IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 16 October 2008   (all times are UTC)

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00:28
<sbalneav>
ogra: Ping
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00:31
<FuriousGeorge>
im using ltsp with kubuntu, and while the kde sounds work (like when i log in) neither konqueror nor firefox's audio make it to the client
00:32
firefox doesnt really surprise me but kubuntu does
00:32
err, i mean konqueror
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00:34
<FuriousGeorge>
surely there is some way to change that, right?
00:34
<cyberorg>
FuriousGeorge, install libflashsupport
00:34
<sbalneav>
Yup, that'll fix the firefox
00:35
<FuriousGeorge>
libflash? ill try it next time im there in the morning... that isn't the same thing as the flash-plugin i manually installed for ff?
00:36
(and konqui)
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00:36
<sbalneav>
no, libflashsupport is to redirect the flash plugin to use alsa/pulseaudio
00:39
<FuriousGeorge>
sbalneav: cyberorg: awesome, thanks
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01:42
<julius>
hi, I have a question relating to ltsp and nfs
01:43
on the client I am getting an error: nfsmount: error mounting 172.31.100.254:/opt/ltsp/i386 on /sysroot as nfs: Bad file descriptor
01:44
on the server I'm getting: mountd[27536]: authenticated mount request from 172.31.100.100:601 for /opt/ltsp/i386 (/opt/ltsp)
01:45
is this the right place to ask?
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01:54
<johnny>
julius, yes.. i just don't have time to help you with it right at this second
01:58
<Pascal_1>
Bonjour
02:07
<julius>
hi johnny thanks
02:07
I'll be up another hour
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02:21
<feinbein>
hi, does someone know how to activate local harddiscs on ltsp-clients?
02:23
[default] LOCALDEV=True is in my lts.conf
02:23
but how do i access the local device on the client?
02:24
the idea behind is taking images of local harddisks via mondobackup, dd etc
02:26
or f. ex. crash recovery on Windows pcs not booting
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02:53
<julius>
hi johnny do you reckon you'llbe able to help inthe nxt while?
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06:05
<feinbein>
hi, anyone knowledgable around?
06:06
need some help with access to local harddiscs in ltsp-clients
06:06
[default] LOCALDEV=True is set in lts.conf
06:07
<nubae>
!docs
06:07
<ltspbot>
nubae: "docs" is For the most current documentation, see http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
06:07
<nubae>
the last part of the docs shows how to do that
06:07
its in the Appendix
06:08
<feinbein>
i have read it but there is no info on how to access localdiscs
06:09
i just found the parameter for the lts.conf but not how you access a lokal sata or ide disc
06:09
if i look at /dev/sda1 i get whats on the servers bootpartition
06:09
<ogra>
section 26.1
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06:12
<feinbein>
i did exactly that but nothing changed in my clients. How can I now access the disk? Like for ex. to take an image of the entire disk
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07:31
<nubae>
hey, I'm being asked, how is dbus-launch works in ltsp
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07:37
<ogra>
nubae, it attaches to the servers system dbus
07:37
<nubae>
hmm anyone know if dbus is launched with ----exit-with-session
07:37
<ogra>
which is suboptimal
07:37
<nubae>
I'm trying to debug sugar, which keeps its dbus running after log out
07:38
<ogra>
we dont run dbus explicitly
07:38
the systems session is responsible for that
07:38
(gnome-session and the kde equivalent do that)
07:40
<Blinny>
Yeah dbus died for me this morning too.
07:40
<nubae>
any idea, what could cause sessions to keep running after logging out? (on sugar that is)
07:40
it stops collaboration working :-(
07:40
<ogra>
nubae, i think you need to convince whatever session manager sugar uses to use dbus
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07:41
<nubae>
it does use dbus
07:41
<ogra>
well, make it use --exit-with-session
07:41
tahts what gnome does at least
07:44
<nubae>
so with gnome, it definetly dies, right?
07:44
so u think this is sugar's session manager that has problems?
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08:02
<nubae>
fixed... doing dbus-launch sugar-shell --exit-with-session
08:03
<ogra>
sweet, the new ubuntu logout process works very well, no hanging processes at all
08:03
sbalneav, looks like the hanging procs issues are solved in intrepid
08:03
<nubae>
nice
08:08
so running sugar, launches 2 dbus sessions
08:08* ogra guesses it has some builtin mechanism already
08:09
<nubae>
well sugar launches one, where is the other one coming from?
