IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 25 November 2009   (all times are UTC)

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00:43
<kaos01>
hi, we just got out LTSP server/clients moved to a new network and now things dont seem to work, the client downloads initrd.ltsp fine, but than mounting of the root-path fails to happen
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01:09
<madcat>
Hi, can anyone help me? How do you backup an ltsp image? I'm trying to do this so I can revert back easily just in case I mess things up by installing something in chroot!
01:10
<johnny>
madcat, just cop it
01:10
copy*
01:10
the whole directory
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01:10
<johnny>
cp -a /opt/ltsp/i386 /opt/ltsp/i386.bak
01:10
<madcat>
Hi, johnny, which directory the /opt/ltsp/i386?
01:10
<johnny>
or whatever you wanna call it
01:10
yes
01:11
<madcat>
Oh that's great, let me try!
01:13
I'm doing it now...
01:18
Hi Johnny, I booted my backup, but it dropped me to initramfs, I did the cp -a /opt/ltsp/i386 /opt/ltsp/i386.bak. I renamed my original to i386orig and I renamed the i386.bak to i386, but there was a problem
01:19
it said Negotiation: Error: Server closed connection
01:21
test
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01:21
<madcat>
rofs, dev, sys proc : No such file or directory
01:22
Target filesystem doesn't have sbin init.... BusyBox...... (initramfs)
01:22
Did I do something wrong?
01:22
I'll try to update the image
01:23
<johnny>
uhmm..
01:23
<madcat>
I'm updating the image now.
01:24
I can see I got a valid address in my subnet and the filename /ltsp/i386 is correct
01:24
Was this correct? cp -a /opt/ltsp/i386 /opt/ltsp/i386.bak $sudo mv i386 i386orig
01:25
$sudo mv i386.bak i386
01:26
Oh wait Johnny it worked!
01:26
After I updated my image!
01:26
right?
01:26
Yes!
01:28
Hey man, thanks a lot.
01:29
I've too many owes to you and Gadi. Can I buy you a coffee sometime?
01:29
:)
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01:30
<madcat>
I was doing this because I was installing something in chroot, but whenever it doesn't go, my chroot just balloons and I would like to revert to previous images, but usually my tar method doesn't work
01:32
Before I used this sudo tar cvpzf i386.tgz, but when I restore it by sudo tar xvpzf i386.tgz -C /opt/ltsp it doesn't work, I wonder why!
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02:06
<madcat>
bye, talk to you later again guys, thanks for your help...
02:06
Thanks Johnny!
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02:11
<Denbert>
Anyone here, using the Thin Client Manager?
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02:13
<Denbert>
I've installed Thin Client Manager, have a client up and running on the server, but can't see the client in the Thin Client Manager
02:13
<Appiah>
https://launchpad.net/tcm <- is this still active?
02:14
52weeks since anything was modified
02:14
<cyberorg>
Denbert, if you want see clients you need italc
02:15
<Appiah>
tcm + italc?
02:15
<cyberorg>
Appiah, i have no idea what tcm is :)
02:16
<Appiah>
Thin client Manager
02:16
the thing Denbert is asking about
02:16
<cyberorg>
is that a project started for lts.conf GUI editor like easy-ltsp?
02:16
<Appiah>
or am I wrong?
02:16
never used Thin client manager
02:17
<Denbert>
I,ll install the italc right away :)
02:17
<Appiah>
Denbert: tcm = Thin client manger , the thing i linked to right? where did you get it?
02:18
<cyberorg>
!italc
02:18
<ltspbot>
cyberorg: "italc" :: http://italc.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php?title=ITALC_in_a_ThinClient_environment
02:25
<Denbert>
I installed the tcm via the Ubuntu Software Cernter
02:25
Center
02:26
Installing the iTalc package awr :-)
02:28
<Appiah>
do you have edubuntu Denbert ?
02:29
<Denbert>
No, I installed the Ubuntu 9.10 Alternate version
02:29
<Appiah>
ok
02:29
<Denbert>
Think the edubuntu might be better, as this test is for public school
02:30
<Appiah>
actully the place I first helped with LTSP i suggested we started over and not included edubuntu
02:31
but rather add the software they really need instead of installing a bunch of "oh this is nice to have"
02:31
gimp,f-spot,openoffice,firefox is pretty much all this school needs .. been like that for almost a year.
02:31
<Denbert>
I totally agree
02:33
Hmm, I had some problems yesterday with connecting to my server via FreeNX client over the internet
02:33
ended up removing second nic in order to have smooth integration to ny existing lan
02:34
now client says no response from server
02:34
Have login screen
02:35
have invoked the ltsp-update-sshkeys && ltsp-update-image command
02:37
<cyberorg>
Denbert, for your school test also http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Live :)
02:37
<Denbert>
Client says: No responce from server, restarting
02:38
<cyberorg>
Denbert, SERVER=IPofserver in lts.conf is missing or wrong
02:38
<Denbert>
what are the key benefits on favor for suse compared to ubuntu?
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02:39
<cyberorg>
Denbert, openSUSE Li-f-e comes with *everything* educational institutions require installed and working out of the box
02:40
italc, ltsp, educational apps, multimedia etc all are included, ltsp comes with nice GUI easy-ltsp, if required there is another one called fl_teachertool available in the repo
02:41
<Denbert>
Ok, it's just as I'm an old man, and Debian/ubuntu is the Linux distro I've worked wit for years, after i skipped the RPM hell :-)
02:42
I'll setup a Suse in half an hour :), just need to fix existing ubuntu ltsp server, in order to stop it (all testing are in vmware)
02:43
Has to present a working test setup tomorrow midday - EST +1
02:45
I don't have a line with IPofserver in my /etc/lts
02:45
ltsp.conf
02:46
<Appiah>
SERVER=xxx.xx.xx.xxx
02:46
e.x SERVER=192.168.0.1
02:46
<Denbert>
cyberorg, i'm downloading direct to my vmware server with wget, should I gram the LIVE CD you linked to?
