IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 22 October 2008   (all times are UTC)

00:08* sbalneav thinks sushi makes up for the lack of grammatical articles
00:16
<warren>
sbalneav: Kobe beef makes up for the lack of anything.
00:17
Eric Harrison is here with me.
00:17
Oh man. Two days ago we had a gigantic Korean-style barbecue dinner, with tons of Kobe beef. ~$280 for 6 people. In America that amount of Kobe beef would be like $750+.
00:17
Kobe beef ruins all other beef.
00:19
<johnny>
beef is bad for the planet anyways
00:19
cows suck
00:19
<warren>
I know
00:19
I'm evil
00:19
I might stop eating beef all year in order to save enough karma to eat kobe beef once a year.
00:20
<rjune>
I was just called a liberal hippie
00:20
<johnny>
limiting consumption would be a good first step
00:20
rjune, aren't you?
00:20* rjune slaps johnny
00:20
<johnny>
is that a problem?
00:21
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, you have used rom-o-matic right? can you help me with an issue?
00:21
<rjune>
it's incorrect.
00:21
<johnny>
gonzaloaf_laptop, i generated a floppy to use
00:21
that's all i know :)
00:21
i used floppies for my clients that didn't have netboot
00:21
<rjune>
gonzaloaf_laptop: what's up?
00:22
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, I'm trying to download an iso for a cd, floppies are too old :p
00:22
<johnny>
rjune, you don't want peace, love , and happiness?
00:22
<rjune>
I prefer the dos loader and run from hd
00:22
<johnny>
gonzaloaf_laptop, that's why i used em , since nobody needs to use the floppy drive :)
00:22
<rjune>
I'll settle for meat, booze, and sex
00:22
<johnny>
i just taped up the floppy holes
00:22
<rjune>
romomatic generates an iso now?
00:23
<johnny>
gonzaloaf_laptop, too easy for people to lose the floppies.. i'm sure it'd be worse with cds
00:25
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, I'm in a testing environment so that wouldnt be a problem, the thing is that I downloaded the iso from http://www.rom-o-matic.net/gpxe/gpxe-git/gpxe.git/contrib/rom-o-matic/ I chose the model of NIC that 'lspci' told me I have but it doesnt boot
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00:25
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, I have tried 3 models
00:25
<johnny>
it was probably the wrong pcicd
00:25
you should be able to get a multi driver cd
00:26
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
how?
00:26
<johnny>
i don't know
00:26
too small to fit on a floppy :)
00:26
so i didn't bother investigating
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00:30
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, I'm sure I got the right pcicd
00:30
<johnny>
then i have no idea
00:30
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
:(
00:31
johnny, am I getting the iso from the correct page?
00:31
gpxe?
00:31
<johnny>
i guess
00:31
i think that's what i used
00:31
been a year since i generated mine
00:32
woot folks write the best product captions
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00:50
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, when using rom-o-matic, do I have to have specific entries in my dhcp.conf?
00:53
<johnny>
no different than what you had previously to support pxe
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01:06
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
johnny, it still doesnt work, I wonder what could be my problem!
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01:14
<gonzaloaf>
johnny, check this piece of my syslog, any clue_
01:14
?
01:14
http://pastebin.ca/1233543
01:14
<johnny>
it's 2am
01:14
i'm going to bed
01:14
<gonzaloaf>
just 3 lines :(
01:23
<rjune>
Oct 23 01:11:02 ltsp-server dhcpd: DHCPNAK on 192.168.2.42 to 00:05:5d:77:5a:74 via eth0 <-- google DHCPNAK
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01:34
<gonzaloaf_laptop>
hi, why when I try to log from a client, I receive the message 'this workstation istn authorized to connect to the server' ?
01:39
<Pascal_1>
Bonjour
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01:57
<stgraber>
gonzaloaf: ltsp-update-sshkeys && ltsp-update-image
01:59
<gonzaloaf>
stgraber, thanks
01:59
is ltsp-manager working_
01:59
?
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03:24
<pfx>
Hi! I'm new in thin-clients. Is there any ability to use LTSP on windows? I need to be able to use windows server with linux clients. Sounds ugly, but it's my task.
03:25
I didn't found much. Just something about playing with samba and using second TSE-server (but for windows thin-clients)
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03:52
<vlt>
pfx: I never used such a setup but I hink you can use rdesktop to connect to a windows server.
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03:52
<vlt>
*think
03:53
<pfx>
vlt: I should boot linux in someway before using rdesktop
03:54
In old (~2003) mailing list archive was suggested to use samba (and put linux distro to there). But I doubt it works
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04:00
<pfx>
Have to go =( Hope will find somebody who did such configuration later
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04:38
<masus>
hi all , have a problem cant login via one client , i have paste all errors and configurations to -> http://rafb.net/p/gXkX4I74.html can anybody help me please ?
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04:48
<masus>
;(
04:50
and here is it with the dhcpd.conf - http://rafb.net/p/lIYhqt43.html
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05:25
<masus>
hi all , have a problem to login to a debian etch ltsp-server -> http://rafb.net/p/lIYhqt43.html from one client here ara some errors and logs can anybody help me please . Thanks All
05:26
or point me to the right direction
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08:31
<rezon8>
what distro is recommended for ltsp5?
08:31
<ogra>
see topic
08:32
<rezon8>
ahh, thanks :)
08:32
<ogra>
:)
08:32
<rezon8>
was hoping to move away from fc
08:33
anyone run k12ltsp? thast what im on now
08:33
fc4 based
08:33
<ogra>
well, ubuntu ill release the latest code with latest ltsp in it in 8 days
08:33
*will
08:33
debian probably with lenny in december
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08:45
<jammcq>
good morning friends
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08:53
<jammcq>
Scotti !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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08:53
<jammcq>
oops
08:53
I killed him :(
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08:54
<jammcq>
Scotti !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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08:54
<sbalneav>
Hmmm, try this again
08:54
morning all
08:54
<jammcq>
Scotti !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:55
<ogra>
!s
08:55
<ltspbot>
ogra: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:56
<sbalneav>
Morning jammcq, ogra
08:56
<ogra>
:)
08:56
<cliebow>
morning morning morning
08:57
<sbalneav>
(morning)^4
08:58
<cliebow>
spitting snow here %<(
09:05
<_UsUrPeR_>
good morning
09:05
<cliebow>
Ho!
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09:10
<sbalneav>
cliebow: Remember, you need to rustle us up a hurricane like you did last year
09:10
<cliebow>
see what i can do...
09:11
<sbalneav>
Snow I can get here by the metric tonne. Hurricanes, however, are a little harder to come by on the prairies.
09:13
<jammcq>
nuthin like a good ole hurricane to make a BTS special
09:15
<sbalneav>
"Rage, winds, and crack thy cheeks! Rage!! Blow!!"
09:15
<bonus points for anyone who can name the source>
09:15
<jammcq>
umm, forest gump?
09:15
<sbalneav>
<hint: Shakespeare>
09:15
No.
09:15
<jammcq>
I was close
09:16
<sbalneav>
Not Forrest Gump :)
09:16
you were
09:16
In that both Shakespeare and Forrest Gump have insight into human nature.
09:17
<jammcq>
umm, yeah, that's what I meant
09:17
<sbalneav>
<best Ben Stein voice>
09:18
Bueller? Anyone?? Anyone?
09:18
<jammcq>
heh
09:18
now class.....
09:18
<sbalneav>
http://www.bartleby.com/70/4332.html
09:19
That's right, King Lear!
09:21
King Lear's also the play that has the famous quote: "How sharper than a serpent's tooth it is to have a thankless child"
09:21
<bell rings>
09:21
Class dismissed! I want you all to do your essays on Act III
09:22
jammcq!! Spit out that gum!
09:22
ogra! No running in the hallways!
09:23
<jammcq>
we don't need no education
09:24
<ogra>
heh
09:25
<sbalneav>
You can't have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat!!
09:25
<jammcq>
mmmm, meat
09:25
although, meat in the UK isn't quite the same as some other places i've been
09:25
<sbalneav>
You! Yes you behind the bikesheds! Stand still laddy!
09:26
<jammcq>
I think scotty knows what' I'm talking about
09:26
<sbalneav>
Yeah
09:26
That one steak was a little disappointing.
09:26
<pscheie>
Now bring us a figgy pudding
09:26
<jammcq>
heh, and that was their best recommendation :)
09:27
<sbalneav>
Should have gone for fish & chips
09:27
<pscheie>
in hell, the English are the chefs...
09:27* jammcq makes note to self. stay out of hell
09:28
<sbalneav>
Oh, I've had good meals in england. Just not THAT particular meal.
09:28
<jammcq>
i've been to england 4 times.... still hoping to find a decent meal
09:28
<pscheie>
most memorable meal I had in England was a grilled cheese sandwich from a vending machine
09:28
<sbalneav>
http://consumptionaddict.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/hell.jpg
09:28
<jammcq>
now France, Spain, Germany and Italy.... there's some good meals
09:29
<sbalneav>
Looks like you turn right.