08:09
<ogra>
are you sure thats not the system bus ?
08:10
<nubae>
run by user... and both die on exit, so dont think so
08:10
btw... do we have ck-launch-session ?
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08:46
<sbalneav>
ogra: And guess what
08:46
<jammcq>
Scottty !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
08:47
<sbalneav>
Xsession < /dev/null > /dev/null solves them in Hardy too!
08:47
hey jammcq!
08:47
<ogra>
sbalneav, in the wrong place though :)
08:48
gnome-session not cleaning up its mess was the main issue ... though it will help with other session managers as well
08:48
sbalneav, does that work with arguments given to Xsession like we call it now ?
08:48
<sbalneav>
When I did the < > /dev/null, everything but the gvs-fuse thing exited cleanly
08:48
and that's a known bug for it.,
08:49
<ogra>
so, "Xsession default < /dev/null > /dev/null" works as well ?
08:49
<sbalneav>
yup, that's what I did! sweet
08:50
<ogra>
great
08:50
<sbalneav>
I also exited the session with the ssh -O exit, and that worked well.
08:50
<ogra>
try also with direct paths to session binaries please, thats what we'll do soon by default
08:51
<sbalneav>
I'll push a branch with my changes today for the -trunk, and I'll work up a patch + file a bug for hardy.
08:51
ok, I'll check that too.
08:51
<ogra>
since default is just a magic word
08:51
resulting in a no-op for ubuntu, but important on fedora i think
08:52
<sbalneav>
so Xsession /usr/bin/mygoofysession < /dev/null > /dev/null
08:52
<ogra>
right
08:52
<sbalneav>
gotcha
08:52
I'll test it today/tonight.
08:52
<ogra>
in ubuntu default is ignored and it will just do what it does anyway
08:52
<sbalneav>
right.
08:53* ogra has to rush out
08:53* sbalneav is so happy
08:53
<jammcq>
doing the happy dance?
08:54* Gadi claps for sbalneav
08:54
<sbalneav>
That'll solve a lot of problems, methinks
08:54
<Gadi>
sbalneav: also check that it still writes to ~/.xsession-errors
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08:54* Gadi is not sure if that comes from stdout as well as stderr
08:55
<sbalneav>
I checked that, it only redirects 2> to .xsession-errors
08:55
but yeah, I'll double check it
08:55
When I got it working at 1 am, I just went to bed happy at that point :)
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09:08
<Q-FUNK>
stdhorror
09:09
I keep on wondering why virologists and urologists don't all end up in computer science. I mean, we have these things called stin, stdout, stderror, stdrepeatifnecessary, etc.
09:10* _UsUrPeR_ groans
09:10
<_UsUrPeR_>
q-funk, that was funny in a goofy pun sort of way
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09:36
<_UsUrPeR_>
Does anyone have any experience with kiosk mode in Ubuntu?
09:37
Booting and pulling up the firefox image, compared to normal LTSP operation is incredibly slow
09:37
any hints?
09:47
<johnny>
how much ram?
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10:16
<_UsUrPeR_>
johnny: 2 gig server, 256 client
10:16
sorry about the wait time on response
10:17
<feinbein>
anybody has managed to set up access to local harddisks (not usb)?
10:18
LOCALDEV=True is set and udev-rulez are set according to new manual
10:18
what to do now to access a local f.ex. a local sata-drive?
10:19
btw. ltsp-update-image has also been run
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10:48
<ninkendo>
Are there any customized version of the ltsp client distro that has an integrated NX client?
10:48
I'm starting to think that using NX's compression would help a lot of problems with speed and resources that I'm facing with the default LTSP setup
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10:49
<cliebow>
ninkendo:Gadi did some work on that..long a go
10:49
<profes>
hi all
10:49
<cliebow>
ho
10:49
<_UsUrPeR_>
morning
10:50
<profes>
i have a problem with localdev, the icon appeared in the desktop but the localdev shows empty
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10:52
<profes>
when I enter to the localdev folder in the desktop, it is empty
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10:55
<sbalneav>
Well, maybe there's no files on the device you're looking at :)
10:55
<cliebow>
Scottie!
10:55
<profes>
haha I check it in another machine
10:55
checked, there is a lot of files in the device.
10:56
<sbalneav>
Is the user a member of the fuse group?