02:47
<cyberorg>
Denbert, you can test iso image in virtual machine or dd the image to 4G usb stick to test without installing on the hard disk :)
02:47
Denbert, we got rid of RPM hell since openSUSE 10.3 with 1-click install ;)
02:50
Denbert, it is located here /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf in ubuntu
02:50
<Denbert>
added SERVER=192.168.9.12 to /etc/ltsp.conf - no luck, or must i do something on the server?
02:50
Ahhhee
02:50
Looking
02:53
strange - dont have a ltsp.conf there -I'm having a pxelinux.cfg folder and inside a default
02:54
<Appiah>
lts.conf
02:56
<Denbert>
cyberorg, started the 2,9 gb download - approx. 1 hour left
02:56
<Appiah>
/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf
02:57
<cyberorg>
Denbert, lts.conf
02:57
Appiah, /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf is for chroot image, you have to change the one in tftpboot folder
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02:59
<cyberorg>
Denbert, cool, i can walk you through with how to get live USB stick or install or run it live in VM
02:59
<Appiah>
oh sorry
02:59
/var/lib/tftpboot/
02:59
<Denbert>
I log of this windows client, and will come back from the ubuntu
02:59
brb
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03:02
<denbert_>
On the ltsp server
03:05
In /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386 folder, there is no lts.conf or similar file
03:09
Hmm
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03:09
<cyberorg>
denbert_, just create one, first line [default] and second line SERVER=192.168.9.12
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03:11
<Denbertuz>
should i create /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf?
03:13
A bit strange, as the server worked, be fore I changed the nic settings - Hence the information about server IP must be somewhere?
03:17
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, looks like you missed this "denbert_, just create one, first line [default] and second line SERVER=192.168.9.12"
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03:19
<Denbertuz>
Hehe - Must admit that the mIrc client is a bit better, than the one i installed on Ubuntu
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03:22
<denbert_>
made the /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
03:22
first line [default]
03:22
Second line SERVER-=192.168.9.12
03:22
Still no luck
03:23
should i restart the ltsp server?
03:24
<cyberorg>
second line should not have - in there
03:26
<denbert_>
I't hasen't just a typo here
03:27
the FreeNX client still works
03:33
<alkisg_work>
SERVER-=192.168.9.12 ==> did you really put a minus there?
03:34
Ah sorry cyberorg already said that
03:34* alkisg_work decides to finish up his coffee before speaking again... :
03:35
<Denbertuz>
The Suse is down in 20 min...
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03:46
<Denbertuz>
Restarted the LTSP Server, still no luck, must have broken something
03:48
cyberdog, does the Suse EDU version come with user skeletons?
03:49
<cyberorg>
what is user skeletons?
03:50* cyberorg is not aware of any dead users' skeletons in openSUSE
03:50
<Denbertuz>
Centralized profiles in order to make custom settings, when you are maken 23 new users for a full classroom
03:51
Skeletons might not be the right word :)
03:52
<cyberorg>
ah, you can create one ideal user, copy everything in his home to /etc/skel/ or change /etc/default/useradd SKEL=/home/idealuser before adding rest of the users
03:52
<Denbertuz>
Great
03:53
Exactly what I'm looking for
03:54
<cyberorg>
that only works for new users added, changing /etc/skel after they are added will not have any effect on existing users
03:54
<Denbertuz>
If you are goingto make 630 users, are there some scripting tools?
03:56
<cyberorg>
not included, but simple bash script that runs something like "for i in `cat xyz.txt`; do; useradd -m $i; done" should work
03:57
you'll have to read up bash scripting guide :)
04:00
<Denbertuz>
sure
04:01
worked on a SMESERVER (CentOS based distro) before - have used some scripting tools there
04:05
<cyberorg>
you may find googling, amy need small adaptations
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04:44
<Denbertuz>
cyberorg, I'm ready to make the install in VM - in order to have a smooth integration in my existing environment I would prefer a one nic setup
04:44
<cyberorg>
should work fine with 1 nic :)
04:45
<Denbertuz>
Nice
04:45
<cyberorg>
here is a step by step http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Live/Install
04:46
<Denbertuz>
VMware has Suse Enterprice and Suse Enterprice 10
04:46
Which flavor should i choose
04:47
<Appiah>
none enterprise
04:47
not that it differs much in vmware
04:47
execpt maybe recommended ram setting
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04:48
<cyberorg>
probably just the icon :)
04:48
<Appiah>
that too :D
04:49
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, make large virtual disk, 15G, keep minimum 10G for /
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04:50
<cyberorg>
more is always better ;)
04:50
<Denbertuz>
made a 20 gb
04:50
How about 64-bit?
