IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 9 July 2007   (all times are UTC)

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06:02
<ecbr>
ola a todos, alguem saber fazer funcionar o scroll do mouse nas estacoes ltsp, quais o parametros que tenho que colocar no lts.conf?
06:06
<cliebow>
ecbr:you will have towait til a Spanish speaker joins the channel..
06:06
<ogra>
ecbr, hey, this is an english channel, afaik ther is #ltsp-br
06:07
so either try english, switch to -br r hopw for a spanish person coming by
06:07
<Q-FUNK>
or that would be brazilian, but never midn that
06:07
which means a funny kind of portuguese
06:08
<cliebow>
vagrantc "might" be able to help..but sonds like you have a scrollmouse problrem
06:08
that looks like Spanish
06:08
8~)
06:08
<Q-FUNK>
portuguese+spanish=lusitanian, anyhow
06:09
almost the same language
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06:13
<cliebow>
guess we scared him...
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06:24
<Q-FUNK>
naa
06:25
he probably just doesn't speak English, poor lad. i'm guessing that he's a sacix user.
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07:19
<cliebow_>
anyone care to give me the quick rundown on bootfromharddisk for "challenged" laptops?
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09:25
<ogra>
hrm, where is jammcq if i need him ...
09:25
<cliebow_>
ogra: any thoughts on pcmcia support in initramfs?
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09:33
<cdealer>
hey... what you think about using a QuadCore Xeon 1.60ghz/L2-2x4mb - 8GB DDR2 667mhz - 2x320GB SATA (RAID) for 60Clients?
09:34
<gvy>
sata will suck badly
09:34
if you ever get down to it with i/o
09:35
i'd get dualcore or dual cpu system, maybe opteron not woodcrest, but at least 2x SCSI/SAS as a disk subsystem
09:35
<cdealer>
gvy... scsi ?
09:35
Hmmm
09:35
the problem is the price that are very high
09:36
<gvy>
raid1 of course (may be softraid but neccessary for reliability when you're gonna lose 60 users' data if anything)
09:36
cdealer, i've bought used 73g 10k for less than $50 this morning
09:36
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: ebay ?
09:36
<gvy>
and ebay prices are pure disaster (in that they're not accessible here)
09:37
not ebay but also second hand
09:37
cdealer, last time i've checked "opteron" in 19" servers on ebay.com there were 4-core (2x2) systems between $1000 and $2000
09:37
in northern america and australia
09:37
last week or so
09:38
btw quad-core xeons aren't even close to twice as good as 51xx...
09:38
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: im talking from brazil... here SCSI are a very expensive ... here the server I was looking for are all about 20K (U$9k)
09:38
<gvy>
only 1.5x, something like that
09:39
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: but you think 8gb of memory could handle 60 Clients?
09:39
<gvy>
cdealer, i wouldn't spend premium money on NEW&IMPROVED cpus :)
09:39
cdealer, i'm rather sure it could -- got hp proliant with 8x sas raid, 4 opteron cores and 8 gigs
09:40
it's gonna run 30 clients on half of the memory and half of the disks
09:40
the problem with sata is that it doesn't really handle parallel i/o :(
09:41
you could remedy that a bit by using xfs for heavy-duty filesystems but then some smart UPS *and* upsd are a neccessity
09:41
<cdealer>
Hmmm interesting... looking btw it could realy become a problem
09:41
I must say that in the first look I was thinking that the memory would be a problem... now Im seeing that it could drop to the disks...
09:42
<gvy>
yup
09:42
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: let me see a good proliant option them
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09:43
<gvy>
cpu *number* might become a problem if you're getting looping processes but otherwise our office server (desktop X2 4400+) is doing fine for 5 clients with ca. 1gb ram dedicated to those
09:43
that includes 3 different browsers and 2 different desktops in use :)
09:43
and browsers tend to be heavily tabbed
09:43
<blinky_ghost>
hi can anybody tell me how do I costumize login window on ldm?
09:44
<gvy>
and that system is working as a build server as well (on separate disks: ide for package archive, scsi for actual build VPSes)
09:44
that's all stuffed into an openvz on altlinux. :)
09:45
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: I have 3 proliants with QuadCore Xeon (2 processor each) and 4gb of memory each (maximum amount of each board) and 2 200GB SCSI disks (6 disks total)
09:45
<gvy>
cdealer, btw here it's sata soft raid1, another installation with 10 clients is currently sata raid1 too (gonna provide separate disks for more clients planned -- up to 40 there)
09:46
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: you think that one of those box could handle 60 clients of the memory could be a problem ?
09:46
<gvy>
cdealer, can you try load tests on those? e.g. hook up 10 or 30 clients and look what happens?
09:47
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: no.. because the ltsp its to be implemented ... they are being used as firewall, oracle and samba
09:47
<gvy>
cdealer, might handle but then environment should be highly reusable with the whole set of apps running minimized as possible
09:47
e.g. no different browsers
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09:48
<gvy>
and preferably no heavy use of browser windows/tabs -- that tends to eat up most individual ram...
09:48
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: the users will use the system only for internet (firefox), office apps and stuff like that (messengers too)
09:48
<sbalneav>
Morning all
09:48* gvy . o O ( 2xquad xeon as a firewall?! sure nice use )
09:48
<gvy>
sbalneav, ! :)
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09:48
<sbalneav>
Morning vagrantc
09:49
<vagrantc>
mornin
09:49
<gvy>
cdealer, firefox tends to er... well if not leak then draw decent amount of memory
09:49
<sbalneav>
On a train yet?
09:49
<gvy>
if it's not possible to rip at least couple more gigs into ltsp system then you might have to resort to tricks like disabling firefox2 in-memory page caching
09:50
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: the big problem is that they are already at the maximum of memory (4gb) ... =( I think about using a grid with these 3boxes
09:50
<vagrantc>
sbalneav: no, a few hours yet
09:50
<gvy>
both memory cache and pre-rendered pages (it's how they made backward/forward that fast)
09:50
cdealer, grid will help little i'm afraid
09:50
the problem is when you run a bunch of apps, one part of memory consumption is at least one copy of each + libs
09:51
<cliebow_>
sbalneav, any thoughts on pcmcia support in the initramfs?
09:51
<gvy>
the other is per-user non-COW data
09:51
with a few systems you're eating up the first part N times
09:52
cdealer, personally i'd try as possible to either get one system upped on ram, or exchanged for anything e.g. 2x2 core but 8 gigs
09:52
<ogra>
vagrantc, where do you go ?
09:52
<vagrantc>
ogra: portland
09:52
<sbalneav>
cliebow_: Well, there IS support for pcmcia in the initramfs.
09:52* gvy hails ogra, cliebow and vagrantc
09:52
<ogra>
vagrantc, oh, i thought you are already there
09:53
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: you see... I have 3 good servers and Im stuck with the memory thing... will be very expensive to buy other server box only for the memory
09:53* cliebow_ cliebow waves back 8~)
09:53* ogra waves
09:53
<vagrantc>
ogra: well, it's only about 2000 miles from here
09:53
<ogra>
pfft
09:53
2000 miles ...
09:53
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: I will see what I can do.. thanks =)
09:53
<gvy>
cdealer, well try with one, maybe i'm overly pessimistic
09:53
<ogra>
sbalneav, do you have any clue where i could find a license for the sis oss driver ? the tgz on the wiki doesnt have any trace
09:53
<sbalneav>
cliebow_: I guess the question is: what ISN'T working, that you wish was?