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09:32
<pscheie>
jammcq, two weeks to BTS, I'm still looking for a ride from Bangor to SWH; you guys coming through that way?
09:32
<jammcq>
pscheie: yeah, just don't know what time yet
09:32
could be noon or midnight, or anytime between or before or after
09:33
<pscheie>
just make it after 3pm
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09:44
<Blinny>
Morning!
09:45
I have more information regarding my problem printing to thin clients' printers. Before the latest libcupsys2 update it worked fine. Afterwards, no go.
09:45
I see lots of cups audit lines in /var/log/messages and wonder if this is related
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10:01
<sbalneav>
Blinny: Is jetpipe starting now
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10:02
<Blinny>
sbalneav: Yes.
10:02
sbalneav: Here's what I've done
10:03
I don't think this is necessarily #ltsp related, as I've taken a standalone hardy install and printed before and after the libcupsys2 update - before worked, after didn't
10:03
However, it is something specific with this printer because another thin client began working after a reboot.
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10:03
<Blinny>
I've got to try to gather more information
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11:30
<monteslu>
warren, finally got a chance to fix flash
11:30
on flash 10
11:30
just needed the nspluginwrapper.i386 like you said
11:31
kind of a strange requirement
11:33
<pscheie>
monteslu, are you running 64-bit?
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11:39
<monteslu>
pscheie, yup
11:40
I have an 8 core server with 16GB or ram running 64bit fedora. Sound working even on flash :)
11:40
<pscheie>
how many clients?
11:41
<monteslu>
about 70
11:41
<pscheie>
how much did the server cost?
11:41
<monteslu>
the server as about $4200
11:42
or was it 5200? Sorry, can't remember
11:42
but it was cheap for what I got
11:42
<pscheie>
did you build it or buy it?
11:42
<monteslu>
also has 3 drives i have in a raid5
11:42
got it from dell
11:42
tired of building boxes :)
11:43
<jammcq>
sbalneav: hey, what was that firefox plug-in that allows editing fields with a real text editor?
11:44
<monteslu>
Only problem i have left is that the thin clients are taking about 4 minutes to log in
11:45
top on the thin client shows "sh" is running, not sure what the script is doing
11:48
<pscheie>
jammcq, greasemonkey?
11:48
<jammcq>
hmm, never heard of that one
11:48
<ogra>
mozed or some such
11:48
<jammcq>
scotty pointed out a plug in quite a while ago
11:48
yeah, mozed could be it
11:48
<pscheie>
greasemonkey may only be for wikis
11:49
<jammcq>
let's you invoke a local editor to edit the text fields
11:49
VERY handy when editing wiki pages
11:49
<pscheie>
monteslu, what kind of hardware are the clients?
11:49
<Q-FUNK>
re
11:49
<pscheie>
jammcq, such as vi?
11:49
<jammcq>
yep
11:49
<pscheie>
cool!
11:50* pscheie goes looking for mozed
11:50
<monteslu>
pscheie, mostly 500MHz via chips with 128mb of RAM. About 30 800MHz clients with 512MB ram
11:50
not sure if the faster ones are as slow to log in as well
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11:52
<pscheie>
monteslu, 4 minutes to login? or from boot to logged in?
11:52
login = for a user to log in
11:52
<monteslu>
from login screen to gnome finishing loading
11:52
boot is actually not that bad
11:53
<ogra>
boot should be below a minute on any ltsp5 implementation nowadays
11:53
<Lns>
ogra: not w/the nbd_swap issue though
11:53
<ogra>
monteslu, checked ~/.xsession-errors ?
11:53
<Lns>
in ubuntu anyway
11:54
<sbalneav>
jammcq: mozex
11:54
<monteslu>
boot taking long wouldn't be a big deal because it only neds to be done in the morning, but right now the slow login is a pain because kids have to wait
11:54
<ogra>
Lns, yes, i'll get to the ton of hardy fixes after release
11:54
<Lns>
monteslu: are you monitoring the server cpu usage? top?
11:54
<ogra>
10 days ...
11:54
<Lns>
ogra: :)
11:54
<monteslu>
ogra, not yet. I'll give that shot
11:54
Lns, top on the client shows sh eating the cpu
11:55
<sbalneav>
monteslu: What's taking a long time? Time to the login prompt? Or time to log in?
11:55
<monteslu>
i don't think the server is being taxed at all
11:55
<ogra>
sbalneav, login
11:55
<monteslu>
time to login
11:55
<sbalneav>
Probably a DNS failure
11:55
ssh is trying to do a reverse lookup from the hostname
11:55* ogra wouldnt know anything that needs dns in the ubuntu session
11:55
<sbalneav>
ssh
11:55
<ogra>
missing loopback might be an issue
11:56
<sbalneav>
it tries to do a reverse mapping by default
11:56* pscheie has seen standalone ssh have that same DNS problem
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11:56
<ogra>
or broken /etc/hosts
11:56
<Lns>
I used to have issues back in the Feisty days with not being able to reach DNS and it booting to a busybox prompt, but that was a separate issue
11:56
<jammcq>
bummer, 'Mozex' is for OLDER versions of firefox
11:56
<sbalneav>
either make sure the terminals are listed in DNS, or in /etc/hosts
11:56
<ogra>
jammcq, might be that greasemonkey replaces it
11:56
<Lns>
sbalneav: i've never had to do that myself
11:56
<sbalneav>
jammcq: Go for the development version
11:57
it'll work in 3
11:57
<Lns>
monteslu: is this a 1-NIC or 2-NIC setup?
11:57
<jammcq>
I see no dev version
11:57
I see last updated June 12, 2004
11:57
<monteslu>
Lns, unfortunately a 2 NIC. I couldnt get 1 NIC to work
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11:57
<monteslu>
i really don't like the bridge setup
11:57
this is fedora 9, btw
11:57
<jammcq>
ah
11:57
found it
11:57
<sbalneav>
http://mozex.mozdev.org/development.html
11:57
<ogra>
bridge setup ?
11:57
ah, fedora
11:58
<Lns>
ogra: i think he means the forwarding of wan traffic over the ltsp server
11:58
<ogra>
no, fedora has a weird bridge setup for their clients
11:58
<Lns>
monteslu: why couldn't you get the 1-nic setup to work?
11:58
<monteslu>
WAN is hit via a gateway
11:58
<Lns>
oh
11:58
<ogra>
not using a two nic setup by default like we do in ubuntu
11:58
<monteslu>
Lns, because the bridge wont let tft traffic through
11:59
two nic is the default as well i think but I'd rather manage the network myself
11:59
<Lns>
this is a real quote-unquote network "bridge" we're talking about? As in, a lan segment router type device?
11:59
<monteslu>
Lns, nope
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11:59
<monteslu>
Lns, like bridge as in vmware
11:59
<pscheie>
software bridge
11:59
<ogra>
btw, did anyone apart from stgraber test the intrepid RC Cds ?
11:59
<monteslu>
splitting a nic
11:59
<Lns>
ah
12:00
<ogra>
i heard it rocks :)
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12:00
<pscheie>
to prevent people from accidently starting the dhcp server on their production network
12:00
<sbalneav>
I loaded up intrepid last night
12:00
<gonzaloaf>
hello, how do I disable encrypted connections?
12:00
<sbalneav>
Didn't get to test LTSP yet
12:00
<monteslu>
I think it needs to be removed from fedora 10, but I'm sure warren will disagree
12:00
<ogra>
gonzaloaf, LDM_DIRECTX=True
12:00
<monteslu>
its a huge pain
12:00
<ogra>
sbalneav, last nights might not have worked
12:00
<masus>
hi all http://rafb.net/p/lIYhqt43.html can't connect to ltsp-server can anybody help me thanks ...
12:00elisboa_ has quit IRC
12:00
<gonzaloaf>
ogra, in lts.conf?
12:00
<sbalneav>
It installed on mine
12:00
<ogra>
gonzaloaf, yep
12:00
sbalneav, with ltsp client ?
12:00elisboa_ has joined #ltsp
12:01
<ogra>
sbalneav, then you have the fixed version
12:01elisboa has quit IRC
12:01
<gonzaloaf>
ogra, this is the path right? /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
12:01
<ogra>
gonzaloaf, /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
12:02
<sbalneav>
masus: What kind of server are you running? Ubuntu?
12:02
<ogra>
looks like your NIC has no driver
12:03
<masus>
sbalneav: debian etch
12:03
sbalneav: it's only one client that cant connect
12:03
<gonzaloaf>
ogra, I dont have that file
12:03
<ogra>
gonzaloaf, what distro ?
12:03
<sbalneav>
Is it the same as all your other clients?
12:03
<gonzaloaf>
ubuntu
12:03
<ogra>
gonzaloaf, create it then
12:03
<vagrantc>
sbalneav, stgraber: how important is the cdpinger segfault patches? what are the situations when it comes up? how important is it that i push them for the next debian stable release?
12:04
<ogra>
/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf should have told you to btw ...