04:50
I've added 2 gb ram
04:50
<cyberorg>
the DVD is 32bit
04:51
with 2G you may be able to run about 20 clients
04:51
<Denbertuz>
In real life i think the server will be needing 32gb ram or more
04:51
Ok
04:51
Impressive
04:51
<cyberorg>
in real life you will need cluster of servers :)
04:52
<Denbertuz>
70 sametime clients
04:52
Yeps
04:52
<cyberorg>
630 users? even 100 users per server would require 10 servers
04:52
*6 servers
04:52
<Denbertuz>
Well - I'll look in to this cluster fun later, I'll start to get the suse smell first :)
04:54
Nive with the vmware tools integrated - I like :)
04:54
Nice
04:58
<cyberorg>
is it? didn't know that
05:01
<Denbertuz>
The Mircosoft sales dude has offered a two server setup - HP 380 G6 Servers - Each with 32 GB Ram
05:03
6 servers sounds like alot
05:03
<cyberorg>
you need 150M per client, and giga lan if more than 50 clients are connected to the server
05:03
<Denbertuz>
Ok
05:03
<cyberorg>
both quad core servers?
05:04
<Denbertuz>
Yep - Dual processor Quadcore
05:04
<cyberorg>
so 8 cores each? that sounds good
05:04
<Denbertuz>
Yeps
05:04
But i really hate the WINTEL setup
05:05
<cyberorg>
well the intel is good :)
05:06
<Denbertuz>
Woulden't two Ubuntu LTSP 64-bit servers with 32 GB ram be able to handle 70 same time clients?
05:07
I'm currently in love with the Dell PowerEdge 2970 Server (AMD based)
05:07
<cyberorg>
just one is enough
05:08
<Denbertuz>
Woulden't it be better with two in Cluster setup with loadbalancing?
05:09
Don't now how to do it, but I'm willing to learn :)
05:10
<cyberorg>
it is quite easy http://en.opensuse.org/LTSP/Cluster worry about it later :)
05:11
<Denbertuz>
Just to be sure - 8 Core Server, 32 GB RAM - RAID 1 + 0 be OK for 70 Clients?
05:11
<cyberorg>
the same method will be fast enough for upto 7 or may be even 10 servers, more than that you need ltsp-cluster packages, those are under development
05:12
yes, it should be more than enough :)
05:13
what kind of load would the clients putting, office/browsing?
05:13
<Denbertuz>
Great - As we all need to control our CO2 footprint
05:13
<cyberorg>
if the clients are fast enough with 512M ram, you can run firefox local
05:14
<Denbertuz>
They asks for Office, browsing, and some special users with access to video streaming, e.g youtube
05:14
<cyberorg>
ok, so browsing/youtube can be run on the client directly, that reduces load on server a lot
05:16
<Denbertuz>
Yes - Especially as they are planning to give students the ability to bring their own laptops
05:16
This is why I've tested the FreeNX
05:17
They will install Wireless Acces Points in all Class Rooms
05:18
and make two class rooms with real thin Clients
05:20
But I think they need a huge plug to the internet :)
05:20
With this setup
05:21
<alkisg_work>
Just install a squid server for caching and make everyone go through it...
05:22
(==gnome mandatory settings for proxy, or iptables or something...)
05:23
<Denbertuz>
The Ubuntu LTSP install was faster :)
05:24
Dammn
05:25
Copy Error under the install 80% done
05:25
returned to the welcome screen
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05:29
<Denbertuz>
Have deleted the disk and made a new, with allocate space now feature
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05:39
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, if / is under 10G it will fail, this will take more time than ubuntu as it is 4 times its size :)
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05:40
<cyberorg>
still the install should complete in 35 minutes if you are doing from an iso
05:44
<Denbertuz>
Started the life
05:44
to see
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05:45
<Denbertuz>
translation to danish is poor - almost non existing, compared to Ubuntu
05:46
<cyberorg>
you may be able to install language pack, there is software management module in yast
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05:46
<Denbertuz>
Has started the install from life
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05:48
<cyberorg>
http://i18n.opensuse.org/stats/trunk/da/index.php it is 100%, so just the language packs are not on the DVD, just get it via yast once install is done :)
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06:25
<Denbertuz>
The install fails
06:25
http://hegnstoften.net/pictures/Suse_Install_error.png
06:27
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, /dev/sda2 for / is just 7.58G
06:28
you need at least 10G or to keep it simple just uncheck "propose seperate home" from partitioning
06:29
<Denbertuz>
It's default settings from the installer
06:30
I'll give it at shot more
06:30
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, yes change the default so / is 10G minimum
06:32
<Denbertuz>
Why not all in one partition
06:33
<cyberorg>
to keep everything in 1 partition uncheck "propose seperate home" from partitioning
06:35
<Denbertuz>
I dont see that option
06:35
<cyberorg>
click "Custom partition" at the default suggestion screen
06:35
http://en.opensuse.org/Image:Life-install8.png "Create partition setup" on that screen
06:37
<Denbertuz>
Got it
06:37
thanx
06:37
way tooo much gui here
06:38
<cyberorg>
just uncheck seperate home there, you can ignore the rest
06:39
<Denbertuz>
Done - I'll grab some coffe as this is my third install attemp :)
06:39
<cyberorg>
yes you need that, that is why i put "takes a long time here" on the installer when it is copying image :)
06:40
<Denbertuz>
You?
06:40
Are you distro maintainer on this?
06:41
<cyberorg>
with tons of other devs :)
06:41
<Denbertuz>
Ok
06:41
I'll hang in then :)
06:41
Are you at Suse Germany?
06:42
<cyberorg>
nopes, India, http://en.opensuse.org/Education/Team some folks there are from SUSE labs
06:42
<Denbertuz>
Ok
06:46
Are you also involved in the Suse Studion project?