10:57
<profes>
yes, of couse
10:57
*course
10:58
<sbalneav>
ok, please run the command "id" from a terminal window, and paste the results to the pastebot
10:58
!pastebot
10:58
<ltspbot>
sbalneav: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
10:59
<profes>
a terminal in x or a local terminal (ctrl+alt+F?) ?
11:00
<ltsppbot>
"profes" pasted "profes@clases:~$ id uid=524(pr" (3 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/42
11:00
<profes>
I did it in a terminal in X
11:02
<sbalneav>
Hmm, fuse is 102
11:02
it's usually 107
11:03
getent group fuse & paste
11:03
<ogra>
sbalneav, no
11:03
<sbalneav>
no?
11:03
<ogra>
fuse runs addgroup during install
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11:03
<ogra>
so depending what distro you run it can have any number, based on when you install it
11:03
<sbalneav>
ok, well, doesn't hurt to check anyway :)
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11:04
<profes>
i'll paste getent group fuse
11:04
<sbalneav>
http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i2jb6VPJX4XBa5yiEEIuPjrcZmFwD93R3JIG1
11:04
<ltsppbot>
"profes" pasted "profes@clases:~$ getent group" (3 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/43
11:05
<ogra>
sbalneav, lol
11:05
<sbalneav>
ok, seems legit.
11:05
<ogra>
sbalneav, so i could sure santa because he has an address ?
11:05
*sue
11:05
<sbalneav>
No
11:05
To be served with papers, there has to be a REAL address with a REAL person there.
11:06
The legal system takes that sort of thing very seriously.
11:06
<ogra>
well, if you write a letter to santa claus, nortpole it will likely get somewhere :)
11:06
*north
11:07
millions of children surely do that every year
11:07
<sbalneav>
Right, but if you GO to the north pole, there isn't a gingerbread house there, with a jolly old fat man in red jumpers there. :)
11:07
<cliebow>
He IS Real!
11:07
<ogra>
there has to be
11:07
<sbalneav>
No, he's in Canada
11:07
<ogra>
heh
11:07
<sbalneav>
We keep him in Northern Manitoba. Well kept secret.
11:07
Shhh
11:07
<profes>
sbalneav, I think you've never been in northpole, so you can't know :p
11:07
<cliebow>
Ohh you mean That North Pole
11:08
<sbalneav>
profes: How do *YOU* know I've never been to the north pole?
11:08
<profes>
since you think santa doesn't exist :P
11:08
<sbalneav>
Oh, I think he exists.
11:08
He's just not at the north pole.
11:08
Therefore, delivery of papers would fail.
11:09
At any rate
11:09
<profes>
may be in north pole papers are redirected
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11:09
<sbalneav>
lets do a grep "ltsp" /proc/mounts, and paste that
11:09
<profes>
okok, but... what could I check about my problem
11:11
sbalneav, it returned nothing
11:11
I did it in an gui terminal
11:12
<sbalneav>
Well, the ltspfs filesystem isn't mounting then
11:12
so, something's the matter
11:12
<profes>
maybe the command was cat /proc/mounts | grep "ltsp" ?
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11:13
<sbalneav>
that's the same as what I said
11:13
<profes>
damn
11:13
<sbalneav>
What server are you running? Ubuntu?
11:13
<profes>
rhel
11:14
<sbalneav>
What version of LTSP are you running?
11:14
LTSP5? or 4.2?
11:14
<profes>
4.2 (my terminals are too crappy)
11:15
<ogra>
sbalneav, ubunt would have had a uid > 1000 ;)
11:15
*ubuntu
11:15
<profes>
i already checked troubleshooting and all steps worked fine, so how could I remount ltspfs?
11:16
<sbalneav>
What did you check for troubleshooting?
11:17
<profes>
every steps (even reboot system, step 12)
11:17
http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42-LocalDev#Troubleshooting
11:18
<Gadi>
profes: is the filesystem ntfs?
11:18
<profes>
no, isnt
11:18
<Gadi>
the one on the local hard drive
11:18
<profes>
is fat32
11:18
<ogra>
is the device properly partitioned ?
11:18
<profes>
its an usb drive
11:18
yes, i have another machine and it worked fine there
11:19
<Gadi>
that does not mean it is partitioned
11:19
<profes>
it has the same hardware and software
11:19
<ogra>
is the device properly partitioned ?