12:04
vagrantc, i have never seen it not working despite the segfaults
12:04
so it might just be cosmetic
12:04
<sbalneav>
vagrantc: Well, cdpinger was segfaulting for me and warren fairly consistently
12:05
<ogra>
sbalneav, for me too, but cdroms worked nontheless
12:05
<sbalneav>
I'd say it's an important to fix.
12:05
<vagrantc>
ogra: that's sort of my experience as well ... i've seen the segfaults ... but i never saw it break anything ...
12:05
<gonzaloaf>
ogra, yes I see, sorry
12:05alkisg has joined #ltsp
12:06X0d_of_N0d_ has joined #ltsp
12:06
<masus>
can anyone take a look please http://rafb.net/p/lIYhqt43.html
12:07
<sbalneav>
masus: You didn't answer my question
12:07
is this client the same as all your other ones?
12:07
be back in 15, gotta go run an errand.
12:07
<masus>
sbalneav: i have answered -> debian etch
12:08
<sbalneav>
sbalneav> Is it the same as all your other clients?
12:08
<masus>
sbalneav: no it's different
12:08
<sbalneav>
ok
12:08
so, looks like etch isn't seeing it's network card.
12:08
change the network card.
12:08
<masus>
sbalneav: the hardware is writing here -> http://rafb.net/p/lIYhqt43.html also the other settings , configs and logs
12:09
<sbalneav>
Your client hardware description is not much help
12:09
doesn't tell me what kind of chipset it is.
12:09
<masus>
sbalneav: it's an mini pc http://www.multipc.com.tr/
12:09
<sbalneav>
whatever it is, it isn't being recognized.
12:10
try disabling the onboard nic, and installing a PCI nic like an e100 or the like
12:10
<masus>
i cant change the hardware :s if u look here u will understand http://www.multipc.com.tr/
12:10
<vagrantc>
looks kind of like the ebox2300, doesn't it?
12:10
<ogra>
shudder
12:10
<masus>
it's a mini box
12:11
<vagrantc>
masus: mini box says nothing ...
12:11
<masus>
:)
12:11
<sbalneav>
well, I'm off on an errand.
12:11
<masus>
yes i know
12:11
vagrantc: yes it's look same like ebox2300
12:12
<vagrantc>
32 bit (risc) ?
12:12
that doesn't even sound like i386
12:12
<ogra>
SiS NIC
12:12
if its the ebox
12:12
<Q-FUNK>
türk de─čilim
12:12
<vagrantc>
although if it's getting that far, it must be (mostly) i386 compatible...
12:13
<ogra>
yeah
12:13
<masus>
vagrantc: Vortex A9100 say this something ?
12:13
<ogra>
it says "multipc 2300"
12:13
sounds not much different to ebox 2300 :)
12:13
<vagrantc>
masus: so some thin clients work, but this model doesn't ?
12:13
<masus>
vagrantc: yes
12:14
<ogra>
even if you get it to boot it wont be much fun
12:14
the ebox sucks
12:14
<Q-FUNK>
masus: Anlamiyorum!
12:14
<vagrantc>
ogra: the ebox was more like a 233MHz, though ...
12:14
ogra: no?
12:14
<ogra>
there were two models
12:14
i think there was also a 300MHz
12:14
<vagrantc>
both painfully slow?
12:14
<ogra>
yes
12:15* ogra ssh's into his router ... which is a ebox 2300 :)
12:15
<vagrantc>
heh
12:15
good for something, at least.
12:15
<ogra>
takes 20 sec for the sshd to open :)
12:16
<ltsppbot>
"ogra" pasted "ebox 2300 lspci" (8 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/64
12:16
"ogra" pasted "ebox cpuinfo" (19 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/65
12:17
<vagrantc>
it must have a different ethernet ... as the rtl-8xxx are pretty well supported
12:17
<ltsppbot>
"ogra" pasted "ebox meminfo" (29 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/66
12:17
<vagrantc>
SiS SiS SiS!!! rah rah!
12:17pmatulis_t60 has joined #ltsp
12:17
<ogra>
anything else you need before i go cooking ?
12:17
heh
12:17
<Q-FUNK>
food!
12:17
<ogra>
yeah, sis fun
12:18
it takes 3 min to boot from the CF card in the router setup i use atm
12:18
anyway ... off to kitchen ...
12:19* vagrantc forgets the break options to pass to initramfs-tools
12:19* vagrantc wonders if those options are in etch
12:20
<_UsUrPeR_>
has anyone had any luck creating new scripts in the screen.d dir?
12:20* vagrantc wonders how to get it to boot to the local device
12:21
<vagrantc>
masus: basically, we need to get the information about your device from your device itself ...
12:21
<masus>
vagrantc: http://www.compactpc.com.tw/ebox-2300SX.htm
12:21
its the same box i think
12:21
vagrantc: how can i give you the information from the device
12:22
<vagrantc>
masus: we basically need to get it to come to a shell rather than kernel panic
12:22
<cliebow>
ogra: that cd is hanging at 81% "scannng security repository" ..suppose cd is borked??
12:22
<alkisg>
vagrantc, break=bottom in pxelinux.cfg/default?
12:22
<vagrantc>
masus: but if it really is an ebox ... it's kind of unlikely to get anywhere with it.
12:23
alkisg: yeah, that's what i was trying to think of ... though i'm not sure it's available in debian etch
12:23
actually, break=top would be better
12:23
<alkisg>
(yeah, but I could only remember bottom :P)
12:23
<vagrantc>
masus: try adding break=top to /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
12:23
<masus>
vagrantc: ok
12:23
<vagrantc>
masus: and then reboot
12:23
<masus>
vagrantc: ok
12:31
brb reboot
12:31masus has quit IRC
12:32
<vagrantc>
?
12:32
i meant reboot the thin client ... *sigh*
12:32
if masus is actually logged into the thin-client we've been debugging ... i'm going to ... laugh.
12:34Subhodip has joined #ltsp
12:36
<sbalneav>
Back
12:38
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: sounds suspiciously like an ebox2300
12:39masus has joined #ltsp
12:39
<masus>
vagrantc: have reboot the server and client
12:40
<vagrantc>
masus: only needed to reboot the client
12:40* vagrantc sighs
12:40
<masus>
ok :)
12:40
vagrantc: what i have to now ?
12:40
<vagrantc>
masus: does it still kernel panic?
12:41
<masus>
yes
12:41
<vagrantc>
no luck.
12:41
<masus>
vagrantc: and there are 2 messages before Fatal Error inserting fan \ Fatal Error inserting thermal
12:41
<cliebow>
sbalneav:may i ask an ot re dns
12:41
<vagrantc>
masus: you added break=top to /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default ?
12:41
<masus>
vagrantc: yes
12:41
<vagrantc>
masus: ok, it probably isn't supported in etch ...
12:42
<masus>
vagrantc: one mom please it doesnt save it
12:42
:S
12:42
<vagrantc>
?
12:42
<sbalneav>
cliebow: Surely
12:45
<masus>
vagrantc: ihave do ltsp-update-kernels and ltsp-update-sshkeys so the old file is come back without break=top
12:45
vagrantc: i have write t again and boot the client
12:45
vagrantc: now iget another message i'll write
12:45
<vagrantc>
ok.
12:45
<masus>
vagrantc: /bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off
12:46
<cliebow>
why would this ;line throw a badd dotted quad error in syslog..
12:46
athletics IN A sites.google.com/a/surryes.u92.k12.me.us/athletics/Home
12:46
<vagrantc>
masus: sounds good ... ok ...
12:47
<masus>
vagrantc: :)
12:47
<sbalneav>
cliebow: What's your dns question?
12:47
<masus>
vagrantc: and this line (initramfs)
12:47
<cliebow>
that line is from a zone file..just posted
12:47
<vagrantc>
masus: cut -f 2,18 /proc/bus/pci/devices
12:48
<cliebow>
sbalneav:athletics IN A sites.google.com/a/surryes.u92.k12.me.us/athletics/Home
12:48
<sbalneav>
cliebow: you can't put a website as an address
12:49
<masus>
vagrantc: there is no file called devices , input/ - pci/ - pnp/ there are three directories
12:49
vagrantc: sorry
12:49
<sbalneav>
are you wanting people to browse to http://athletics, and it redirects to sites.google.com/a/surryes.u92.k12.me.us/athletics/Home?
12:49
<masus>
vagrantc: there are 9 lines of numbers
12:50
vagrantc: like 17f36021
12:50
do you want all ?
12:50
<vagrantc>
masus: one of those is your ethernet card.
12:50
probably
12:50
<masus>
vagrantc: yes
12:51
<vagrantc>
masus: please paste the output to the pastebot:
12:51
<cliebow>
seems to me when it worked they simply typed athletics in a browser and up it came
12:51
<vagrantc>
!pastebot
12:51
<ltspbot>
vagrantc: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
12:51
<sbalneav>
cliebow: are you wanting people to browse to http://athletics, and it redirects to sites.google.com/a/surryes.u92.k12.me.us/athletics/Home?