06:46
Studio
06:51
New error http://hegnstoften.net/pictures/Suse_Install_error_2.png
06:51
<cyberorg>
nopes, that is run by another team, it uses the same technology we are using, kiwi for creating images
06:52
hmm strange, do md5sum match?
06:53
you can /join #opensuse-edu, sattelit there is our tester on VMWare, he may have some suggestions
06:56
<Denbertuz>
I'll try on real metal
06:57
<cyberorg>
first check md5sums
06:57
<Denbertuz>
How do I do that on Debian Lenny?
06:58
Host OS is 64-bit Lenny
06:58
<cyberorg>
run md5sum imagename.iso
07:01
<Denbertuz>
running
07:01
858a6dcbe7627040347558d4478e1ac8
07:02
<cyberorg>
that is correct
07:03
so image is perfect, got 4G usb stick?
07:03
<Denbertuz>
No, got a DVD burner
07:03
<cyberorg>
ok, that would work too :)
07:03
<Denbertuz>
:-)
07:04
<cyberorg>
install from usb is much faster than dvd
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07:06
<Denbertuz>
Ok
07:07
I might grab a USB stick from the local Seven/Eleven :)
07:08
<cyberorg>
for demo you don't even have to install, run the iso in vmware, follow this to configure ltsp: http://en.opensuse.org/LTSP/Quick_start
07:09
<_UsUrPeR_>
hey guys
07:09
<cyberorg>
make changes to network settings according to your requirement, then instead of shutting down use hibernate, so next time you reboot your settings are saved
07:10
hi _UsUrPeR_ :)
07:10
<_UsUrPeR_>
I'm working with fedora 12, just testing out our clients. I have rebuilt the image, but am still getting quite the weird error
07:10
<cyberorg>
you need warren or Ryan52 :)
07:11
<ogra>
_UsUrPeR_, note that F12 dropped support for many arches ...
07:11
<_UsUrPeR_>
[drm:drm_mode_r,fb] *ERROR* tried to remove a fb that we didn't own
07:11
ogra: arch = i386 :P
07:11
<ogra>
i.e. a bunch of VIA and Geode wont be supported anymore the way they build their default kernel
07:12
<_UsUrPeR_>
ogra: oh. Still, it's an Atom I am testing with
07:12
<ogra>
its now highly optimized for 686
07:12
ah, well, then its likely a KMS problem
07:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
ogra: KMS?
07:14
<ogra>
kernel mode setting
07:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
hmm :/
07:15
<ogra>
file a bug :)
07:15
<_UsUrPeR_>
tempting :)
07:15
<ogra>
but i'm not sure there are any responsible people for FC anymore
07:15
<_UsUrPeR_>
yeah
07:15
<ogra>
afaik warren works on something different now
07:15
and he was the only one really taking care
07:16
<_UsUrPeR_>
yeah :(
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07:20
<cyberorg>
_UsUrPeR_, if you file bug against live CD they may fix it, see if the same issue is on that too :)
07:20
<_UsUrPeR_>
cyberorg: k, thanks for the hint. I need to get some more information about this first
07:46
<leio>
ogra: they end up using the "undocumented" i686 instructions?
07:47
<ogra>
leio, who ?
07:47
<leio>
ogra: fedora
07:47
<ogra>
not sure which these would be ..
07:48
<leio>
ogra: right, you mentioned it doesn't work anymore on geode
07:48
<ogra>
the chips i mentioned above need a kernel build -march=586
07:48
<leio>
ogra: but to my knowledge cmov exists on geode
07:48
<ogra>
s/build/build with/
07:48
<leio>
586 is quite bad for geode, but ok ;p
07:48
at least works.
07:48Lumiere_ is now known as Lumiere
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07:53
<ogra>
leio, http://docs.fedoraproject.org/release-notes/f12/en-US/pdf/Fedora_12_Release_Notes.pdf see page 6
07:53
topic 3.1
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08:41
<leio>
ogra: which says GeodeLX should still work
08:42
ogra: but yeah, Geode GX1 and GX2 are likely sad, unsure about LX before anyone tests
08:43shawnp0wers has joined #ltsp
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08:44
<shawnp0wers>
Guess who is doing a big LTSP demo to the school board on Monday? <-- THIS GUY :D
08:45
We've been using it for like 8 years of course, but LTSP5/Ubuntu is awesome enough to warrant a new demo.
08:45
<sbalneav>
Morning all
08:46
<shawnp0wers>
'mornin
08:51
<elias_a>
shawnp0wers: How did they take it?
08:51
<shawnp0wers>
Dunno, I'll tell you Tuesday. :)
08:51
<elias_a>
shawnp0wers: I am going to to the same thing in the neighbouring municipality in December
08:52
<Denbertuz>
shawnp0wers, how many clients?
08:52
<shawnp0wers>
My advice: Set up compiz. It sounds absurd, but wiggly windows and 3D cube desktop switching means more to most people...
08:52
Denbertuz: We have a couple hundred now
08:52
<elias_a>
And did it yesterday in a conference called Day of Virtual Learning.
08:52
<Denbertuz>
In cluster setup?
08:52
<elias_a>
shawnp0wers: Wow!
08:53
I just used 2 laptops...
08:53
<shawnp0wers>
Denbertuz: no, I just have them manually pointed to different servers via dhcp
08:53
elias_a: My demo will only have 1 thin client, I just meant our school has a couple hundred running. :) Mostly LTSP4.2 though.