09:54
<gvy>
cdealer, but altlinux is quite optimized for memory consumption: we have -Wl,--as-needed as default gcc (thus linker) options and the campaign against library bloat is like year long already
09:54
<sbalneav>
Which, the kernel driver?
09:54
<ogra>
i pathed it and have it running, it could go into gutsy ... but not unlicensed
09:54
<sbalneav>
Morning ogra, btw
09:54
<ogra>
sbalneav, yeah
09:54
<gvy>
it really did help with lowering memory footprint
09:54
<ogra>
afternoon :)
09:54
its getting cloudy in london
09:55
<sbalneav>
I thought everything that was in the kernel was gpl2 licensed, or is this an external driver?
09:55
<ogra>
but the view is awesome :)
09:55
sbalneav, no idea, its on the ltsp wiki
09:55
<sbalneav>
heh
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09:55
<ogra>
it was never in the kernel officially though
09:55
<sbalneav>
ok
09:55* gvy . o O ( ogra w4r3z d00d )
09:55
<sbalneav>
then I'm not sure.
09:56
<ogra>
kylem just said he could write an alsa variant of that within a week
09:56
hmm
09:56
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: so you think that maybe 4gb could handle(64mb per user) ?
09:56
<sbalneav>
That'd be the way to go.
09:56
<cliebow_>
sbalneav:just contemplating my pile of old laptops..wondering whether i could dump kernel on the hard drive and use pcmcia cards..
09:57
<ogra>
i wonder if BenC would kill me if i steal kyle for a week :)
09:57
<gvy>
cdealer, it's not "per user"
09:57
<sbalneav>
cliebow_: I guess the thing to do would be to TRY it and see :)
09:57
ogra: I think you're bigger than benc, IIRC, so I bet you could take him in a fight. :)
09:58
<cliebow_>
i thought i;d stick damnsmall on it and point to the ubuntu kernel
09:58
<gvy>
it's like 300 or 400 megs "for all" (sum of one copy of apps/libs size) and the rest is "per user"
09:58
<ogra>
sbalneav, well, he forgot his poker set ... i'd have good chances to "win" kyle for a week :)
09:58
<sbalneav>
lol
09:59
<gvy>
cdealer, even without that baseline, i'm afraid it resembles 1--2 firefox windows/tabs at a time -- if you go more or less actively swapping on the same drives as user data and software you're in deep trouble...
09:59
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: so... to avoid problems I will search for a good mb that supports 16gb of ram and use it
09:59
<ogra>
cliebow, well, you could put the whole squashfs image pus kernel on the client (from gutsy) its only 120M for the image plus the space for the kernel
09:59
s/pus/plus/
09:59
<gvy>
cdealer, probably yes
10:00
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: I have processor to spare and disk too... the only botleneck is the memory...
10:00
<vagrantc>
ogra: i think you should be clear when reporting on debian bugs, and you're referring to features, to mention that the versions you're talking about are from ubuntu
10:00
<gvy>
cdealer, ram and disk subsystem are more important for the majority of things to do with a server
10:00
<cdealer>
Im going to lunch... later im back
10:00
<ogra>
vagrantc, with the assumption that you sync eventually
10:00
<gvy>
we do HPC so i know a bit of when it's not exactly so too :)
10:00
<ogra>
debian is at 5.0.8 afaik
10:00
<vagrantc>
5.0.8debian2
10:01
<ogra>
i'm about to release 5.0.21
10:01
i just added the x config stuff to my tree
10:01
<vagrantc>
but there isn't really a direct correlation between ubuntu versions and debian versions, since there really isn't an upstream
10:01
<ogra>
i'll put (ubuntu) to the versions in the future
10:02
<gvy>
btw... ogra, should we submit altlinux scripts and a few occasional minor patches as well?
10:02
<vagrantc>
frequently the debian version includes patches from newer ubuntu versions, and sometimes vice-versa
10:02
<ogra>
gvy, if you make changes that should be upstream, please do :)
10:02
<gvy>
seems i've underbothered a person working on it here :)
10:02
<ogra>
vagrantc, yep, understood, i'll make that clearer
10:03
<vagrantc>
ogra: like, for example, the 5.0.8debian2 version includes the unencrypted LDM support
10:04
<ogra>
and the new ldm ?
10:04
<vagrantc>
no
10:04
<cliebow_>
ogra:i'm a gonna give it a whirl...
10:04
<vagrantc>
haven't had any luck with the new ldm
10:04
<ogra>
hmm
10:04
weird
10:05
it works just fine here
10:05
<vagrantc>
i'm not really sure what to try ... it seems to log in and start a session, yet the login screen respawns simultaneously
10:05
with only the patches in the gutsy branch
10:07
<ogra>
thats really stranfe
10:07
*strange
10:07
<cliebow_>
ogra:will you clarify the role of squashfs for me...it ends up being the rootfilesystem?
10:07
<ogra>
for me it starts the ssh tunnel and then starts a second ssh client that runs the session over the socket
10:07
cliebow, yep
10:07
well
10:08
squashfs+unionfs="/"
10:08
<cliebow_>
k
10:08
<vagrantc>
squashfs+tmpfs+unionfs, no?
10:08
<ogra>
unionfs mounts a ramfs and merges that with the squashfs
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10:09
<ogra>
right, what vagrantc said
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10:09
<cliebow_>
thank you...
10:12
<vagrantc>
or ... unionfs(squashfs+tmpfs)="/"
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10:14
<EXP__>
how i can write zdsk file to floppy, when i have usb floppy drive?
10:14
<vagrantc>
ogra: when do you hit portland?
10:15
<ogra>
my itinary says july 21 20:14
10:16
after hanging around for four hours on philadelphia before
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10:19* ogra starts to like this office ....
10:19
<ogra>
bzr push took less than 5 seconds :)
10:20* ogra just added the new X config script
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11:01
<ukasz>
hi
11:01
<gvy>
dzen dobry
11:01
<ukasz>
i have a problem with indirect option
11:01
witam:)
11:01
gvy znasz sie cos ?
11:02
gvy: mam problem
11:02
<gvy>
ukasz, well, i don't really speak polish :-)
11:02
<ukasz>
moze mi pomozesz
11:02
aha
11:02
:P
11:02
lol
11:02
<gvy>
mozhe, ale krashe english :-)
11:02
<ukasz>
are you polish ?
11:02* gvy lives in ukraine and travels carpathians at times
11:02
<gvy>
nope, russian
11:02
<ukasz>
aha
11:02
ok so let me say what is the problem
11:03
when i write in SCREEN_07=startx -indirect 192.168.2.225 it shows me a chooser witch x servers but i can not log in to anyone
11:04
when i do alt+ctrl+backspace it is restarting x and shows me the chooser again
11:05
when i write SCREEN_07=startx and XDM_SERVER=192.168.2.225 i don't have chooser but i can log into the x server. but when i do alt+ctrl+backspace it sends me to console
11:06
gvy: any idea
11:06
?
11:06
<gvy>
hm
11:06
what ltsp flavour is it?
11:06
<ukasz>
oh i have ltsp v5 and debian
11:06
<gvy>
did you want X -query 192.168.2.225?
11:07
<ukasz>
when i have indirect option i have gray screen with black X in the middle
11:07
<gvy>
it's X started but w/o apps (including display/window manager)
11:07
<ukasz>
my goal is to bot thin clients and let the choose the x server. and whenever thay will do alt+ctrl+backspace it will send them to the chooser
11:08
<vagrantc>
ukasz: do you have a chooser configured ?