12:51
<cliebow>
yeah.
12:51
<sbalneav>
Yeah, you won't be able to do that via dns.
12:52
<cliebow>
ok..
12:52
<sbalneav>
You'll need a redirect in a proxy
12:52
Your school have a proxy like squid?
12:52
<cliebow>
not in surry..i ll have em do something else..
12:53
<sbalneav>
Yeah, you'll need a proxy to do that.
12:53
<ltsppbot>
"masus" pasted "ltsp" (9 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/67
12:53
<cliebow>
thanks as usua ;-]
12:53
<sbalneav>
NP
12:53
<masus>
vagrantc: have paste it http://pastebot.ltsp.org/67
12:58
are u all still there or am i disconnected :)
13:00
<sbalneav>
You're still here
13:00
<masus>
oh ok
13:01
<vagrantc>
so that's the list of pci ids ...
13:01
<masus>
vagrantc: yes
13:04mccann has quit IRC
13:04
<vagrantc>
hmmm... i don't have any vendors in 17f3 ...
13:04mccann has joined #ltsp
13:04
<vagrantc>
but that's a fairly old list ...
13:05
<alkisg>
cliebow, if you have apache installed, you can also do it with a http redirection
13:05
<masus>
vagrantc: maybe this helps http://www.mail-archive.com/pld-cvs-commit@lists.pld-linux.org/msg144240.html
13:05
<vagrantc>
http://pciids.sourceforge.net/
13:05
<cliebow>
alkisg, yeah was just thinking that\
13:06
<vagrantc>
masus: either my pci id list is wrong, or you have something other than pc ethernet
13:07
pci ethernet
13:07yemu has joined #ltsp
13:07
<masus>
vagrantc: 6040 R6040 MAC Controller
13:07
is it this one :s
13:08
vagrantc: 17f36040
13:08
<vagrantc>
MAC Controller is ethernet?
13:08
it's definitely none of the others
13:09
<yemu>
hi! do you know how to fix firefox freezing issue? I use ubuntu hardy and when i open couple of tabs in firefox i get a hard freeze of thin client :-(
13:10
<sbalneav>
The whole thin client freezes?
13:10
How much ram is in the thin client?
13:11
<yemu>
64mb or 32mb
13:12
yes the whole client is dead, i have to power it down and reboot
13:12
<sbalneav>
You're probably running out of ram.
13:13
You'll need to turn on NBD swap
13:13
<yemu>
how can i do it?
13:13
<sbalneav>
!doco
13:13
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "doco" is you can find the link to the latest, and most current upstream documentation at: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
13:13
<sbalneav>
Should be in there
13:14
Short answer: NBD_SWAP=True in your lts.conf
13:14
<ltsppbot>
"masus" pasted "/proc/bus/pnp/devices" (10 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/68
13:15
<masus>
vagrantc: maybe this helps ? http://pastebot.ltsp.org/68
13:15
<vagrantc>
masus: no idea what those are ...
13:15
<yemu>
sbalnaev: i have USE_NBD_SWAP=True in my lts.conf
13:16
<masus>
vagrantc: ok
13:16
<yemu>
but i assume i have to change it
13:16
<vagrantc>
masus: my guess is that debian etch doesn't know what kind of network card you have.
13:16
<yemu>
to NBD_SWAP
13:16
<masus>
vagrantc: ok thank u very much for your time
13:16
<vagrantc>
masus: if you can figure out what ethernet module you need to load, you could force it to be loaded.
13:16
masus: and that pci id is probably the key.
13:16
<Lns>
yemu: are you using ubuntu?
13:16
<yemu>
yes
13:16
<masus>
vagrantc: ok i'll try it
13:16
<Lns>
oh yes you are sorry
13:16
<masus>
thanks again
13:17
<Lns>
yemu: I'd suggest following this: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/EnableNBDSWAP
13:17
<yemu>
Lns: thanks
13:18
trying that
13:18
<Lns>
yanu_: reload the page - i just added something at the top you'll want to follow (updating chroot)
13:18masus has left #ltsp
13:18
<Lns>
It fixes a bug in nbd_swap for the chroot
13:19
yemu: ^^^
13:19
<yemu>
reloaded
13:19
thanks
13:19
<Lns>
np
13:20
<sbalneav>
Off for a bit.
13:20
<yemu>
trying, will get back to you and tell if it works
13:20
<Lns>
ok
13:21
yemu: should work fine - I've done this at a bunch of my own sites and have documented all the issues i had to iron out along the way
13:21K_O-Gnom has joined #ltsp
13:25
<yemu>
Lns: first problem: i don't have network access when I chroot :-(
13:25
so i can't upgrade
13:25
<Lns>
yemu: why not?
13:26bananin has joined #ltsp
13:27
<alkisg>
(maybe resolv.conf?)
13:27
<yemu>
i have no network, can't even ping any site
13:28
<Lns>
yemu: can you ping outside the chroot?
13:28
yemu: can you ping an IP address
13:28
?
13:28
<yemu>
i can ping my router
13:28
can't ping google
13:29
<alkisg>
yemu, try to copy /etc/resolv.conf from outside the chroot into the chroot, for dns resolving
13:30
<yemu>
alkisg: worked!
13:31
<alkisg>
ok, go on, I don't know what you two are talking about... :)
13:32
<Lns>
wooo :p
13:33
<yemu>
Lns: hope the upgrade won't brake my system ;-)
13:33
<Lns>
yemu: it shouldn't break it, it should fix it ;)
13:33Q-FUNK has quit IRC
13:35
<Lns>
But you raise a good point, maybe it'd be a good idea to document backing up your chroot first
13:36Subhodip has quit IRC
13:37
<yemu>
lns: stop scaring me...it's already too late
13:38
<Lns>
yemu: ;) don't worry, unless you've done tons of modifications to the chroot it shouldn't have an affect (besides fixing bugs)
13:38
At least that's what my experience has shown
13:39
<yemu>
ok, i've just made a quick copy of chroot
13:39* Lns added the recommendation of backup to wiki
13:39
<alkisg>
yemu, also do a copy of the image before running ltsp-update-image later
13:40
<Lns>
alkisg: well he can always just rebuild the image from the copy of the chroot
13:40
but either way works
13:40
<alkisg>
Lns, sure, but I thought he already started the update, maybe something is already modified...
13:40bobby_C has joined #ltsp
13:40
<alkisg>
How difficult would be to install an ltsp chroot into a client hard disk? It could be faster, and it would surely be handy for debugging...
13:41
<yemu>
creating image ;-)
13:41
<Lns>
alkisg: many have done just that.. http://thesymbiont.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=137&Itemid=145
13:41
Ask gadi about that when he's on, he works for Symbiont
13:42
they make ltsp chroots on those little guys
13:42
<alkisg>
Ah, something like thinclientos... no, I meant an ltsp image
13:42
Like, copy the Ubuntu image into a client
13:42
And probably modify some scripts...
13:42
<Lns>
alkisg: that's essentially what they're doing
13:43
<johnny>
alkisg, how would it be handy for debugging?
13:43
sounds like it'd be more difficult
13:43
what's handy for debugging, is changing from nbd to nfs
13:43
<alkisg>
johnny, e.g. I have a client that hangs up when starting X. It would be much easier to debug this locally...
13:44
<johnny>
you can still debug that locally
13:44
just switch to a console on the client
13:44
<alkisg>
I can't do modifications that stick
13:44
So every time I have to start over (hangs => reboot => modify again)
13:45
<johnny>
you mean it hardlocks everything?
13:45
did you try ssh ?
13:45
<alkisg>
yeah :(
13:45
Like, not even caps lock working
13:45
I didn't try to install ssh into the chroot
13:45
<johnny>
try that
13:45* Lns didn't know that CTRL+ALT+F8 goes straight to console log on a TC...neat
13:45
<johnny>
it's helpful
13:45
f8 is unfortunate.. it should be f+12 :)
13:45
err f12
13:45
<alkisg>
Lns, where is that? Ubuntu?
13:45
<Lns>
alkisg: yeah
13:46
<alkisg>
cool!
13:46
<Lns>
johnny: why F12?
13:46
room for more screens?
13:46
<johnny>
i thought f12 was the standard for such things
13:46
<yemu>
ok, everything seems fine
13:46
<johnny>
f8 is usually used as the second X screen, another defacto standard since ages gone by
13:47
<yemu>
thinclients reboot ok
13:48
<_UsUrPeR_>
!pastebot
13:48
<ltspbot>
_UsUrPeR_: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
13:49
<Lns>
yemu: nice.
13:49
<alkisg>
johnny, if I switch to NFS, are all clients log files stored on the server? E.g. /tmp/client1/Xorg.0.log etc?
13:49
<Lns>
yemu: So then follow the nbdswap directions and you should be golden
13:50
<yemu>
i did it, i get files created in tmp so I think it worked!
13:50
thanks man!
