:03
<benplaut>
i've got donations on hold... the local university is junking them because they can't find anyone to take the donations
22:04
yea, public
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22:41
<wyrm>
hi, who can help me with the tftpboot because this don't charge in the terminals...
22:44
quien podría ayudarme, tengo un mal inglés...
22:44
tengo problemas en las terminales, quedan pidiendoe le archivo de tftp vmlinuz-2,6,16-ltsp-2
22:44
y no hace nada más....
22:45
está instalado en un Debian 4.0 de 32bits
22:45
con ltspacfg
22:56
bye
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