11:08
ukasz: -indirect requires that you configure the chooser
11:09
<ukasz>
well let me paste my gdm.conf but i forgot the aste site
11:09* vagrantc doesn't actually remember how to configure the chooser
11:09
<gvy>
ukasz, pastebin.ca
11:10* gvy never used multiple dms even if there are two in lan right now
11:10
<vagrantc>
!pastebot
11:10
<ltspbot`>
vagrantc: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
11:11
<ukasz>
http://pastebin.ca/610674
11:12
it is gdm.conf on an x server not on ltsp server
11:12
<gvy>
here in kdm.conf, there's a commented out sample line:
11:12
#ChooserHosts=*,ugly,sky,dino,kiste.local,login.crap.com
11:12
you have gdm on *clients*?
11:13
that is, terminals
11:13
<ukasz>
gdm on ltsp and on x server
11:13
<gvy>
s/kdm.conf/kdmrc/
11:14
<vagrantc>
ukasz: what do you mean by x server ?
11:15
<ukasz>
server with installed applications and xdcmp enablem
11:15
<gvy>
X server is a process which is physically accessing videocard and input devices
11:15
thus on a terminal
11:16
<vagrantc>
that's why i asked
11:16
<gvy>
"LTSP server" is an "application server"
11:16
<ogra>
well
11:16
not really ...
11:16
its a bootserver as well
11:16
<gvy>
not neccessarily :)
11:17cyberorg has quit IRC
11:17
<ogra>
well, both or either ;)
11:17
<gvy>
some PXE implementations i've stumbled on would ignore next-server and thus force me to put tftpd near (pre-existing) dhcpd ;(
11:17
<ukasz>
but my goal is to boot thin clients from ltsp server and then "send" them to a diffrent server witch has installed gdm gnome desktop etc. and to enable my clients to choose between application servers
11:18
<gvy>
ukasz, well... if they don't really need to choose each time you could bind them by mac addresses
11:18* ogra wouldnt even know if -indirect is respected by the startx script ... nobody really cares for XDMCP in ltsp5 ... so it might be broken
11:19
<ogra>
even though i think since we just use the startx script from 4.x unmodified it probably should work
11:19
<gvy>
e.g. form two subnets with different options passed
11:19
<ukasz>
as i written before. if i do that it client will get a login prompt and will login,but will return to console whenever it pushes ctrl alt backspace.
11:20
<ogra>
err
11:20
thats kind of expected ?
11:20
oh, wait, to console you say ? ... no, that isnt
11:20
<ukasz>
yes that it what i mean
11:21
<ogra>
probabyl the startx script is broken then
11:21
<ukasz>
ofcourse that hapen if i supply XDM_SERVER option in lts.conf
11:21
<ogra>
but as i said, we dont really focus on any of the insecure stuff
11:21
<ukasz>
so what do you suppouse?
11:22
<cliebow_>
ogra:ya think everything in /var/lib/tftpboot with a 2.6.22-7-386 should be moved to an old lappie to boot from?
11:22
<ogra>
cliebow, hmm
11:22
likely ...
11:22
<cliebow_>
cant hurt anyway..
11:22
<ogra>
you will somehow need to tell the system to actually boot that :)
11:22
<cliebow_>
like grub?
11:22
<ogra>
i.e. make a manual grub setup
11:23
<cliebow_>
i put damsmall on there..so i can tweak menu.lst..
11:23
<ukasz>
hmm i have problems with this ltsp ever since.
11:23
but i really want it
11:24
please help
11:24
<vagrantc>
the startx script doesn't respawn
11:24
so if you kill the X server, that's it.
11:25
<ukasz>
ok i will coppy the startx sript from the official site
11:25
<vagrantc>
once we get support for multiple login servers in LDM, i think we can say goodbye to XDMCP
11:25
<sbalneav>
I think we were using inittab before to run the screen_session script, so when it dies, init would respawn.
11:25
<vagrantc>
ukasz: it's the same script
11:26
like sbalneav said
11:26
<sbalneav>
We're not spawning it from init anymore, so it's kind of a one shot deal.
11:26
I agree with vagrant, getting multi-host login going in ldm2's the way to go.
11:26
<vagrantc>
i wrote some code in the sdm screen script to use "daemon" to respawn it. could do the same for startx
11:27
<cliebow_>
ogra: where does the squashfs live?
11:27
<ogra>
in /opt/ltsp/images
11:27
<cliebow_>
aha
11:27
<ogra>
/opt/ltsp/images/i386.img to be precise
11:28
<cliebow_>
Wow!
11:29
<ogra>
well, respawning from init i hard without init :)
11:29
*is
11:29
<ukasz>
vagrantc: use sdm ?
11:30
<vagrantc>
ukasz: no, but there's code in the sdm screen script to respawn that you could use to modify the "startx" script.
11:30
<cliebow_>
heh!'][
11:34
<ukasz>
ok i vagrantc: i do get a login prompt on ltsp server and when i choose "run xdcmp chooser" i get a list of servers and i can login and alt ctrl backspace doesn't return me to console
11:34
i am not a programmer (the good one) what should i modiffy ?
11:38
<sbalneav>
ukasz: You'd want to look at the /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib/ltsp/screen.d/startx file
11:38
tell me when you've got it open.
11:39efra has quit IRC
11:40
<ltsppbot>
"ukasz" pasted "startx" (186 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/208
11:41
<ukasz>
sbalneav: it is on http://pastebot.ltsp.org/208 what should i moddify ?
11:41
<sbalneav>
Lets try this.
11:41
Go down to line 167, just above the line that says:
11:41
if [ -w /proc/progress ]; then
11:42
Insert a line that says:
11:42
while /bin/true; do
11:42
Then, at the very end of the file
11:42
after the "fi"
11:42
add a line that says:
11:42
done
11:43
I have no idea if it will work, but it's worth a try.
11:43
restart the workstation, and see if you get the desired behavior.
11:43FernandoMM has joined #ltsp
11:45* ogra stares out the window ... seeing a big thunderstorm approach while sitting in 27th floor is slightly exciting
11:45
<sbalneav>
Where are you?
11:47
<ogra>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tallest_buildings_and_structures_in_London
11:47muh2000 has joined #ltsp
11:47
<ogra>
in number 17
11:47
<sbalneav>
Whatcha doin' in London?
11:47
debconf?
11:48
<ogra>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millbank_Tower
11:48
sitting in the canonical office ...
11:48
(distro development sprint)
11:48
<cliebow_>
it is not raining up is it?
11:48
<sbalneav>
Ah, cool.
11:48
<ogra>
its still below clouds ....
11:48
<ukasz>
sbalneav: it din't work. i have XDM_SERVER=192.168.2.225 ( witch is a diffrent computer than ltsp) and it din't send me to it
11:48
<ogra>
ugh
11:48
<ukasz>
:(
11:48
<ogra>
thunder
11:49
<cliebow_>
Cool@!
11:49
that is actually a popular expletive in Maine..
11:49
<sbalneav>
ukasz: My patch doesn't do anything for that, it was for hitting ctrl-alt-backspace, and re-starting.
11:49
Does it fix that?
11:50efra has joined #ltsp
11:51
<ukasz>
sbalneav: it doesn't. i couldn't log into 192.168.225. just to a ltsp server
11:52
<ogra>
does it restart if you hit ctrl-alt-backspace ?
11:53
<ukasz>
yes it does
11:53
<sbalneav>
ok
11:53
<ogra>
so the fix works
11:53
<sbalneav>
You bet.