13:50
have to go
13:51yemu has left #ltsp
13:51ogra has quit IRC
13:51
<ltsppbot>
"_UsUrPeR_" pasted "ltsp.conf w/rdesktop question" (11 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/69
13:52
<_UsUrPeR_>
hey all. having some problems with SCREEN_7=rdesktop. Changing the SCREEN_7 does not appear to execute anything pertaining to rdesktop. here's my lts.conf: http://pastebot.ltsp.org/69
13:52
there is no mention of rdesktop while tailing messages or syslog :/
13:53
<johnny>
SCREEN_07
13:53
<Lns>
heh
13:53
<johnny>
leading zero..
13:54
<alkisg>
_UsUrPeR_, I think (besides the zero) you also need RDP_SERVER
13:54
<johnny>
alkisg, not Xorg.0.log.. but others can be.. if you set the remote syslog var
13:54
<Lns>
wham-bam-nbdswap-thankyoumaam
13:54
<johnny>
i don't know if there's a way to log xorg to syslog
13:54
i could be wrong tho
13:54
<alkisg>
johnny thanks, I'll try it when I get the chance
13:55
<_UsUrPeR_>
johnny: my bad. I have the 07 in there already
13:55
<johnny>
Lns, you not want to include the specific documentation for lts.conf directly in your wiki
13:56
<_UsUrPeR_>
but I will check the rdp_server thing
13:56
<johnny>
unless we remove it from the src
13:56
it'd prolly be best to link or embed the docs directly from bzr
13:56
based on the revisions that various distros released with
13:57
<alkisg>
wasn't there an lts.conf editor gui application?
13:57
<johnny>
alkisg, for suse
13:57
easyltsp
13:57
<Lns>
johnny: it's not my wiki :p
13:57
<johnny>
Lns, so?
13:57
whatever
13:57
<alkisg>
Oh... maybe I'll try to make one in the summer! :P
13:57
<johnny>
it's part yours :)
13:58
<Lns>
johnny: what do you mean btw? where?
13:58
<johnny>
huh?
13:58
<Lns>
johnny: what specific documentation for lts.conf
13:59
<johnny>
what's in lts-parameters.txt
14:00
<Lns>
johnny: are you talking about the Ubuntu wiki or the LNS wiki?
14:00
<johnny>
the upstream documentation i was hoping
14:00
<alkisg>
I think an easy and helpful thing to do would be to provide a default lts.conf with ALL directives included but commented out...
14:01
(in ltsp-server package)
14:01
<Lns>
johnny: I have no clue what you're talking about now.
14:01
url me
14:04
<Nubae>
hi Lns
14:04
<johnny>
uhmm.. in the topic
14:04
<Lns>
hey Nubae
14:04
<johnny>
http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
14:04
<Nubae>
hi johnny, alkisg
14:04
<alkisg>
Hi Nubae!
14:04
<Lns>
Nubae: I wanna talk with you re: fatclient setup sometime soon
14:04
is your wiki page up to date for that install?
14:04
<Nubae>
johnny: yeah, I've been putting off pushing the latest docs, I added some missing lts.conf variables
14:05
Ill see if I can push today
14:05
<johnny>
Nubae, wouldn't it be better to embed the one directly from bzr?
14:05
<Lns>
johnny: I'm not sure who put my docs in the upstream documentation...
14:05
<Nubae>
johnny: thats the one Im working on
14:05
Lns: that would be me
14:05
<Lns>
that's right
14:05
<johnny>
then you can link specific revisions of lts-parameters.txt per distro release
14:05* Lns points the finger at Nubae
14:06ogra has joined #ltsp
14:06
<johnny>
Lns, i thought you were working with nubae and sbalneav on that
14:06
that way.. the trunk can stay trunk.. but you can still see the state of the lts-parameters.txt per the versions released in each distro
14:06
<Nubae>
Lns: is more responsible for the wiki stuff, which got a major update after he touched it :p
14:06
<Lns>
johnny: Kindof..I haven't messed with any "official" documentation yet, but some of my personal docs have found their way in there
14:06cosf has joined #ltsp
14:07
<Nubae>
johnny: thats the way it is right now... seperate lts.conf file
14:07
<Lns>
yeah..i mostly work on the ubuntu ltsp wiki now
14:07
<johnny>
silllyness
14:07
burn them
14:07
<Nubae>
burn who?
14:08srini has joined #ltsp
14:08
<Nubae>
Lns: what did u want to know re: fatclient?
14:08
<srini>
hi
14:09
<Lns>
Nubae: well i was going to start testing this out at one of my sites..was wondering if the ubuntu wiki doc for this was totally up to date
14:09
<srini>
I need a clarification regarding the weblogic domain.. Can anybody help on this..?
14:09
<Lns>
Or if you've found easier methods for any of it
14:09
<Nubae>
Lns: it is, but I suggest using the plugin
14:10
<Lns>
Nubae: ok
14:10
<Nubae>
Asmo tested it for hardy and I believe it worked
14:10
<Lns>
thx
14:10
awesome..although i'm sure there's no better way, kinda sucks to (re)enable nfs for homedirs..of course i'm sure that's the best way to do it
14:10
<Nubae>
if u need help with ldap or whatever, install the plugin first, and then take a look at the ldap bits in the wiki
14:10
Lns: it could be done via sshfs, but there are problems keeping the sockets open
14:11
<Lns>
Nubae: yeah, i was wondering about that and/or some sort of rsync thing, but that'd probably be real ugly
14:11
<Nubae>
another possibility is kerberos + nfs4
14:11
but do u really need encryption?
14:11
rsync = definitely ugly
14:12mccann has quit IRC
14:12
<Lns>
Nubae: well encryption will be nice for those who don't use LDM_DIRECTX
14:12
has anyone ever done nfs over ssh?
14:12
is that even possible?
14:13
<Nubae>
Id imagine that is like sshfs, heh or nfs4
14:13* Lns doesn't know a WHOLE lot about nfs
14:14
<Nubae>
if u use ssh, there is no point in using nfs... it already does the file sharing with sshfs
14:15artista_frustrad has quit IRC
14:15
<Nubae>
I get to present sugar over ltsp at a linux conference here... should be cool
14:18Nubae has left #ltsp
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14:35
<Lns>
Nubae: nice! good luck with that
14:35Q-FUNK has quit IRC
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14:38* Lns just created https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ACLSupport
14:41
<Nubae>
cool stuff, never used ACLs before
14:41
cept in squid :-)
14:42
<Lns>
Nubae: it's so nice in educational environments
14:42
it took me a bit to get used to them, but it's real easy
14:43
<Nubae>
I'll have to experiment with that
14:43
always fun to discover something new
14:43
<Lns>
yup
14:44
<johnny>
except there's still no standard across distros on that
14:44
and no set policy on ubuntu
14:45
<Lns>
johnny: what do you mean no standard across distros?
14:46
<johnny>
no acl system is default across desktop oriented distros
14:47
<Lns>
johnny: What do you mean "default" ? Installed/activated by default? ACLs are a kernel module IIRC, should be pretty much standard across anything
14:48
posix anyway
14:48
<johnny>
not necessarily installed
14:48
and obviously i see an apt-get install in your documentation
14:48
c'mon.. don't pretend that's standard
14:48
or default
14:49
<Lns>
johnny: ok, i wasn't sure what you meant by "standard"/"default"
14:49
I thought you meant the mechanism itself
14:49
<johnny>
there are about 4 different mechanisms
14:49
more than 1 is in the kernel
14:50
and none are enabled by default
14:50
it's still the same old octal permissions for most
14:50
<Nubae>
well it is in the Ubuntu LTSP docos...
14:51
<johnny>
just wait until one is chosen.. and all their nice config goes out the window :)
14:51
<Nubae>
yeah well, we had to put up with that with network damager
14:51
<Lns>
johnny: variety is the spice of life!
14:53
<johnny>
i'm soured on that, after being involved in web development where 10 different modules for a cms do the same thing
14:53
but each fails in different ways
14:54
<Lns>
johnny: well I'd hope ACLs are a bit more tried and true than your cms ventures
14:54
You're always going to have cruft to sift through, but that's even better than having nothing at all..you can at least put your motivation behind the one you like the most and get it more stable
14:54
<johnny>
you're probably wrong :)
14:54
<Lns>
lol
14:55* Lns thanks johnny for being the ultimate pessimist ;)
14:55
<Nubae>
yet he likes network manager :p
14:55
<johnny>
yeah.. networkmanager is awesome
14:56
standardized in all the desktop oriented distros
14:56
<Nubae>
but it wasnt
14:56
<johnny>
now we jsut have to make it do everything the original systems did
14:56
<Lns>
lol
14:56
<johnny>
which is close
14:56
and then i won't have to learn five different ways to enable a network device :)
14:56
Nubae, it wasn't?
14:56
it's on suse, ubuntu, fedora
14:56
<Nubae>
note the past tense
14:56
<Lns>
johnny: networkdamager changed everything...and broke compatibility with the standard way of bringing up/down network adapters
14:57
<Nubae>
right!