08:54* shawnp0wers will be switching to a trimmed down version of LTSP5 over Christmas break
08:54
<Denbertuz>
08:54
<shawnp0wers>
many of my thin clients are P133 machines
08:54
Denbertuz: cool! Be sure to demo local apps with sound, flash, video, etc
08:55
and depending on the grade level, things like gcompris as a local app
08:55
<alkisg>
shawnp0wers: you use LTSP 4.2 with them?
08:55
(the ones with 32 Mb RAM, weren't they?)
08:55
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: with my old thin clients yes
08:56
<alkisg>
And the server? What does it run?
08:56
<elias_a>
Flash with P133? Huh?
08:56
<shawnp0wers>
using your advice, I'm going to try switching over to LTSP5 with NBD swap and no sound
08:56
elias_a -- no, those don't work with flash
08:56
<Denbertuz>
shawnp0wers, I'm not there quit yet, but thats also ok, as school only has received an offer from the Local M$ Pimp offering tons of hardware and Windows Terminal Server 2008
08:56
<alkisg>
shawnp0wers: with 64 RAM it works fine, but it doesn't work with 32 MB RAM
08:56
<elias_a>
shawnp0wers: Already thought I have missed something... :)
08:56
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: evenwith NBD swap?
08:56
<alkisg>
And a fellow teacher called me to set up his lab, and he only has 32 RAM :-/
08:57
<elias_a>
M$ Pimp - nice concept...
08:57
Have to borrow that one... :)
08:57
<alkisg>
That's why I'm asking, to see if I could make do with what he has, or if I should look for more RAM for him
08:57rjune has joined #ltsp
08:57
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: I won't be able to test for another week or so, but I'll see what my old 32MB beasties can do, and let you know
08:57
awe heck, I'll see if I can grab one now
08:57
lol
08:58
<alkisg>
Thanks - and if they won't run with LTSP5, I could use some hints for LTSP 4.2 :D
09:02
<shawnp0wers>
ok, found one in storage... first I have to figure how to get etherboot machines to boot to LTSP5
09:02
I think it only supports PXE?
09:02
for these old machines, I just wrote etherboot code to the boot sector of the hard drive, because they don't support PXE
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09:09
<Denbertuz>
shawnp0wers, Are you using Ubuntu 9.10 LTSP5 setup?
09:09
<shawnp0wers>
Yes
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09:16
<Denbertuz>
I've changed the ssh port to 8888 in order to give access from internet in FreeNX
09:16
can sshd handle 22 and 8888?
09:16
Or just one port?
09:17
My fucked-up Netgear Firewall cant portmap 8888 to 22
09:21
wow, google says yes
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09:24
<cyberorg>
Denbertuz, you dont need your netgear to map ports, see rinetd
09:24
<Denbertuz>
cyberorg, it works great again after adding Port 22 to my sshd.conf
09:25
<shawnp0wers>
Note to self: nbi.img is the etherboot image... I think...
09:25
hmm... maybe not
09:26
anyone know, do I need to create an etherboot image for LTSP5? like with mknbi-linux or something?
09:26
<Denbertuz>
cyberorg, italc is also working - thanks for pointing me
09:26
<Gadi>
shawnp0wers: I believe you need a new rom-o-matic image -> there was a bug that older ones are broken
09:27
<shawnp0wers>
Gadi: so rolling my own isn't the proper way?
09:27
I'll admit, I'm not entirely sure the interworkings of etherboot
09:27
other than it "just works" on my LTSP 4.2 machines. :)
09:28
<Gadi>
shawnp0wers: etherboot is now gPXE and some of the magic has changed
09:28
<shawnp0wers>
I see
09:28
darn magic
09:28
<Gadi>
nbi.img is supposed to work for etherboot and is made with mknbi
09:28
<shawnp0wers>
so I was on the right track, but yeah -- it fails
09:28
with Issue RESET:
09:28
<Gadi>
but, something recently broke with older etherboot images
09:29
if you can grab a new rom-o-matic image and flash the client
09:29
<shawnp0wers>
is there a new image in the ubuntu repo, or is this a download and put, OR a make a new one sorta thing?
09:29
<Gadi>
you should be good-to-go
09:29
www.rom-o-matic.net
09:29
<shawnp0wers>
Oh, so I'm supposed to update al my clients?
09:29
that... sucks
09:29
:(
09:29
<Gadi>
ah....
09:30
yeah, that would suck
09:30
<shawnp0wers>
also, my clients all just have the etherboot code written to their hard drive boot sectors
09:30
<Gadi>
guess we have motivation to fix the bug...
09:30
:)
09:30
<shawnp0wers>
lol!
09:30
can I just roll my own image though?
09:30
like mknbi-linux --output=vmlinuz.ltsp ......
09:30
sorta thing?
09:31
<Gadi>
I guess - but how would you do it differently than what is done already?
09:31
<shawnp0wers>
or is the bug in the files that it uses to create that
09:31
that's what I wondered
09:31
:)
09:31
<Gadi>
nbi.img is kinda made that way
09:31
<shawnp0wers>
yeah, ok
09:31
well poop
09:31
<Gadi>
read: /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels
09:32
it may be a versioning thing or something
09:32
not sure - I personally have not been motivated to investigate the bug
09:32* Gadi does not work with etherboot much
09:33
<shawnp0wers>
Gadi: It's only a big deal for me because I'm trying to push my old clients to LTSP5
09:33
it might not work anyway though
09:33
because they're REALLY old
09:33
<Gadi>
tell ya what
09:33
<shawnp0wers>
I'll reflash one with GPXE
09:33
and if it works, I might bug you a bit more about the nbi image
09:33
sound good?