11:54
<ogra>
:)
11:54
<gvy>
he sprints. :)
11:54
<ogra>
we really need that selection mode for ldm ...
11:54
<sbalneav>
As for logging into other servers, I'd have to know more about your network.
11:54
<ogra>
but i doubt thats doable in time for gutsy
11:54* gvy . o O ( and a userlist? )
11:54
<ogra>
gvy, hrd to do
11:54
*hard
11:54
<sbalneav>
Not on my todo list.
11:54
<gvy>
ogra, yep, we discussed that in short
11:55
either separate daemon or pre-created pseudo user for ssh transport seems needed
11:55
<ogra>
we'll surely have such a thing some day if we just easily can query an ldap server
11:55
gvy, neither will pass any security review :)
11:55
<gvy>
er... tossing (open)ldap in might be problematic
11:56
<ogra>
why ?
11:56
<sbalneav>
Why do you need a userlist?
11:56
<ogra>
we'll need that anyway at some point for local apps
11:56
<gvy>
ogra, well pseudo might do but that brings in another problem, either it's created same-time-same-place or manually synced... which is not pretty
11:57
<ogra>
gvy, that would bring various other probs
11:57
<sbalneav>
Out for lunch. Back later
11:57
<gvy>
sbalneav, 'cause users would have a hard time typing their usernames correctly in the larger deployments i've seen :o(
11:57
ogra, sure, that's why i didn't even try to demand that
11:57
(as if i'd demand anything for free anyways, heh :)
11:58
<sbalneav>
Question: if they can't type in a username, how they gonna type in a password? :)
11:58* ogra has seen a 2000 user windows NT4 deployment ... and has never seen problems with users not remembering their own names :)
11:58
<sbalneav>
out
11:58
<gvy>
ogra, that is, thanks for sync, if we come up with any sane ideas, i'll sync back :)
11:58
<ogra>
gvy, the way ldm works now, you would have a control tunnel owned by the pseudo user that breaks security completely
11:59
<gvy>
(to sbalneav's back) well if it's "1" they could
11:59
<ogra>
user lists are possible ... but i dont think its doable in a sane way without using ldap
11:59
<gvy>
ogra, that might mean another connection; but requiring ldap for that sounds definitely more sane
12:00
<ukasz>
ok guys any idea how to do that damm chooser ?
12:00
<ogra>
gvy, if its "1" youre better off to define autologin per workstation :)
12:00
<gvy>
ogra, users would sometimes roam though (i'm not even making this up!)
12:00
<vagrantc>
i think some sort of autologin that uses the host or ip address by default would be sane.
12:01
<gvy>
the problem was the difference: some departments would be more smart, and some... erm... less
12:01
well, that could save a day in some situation, again...
12:01
<vagrantc>
the way sdm works, is if you specify a username, it uses that, and if you don't specify a username, it defaults to hostname
12:01
<gvy>
btw is there any sort of "use case" pake on wiki that such stuff could be dumped onto?
12:01
i mean, what works, what doesn't, and in between
12:02
s/pake/page/
12:02
<vagrantc>
and, if they don't specify a username, it can be configured to log into a different server
12:02spectra has quit IRC
12:02
<vagrantc>
so you can have all your anonymous accounts on a different machine
12:03
wouldn't be too hard to get similar behavior in LDM
12:04
<ogra>
vagrantc, if you have any idea how to avoid the screen flashing for my commit 386 that would be great
12:04
<ukasz>
what do you do when u have to put severall applicatin servers ? one is not enough ? how does your lts.conf look like ?
12:04
<ogra>
i played with chvt a bunch but that just avoids that the user sees white text on tty1
12:05
X flashing three times before starting up *feels* strange ...
12:06
<vagrantc>
ogra: this is just the new x configuration stuff?
12:06
<ogra>
vagrantc, yup
12:06
http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ltsp/gutsy-ltsp/revision/ogra%40ubuntu.com-20070709151737-1o1kndd0or2ktdg4?start_revid=ogra%40ubuntu.com-20070709151737-1o1kndd0or2ktdg4
12:06
http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ltsp/gutsy-ltsp/annotate/ogra%40ubuntu.com-20070709151737-1o1kndd0or2ktdg4?start_revid=ogra%40ubuntu.com-20070709151737-1o1kndd0or2ktdg4&file_id=configurex.sh-20070709151557-6ft3udkgno192vxg-1
12:06
these two
12:06
(second is the new file)
12:07
i've put a clear at the top and bottom for now
12:07
<vagrantc>
ukasz: i haven't set it up with LTSP yet.
12:07
<ogra>
but tats not the proper solution
12:10
<gvy>
ukasz, i'd basically start reading up on xdmcp and chooser... if it's not a well walked path
12:11
and that might get you into sort of development
12:11
or at least fixing up something in a part of a project that's considered un(der)maintained and untested (xdmcp is that with ltsp5)
12:12
that might be not that scary as it sounds... especially when you do need the result
12:12
ukasz, but you might also want to formulate the initial problem, not the way you currently see a solution
12:13
<ogra>
gvy, XDMCP should die
12:13
we're workig ard to get ldm feature comlete to completely replace it
12:13
<vagrantc>
and until we can replicate all of the functionality of it, it won't die.
12:13efra has quit IRC
12:14
<ogra>
putting time into XDMCP is a waste imho ... but we wont refuse sent in patches indeed :)
12:14
<vagrantc>
agreed :)
12:15efra has joined #ltsp
12:15
<gvy>
ogra, i don't disagree
12:16
but i oppose the "break it and maybe some day create a robust alternative" in devel@altlinux all too often...
12:16
even on a "default permissions" (especially changing them) side
12:16
you see, we employ control(8) originating from Owl, and perms on critical stuff like suid binaries are usually kept very restricted in the package
12:17
but brought to some reasonable state by control script
12:17spectra has joined #ltsp
12:17
<gvy>
so that there's no race with loosening perms up between snapshotting e.g. /bin/su state before package upgrade and restoring it afterwards automatically
12:18
but sometimes things would get tightened up without control script :-/
12:19
oh well, that's rather for security-obsessed distros like owl or alt. :)
12:20
<ogra>
gvy, we dont break it ... its just not cared for ... for 90% of the cases we have ldm is fine as is
12:20* vagrantc finds ldm lacking
12:20
<ogra>
fo the other 10 you still have the XDMCP script there
12:20
<gvy>
ogra, again, i don't disagree :-)
12:21
<ogra>
vagrantc, ldm2 will change that a lot
12:21cdealer has left #ltsp
12:21cdealer has joined #ltsp
12:22
<ogra>
vagrantc, i'm having some basic code for automatic printer detection at home :) ldm2 makes that trivial ...
12:22
also having shutdown/reboot options in the desktop to affect the client wont be any prob anymore
12:23
<gvy>
that sounds interesting, 'cause currently on todo
12:23
<ogra>
the communication has improved so much that we're probably even able to have hal only seeing the client HW in an ltsp session
12:24
thats why i pushed so hard for implementing everythng client side
12:24
(everything session related in mean indeed)
12:26
gvy, well, have a look at he new ldm code :)
12:27
it spawns an ssh tunnel independently of the session ... with a socket attached to it ...
12:27
now everything you exectute like ssh -S <socketname> <command> will be executed as the user you are logged in on the server
12:28
so the X session is actually started like that ...
12:28
the socket persists for the duration of the session ...