14:57
<johnny>
that wasn't standard!
14:57
that was the debian/ubuntu way
14:57
not what i call standard :)
14:57
<Lns>
ifconfig isn't a standard?
14:57
<johnny>
actually iproute2 is the standard
14:57
yet you're using ifconfig
14:57
lol
14:57* Lns gives up the fight
14:57
<johnny>
what you call the standard.. isn't
14:58
it's just the de facto standard
14:58
<Nubae>
well... the point is, people are making t-shirts that say, I invented NM on one side and kill me on the other :p
14:58
<Lns>
well, that's standard enough for me... if it works on Linux, Solaris and others (and microsoft imitates it with 'ipconfig') then it's standard enough =p
14:58
<johnny>
my life became 100x times simpler now that i can point and click and enable everything... it just sucked that i lacked a cli way
14:59
but now that exists too
14:59
<Lns>
johnny: where?
14:59
<johnny>
nm-tool, cnetworkmanager
14:59
<Nubae>
yeah, and if u have a dhcp server? then what?
14:59
<johnny>
Nubae, on your desktop?
15:00
<Nubae>
hey, its installed standard on servers
15:00
<johnny>
Nubae, i still think the ifconfig and the like are better on the server
15:00
atm
15:00
<Nubae>
right, but NM is standard on servers
15:00
thats what Im upset about
15:00
<johnny>
Nubae, you tried intrepid yet?
15:00
<Nubae>
yes
15:00
<johnny>
ok.. maybe it happened too late
15:00
<Nubae>
been on it since alpha 6
15:00
<johnny>
maybe it was too late for feature freeze
15:00
<Nubae>
its still screwed
15:01
<johnny>
but it actually integrates with /etc/network/interfaces in some fashion now
15:01
and allows to "adopt"
15:01
<kc8pxy>
i just installed ltsp on my ubuntu hardy amd64 desktop. once i have a client image built, is there anythign i need to do to bring the ltsp server to life?
15:01
<Nubae>
yeah either u turn it off (unmanaged) or NM takes everything over managed
15:01
<Lns>
Has Debian standardized on nm for the server as well?
15:01
<Nubae>
and dhcp stops working
15:01
<johnny>
Lns, doubtful
15:01* Lns wipes his brow
15:02
<Nubae>
hey Im all for standards... but make it work
15:02
<johnny>
Lns, my opinion is that networkmanager was adopted a bit too early
15:02six2one has quit IRC
15:02
<johnny>
Lns, there were only like 3 developers ever working on it anyways afaict
15:02
<Lns>
kc8pxy: depends on how you installed ltsp.. probably not though
15:03
<Nubae>
NM has constant discussion on ubuntu-devel
15:03
<Lns>
johnny: yikes. Yeah, I agree - definitely adopted too early..along with FF3 beta. But I'm not gonna start a flamewar on all of this =p
15:03
<johnny>
Lns, it would have been nice to have the major distros actually hire folsk to work on upstream projects of such importance
15:03
instead of saddling their users with the issues in the meantime
15:03
<Nubae>
right
15:04
<johnny>
Nubae, i hear just as bad issues with session saving and user switching with upstream gnome
15:04
<Lns>
I can vouch for the session saving issues AND user switching
15:04
both are horribly broken, especially user switching in LTSP environments..just...doesn't...work...
15:05
<johnny>
well canonical has just recently decided to hire folks to do some upstream work
15:05cliebow has quit IRC
15:05
<Lns>
and that damn user switch applet takes FOREVER on any multiuser system
15:05
<sbalneav>
Here's the root of the problem.
15:05
<johnny>
Lns, you should probably read about what happened at the linux plumbers conference
15:05
there was even talk about providing a base image with all the stuff.. and then distros use that to base on
15:06
<sbalneav>
All of these applications (NM, Dbus, Consolekit, user switching applet) are written from the point of view of the single user desktop
15:06
<johnny>
not sure that'll go anywhere.. due to all the crusty old geeks around tho
15:06banain has joined #ltsp
15:06
<johnny>
sbalneav, what you say contradicts the need for consolekit :)
15:06
lol
15:06
<sbalneav>
All of these apps work not bad IFF you've got 1 user sitting at one console at a time.
15:06
<johnny>
that was actually in the original dsicussion!
15:06
it just didn't work out right
15:07
consolekit was for multiseat originallY!
15:07
<Nubae>
sbalneav: yeah agreed, Im sure non server people dont complain so much
15:07
<Lns>
sbalneav is right IMO. It really sucks to see all this work going to single-user scenarios ONLY. Devs need to pay more attention to the roots of Linux/*nix
15:07
<johnny>
it was the reason for its invention!
15:07
consolekit is pointless withtout the idea of multiseat
15:07
<sbalneav>
What's happened is, Linux is slowly drifting away from it's unix multiuser roots, and becoming more and more like windows, insofar as 1 user at at time per machine is the norm.
15:08
<johnny>
sbalneav, i couldn't disagree more
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15:08
<Nubae>
theres still plenty of terminal service going on
15:08
<johnny>
what i saw happen.. was just people running out of time
15:08
<Lns>
sbalneav: I'd say Gnome and friends have, maybe not Linux in general
15:08
<dberkholz>
i tend to agree with that, actually.
15:08
multiseat is just another use case instead of the typical case
15:09
<johnny>
and they focused on the 1 user thing cuz it was most important
15:09
to have working
15:09
<Nubae>
right
15:09
agree
15:09
multi user stuff is always put on the back burner
15:09
<johnny>
Nubae, this is where 6 month release cycles bite
15:09
<Nubae>
check all the SDL apps
15:09
cant use them on a multi user system
15:10
<kc8pxy>
johnny: why is that bad?
15:10
<Lns>
I think that's all going to shift over time though.. LTSP and alike projects are going to be in the spotlight a lot more now that "going green" is a household term
15:10
<Nubae>
and no one will do shit about it
15:10
<johnny>
certain changes require a bit longer to marinate
15:10
Nubae, put your money where your mouth is :)
15:10
<Nubae>
johnny: hey I help plenty with what I can :p
15:10
<johnny>
if we all paid into a fund to hire developers who focused on these issues and who could work directly with upstream
15:10
<Lns>
Nubae: actually i've seen a lot of effort to making tuxtype/paint/etc work better in LTSP
15:10
<johnny>
we'd have what we wanted
15:11
<Nubae>
Lns: really? where?
15:11
<Lns>
lemme dig up the bugs
15:11
<johnny>
he has who has the gold.. makes the rules..
15:11
and that is what happened
15:11
<Lns>
Nubae: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tuxpaint/+bug/269082
15:11
<Nubae>
yeah I reported that bug... from what Ive read debian set it to fixed
15:12
<johnny>
oh.. and he who has the most commented bug reports too :)
15:12
when the users get really up in arms about something..
15:12
<Lns>
johnny: gold isnt the issue i think.. it's momentum that will change things in the OSS world
15:12* Lns looks at the "reported by" and laughs
15:13banain has joined #ltsp
15:13
<johnny>
Lns, it's too bad thin clients are still too expensive for what they are
15:13
<Lns>
johnny: that's changing every day
15:13
<johnny>
you can buy an entire pc for not much over a thin clinet
15:14
Lns, perhaps some day.. you could hire me in trade for some thin clients..
15:14
to fix some annoyances of yours
15:14
<Lns>
johnny: http://www.disklessworkstations.com/cgi-bin/web/200110.html?id=eTYHaDf7 going for $100
15:14
<Nubae>
Lns: it shows as fixed, but nothing happened
15:14
<Lns>
Nubae: hmm.
15:14
<johnny>
Lns, i doubt that will do local apps
15:14
<Nubae>
and Ive been following that from the beginning :p
15:15
<Lns>
johnny: that wasn't your argument before =p
15:15
<Nubae>
but we did what we could... lots of people commented
15:15
<Lns>
Nubae: It was fixed in debian, ubuntu probably just needs to pull it down
15:15
<johnny>
a tiny box with 512mb of ram and 700mhz proc and onboard video SHOULD NOT COST $200
15:15
<Nubae>
how was it fixed in Debian?
15:15
where do u see that?
15:15
<johnny>
or more even..
15:16
<Lns>
Nubae: see the triaged bug
15:16
johnny: it's the size that's causing higher costs
15:16
<Nubae>
i see the fix released comment, it was just changed from undecided to fix released without an actual fix release
15:16
thts my point
15:17
<johnny>
Lns, give me something with the demensions of a standard laptop but thicker.. and i'd be happy :)
15:17
it doesn't have to hard drive or keyboard or optical
15:17
or batter
15:17
you'd think you could get something like that in the $150
15:17
range
15:17
<Nubae>
Filing a bug to find out whether its a bug is not the right thing, sorry. Filing bugs in Debian is of course a good thing, but see above :) Making mistakes is also a good thing, _if_ this causes lessons to be learned. If this happens, I'm very happy about mistakes ;-)
15:17
that is the debian fix
15:18
theysaid it was SDL related and as such was not a debian bug
15:18
<Lns>
Nubae: ah...so they're just confused
15:18
<Nubae>
I've given up on it...