09:33
<Gadi>
if you reflash one with gPXE and get it working, I'll help you fix the etherboot bug
09:33
<shawnp0wers>
HA
09:34
<Gadi>
:)
09:34
<shawnp0wers>
::mindlink active::
09:34* shawnp0wers now tries to remember how he wrote the image to the hard drive all those years ago...
09:34
<shawnp0wers>
:D
09:34
<Gadi>
hehe - prolly boot from a liveCD
09:34
:)
09:34
<shawnp0wers>
documentation. I must remember to make documentation.
09:35
these are way before bootable cds. :) floppy disks
09:35
<Gadi>
tomsrtbt?
09:35
;)
09:36
or, boot it off of LTSP4.2 with a shell session ;)
09:36
<shawnp0wers>
HMM....
09:36
that might work
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09:36
<shawnp0wers>
I have a shell session already running on 'em
09:36
I dunno if the shell has dd installed though
09:36
my guess is no
09:36
:)
09:37
<Gadi>
it should
09:37
I used to turn LTSP4 servers into "poor man's burn servers" dd'ing harddrives over the network with dd and ssh
09:37
;)
09:37
<shawnp0wers>
cool, rebooting now. :)
09:38
I like the idea that doesn't involve finding 1) a floppy disk, and 2) a floppy drive that actually works
09:38
:)
09:38
<Gadi>
I guess you're actually doing exactly the same thing
09:38
ssh user@server dd if=my.img | dd of=/dev/hda
09:39
:)
09:39
hmm... may need some quotes in there
09:39
be careful with dd
09:39
:)
09:39
<shawnp0wers>
not with the quotes again...
09:39
:D
09:39
hmm... suggestions on what rom-o-matic image?
09:39
floppy?
09:40
<Gadi>
hmm... I guess
09:40
<shawnp0wers>
pxe bootstrap?
09:40
I hate it when my ignorance hangs out like this...
09:40
lol
09:40
<Gadi>
alkisg is my go-to-guy for gPXE
09:40
<alkisg>
:label alkis
09:40
goto alkis ? :D
09:40
<shawnp0wers>
hehehe
09:40
<alkisg>
!rom-o-matic
09:40
<ltspbot>
alkisg: Error: "rom-o-matic" is not a valid command.
09:40
<alkisg>
damn
09:41
<shawnp0wers>
:D
09:41
alkisg: I need to write boot code to a hard drive...
09:41
it's been like 8 years since I've done it
09:41
<alkisg>
grub?
09:41
<shawnp0wers>
and... well, 8 years is a long time
09:41
<alkisg>
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/grubgpxe
09:41
<shawnp0wers>
so like the lkrn image?
09:41
<alkisg>
Right, for grub it's perfect
09:42
linux16 gpxe.krn
09:42
(for grub2)
09:42
<shawnp0wers>
then I just dd the image onto the hard drive?
09:42
<alkisg>
No no no :)
09:43
You want to waste the whole drive?
09:43
<shawnp0wers>
yes
09:43
I only do this because I don't have pxe boot
09:43
the hard drives currently have 8 year old etherboot written to the boot sector
09:43
<alkisg>
Are those the old clients? Why don't you also put a local swap on them?
09:43
<shawnp0wers>
but there is a bug that won't allow etherboot to work right
09:43
hmm...
09:43
that's actually a pretty good idea
09:44
<alkisg>
So just format it normally, e.g. 500 MB swap and the rest ext3
09:45
And put grub and maybe a small recovery distro on the ext3 partition... (e.g. I've put knoppix or dsl on my thin clients there)
09:45
(unless of course you *don't* want them to be able to localboot)
09:45
<shawnp0wers>
then the gpxe.krn is just something to add to the menu.lst for grub?
09:46
<alkisg>
Right
09:46
<shawnp0wers>
and no, I don't want them to local boot
09:46
fascinating idea
09:46
<alkisg>
Well, local boot is handy for copying new gpxe versions :)
09:46
<shawnp0wers>
now if I can just get a boot floppy to actually install with...
09:46
<alkisg>
You can always put a password on grub
09:46
Well, download the gpxe floppy....
09:46
<shawnp0wers>
(yeah, I'll just default to gpxe with a short timeout, not a big deal really)
09:47
what does the gpxe floppy provide?
09:47
<alkisg>
Or the grub-rescue-pc package from ubuntu distros
09:47
<shawnp0wers>
I thought gpxe floppy would, *just* PXE boot. :)
09:47
<alkisg>
see the link I gave you
09:48
Hmmm well it supports installing to the mbr, but not actually copying the files... so no, not that one either
09:49
<shawnp0wers>
suggestions on a minimalistic, text only distro?
09:49
<alkisg>
I guess you need tonysbt what's-the-name or freedos, wait..
09:49
<shawnp0wers>
does tomsrtboot support installing to hard drive?
09:49
well, no, I need grub
09:49
<alkisg>
http://www.toms.net/rb/
09:49
<shawnp0wers>
I'll figure it out
09:49
<alkisg>
With that one you can format the disk
09:49
and partition
09:50
Then, insert the grub disk and copy it...
09:50
shawnp0wers: do those clients have a cd?
09:50
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: well, they do -- no idea if it works though
09:50
I can get one that does
09:50
<alkisg>
Dah. I forgot. You can also do this:
09:50
<shawnp0wers>
once I make the image
09:50
<alkisg>
1) Boot from a gpxe floppy
09:50
<shawnp0wers>
I can just clone the drives though
09:50
<alkisg>
2) Run ltsp! and then format the disk from the ltsp prompt
09:51
I've done that as well some times
09:51
You need to manually mount the disk, but it's easy...
