but… when I try to login while sitting at a booted client, it says: “Permanently added the ECDSA host key for IP address ‘192.168.67.1’ to the list of known hosts” sits there for 30 seconds or so, then returs straight to the login screen.
Need to leave, will post on ltsp-list. Thanks!
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hi, 16.04, I've NO network manager (everything in /etc/network/interfaces) setup dnsmasq only as a dns cache (cache-size=1000, listen-address=127.0.0.1, listen-address=192.168.20.10 that is LTSP client side), but now resolution does not work, I don't understand how to make them play nicely, the doc I've found implies network manager that I've REMOVED (I don't want it)
mmm seems related to that listen-address, removing and restarting then works
but I don't want to provide dns services on the (ltsp server) wan interface (eth0 that is 192.168.1.10)
mmm restoring the config works too... so seems a race condition, dnsmasq is run before resolver at startup... possible?
yes, rebooting seame problem, restarting dnsmasq solved :(
alkisg: having /etc/hosts with items like "192.168.20.101 ltsp101" ... "192.168.20.150 ltsp150" is necessary? Was necesary? Improves anything? Don't remember why I put them there
markit: dnsmasq conflicts with nbd-client so it doesn't start half of the times
Solved with ltsp-pnp or ltsp-manager
It improves "reverse dns lookups"
E.g. if a client contacts the server, and IF you've configured the server to do reverse dns lookups, it'll need to do a dns lookup for 192.168.20.101, which might be slow depending on your setup
It's not necessary to do it normally
Normally mdns (avahi) takes care of this
I've to setup this 12.04 to 16.04 server ASAP, so no time to dig into ltsp-manager (but I've took note to do very very soon). So better avoid dnsmasq at all at the moment
Hope they will fix this nasty bug of dnsmasq/nbd-client soon sigh
ok, found the fix in your doc (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPLiveUSB)
but seems network-manager related
also I've no nbd-client on ltsp server
I think it's easier to use something new that works, rather than re-do all those last months that I did troubleshooting stuff, by yourself again
But if you like bugs, sure, do it as you like :)
LTSPLiveUSB is based on some of my docs, but I didn't write it
Also, it's incomplete, it doesn't contain the new bugs that were found in 16.04
You don't need nbd-client on the ltsp server if you're not using ltsp-pnp
network-manager also conflicts with dnsmasq, even if you remove it
It would worked if you purged network manager, instead of apt-get remove, which leaves the conffiles in /etc behind
alkisg: dpkg -l | grep ^rc shows no network manager left
markit: ls /etc/dnsmasq.d
and I did a purge
ls: cannot access '/etc/dnsmasq.d': No such file or directory
It's strange to have dnsmasq without its configuration directory
ehm, of course, I've purged dnsmasq before
do you want me to reinstall?
Maybe I misunderstood?
Are you using dnsmasq or not?
alkisg: I WAS using dnsmasq, was unable to make it work, and since I used it ONLY as dns cache, I purged it to solve the issue fast
[12:41] <markit> yes, rebooting seame problem, restarting dnsmasq solved :(
(now I realize I did not wrote about that sorry)
OK, I was talking about dnsmasq, I didn't realize that you removed it
Never mind then :)
alkisg: yep, manually restarting dnsmasq or resolver, but at each reboot the dns is broken, so I removed dnsmasq
That's what I was trying to help you with, yeah
I know what causes it and how to solved it...
But since you're not using it, nevermind
I would love to use it, we have a very slow connection at school, but if it takes too long I have to give up and have a look another time
"dnsmasq conflicts with nbd-client" I have no nbd-client so decided not to bore you further on this topic
you are vey kind and helpful, but I don't want to waste (too much of) your time if not strictly necessary ;P
There are 3 reasons for dnsmasq to break, nbd-client and networkmanager are 2 of them, anyway ltsp-manager automatically solves all of them so np
I mostly care about the recommended ltsp setup, not about custom setups...
Custom setups require a sysadmin, so it's his job to troubleshoot them :D
alkisg: you are right, the "problem" is (forgive me) I learned about ltsp-manager just a day ago, and since I have no time to understand and test it with my kubuntu install, I skipped but this does not mean at all I'm not very much interested in it, as I am in eveything you do for ltsp
Hey I'm not blaming you for anything no worries!
hahaha, ok, I'm the sysadmin, so you should write "a good sysadmin" ;P
It's only my part; that personally I don't mind about bugs found in custom installations
ltsp-manager is the same as ltsp-pnp, which has been around for years
It doesn't have any new or old bugs
Yes, it's just an automated ltsp-pnp installation
The ltsp-pnp page mentions how to do things manually, while ltsp-manager do them via a menu
ltsp-pnp... I don't use (yet) ltsp-pnp, I have to solve some problems kde related before (had no time so far)
that's maybe why I did not noticed
I can't imagine how kde fat clients with work without ltsp-pnp and would break with ltsp-pnp
Do you mean that ltsp-pnp breaks things for you, and plain ltsp works?!