12:29
so adding a udev script that checks for the socket existance and then runs gnome-printer-manager through that tunell in the users session is trivial
12:30
(an udev script that reacts on plugging in printers indeed)
12:30
<gvy>
ogra, again, is there ldm[2] page on wiki? i'd add this there
12:30
<ogra>
indeed thas limited to usb printers atm ... but i guess you understand the principle ...
12:30
gvy, nope
12:30
<gvy>
yup
12:30
<ogra>
feel free to create one
12:31meduxa has joined #ltsp
12:31
<ogra>
anyway, everybody seems to leave the office here ... i think i'll join so i dont have to walk alone to the hotel
12:34
<gvy>
thanks, and good night :-)
12:36irule has quit IRC
12:40
<ukasz>
your wiki site is nice but where i can find how to configure ldm ??
12:43
<gvy>
ogra, http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LDM (autolinked from http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/IntegratingLtsp)
12:45
<sbalneav>
ukasz: Perhaps you could tell us a bit how your network's laid out?
12:45
The startx script may work for you, depending on how you've got things set up.
12:46
<ukasz>
i have one server and my workstation. and ofcourse a thin client. on server i have installed ltsp nfs and dhcp. on workstation i have debian with gnome
12:48
<sbalneav>
On the server, do you have two nics? I.e. does the thin client hang off the server, or are these two servers you want to speak to and the client on one common network?
12:49
<ukasz>
on the server (it is also a router) i have 2 nics. everything (client workstation and server) resides on one physical network
12:50
<sbalneav>
ok, you say you've only got one server.
12:50
So how are you expecting the chooser to work, via -indirect?
12:50ogra has quit IRC
12:51
<ukasz>
yes but the reason why i want the chooser is that i have a job to configure several application servers.
12:51
yes via indirect
12:51
<sbalneav>
ok, but RIGHT NOW you only have one box listening via XDMCP, right?
12:52
<ukasz>
yes
12:52
<sbalneav>
Have you configured the xdmcp on that server with "allow-indirect"?
12:53
<ukasz>
yes
12:53
<sbalneav>
How?
12:53
<ukasz>
in gdm.conf
12:53irule has joined #ltsp
12:53
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: we come to a conclusion: 2xQuadXeon 1.60Ghz - 2x4MB L2 - 1066mhz / 2x200GB SCSI / 16GB DDR2 667mhz / 2xGigabyte NIC ... up to 70 Thinclients ... what do you think ?
12:54
<ltsppbot>
"ukasz" pasted "gdm.conf" (3 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/209
12:54
<ukasz>
sbalneav: line above shows my gdm.conf on my workstation
12:55
<sbalneav>
Did you do this in the gdm.conf, or gdm.conf.custom?
12:55
This is on debian?
12:55
<ukasz>
yes debian
12:55
in gdm.conf
12:56
<sbalneav>
I believe you want to make those changes in gdm.conf-custom.
12:57
vagrantc: That's where gdm does custom setup now, correct?
12:57
<vagrantc>
not sure the exact name, but something like that
12:57
<ukasz>
i don't have that file. i have debian sid on workstation
12:57
<gvy>
cdealer, there's no 200GB SCSI, 73/146
12:57
<vagrantc>
if there's two nics ... is the workstation on a different network ?
12:58
i also don't think XDMCP works across NAT, but i could be wrong.
12:58
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: they are 183gb
12:58
<gvy>
cdealer, should do but quads are pretty expensive here -- i'd prefer 2x5150 or 5160, or two opterons 275+
12:58
<sbalneav>
It won't, but my reading of his network was that what we're interested in is all on one side of the router.
12:58
<ukasz>
one nic is connected to a dsl modem and second to my private network
12:59
<sbalneav>
ukasz: lets do thisL
12:59
<vagrantc>
ah, got it./
12:59
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: We already have the SCSI disks and the Xeon processors we will take from those 3 proliants we have here =D
12:59
<sbalneav>
netstat -an | grep :177
12:59
<gvy>
cdealer, that means that i prefer 2x2.66/3.00 to 4x1.66 since that improves peak single-thread performance
12:59
cdealer, ah
12:59
well should be still all good
12:59
<sbalneav>
ukasz: Please paste the output of that command
13:00
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: we are thinking about buying the intel S5000VSA or intel S5000PSL MB who can support 16GB of ram
13:01
<gvy>
cdealer, if at all possible, try an upgrade/trade-in
13:01
those mobos are pretty expensive =/ and with hp i'd not be surprised with custom sized ones
13:01
<ukasz>
udp6 0 0 :::177 :::*
13:01
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: well... this hp thing is something we are afraid...
13:02
<gvy>
cdealer, that is, from manager's pov it's safer to try and give one box and some money for another box
13:02
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: direct with HP ?
13:03* gvy is facing similar trouble: www.linux.kiev.ua asks for upgrade, can do homegrown 19" with desktop guts and scsi or pay 1.5x as much and buy 19" prebuilt server...
13:03
<sbalneav>
ok, so it's listening. So, you do an XF_ARGS="-indirect w.x.y.z", and it won't connect?
13:03
<gvy>
cdealer, with someone who sold you these three i guess
13:03
it's not that cheap hardware they shouldn't treat you at least with some respect and it's also not that old not to re-sell
13:04
<ukasz>
no i do SCREEN_07=startx -indirect x.y.z.s
13:04
<sbalneav>
That's wrong, I think
13:04
Do a "SCREEN_07=startx"
13:04
<ukasz>
ok i am trying now
13:04
<cdealer>
[gvy]:: the problem is that every new buy must be done through an audiction
13:04
<sbalneav>
XF_ARGS=" -indirect x.y.z.s"
13:05
Ah, no
13:05
wait that should be fine, was misreading the script.
13:05
<gvy>
cdealer, i don't know your details, and i don't tell that's feasible... situations do differ
13:06
<sep>
how is ldm called ? what's running screen.d/ldm ?
13:06
<sbalneav>
So, the startx doesn't connect, or just gives you a grey X on the screen?
13:06
<gvy>
although here folks who are on budget and buy sparingly somehow don't yet buy quads(-on-a-chip). :)
13:06
<sbalneav>
sep: SCREEN_07=ldm
13:07
<ukasz>
please w8
13:12
<sep>
and ltsp-client reads in this variable
13:13
<sbalneav>
sep: well, the client uses that variable to determine what screen script to run on tty7
13:16
<sep>
so when that variable is missing, where would i look ? what's responsible of setting it ?
13:16
<vagrantc>
sep: from the ltsp-client init scripts
13:17
sep: /usr/lib/ltsp/ltsp_config
13:17
<sbalneav>
sep: By default, if none is specified, it defaults to ldm
13:17
<vagrantc>
sep: that's what sets the variables
13:18
<ukasz>
sbalneav: now i have something messed up. i don't have the chooser
13:19
<sbalneav>
what DO you have?
13:20
<sep>
i'm working on http://bugs.skolelinux.no/1210, ldm starts fine on the stock install. but does not start after ltsp-make-client have run. and i have the default debian-edu lts.conf (that works prior to using make-ltsp-client)
13:21
sound=y localdev=y and networkswap
13:23
<sbalneav>
So, if you blow away the /opt/ltsp chroot, and rebuild it with ltsp-build-client, ldm won't restart?
13:23
<ukasz>
sbalneav: now i have normal login window. without the chooser
13:23
<sep>
seams ltsp_config don't set SCREEN_07=ldm if there is a configured displaymanager
13:23
and ltsp-make-client installs kdm
13:23
<sbalneav>
ukasz: ok, but you've only got ONE box doing xdmcp, right?
13:23
you won't get the chooser unless there's TWO or more boxes on the network offering XDMCP.