15:18
<Lns>
Nubae: well upstream knows about it, maybe we need to squeak the wheels a bit more
15:19bananin has quit IRC
15:19
<Nubae>
You speak of ubuntu ltsp, of ubuntu sdl and ubuntu tux*. This bug might affect debian or might not. Please confirm it does, before filing bugs against debian packages.
15:20banain is now known as bananin
15:20
<Lns>
Nubae: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tuxpaint/+bug/269082/comments/15
15:20
<Nubae>
thats teh debian guys
15:20
yep SDL is being blamed, which might be or might not be true... unfortunately I havent been able to get to a lab to verify that
15:21
<Lns>
Nubae: well that's what we need to do
15:21
<Nubae>
yep
15:22
<johnny>
well.. valgrind sounds like a good idea
15:22
or even strace when it failz
15:22jhutchins_wk has quit IRC
15:23
<Lns>
i was thinking strace too, since that's the only tool i've used for debugging before =p
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15:32
<alkisg>
Wow... I've been trying for months to send some patches to ipconfig to make LTSP work in 2 dhcp server environments (in 68 port), and I just found out that all I needed to do was add "IPAPPEND 1" to pxelinux.cfg/default!!! :(
15:32
Has anyone tried that before? I just tried it, and it passes ipconfig the same IP that was used during the pxe phase!
15:33
So only 1 dhcp request is made... I wonder why we don't use that be default
15:33
*by
15:34
<Lns>
alkisg: do you mean it keeps the ORIGINAL lease or just gets the same IP in a 2nd lease request?
15:34
oh
15:34
<alkisg>
Lns, there are no leases, there's no daemon running
15:34
<Lns>
heh.. i need to read everything
15:34
<alkisg>
But it gets the same ip
15:34
Ehm, I mean that we ignore any lease times :)
15:35
<Lns>
wait
15:35
<alkisg>
ipconfig runs just once. dhclients stays as a daemon, to ask for a renewal before leases expire
15:35
*dhclient
15:37
<Lns>
ok
15:38
<sbalneav>
What would be a use case for having 2 dhcp servers running?
15:38cosf has quit IRC
15:38
<vagrantc>
to extract information from terrorists
15:38
<alkisg>
sbalneav, in most schools in my country, there's a router/dhcp server for windows PCs, and if we want ltsp, we have to have a second ltsp/dhcp server
15:38
<vagrantc>
"talk, or we'll put up a THIRD dhcp server!"
15:39
<alkisg>
heh
15:39
OK, we're just trying to save money... :)
15:39
We could give 400€ and buy a descent router, or always keep the ltsp server running
15:39
<sbalneav>
So, either have the ltsp box handle both, or, simply isolate the thin clients on their own subnet
15:40
<alkisg>
sbalneav, that would require money for another switch! :)
15:40
<Lns>
or configure your router for pxe booting clients as well...i use IPCop and it's easy enough to do on that
15:40
<alkisg>
Well, now everything's easy, all that's needed are some lines in pxelinux.cfg/default and in dhcpd.conf
15:41
Lns, the routers are very cheap, non configurable
15:41
<Lns>
alkisg: gotcha
15:41pmatulis_t60 has quit IRC
15:41* Lns remembers this conversation, oddly enough
15:41
<sbalneav>
Well, you must have SOME money, you've got an LTSP server and clients, how much is 1 extra switch?
15:41
<alkisg>
Well, I'm happy! :P Adding some lines is the cheapest solution!!! :)
15:42
<sbalneav>
Anyway, good fo you
15:42
<alkisg>
sbalneav, I had to wait for 2 months to get 2 mice... don't get me started!!!
15:42
<sbalneav>
but I don't think it should be a default.
15:42bananin has quit IRC
15:42
<alkisg>
sbalneav, why not? Can you think of any case where you would want a *different* IP? (pxe / ipconfig)
15:44
<vagrantc>
the pxelinux documentation recommends against using it ... (for some unknown reason)
15:44
<alkisg>
uh... let me see... (you have any url?)
15:44
<vagrantc>
IPAPPEND ?
15:45
<alkisg>
OK, I saw it.
15:45
It says that we have to use dhclient, but we're not to save memory
15:45
<vagrantc>
/usr/share/doc/syslinux/syslinux.txt.gz
15:46
although "IPAPPEND 2" sounds like a *really* good idea.
15:46
<alkisg>
There's also IPAPPEND 3, which combines them
15:47
<vagrantc>
wow
15:48
<alkisg>
I really can't see any reason to ask for a second lease, since we're not respecting lease times anyway.
15:48
<vagrantc>
i tend to agree.
15:48
<alkisg>
But my problems are solved with just some line editing, so I don't mind!!! :)
15:49
<vagrantc>
i actually got some patches to initramfs-tools to make IPAPPEND work a couple years back :)
15:50
got some patches into
15:50
<alkisg>
with IPOPTS, I know, I was very glad to find out!!!
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15:52
<vagrantc>
gotta run.
15:53
<alkisg>
bye!
15:53vagrantc has quit IRC
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16:30
<sbalneav>
!doco
16:30
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "doco" is you can find the link to the latest, and most current upstream documentation at: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
16:31
<sbalneav>
Heading home, be on later
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16:58
<warren>
sbalneav: vagrantc: The cdpinger segfaults distracted from other real problems
16:58
so it isn't bad to fix
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<cliebow>
x
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20:15
<chupacabra>
sbalneav: that your supybot?
20:15
oops
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20:26
<sbalneav>
Evening all
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20:59
<davidj>
jammcq: ping?
21:00
<sbalneav>
Hey davidj!
21:00
<davidj>
scotty!
21:00
How are you?
21:01
<sbalneav>
Doin' fine. Yourself?
21:01
<davidj>
Good. The family's healthy, business is odd.
21:01
business has been running really hot or stone cold for a month or so.
21:02
Are you going to Maine this year?
21:02
<sbalneav>
I sure am!
21:03
<davidj>
I'll try to drop in via irc. Best I can do this year...
21:06
Are you watching our elections?
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21:07
<sbalneav>
I sure am!
21:08
<davidj>
Are you entertained or terrified?
21:10
<sbalneav>
Little of both. Entertained by watching McPain/Failin flounder around like a couple of goofs, terrified at the prospect that they may win. Fortunately, recently that doesn't look likely.
21:13
<davidj>
Any chance the RMCP might arrest her on her way back to Alaska? ;-)
21:15
<sbalneav>
Nah.
21:15
<davidj>
that's too back.
21:15
s/back/bad/
21:15
I really just stopped by to say I won't be able to come this year.
21:15
<sbalneav>
Well, you know, she's got all the foreign policy experience by having us as neighbours :)
21:16
That's too bad. Would have been fun to have you there!
21:16
<davidj>
That, and she can see Russia from her house!
21:16
<sbalneav>
Putin's givin her the googly eyes.
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21:16
<davidj>
I've looked forward to BTS every fall for three or four years now.
21:17
<sbalneav>
We'll be there next year.
21:17
And the year after.
21:17
<davidj>
I plan to be there next year.
21:17
Hello, warren. How are you?
21:17
<sbalneav>
Hey warren!
21:17
How's Japan?
21:17
<warren>
Eric said he wont go to BTS.
21:18
To be honest, I don't want to go because I'm incredibly exhausted now.
21:18
I don't return to America for 6 days, and it will be ROUGH to adjust back to the timezone.
21:18
<davidj>
You could come and stay on Japan time.
21:18
<johnny>
i'd love to go myself.. but i just can't afford it atm
21:18
<sbalneav>
No? Well, if you're NOT there, then you just miss out on fun + beer + lobster :)
21:18
<davidj>
Scott's a night owl.
21:19
<sbalneav>
Night hawk
21:19
http://nsm.uh.edu/~dgraur/Images/hopper.nighthawks.jpg
21:19
<johnny>
hehe
21:20
<sbalneav>
That's me, with my back to the street :)
21:20
Wow, I've managed to reference a shakespearian play, AND an Edward Hopper painting in one day.
21:21
<davidj>
The worst jetlag I ever had was when I flew from Madrid, to New York, to Mexico City, to Madrid, and back to Atlanta in 6 days. I think I passed myself on the way somewhere.
21:21
<sbalneav>
That's my mission: to bring culture to this channel.
21:21
Did you wave, at least?
21:21
Never hurts to be friendly.
21:22
warren: Did your nasal problems clear up?
21:22
<warren>
sbalneav: like today, yes.
21:23
day 5 of antibiotics, the thick yellow mucus is gone
21:23
<davidj>
sbalneav: Thanks for the link to the painting.
21:23
warren: Stay in Japan until you're healthy! ;-)
21:23
<sbalneav>
Makes a great background
21:23
<warren>
the food here is certainly helping
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21:23
<warren>
the "junk food" is healthier than what I usually eat
21:24
<sbalneav>
That's like, one of the most parodied paintings in history. Right behind the Mona Lisa, I think.