That would be very strange...
no, I just have it to run some (custom) script I made to solve some phonon issues or directory links/paths
otherwise kde crashes or takes a huge amount of time to boot
I don't remember, I asked you about it when I tested ltsp-pnp (for one user), I took some note about your replies but had no time to investigate so far
And that script works in ltsp and it doesn't work in ltsp-pnp?
I just can't understand what part would work in ltsp, and wouldn't work in ltsp-pnp...
let me retrieve some info if I find them...
In fat chroot I create this script
and I put something like (took from my ruby scripts, so there are escapes for ruby)
"# change kde permanent cache path from default /var/tmp to ~/.cache"
this has to be done for ltsp clients and not for the Server regular users
so the question is/was: how can I do for -pnp?
I need this to be executed by the clients at startup of the session (I mean, when "normal" fat executes them from /etc/X11/Xsession.d/)
You just do this on top of the script:
test -n "$LTSP_CLIENT" || return
Or you put it in /usr/share/ldm/rc.d/X*
oh, you mean put in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/10ltspMM_rm_phonondevicesrc and with that test I can run only if a ltsp client? Cool
what about /usr/share/ldm/rc.d/X* ? What is it for?
To run things when the Xsession starts, while also having access to the ltsp variables and lts.conf and the remote file system for thin clients etc
Check the scripts that are already there
I've only X50-client-env, hope is enough :)
Look in the chroot, in your case
You're not using ltsp-pnp now, so you don't have ldm in the server, you have it in the chroot
btw, ltsp-manager is GUI based, is there something I can run in ssh instead? I remember a ltsp-config or something like that. I think is time to avoid my script and move to your stuff (for the next install). But with automated stuff I did not wrote I will loose even more control, so my low skill about what is going on will be even worse, what do you think?
btw, http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Ltsp-manager/Preparation I get (firefox) "This version of the UserMerge extension requires MediaWiki 1.25+"
I'm playing with the wiki now, I'll fix it in a few minutes
ltsp-manager is gui based, but it has scripts underneath
One of them is /usr/share/ltsp-manager/initial-setup.sh
alkisg: where is the official doc? I've found some link but seems obsolete, like http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/ that does not mention -pnp at all
ogra_: can you delete that ^ because it's misleading people?
eep ... i need to delete that dir i guess
maybe I just have to try it in a proxmox VM and come back if I have issues
ogra_: There's also a blueprint about ltsp-manager that needs deletion... thanks!
(though the creation date should have told you something :P )
not sure i can delete blueprints
markit: ogra had a project with the same name in the past, but they are unrelated
ltsp-manager: LTSP Manager is a GUI tool that makes LTSP maintenance easy. It's the recommended way to install LTSP in common setups. More info: http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Ltsp-manager
That's the official doc
oh, I see, in fact I was confused by this
mmm sounds great (as usual is Alkisg's stuff I must say), just to understand the impact in how I've organized my stuff but I'm optimistic :)
i removed the dir
thank you ogra_ :)
alkisg: I don't remember the requirement of the ltsp server to be named "server" if has been remove and/or is configurable somewhere. None of my servers have that name and things worked so far but...
btw, I've a lot of notes about our conversation, but is frustrating how difficoult is to translate it in a clear, updated and coherent/complete documentation. I feel lost and clueless so often :(
markit: up until a year ago, if you didn't name it "server", then cups wouldn't work
I fixed it about a year ago
oh, yes, now I remember, thanks
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argh, I've 12GB ram and a i386 installation, and I see the reference to this bug https://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=196157
wondering how bad will affect the boot of 24 fat clients
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Hi, is it possible to use passphrase-protected ssh-keys for authenciation with ldm?
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alkisg: If you are not asleep, may I chat with a bit?
First of all I again congratulate the three of you for sending upstream the more flexible LTSP Manager.
I will try it with both Stretch and Ubuntu
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alkisg_web: in http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Ltsp-manager/Preparation , Network, config has to be in /etc/network/interfaces or with NetworkManager or does not matter at all?