11:19
<Gadi>
it is a thin client running ltsp 4.2?
11:19
<profes>
but i copy files into it, and then checked in 2 machines
11:19
<ogra>
(i didnt ask if it works elsewhere ;) )
11:20
<profes>
i think is prperly partitioned
11:20
Gadi, yes
11:20
<ogra>
so it mounts sdX1 and not sdX on the other machines ?
11:20
<Gadi>
profes: so on another thin client, it works, but on this thin client it does not
11:21
yeah, do that- plug it into the server and pastebot: dmesg|tail
11:21
<profes>
ok
11:23
<ltsppbot>
"profes" pasted "profes@clases:~$ dmesg |tail i" (12 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/44
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11:25
<Gadi>
profes: this is a USB flash drive or a USB hard drive?
11:25
<profes>
usb hard drive
11:26
<Gadi>
do dmesg|tail one more time
11:26
with it plugged in
11:26
are there any more messages?
11:27
<profes>
is the same message
11:27
<Gadi>
grep sd /proc/mounts
11:27
<profes>
just in case: the dmesg|tail that I did was with the device plugged in
11:27
<Gadi>
right
11:27
plugged into the server
11:28
<profes>
yed
11:28
*yes
11:28
<Gadi>
so, mount it on the server
11:28
<ltsppbot>
"profes" pasted "[root@clases ~]# grep sd /proc" (4 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/45
11:28
<Gadi>
sorry - browse the hard drive first
11:28
then just pastebot: cat /proc/mounts
11:29
<profes>
what do you mean with 'browse the hard drive first' ?
11:29
where do you want to see?
11:30
<Gadi>
I mean, make sure the hard drive is mounted
11:30
it won't appear in /proc/mounts if you just plug it in
11:30
(unless it automounts)
11:32
<profes>
:S i think i have problems here... according to dmesg|tail the two partitions should be sg0 and sg1 but when im trying to mount i got the message 'mount /dev/sg0 is not an block device', the same to sg1
11:33
(why sg* and not sda*, sdb*, etc..) ?
11:34
i'll try with an usb flash drive
11:35
<Gadi>
profes: can you browse files on the hard drive in nautilus?
11:35
read: graphical file browser
11:35
<profes>
Gadi, as you see, i cant mount it
11:36
<Gadi>
are you mounting it by hand?
11:36
from a terminal?
11:36
or using the volume manager?
11:36
<profes>
but, when i plugged it their icon appeared in desktop but empty
11:36
<Gadi>
(you told me before: (12:18:52 PM) profes: yes, i have another machine and it worked fine there)
11:37
<profes>
yes
11:37
thats true
11:37
<Gadi>
so, I am confused
11:37
doesn't "worked fine" == mounted?
11:38
<profes>
I have two identical machines, in the other machine it worked fine, showing files and such, plugged in clients. But in this machine when i plug in clients the icon appear in desktop but when I browse with nautilus it shows empty
11:40
now, i have the drive plugged into the server
11:42
but i cannot mount, i dont know which device is, according to dmesg|tail the drive's partitions should be sg0 and sg1 (i was expecting sdb* or some), but when i trying to mount sg0 or sg1 i got 'mount: /dev/sg0 isnot a block device', the same to sg1
11:42
<sbalneav>
So, maybe you've just got a USB problem on that one machine
11:42
If it works fine on ANOTHER thin client, then you're setup is ok
11:43
Maybe you've just got a bad USB port
11:43
<profes>
now, ill try a standard usb flashdisk
11:43
in a client
11:43
let's see if i can browse the files
11:43
<Gadi>
you may also want to set up a shell session, too, on the client
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11:43
<Gadi>
so you can see the dmesg output there
11:43
could be too high a current draw
11:43
<profes>
i have a shell session in clients
11:43
<Gadi>
USB is very sensitive to that
11:44
if you draw too much current, the driver can shutdown and only be fixed with a reboot
11:44
<profes>
wow, i cannot see files in usb flash disk neither, but icon appeared as i said
11:44
now, ill plug usb flashdisk in the server
11:46
OMG it worked plugged into the server
11:46
the usb flashdisk is /dev/sdb and its partition is sdb1
11:48
why the usb harrdisk is /dev/sg ?
11:48
what is sg
11:48
?
11:49
<sbalneav>
A general device.