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21:24
<davidj>
warren: I've heard all kinds of jokes about the food in Tokyo.
21:25
Never been there, though.
21:25
<warren>
jokes?
21:25
the food here is great
21:25
<sbalneav>
heh, you're in Japan, you didn't need antibiotics, just ask for an extra large helping of Wasabi and eat it all at once. THAT will clean out your sinuses :)
21:25
<warren>
sbalneav: the health care is great too, after I nearly kill myself doing that.
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21:25
<davidj>
heh
21:26
<sbalneav>
They've got public healthcare there, don't they?
21:26
<davidj>
Real wasabi is really good.
21:26
<warren>
sbalneav: ooh, last night, Eric Harrison nearly killed himself with a capcaisin infused hard liquor sauce. most burning thing he ever tasted.
21:26
<sbalneav>
lol
21:26
Got a little hot under the collar, did he?
21:27
<davidj>
Man, and I seem to remember he has a very high tolerance.
21:27
<warren>
yes, he has no problem with normal hot sauce
21:27
but this was killer
21:27
<sbalneav>
If your back and upper lip aren't sweating, the food's not hot enough :)
21:27
<warren>
I put only one drop of it into my soup and it completely changed the flavor
21:27
<davidj>
I prefer the heat from horseradish and wasabi
21:27
<warren>
He drank half a sake cup
21:27
BAD IDEA
21:27
<sbalneav>
hehehe
21:28
Did he down it in one gulp?
21:28
<warren>
yes
21:28
<sbalneav>
Good man.
21:28
<davidj>
If it feels like you've just been kicked in the back of the head by a mule, it might be strong enough.
21:28
heh
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21:28
<sbalneav>
Got any pictures of your trip online?
21:28
<davidj>
Did you get a picture?
21:28
<warren>
ooh... and a few nights ago we had a HUGE amount of kobe beef
21:28
in Kobe
21:29
Kobe beef is normally too expensive to eat. It has completely ruined all other beef for me now.
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21:29
<warren>
eric has some pictures
21:29
dunno where though
21:30
<sbalneav>
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/4_Kobe_Beef%2C_Kobe_Japan.jpg
21:30
<warren>
read about how they massage the cows and feed them beer
21:30
<sbalneav>
I wish I could oneday go to Japan. I've always wanted to own a REAL go board.
21:30
I play go.
21:31
<davidj>
You play go?
21:31
I wish I knew that last year.
21:31
<sbalneav>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:My_Go_Equipment_3.JPG
21:31
<warren>
http://eharrison.mesd.k12.or.us/gallery/Yao
21:31
<sbalneav>
davidj: You play go too?
21:31
<davidj>
Not well, but yes.
21:32
<sbalneav>
Great game.
21:32
<davidj>
it is.
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21:32
<sbalneav>
Everybody rages on and on about chess, but once you've played go, there's simply no comparison.
21:32
<long go story to follow>
21:33
So, years ago, on my first trip to San Fransisco, I visited the Go club there.
21:33
Met an interesting variety of characters.
21:34
Met Nolan Bushnell, the founder of Atari
21:34
And yes, that's where he got the name from. He was a 3 dan player at that time.
21:34
Played several games with a homeless vietnam vet who learned the game overseas.
21:35
And about 5 games with a "Mr. Ishiki" or "Ishiri" or something like that...
21:35
Kindly old japanese man in his 80's
21:35
No matter how I played, what I did, he'd always beat me by 1 point. Exactly.
21:36
<chupacabra>
sbalneav: that your supybot?
21:36
<davidj>
he
21:36
<sbalneav>
who? ltspbot?
21:36
he's mine
21:36
<chupacabra>
ya
21:36
<sbalneav>
ltspbot: status
21:36
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: I am connected to freenode as ltspbot.
21:36
<chupacabra>
I couldn't get mine to be talkative enough.
21:37
<sbalneav>
So, turns out this nice old guy's like a 9 dan go player, and basically, he can literally manipulate all the sente's to the point where he can always just beat you by one point
21:37
because beating you by more he considered as "impolite".
21:38
He had some of the most awsome moves I'd ever seen.
21:38
Anyway: great game.
21:39
chupacabra: Want me to send you my configs?
21:40
<davidj>
Sounds like fun.
21:45
warren: Please tell Eric we want a picture of him drinking half a sake cup...
21:51
'night, Scotty.
21:51
'night, Warren.
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22:06
<chupacabra>
sbalneav: this one is too quiet for me and where I want to put him but yes, I'd love to peruse some good confog files.
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22:07
<sbalneav>
chupacabra: Where should I mail 'em too
22:07
<chupacabra>
I have one on #amahi in here but he needs to be more proactive.
22:07
linuxlink@gmail.com
22:07
<sbalneav>
He's not quiet, he just doesn't speak until spoken to.
22:07
ltspbot: google ltsp
22:07
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Search took 0.16 seconds: Linux Terminal Server Project: <http://www.ltsp.org/>; Lutheran Theological Seminary at Philadelphia Homepage: <http://www.ltsp.edu/>; Linux Terminal Server Project - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_Terminal_Server_Project>; LTSP - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LTSP>; Linux Terminal (2 more messages)
22:07
<sbalneav>
ltspbot: weather ywg
22:07
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: Error: "weather" is not a valid command.
22:08
<chupacabra>
you keeping Canada honest?
22:08
<sbalneav>
yeah, it's not hard. We're an honest bunch up here :)
22:08
2 seconds, I'll mail 'em
22:08
<chupacabra>
hehe
22:08
no hurry
22:09
redhat says the downturn is good for open source.
22:09
I have to agree.
22:12
<sbalneav>
So do I. Poeople have been putting off moving from XP to Vista. With the downturn, what are they gonna do? Go out and re-buy all their dessktops to be vista capable? Or.... the alternative? :)
22:13
sent
22:20
<johnny>
i can't imagine using adobe reader ever again after using evince
22:21
<chupacabra>
5~5~5~5~5~5~
22:21
scotty that is so true
22:22
you read about the small box cray just put on the market. great ltsp server.
22:23* chupacabra needs to try evince
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22:26
<johnny>
chupacabra, well.. i assume anything based on poppler would be fine
22:27
i'm always impressed at the intersection between pango, cairo and gtk
22:27
those guys are swell
22:28
superduperswell
22:28
<ogra>
hyperswell ?
22:28
<johnny>
morning ogra!
22:28
ogra, sure why not :)
22:29
<ogra>
heh, morning ? right, there was that thing
22:29
<stgraber>
ogra: hmm, you didn't sleep ? :) isn't like 5am your time ?
22:30
<ogra>
5:30
22:30
it was considered that the mobie images should become official in intrepid ... so the build and publishing system needed to be changed
22:31
i'm working since 10am yesterday
22:32
<stgraber>
Sounds like release week :)
22:32
<ogra>
not even that
22:32
its the one before
22:33* ogra is scared of the weekend
22:34
<stgraber>
well at least looking at the number of fix that were included last-minute in RC, the delta between RC and final should be low so we shouldn't have any major issue with final (/me has bad memories of some unionfs issue a while ago ...)
22:34
<ogra>
yeah
22:34
well, i have a good bunch of stuff
22:34
and the madwifi situation is still open
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22:34
<johnny>
ogra, how about the session saving bug in gnome-session
22:34
<stgraber>
hmm, the madwifi vs ath5k thing ?
22:35
<johnny>
is that a big deal for you guys?
22:35
<ogra>
stgraber, right
22:35
johnny, ?
22:35
<stgraber>
johnny: we don't have session saving turned on by default so I haven't seen any problem myself
22:35
<ogra>
session saving bug ?
22:36
we dont even use the session dialogs anymore
22:36
<jammcq>
hey kids
22:37
<johnny>
don't use em?
22:37
do you remove it from the menu or something?
22:37
<ogra>
from the panel
22:38
ubuntu uses a hacked up fusa for logout/power management/screen locking etc
22:38
<johnny>
no.. not that.. i mean under Preferences | Sessions
22:39
i know a lot of folks who are upset about that
22:39
<ogra>
what is with it ?
22:39
<johnny>
you can't choose to save your sessions, it's a regression
22:39
<ogra>
"Remember Currently Running Applications" is the button i see
22:39
<stgraber>
johnny: Options tab: Automatically remember running applications when logging out ?
22:39
<ogra>
and a checkbox above
22:40
<stgraber>
we have that, I don't use it (I don't like session saving) but at least it's there
22:40
<ogra>
no regression here
22:40
<johnny>
guess your folks fixed it :)
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22:41
<sbalneav>
Reinstalling Intrepid
22:41
<ogra>
sure, would be a regression and upset our users, you know ;)
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22:59
<johnny>
good words for our times..
22:59
out of the chaos the future emerges in harmony and beauty -- emma goldman
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23:09
<chupacabra>
sbalneav: thank you.
23:49
johnny: hidy
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