13:24
<ukasz>
yes
13:24
<sbalneav>
yes, what?
13:24
<ukasz>
no that is not true
13:24
<sep>
sbalneav, if i rebuilt the ltsp chroot as a thinclient only i expect it would work as expected.
13:24
<ukasz>
i can run an xdcmp chooser from my own computer
13:26
<sep>
just wondered when ltsp_config changed. since i am prettu sure it did set SCRREN_07 in the sarge version even with a dm installed
13:26mopey has quit IRC
13:26
<ukasz>
i can run an xdcmp chooser from my thin client only when i get a standard login and then go to operations and run xdcmp chooser
13:27
<sbalneav>
Well, what's your remote greeter set to in gdm?
13:27
You probably want to set it to gdmchooser instead of gdmgreeter or gdmlogin.
13:27
<sep>
vagrantc, it we set SCREEN_07=ldm manually in lts.conf will it break anything else ?
13:28
<vagrantc>
sep: shouldn't
13:28
<ukasz>
i havestandart cgreeter
13:28
<vagrantc>
sep: ah.
13:28
<sep>
any chance that ltsp_config will revert to setting SCRREN_07=ldm even with a configured dm installed ?
13:28
<vagrantc>
sep: i think i know what's happening.
13:28
<ukasz>
you mean on myworkstation ?
13:28
<sep>
we realy want to release terra soonish :)
13:28
<sbalneav>
ukasz: RemoteGreeter=/usr/lib/gdm/gdmchooser
13:28
<vagrantc>
sep: if you have a display manager installed, it defaults to that.
13:29
<sep>
vagrantc, didn't use to.
13:29
<vagrantc>
sep: this is with your thin-client + workstation all in the same chroot ?
13:29
<sep>
yes
13:29
<vagrantc>
sep: it's been that way for quite some time.
13:29
<sep>
havent played with this since sarge released :)
13:29
<sbalneav>
hmm
13:29
no, that doesn't seem right.
13:30
<sep>
ltsp_cleint say if [ "$display_manager_configured" = "true" ]; then
13:30
# Do nothing, these daemons (xdm, gdm, kdm, wdm, etc.) should configure themselves.
13:30
<sbalneav>
Dunno. Been so long since I've dealt with choosers.
13:30
<sep>
and with kdm installed that's obviously true
13:31
<vagrantc>
sep: if you modify /etc/X11/default-display-manager
13:31
sep: but then you'll have to configure kdm to ignore that
13:31
<ukasz>
sbalneav: maybe i can do what i want with ldm ?
13:31FernandoMM has quit IRC
13:32
<sbalneav>
ukasz: ldm currently doesn't support multiple hosts.
13:32
<sep>
well just as long as it works.
13:32
<sbalneav>
It will on the next version.
13:33
<ukasz>
when it will be released (just curious)
13:33
?
13:33
<vagrantc>
sep: well, now you know where it's breaking ...
13:33
<ukasz>
where should i put the RemoteGreeter=/usr/lib/gdm/gdmchooser ? in witch section in gdm.conf ?
13:33
<sep>
vagrantc, thanks it's all clear now :)
13:34
<sbalneav>
ukasz: I don't think that will work.
13:35
ukasz: we're targetting october.
13:36
<sep>
vagrantc, thin client and workstation from the same chroot is not a goal for ltsp ?
13:37
<vagrantc>
sep: hasn't been worked on much
13:39
<sep>
would adding SCRREN=07=ldm make ldm start on the workstations too ?
13:39
<vagrantc>
probabl
13:39
y
13:43
<sep>
vagrantc, sorry for asking before thinking :)
13:45
<ukasz>
ok maybe a diffrent question. what machine you think will be good for 20 thins ??
13:46
<sbalneav>
ukasz: A dual core box of some kind with 2 gigs of ram should work fine.
13:47
4 gigs of ram, if you want some wiggle room
13:48
ps -ef | grep LTSP_CLIENT | wc
13:48
77 1751 15957
13:49
So, I've got 77 people logged in on this server.
13:49
13:47:34 up 14 days, 20:27, 7 users, load average: 1.87, 1.75, 1.52
13:49
it's a quad xeon, with 5 gigs of ram.
13:49
<ukasz>
the reason why i would like to chave that chooser is that not every office can affort those kind of servers. i could setup some weaker servers
13:51
<jvin248>
Hi..... Since there is some discussion on servers.. Has anyone set up an LTSP server that is made up of a cluster of weaker computers (like an openmosix server with an LTSP layer to run clients from)? Any leads on where to look at how to install/setup such a configuration?
13:51
<sbalneav>
jvin248: Lots of people talk about it, none/few have done it.
13:52
<jvin248>
That's what I thought. I can see it being a big challenge.
13:53
<sbalneav>
ukasz: Well, dunno what I can tell you. Either keep fiddling with the startx, or wait till we get ldm2 done.
13:53
<jvin248>
A few months ago I was trying to get the server part running and struggled (without starting with any LTSP)
13:54
<sbalneav>
Seeing as how openmosix is still alpha on 2.6 kernels, I don't really view it as a serious contender.
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13:56
<ukasz>
sbalneav: i can't wait for that :-) btw do i only need ssh server on ltsp server to make ldm working ?
13:56
<sbalneav>
yep
13:56
<ukasz>
mhm
13:57
can i make ldm to send ssh requests to a diffrent computer ?
13:58
ah maybe i will manage to convince my employee to buy a better server
13:59* gvy is away: ~
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14:11
<ukasz>
will ldm work in chrooted enviroment ??
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14:41
<cliebow_>
sbalneav: you still around? if i were to swap in the ubuntu ltsp kernel and initramfs what would a grub entry look like?
14:41
title ltsp
14:42
kernel /boot/vmlinuz'
14:42
root=??
14:47
root=/dev/ram?
14:50
<sbalneav>
dunno
14:51
<cliebow_>
what spurs losding of the iniramfs once the kernel is loaded?
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14:53
<cliebow_>
i guess i see that with etherboot the ramdisk is tagged on..and in pxe it is defined in default file
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14:58
<shale>
howdy.... i'm trying to get a thin client to work in ubuntu, running feisty server, the client pxe boots OK, loads initrd.img OK, but then at the initial ubuntu boot screen it pauses then falls to a blinking cursor.
14:58
Any ideas why?
14:58mopey_ is now known as mopey
14:59
<cliebow_>
shale:you get an initramfs prompt?
15:01
<shale>
no, just the ubuntu splash screen then it drops to a blinking cursor.
15:01
if i do ALT-F1 it doesn't show any errors
15:01
the last line is "filename: ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0
15:01
<cliebow_>
maybe you should comment out splah quiet in default file of pxelinux.,cfg
15:01
might give you some info to go on
15:02
<shale>
ok
15:03
same thing
15:03
do i need to /etc/init.d/something restart ?
15:03
<cliebow_>
no..just reatart the client
15:04
<shale>
ok
15:04
ya, same thing
15:04
do i need to apt-get install anything other than ltsp-server ?
15:04
<cliebow_>
i cant tell where in the process it borks..
15:04
you have run ltsp-build-client
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15:05
<shale>
yes i did, and it created the /opt/ltsp/i386 dir
15:05
but since the OS is just feisty server, i'm wondering if i also need to have installed gnome or other stuff like that?
15:06
<cliebow_>
feisty server...you Will need x
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15:07
<cliebow_>
you can sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop..or edubuntu-desktop or xubuntu-desktop..or kubuntu-desktop..whatever flavor you like
15:08
<shale>
hmm ok
15:08
is installing all that required if i want to launch rdesktop?