09:51
<shawnp0wers>
cool, but can I create swapspace?
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09:51
<alkisg>
SCREEN_02=shell in lts.conf
09:51
Sure
09:51
mkfs etc
09:51
<shawnp0wers>
oh, right -- after gpxe is installed
09:51
<alkisg>
fdisk for partitioning... you know the deal
09:51
Without installing gpxe
09:52
Boot it from a floppy, and then format the disk without installing gpxe
09:52
<shawnp0wers>
OH, so just use a boot floppy, then to the dirty work from an LTSP5 booted environment
09:52
<alkisg>
After you partition, format etc copy grub and install grub
09:52
And just copy gpxe.krn from the server...
09:52
Right
09:52
<shawnp0wers>
I may have to either google or pick brains about installing grub from there...
09:52
but I'll work on it now
09:52
:)
09:53
<alkisg>
When you get there ping me
09:53
I think I remember most of the stuff
09:53* shawnp0wers goes off in search of the elusive "floppy disk" and a usb floppy drive
09:53
<shawnp0wers>
(for his workstation)
09:54
<alkisg>
For the gpxe disk, you just click "Get image" here: http://rom-o-matic.net/gpxe/gpxe-0.9.9/contrib/rom-o-matic/
09:54
<shawnp0wers>
it gives me a certain joy that the floppy disk I found was a win95 install floppy...
09:54
<alkisg>
...and dd it to a floppy
09:55
Wait
09:55
You can also use this one :)
09:55
(to partition the disk... :))
09:55
<shawnp0wers>
the gpxe disk?
09:55
<alkisg>
No, the win95 install floppy! :D
09:55
<shawnp0wers>
crap, bad floppy
09:55
(oh, it's like "disk 5"
09:55
:)
09:56
<alkisg>
Heh, never mind then
09:56
It's fun playing with all the ancient hardware. Like Indiana Jones or something...
09:59
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: heheh -- http://www.natuba.com/photo/1EY5h4/
09:59
<alkisg>
Muwahahaha :)
10:06
<shawnp0wers>
alkisg: do I point the gpxe to pxelinux.0, or nbi.img?
10:06
<alkisg>
pxelinux.0
10:06
<shawnp0wers>
thx
10:07
<alkisg>
nbi.img is not only difficult to work with, it's also broken in Karmic :)
10:09
<shawnp0wers>
grr, fail on boot
10:09
maybe bad disk
10:09
maybe bad drive
10:09
maybe just bad karma
10:09
(hehehe, bad karma... see what I did there?)
10:10
ok, I'll try to work on it a bit more
10:10
maybe do it in a more recent computer
10:10
and image the drive
10:10
or somethign liket hat
10:11
<alkisg>
If you're going to pull out the hard drive, and put it on a new computer, you can do all the formatting and grub installing there...
10:12
<shawnp0wers>
Yeah, that's what I was thinking
10:12
boot from a CD
10:12
etc
10:12
<alkisg>
You don't need to boot from a CD
10:12
<shawnp0wers>
maybe even install a very stripped down distro
10:12
and add it to the grub menu
10:12
<alkisg>
Ah, ok then
10:13
Deli linux works with 16/32 RAM :)
10:13
<shawnp0wers>
cool, I'll check it out
10:13
I was googling for what distro to try
10:13
:)
10:13
<alkisg>
(with X, I mean, not text only)
10:13
Ah sorry it has lilo
10:13
You can use lilo of course, not sure if you want to, though
10:13
<shawnp0wers>
heck, I could install ubuntu on it for that matter
10:13
not going to load it
10:14
and never going to load x
10:14
<alkisg>
Well then copy the chroot :D
10:14
<shawnp0wers>
OOOO!!! great idea
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12:26
<Denbert>
cyberorg, italc can't see clients if they login via FreeNX - Which admin tool should I use for those clients?
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13:06
<alkisg>
Is the following idea for passwordless ssh an acceptable way to control many standalone clients from a server?
13:06
1) Create ssh keys for the root user on the server: sudo ssh-keygen
13:06
2) Edit /etc/ssh/sshd_config on the clients, and specify: AuthorizedKeysFile /etc/ssh/authorized_keys
13:06
3) Copy the public key of the server root user to the clients' /etc/ssh/authorized_keys
13:06
This way anyone with sudo privileges on the server could do: sudo ssh user@client and automatically logon there.
13:06
Any tactical problems with this approach?
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13:12
<Denbert>
Anyone got an idear to lock users to their home dir?
13:12
<sbalneav>
define "lock users to their home dir"?
13:12
you mean, make it so they can't see anything OUTSIDE their home dir?
13:14
Denbert: ?
13:20
<Denbert>
sbalneav, correct
13:20
<sbalneav>
Not really possible on Unix-like systems
13:21
And not really a worry anyway. They can look, but they can't touch
13:22
And, if you set the default permissions correctly, they won't be able to get into eiach others home dirs, so apart from wandering around looking at the file system, there's no concern.
13:22
<Denbert>
If the setup is for students, they should have their own private documents
13:22
<sbalneav>
right, in their home dirs.
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13:24
<Denbert>
Won't other users be able to see and read their documents
13:25
<sbalneav>
No, not if you set the default home directory permissions to 700
13:25
then they'll only be viewable by the users themselves
13:25
<Denbert>
Ok
13:26
Thanx
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13:27
<Denbert>
How about this doc https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LockdownHomeDirs
13:30
<sbalneav>
How about it?