11:49
the local workstation can't detect what it is.
11:49
<loather>
scsi generic
11:49
<sbalneav>
I think you've just got a problem on that one workstation.
11:49
<profes>
hum i see, ok, it seems that the problem is ltspfs
11:49
<sbalneav>
Maybe the hardware's bad
11:50
no, you said it worked at another workstatin
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11:50
<profes>
no, another machine (an identical server, with identical clients)
11:51
<sbalneav>
<quote>I have two identical machines, in the other machine it worked fine</quote>
11:51
<Gadi>
sbalneav: I think machine == server
11:51
<profes>
ok, when i said machines i mean server
11:51
yes
11:52
<Gadi>
profes: the thin client power supply may not have enough power to support an external USB hard drive
11:52
are these thin clients with an external power supply?
11:53
and does the hard drive have its own power supply?
11:53
real hard drives draw a lot of current
11:53
<profes>
Gadi, yes, the power is enough, i think is ltspfs as sbalneav said
11:54
<Gadi>
well, can you get the hard drive to mount on the server now?
11:54
because that would be the first step
11:54
to make sure the drive is good
11:54
<profes>
sbalneav Well, the ltspfs filesystem isn't mounting then
11:54
sbalneav so, something's the matter
11:56
how can i fix that? where can i check?
12:02
Gadi, i cannot get hd mounted on the server, but i can mount the usb flash disk perfectly, so since now ill only try with the flashdisk
12:02
<Gadi>
ok
12:04
<profes>
Gadi, where can i check if ltspfs isnt working fine?
12:06
<Gadi>
profes: did you install the ltspfs package on that second server?
12:06elisboa has joined #ltsp
12:06
<profes>
yes, everything worked fine just a couple days ago
12:07
<Gadi>
hmm - what changed?
12:07
did you update the server?
12:07
<profes>
nop, nothing, maybe a configuration was changed by mistake or erased
12:08
anyway, how can i check if ltspfs is installed ?
12:08
<Gadi>
on rhel? rpm -qa|grep ltspfs
12:09
<profes>
:o noting... :S
12:09
<Gadi>
actually
12:09
rpm -qa|grep ltsp
12:09
looks like the rpm is ltsp-server-pkg-fedora
12:10
<profes>
ltsp-utils and ltsp-server-pkg-fedora
12:10
<Gadi>
(if that's the one you installed)
12:10
<profes>
and i have available the command ltspfs
12:11
<Gadi>
lsmod|grep fuse
12:11
<profes>
fuse 49556 0
12:12
<Gadi>
firewall?
12:12
can you mount any devices?
12:12
on the thin client?
12:12
<profes>
i havent firewall, how can i check if i can mount devices in client?
12:13
<Gadi>
I mean, do any devices come up correctly?
12:13
or have you only tried the usb flash and usb hard disk?
12:13
<profes>
i did cat /etc/fstab in client shell (ctrl+alt+f1 in my case) and i got the device info
12:13julius has joined #ltsp
12:14
<Gadi>
hmm... try putting the shell on screen 2 and the startx on screen 1
12:14
<profes>
hum.. ive not tried another devices, just a camera, with the same results (empty folder)
12:14
sorry, shell is in screen2
12:14
x on scr1
12:14CAN-o-SPAM has joined #ltsp
12:15
<Gadi>
ps -efw|grep lbus
12:15
<profes>
in shell?
12:16
<Gadi>
in terminal window
12:16
on server
12:16
<profes>
/usr/bin/perl -w ...
12:16
<Gadi>
ok, and on the shell?
12:17
<profes>
/sbin/lbuscd
12:17japerry has joined #ltsp
12:19Lns has joined #ltsp
12:20
<Gadi>
profes: in the terminal window, do: echo $DISPLAY, and in the shell do: hostname
12:20
<Blinny>
Just tuning in - is the HD partitioned?
12:20* Lns waves good morning to all
12:21
<Gadi>
make sure that they match exactly (except for :0.0)
12:21
<profes>
yes, it matches
12:22
<Gadi>
no domain names, right?
12:22
<profes>
nop
12:23
<Gadi>
/usr/sbin/lbus_event_handler.sh add block /tmp 1024 Temp
12:23
you tried that?
12:23
<profes>
nop, now ill try
12:23
in X right?