15:08
i don't really want to install 1.5GB worth of stuff just to launch rdesktop
15:09
<cliebow_>
umm..you better ask one of the schmarties..
15:09
<shale>
hehehe
15:10
<cliebow_>
Gadi is not here atm..he has done a lot with rdesktop..and Scottie seems preoccupied
15:11* cliebow_ cliebow googles
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15:12
<shale>
ok i'll hang out hoping one of the wizards shows up :)
15:14
<whiprush>
an xserver and rdesktop should do the trick
15:15
<cliebow_>
first thing in the morning is good..while ogra is not sleeping
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15:24
<shale>
what is the smallest xserver?
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15:27
<shale>
or do i have to use one of the *-desktop ones? (like ubuntu-desktop)
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15:29
<lynn_>
any one know how to set my ltsp server to use a different ethernet card?
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15:31
<shale>
lynn_: you mean so one nic goes to the wan and the other has thin clients plugged into it?
15:32
<lynn_>
yes
15:32
that's how it is, but eth1 changed to eth2. the LAN connects to eth0
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15:35
<shale>
try this https://wiki.edubuntu.org/ThinClientHowtoNAT
15:35
<lynn_>
I switched out the thin-client server card and the new one shows up as eth2
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15:37
<lynn_>
thanks shale
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15:44
<john_s>
can two samba servers use active dirctory for auth? IF so how?
15:45
<shale>
john_s: yes
15:45
<john_s>
Ok, so how please
15:46
?
15:47
<joebake1>
john_s: Google for terms "samba" and "winbind"
15:47
<john_s>
sure
15:47
I am well past that
15:47
<shale>
well, you use a combination of winbind, kerberos, and acl
15:47
<john_s>
ok, so where are the rid's stored
15:47
?
15:48
and how is the uid/gid map kept consistent between the two servers?
15:48
<shale>
are you sure you're in the correct chan?
15:48
<john_s>
perhaps not
15:48
I am sort of pursuing this on #samba as well
15:48
I am just hoping that someone has been here before
15:49
I can't tell if I am thick or I am not asking the right question
15:49
<shale>
http://www.google.com/search?q=authenticating+samba+to+active+directory&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a
15:50
<john_s>
Ok shale, I appreciate that. But I am sort of hoping that someone has 2 LTSP servers that need to live on a windows domain as domain members and share a single source of authentication
15:50
and that they can sort of nudge me in the right direction
15:51
Everything I've found sort of stops at one linux server as a domain member
15:52
<shale>
have you seen this page? http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/WinIntegration
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15:53
<john_s>
yes, thanks
15:53
Thats pretty good. But I am trying to scale it to more than one server
15:54
<shale>
seems to me it would be the same procedure for the 2nd server, so long as it joins the domain with a diff name.
15:54
<john_s>
One way to do that is to use smbldap and set up another domain and then I *think* I could set up an inter-domain trust
15:54
ahh, yes but the problem is that each ltsp server would then have its own uid/rid map so that users could share files accross the two serers
15:55
and one of the things I want to have happen is have an nfs file store on a different machine.
15:55
so \home is somewhere else than the LTSP server is
15:56
am I being clear or am I babbling?
15:56
<shale>
i guess i don't understand the prob... two domain members, linux servers, should be able to share the file shares from other servers, incl /home dirs.
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16:00
<john_s>
ok. Well as I understand it (an there may be other ways to do this) if you use winbind and samba the default way that authentication is handled is that winbind maps windows RID to unix UID's and stores them locally in a database in /usr/lib/samba (i/var/lib/samba/winbindd_idmap.tdb) that works great for a single server. Now suppose another server is set up and it joins AD as well. It also has a local instance of the winbind_idmap.tdb, but it
16:00
am I missing something easy here?
16:00
basically if you
16:00
sorry,, basically if your users don't have the same map they can't mount files from other servers as that same user
16:01
<shale>
hmm, i'm out of my depth on this one, sorry
16:01
<john_s>
The reason I think this is sort of an LTSP question is because it is about how to scale LTSP
16:02
<shale>
have you seen the pdf at the bottom of this page: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/Documentation
16:02
<john_s>
shale: thats fine. I am out of my depth too :-)
16:03
thanks. I have read that.
16:04
<shale>
how bout this one: http://math.univ-lille1.fr/~hafidi/terminal-services/
16:04
<john_s>
Ok, well as I say I know that some folks are using smbldap which is pretty cool, but as I fooled with it, it appeared to me that I was going to not only have to create a parallel domain with parrallel user records but that I would need to investigate inter-domain trusts as well
16:07
Yes, I like this fellow stuff, he is really great, but I think he missed the boat here. His solution is to run a cron job every five minutes to reset uids as I read it. Thats downright scary! "For some reason the ID mappings may change. Thus, the files owner and group on the home directories will not correspond the id and gid of the user. A solution consists of running a cron, say every 5 minutes, to check that each homedir is really owned
16:07
"
16:08
I really appreciate your help. I am definatly puzzled. Anyone else care to chime in on this?
16:10a5benwillis has quit IRC
16:11
<shale>
for the number of folks in this chan, it's pretty quiet
16:11
i've been trying to figure out how to boot a thin client straight to rdesktop for a while now but no one ever answers :)
16:13
<john_s>
yeah
16:13
ok so maybe I can help with that. I assume that you edited your /lts.conf file right?
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16:14
<shale>
yes i added... SCREEN_02 = rdesktop ip.of.server
16:14efra has quit IRC
16:15
<shale>
but i can't even get it to give me a linux login window
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16:16
<shale>
i started with a plain jane feisty-server install, then added xfce4 but it still didn't work, so now am installing ubuntu-desktop
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16:16
<shale>
previously, i'd just done apt-get install ltsp-server rdesktop
16:16
the pxe client booted the initrd.img fine, showed the ubuntu splash page, then dropped to a blinking cursor.
16:17
<john_s>
hm, I've had similar issues. Did you try setting rdesktop to by screen_01 just for giggles?
16:17
<shale>
no i didn't but will try that
16:18
<john_s>
This is something that I never got working right and finally gave up on myself. I could get it to go to X, or tty but never automagically to a remote redesktop
16:19
<shale>
changing it to SCREEN_01 gives same effect.
16:19
<sbalneav>
john_s: did you install rdesktop in the chroot?
16:19
it's not there by default, iirc
16:19
<shale>
sbalneav: no, i just did apt-get install rdesktop and then ran ltsp-build-client... how do i install it in the chroot?
16:20
<sbalneav>
chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
16:20
then apt-get install rdesktop
16:20
I don't use rdesktop myself, so I've never tested that part.
16:20
But I suspect that's your problem.
16:20
<shale>
hmm i'll try it
16:21
altho when i removed the rdesktop line from lts.conf and tried even then i never even got an xfce login screen
16:21
<sbalneav>
Anywho, heading home for the day.
16:21
<shale>
do i need to apt-get install xfce4 as chroot?
16:21
<sbalneav>
no
16:21
<shale>
thx sbalneav
16:21
<sbalneav>
because it runs on the server.
16:21
bye
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16:29
<john_s>
So is there anyone on channel right now with _more_ than one ltsp server AND a Win2k3 domain controller?
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17:01
<lynn_>
is there a way to smooth out choppy video on ltsp thin-clients?
17:05
i'm using switch, not a hub, and testing with 2 gigabit ethernet cards. however, the video is still choppy!