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markit: 12 GB => you can limit them with mem=8G in the kernel cmdline
markit: about network config, ltsp manager configures dnsmasq in proxydhcp mode
If you are using isc-dhcp then you need to manually update ltsp-server-dnsmasq.conf
LTSP manager shouldn't break if you're using /etc/network/interfaces for static IP etc, it should work without network manager fine, but I haven't tested it
I see, my problem is that teachers are clueless so if I expose the NM to them, they could break it and cry "nothing works, but nobody did anything wrong!"
I'm trying ltsp-manager in a vm, reading about shared dirs and trying to figure out that config
(I'm using ACLs for that, but I've some troubles and there is added complexity, windows ACL sigh seem better to me, i.e. if you copy a file it gets the acl of the destination dir, so if the dir is "everyone" becomes a shared file automatically)
Teachers here like to see the network manager applet because it tells them when they pulled the network cable by mistake
And it shows the speed etc
Shared folders should work fine out of the box, without bothering about ACLs
ACLs don't properly solve the shared folders issue, that's why I used bindfs
sure, but you told me time ago that your average teacher is not a clueless newbie, mine are
The "sysadmins" aren't; but the normal teachers are
is there an explaination about different roles? teacher, stuff, student, administrator...
A computer teacher is the "sysadmin", but many teachers use the computer lab, which are clueless
administrator means "put him in sudo"
teacher means "put him in teachers and in epoptes"
student => none of those
also would be great having the possibility to import/export accounts for creation/deletion/whatever from .ods or csv for mass management
stuff => only in epoptes
It's there, read the docs :)
Import/export to .csv
oh, I see, sorry for the noise, lol
(I searched under "users")
We should probably merge the "file" menu with the "users" menu
Let's see if people like ltsp-manager first
also I should shift from my "every user has it's own account" (and I have to create them every year) to your "fixed accounts, rotate users. Woundering if you have already created the tool/option to remove all the home content once the student has graduated and leaves
Right click on the users, delete, and check remove home
E.g. select the c1, c2, c3 groups first, then select all users
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also I've the option to reset the setup (removing i.e. .config or .kde) so if a user messes up the desktop or whatever, the teacher can "restore" a working situation in a snap
I think I'll shift to the model of "u17a01", which means "user that got in the school in 2017 and got to the a class and works on pc01"
That should be an epoptes option
Right click on the user
In some cases it can go in ltsp manager too, sure
ah, I don't create users in epoptes, to be sincere I don't use epoptes ad all (teachers do... well, some...)
epoptes can't create users, but it can run commands on the logged in users
So if a teacher detects an issue, he could reset the panel etc without calling the sysadmin
good, but as a sysadming then having that in ltsp-manager (so you can act against a user not logged) sounds good too
as you already said :)
Yes, some actions are for the teacher and others for the sysadmin
E.g. "reset panel/desktop" is for the teacher, while "delete all files" is for the sysadmin
or the evil teacher ;P
alkisg: ltsp-chroot -a i386 -p -d -c, then nano /etc/cups/cups-browsed.conf and I get "Error opening terminal: screen.xterm-256color.". I don't remember anything like that in the past
(outside chroot works fine)
Dunno I don't use chroots
They had a lot of issues that I didn't like to troubleshoot :)
urgh, /etc/default/grub is not present in my server... wondering if has been removed by something by mistake, let's dig
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mm 12.04 did not had it too...
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markit: you can find the example at /usr/share/grub/default/grub
Copy it to /etc/default manually because it appears you deleted it
I'm trying with a vm as thin client (ipxe boot), seems slow like hell
sorry, solved with a purge/reinstall of grub
now set 8GB limit, hoping in a kenerl fix soon but seems 32 bit is almost abandoned these days
mmm I forget that I reinstalled dnsmasq, then I purged it again, now seems fast in booting (maybe the reason is a different one), I just during boot I get a "FAILED failed to start simple desktop display manager" but things go well then, seems I'm ok, thanks A LOT as usual
btw, the model of "u17a01" seems bad since suggests to link an user to a PC
while the fabolous thing of ltsp is that if a pc is broken you can use another without issues
also happens that a student changes classes, i.e. from a to b
markit: in schools, we use this model a lot
We have e.g. 2-3 students working on the same pc
and we want to keep them on the same pc to discover vandalism, broken keyboards etc
Of course they can work elsewhere, but that's where we want them
So, that model is per seat and per class
There are other 3 models for user accounts, read the ltsp-manager docs for the one that suits you
E.g. per student or only per seat etc
I've to leave, thanks you again, have a good night :)
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