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13:33
<Denbert>
This doc suggest 770
13:33
but this would give read acces for group, right?
13:36
<sbalneav>
Correct.
13:36
<Denbert>
I'll read up on ACL intensive right now :)
13:36
Looks important for a School LTSP server
13:37
<sbalneav>
The document assumes the groups are assigned in the linux standard way, with each user getting their own group
13:37
if you assign all your users to ONE primary group, then you'll have to use 700
13:42
<Denbert>
Thanks - I'll try to implement groups being class no/grade e.g. 1B
13:42
Therefore I'll keep the 700 in mind
13:44
I've talked to cyberdog earlier today
13:44
about serverload
13:46
If i have a Dual Quad Core Processor server with 32 gb RAM and really fast RAID 1 + 0 setup
13:46
Would this server be able to handle 70 clients?
13:59
<sbalneav>
That's completely and utterly dependent upon what you're wanting to do with the clients.
14:04
<Denbert>
sbalneav, It's for Open Office, Browsing Internet and for some users ability to Videostream from Youtube
14:04
<sbalneav>
If you want 70 clients all watching simultaneous youtube videos, without using localapps, then the answer is no.
14:04
<Denbert>
Mainly OpenOffice and Browsing
14:05
<sbalneav>
Flash is the big resource killer, since it's a badly behaved app
14:05
other than thay, should be fine.
14:05
brb, meeting
14:05
<Denbert>
thanx
14:07
<alkisg>
Denbert: how much RAM do your clients have?
14:07
<MaRX-Mode>
what is the situation with ltsp5 and gentoo? will it going to be a fight get it working ?
14:07
<alkisg>
afaik johnny doesn't have a gentoo box atm, and he's looking to get one... or any help welcome or something like that
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14:09
<MaRX-Mode>
mmh
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14:13
<MaRX-Mode>
so basically i should pull some gentoo machine up and see what's bout to happen
14:14
<alkisg>
For details on the current status, come again and try to find johnny....
14:17
<MaRX-Mode>
thx, i'll fall back to shadows and ask him
14:17
<Denbert>
alkisg, Clints is mixed, most have 128mb or more
14:17
<alkisg>
Denbert: with 256 you could probably run firefox locally. With less, I don't think so.
14:18
If you run firefox locally, flash goes smoother, and the server CPU is not a bottleneck anymore
14:18
Otherwise, even a few clients on youtube could get you 100% CPU usage.
14:19
<Denbert>
Case is that some clients also wil be using NX client from their Windows Laptops - But those will be browsing locally
14:20
I'll try to start 5 clients om my local server and watch youtube later
14:20
<alkisg>
What were you saying about italc before? Why doesn't it support nx clients?
14:20
Is it a ports thing?
14:21
<Denbert>
The italc is installed from ubuntu repo
14:21
the NX client is nomachine
14:22
PXE clients works treat in italc
14:22
<alkisg>
Yeah then I think if you define "LTSP_CLIENT" in the nx client environment, it should work
14:22
<Denbert>
Ok
14:22
<alkisg>
And if it doesn't, I bet it's easily fixable with a little "ica-launcher" tweaking.
14:23
(that's the client italc launcher)
14:27
<Denbert>
in the NX client I have Unix, Windows, VNC & Shadow
14:28
No LTSP_CLIENT
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14:32
<Gadi>
Denbert: try adding: export LTSP_CLIENT=0.0.0.0 to the end of the node.conf file on the server
14:33
<Denbert>
Is userquota controlled like a normal Ubuntu, or do I need a special setup for LTSP?
14:36
Gadi, done, should I restart something?
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14:39
<Denbert>
Gadi, TNAHX - Worked great
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14:42
<alkisg>
Gadi: you should keep a wiki or a blogs with all those nice tips :)
14:44
<Denbert>
How do I save all these posts to my local com :)
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14:45
<Gadi>
alkisg: I am too Web 0.1 ;)
14:45
<alkisg>
Bah, me too, I'm waiting for the revolutionary Web 3.11 :D
14:47
<_UsUrPeR_>
I'm waiting for that sweet VR suit from "The Lawnmower Man"
14:49
<Gadi>
just for the record, that was not my hack and I never used it. I think it got in my brain from some patch stgraber posted somewhere
14:51
<alkisg>
No I knew about the LTSP_CLIENT hack, I just didn't know about node.conf...
14:52
<Gadi>
yeah, I said the same thing - huh. mental note...
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15:03
<Denbert>
alkisg, Youtube is a CPU killer
15:03
<alkisg>
Yeah I know.
15:03
!flash
15:03
<ltspbot>
alkisg: "flash" :: Yes, flash sucks. Make sure you have LDM_DIRECTX=True in your lts.conf file, or if it's just youtube you're after, try the HQtube plugin. Install greasemonkey for firefox, and see http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/24999
15:03
<Denbert>
Having 3 clients now running U2 Live from Rosebowl
15:08
Should greasemonkey be installed on server or should I install in LTSP area?
15:10
<alkisg>
Server
15:10
I also have this one bookmarked, I don't know which one is better: http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/50771
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15:12
<Denbert>
Installed the first script
15:13
3 youtube sessions, still burns CPU
15:13
should I restart Client FireFox?
15:18
My server is a Quadcore AMD 9950 BE, 64-bit OS, 8 GB Ram - AVG CPU is 48% for 3 clients streaming Youtube
15:22
Stopping browsers, and CPU load drops to 5-6%
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