17:09
<mopey>
You could bypass the encryption of X, by using what they talked about here http://marc.info/?l=ltsp-discuss&m=118343389721369&w=2
17:11
and your switch needs to be a gigabit switch, right? Not just the cards.
17:11
Or else it will run at 100mb
17:12
(if your switch is only 100mb)
17:13
<lynn_>
the switch is 1000, i'll try that link. thanks mopey
17:15
<shale>
anyone know how to get ltsp to auto-launch rdesktop to a specific address?
17:16
<mopey>
you could put it in rc.local
17:17
/opt/ltsp/.../rc.local
17:21
<john_s>
shale: the chroot idea didn't work, huh?
17:21
<shale>
john_s: nope
17:22
<john_s>
but other things work like telling it to got to a tty automagically right?
17:22
<shale>
i wonder if my problem could be related to my running the ltsp server out of a VM
17:22
john_s: no, actually, i can't even get a login screen
17:22
<john_s>
um, wait have you ever gotten a login?
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17:23
<shale>
john_s: No :)
17:23
<john_s>
like on tty1 does it come up with the gnome splash or whatever
17:23
ohhhh
17:23
<shale>
ubuntu splash appears then it goes to a blinking cursor and nothing after that
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17:23
<john_s>
I think you should start there first. So you are saying. It pxe boots, you see all that great nearly meaningless boot info and then you get a splash and then it keels over?
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17:24
<shale>
correct
17:24
<john_s>
ok and your server is hosted on vmware but your client is a real world computer?
17:24
<shale>
i figured it was because there was no X installed, so i apt-get installed xfce4 but same effect.
17:24
correct, server = vm, client = classic p3
17:26
<john_s>
ok, well try going pre-graphical by setting this option in lts.conf SCREEN_01 = shell
17:26
SCREEN_01 = shell
17:26
sorry the space doesn't need to be that big, gaim is being mean
17:26
then you'll need to reboot your client
17:27
<shale>
ok rebooting...
17:27
<john_s>
one advantage to this is not only will you know if you are really connecting but any meaning debug message re: your vga card or whatever will be here
17:27
<mopey>
wait. you need to set SCREEN_02 not SCREEN_01 I think for ltsp5
17:27
<shale>
after it loads initrd.img it says Ready. then it shows the ubuntu splash, and now it just dropped to a blinking cursor.
17:28
yes ltsp5 (ubuntu feisty)
17:28
<mopey>
Try SCREEN_02=shell
17:28
<john_s>
ok, something isn't quite right, since you probably shouldn't get an ubuntu splash at all
17:28
<shale>
trying SCREEN_02 now
17:29
still getting the splash
17:29
<john_s>
I am not sure you are actually pxe booting
17:29
<mopey>
SCREEN_01 is reserved for something. That was a hangup for me when I was trying to debug.
17:29
<john_s>
ok
17:29
are you seeing all of the typical linux dmeg type stuff when you pxe boot the piii
17:30
<shale>
got splash again
17:30
<john_s>
shale: are you seeing typical linux boot mesg stuff from the piii
17:30
?
17:31
your reboots are awfully speedy it seems to me
17:31
<shale>
when it pxe boots, i get the PXE stuff, Loading vmlinux..., Loading initrd.img.... Ready. then Loading, please wait... a bunch of IP-config info incl rootserver, rootpath, filename, then the blinking cursor.
17:31
<john_s>
ok and if you hit alt F2 what do you see?
17:31
<shale>
so john_s, no i don't think i'm seeing the linux dmesg stuff
17:31
<mopey>
Check your dhcpd.conf stuff
17:32
<shale>
when i hit alt F2 I see just the blinking cursor, altF1 shows me all that stuff i listed above.
17:32
<mopey>
Like yout root-path
17:32
<john_s>
I agree with mopey
17:32
I think you aren't actually booting the kernel
17:32
you may have to adjust a bit
17:33
<shale>
rootpath = /opt/ltsp/i386 bootfile name = ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 boot server host = 10.21.2.229
17:34
<john_s>
ok and when you go to ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 is there an image there with that name?
17:35
<shale>
when i got to /opt/ltsp/i386 i see all the linux dirs (bin, boot, dev, etc).
17:36
<john_s>
like when I do # locate pxelinux.0 i see # /tftpboot/lts/2.6.17.8-ltsp-1/pxelinux.0
17:36
ok but look for the boot image, probably in /tftpboot/lts/ or something
17:36
<shale>
root@ltsp:/opt/ltsp/i386# locate pxelinux.0
17:37
<john_s>
wait sorry just do locate pxelinux.0 from your command prompt
17:37
<shale>
i have three pxelinux.0
17:37
<john_s>
ok they are probably associated with various kernels right?
17:37
<shale>
/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/lib/syslinux/pxelinux.0 and /opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0
17:38
<john_s>
i think you need to point it at the one in tftpboot my systems a bit different than yours but thats a hunch so you need to adjust your path in dhcp accordingly
17:39
dunno, perhaps I am offbase here since I am using LTSP 4.2 what do you think mopey?
17:40
<mopey>
I've never used ltsp4.2, so I have no idea.
17:40
<shale>
i'm using ltsp5
17:41
<mopey>
ahhh, I misunderstood
17:41
I think you have it right shale
17:41
That's where the pxelinux.0 is on mine.
17:42
What about your server host, is that ip right? Maybe your vm is doing something there?
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17:42
<shale>
its the correct ip, the PXE boot makes it through loading vmlinuz and initrd.img
17:44
should the dhcp option 067 bootfile name (ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0) refer to /var/lib/tftpboot/... or /opt/... ?
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18:10
<antiyanki>
HOla...
18:10
primera ves por el canal IRC
18:10
ignoro incluso si Uds. me ven
18:10
ando medio perdido con cuestiones relativas al lts.conf.... me echarian una manito?
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18:19
<antiyanki>
Perdón por la impaciencia.....
18:19
pero que pasa que esto se mueve tan poco
18:19
??
18:19
Uds. son usuarios ltsp con Ubuntu????
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19:07
<shale>
anyone use ltsp with xfce4?
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19:10
<shale>
anyone use ltsp with xfce4?
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19:32
<cliebow>
ive used xubuntu-desktop with ltsp ok..
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20:16
<antiyanki>
Hola
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21:26
<griberal>
Can LTSP be run over an broadband Internet connection?
21:27
<MrMoo>
You probably want to look at the FreeNX connectivity
21:28
<griberal>
What is the difference between the two?
21:29
<MrMoo>
FreeNX has optimised network handling
21:29
you cannot boot a client over a broadband connection though
21:30
<griberal>
So, why wouldn't one use FreeNX for local thin clients also?
21:30
<MrMoo>
but you can probably copy the necessary files to a hard disk, etc.
21:31
FreeNX is a new custom protocol, its not basic X11
21:31
some people are concerned over its security policy
21:31
and its a few extra packages and configuration
21:32
its a spin off from NoMachine NX
21:32
a commercial solution
21:33
a competitor to 2X I believe
21:33
The cute feature of NX is that you can disconnect sessions like the console program screen
21:35
<griberal>
So LTSP doesn't work well over an Internet connection?
21:35
<MrMoo>
LTSP 4.2 uses regular X11 so it needs a lot of bandwidth and is insecure, ~300KB/s
21:35
LTSP 5.0 tunnels through SSH so it would be a lot better
21:36
http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/FreeNX
21:37
it would not work out of the box
21:37
but it is feasible
21:37
you would need some serious testing to see if its sensible
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