12:24
<Gadi>
right
12:24ltsppbot has quit IRC
12:25
<profes>
[root@clases ~]# /usr/sbin/lbus_event_handler.sh add block /tmp 1024 Temp
12:25
ERROR connecting
12:26
<Gadi>
now we're getting somewhere
12:26
are you using ldap for auth?
12:26
or local users?
12:27
<profes>
local users i think
12:27
its a server+switch+clients, no more
12:29
<Gadi>
that's an ltspfs error
12:30
<profes>
the tmp folder is created in ~/Drives folder but the desktop icon doesnt appear
12:30
<Gadi>
on the shell, do: ps -efw|grep ltspfsd
12:31
it sounds like ltspfsd is not running
12:31
<profes>
nothing
12:31
<Gadi>
on the shell, do: getltscfg LOCAL_STORAGE
12:32
<profes>
i got Y
12:32
<Gadi>
try rebooting the thin client
12:32
and logging into X
12:33
and running that lbus_event_handler command
12:33
brb
12:34
<profes>
ok, ill try to reboot another client, its the same?
12:34
<Gadi>
if it is the same, check for ltspfsd on the client
12:34ltsppbot has joined #ltsp
12:34
<Gadi>
and try to run it manually from a shell
12:35
<profes>
ok
12:35Q-FUNK has quit IRC
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12:36Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp
12:36Q-FUNK1 has quit IRC
12:36
<profes>
OMG! sh*t nsognsfklfslkfsfmgportrTJSO it worked fine in other clients :@!!!!
12:37
ill reboot this freakin client... ill come in 4 mins to tell you what happened, Thanks Gadi , bye
12:37profes has quit IRC
12:39profes has joined #ltsp
12:40
<profes>
OMG it worked...
12:40
:S
12:40
:D
12:40
hahahah
12:40
freakin client, how... it could happen _S?
12:40
omg, thanks a LOT!
12:41profes has quit IRC
12:41* Blinny blinks
12:45laprag has joined #ltsp
12:48
<laprag>
jammcq: ping
12:51ltsppbot has quit IRC
12:52
<laprag>
ltspbot: help
12:52
<ltspbot>
laprag: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
12:52
<laprag>
ltspbot: help seen
12:52
<ltspbot>
laprag: (seen [<channel>] <nick>) -- Returns the last time <nick> was seen and what <nick> was last seen saying. <channel> is only necessary if the message isn't sent on the channel itself.
12:52
<laprag>
ltspbot: seen jammcq
12:52
<ltspbot>
laprag: jammcq was last seen in #ltsp 3 hours, 58 minutes, and 58 seconds ago: <jammcq> doing the happy dance?
12:53
<laprag>
ltspbot: seen sbalneav
12:53
<ltspbot>
laprag: sbalneav was last seen in #ltsp 1 hour, 2 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: <sbalneav> <quote>I have two identical machines, in the other machine it worked fine</quote>
12:54ltsppbot has joined #ltsp
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12:55nubae has joined #ltsp
13:04tux_440volt has quit IRC
13:05
<julius>
hi, I have a question relating to ltsp and nfs
13:05
on the client I am getting an error: nfsmount: error mounting 172.31.100.254:/opt/ltsp/i386 on /sysroot as nfs: Bad file descriptor
13:05
on the server I'm getting: mountd[27536]: authenticated mount request from 172.31.100.100:601 for /opt/ltsp/i386 (/opt/ltsp)
13:05
is this the right place to ask?
13:06
<Gadi>
julius: try restarting the nfs server
13:06
<julius>
thanks I tried that
13:06
<Gadi>
grep ltsp /etc/exports
13:06
is the exports file correct?
13:06
<julius>
/opt/ltsp 172.31.100.0/24(ro,async,no_root_squash)
13:06
I believe so
13:07
it had a * instead of the ip before but I get the same poblem either way
13:07
<Gadi>
which version of ltsp?
13:07
<julius>
should be 5.... is there a way to tell from the cli?
13:08
<Gadi>
what distribution?
13:08
<julius>
it says 5.1.26
13:08
fedora
13:08
rpms are:
13:08
ltspfs-0.5.2-1.fc9.i386
13:08
ltsp-server-5.1.26-1.fc9.i386
13:08
<Gadi>
warren is our resident fedora ltsp guy
13:08
!seen warren
13:08
<ltspbot>
Gadi: warren was last seen in #ltsp 2 days, 19 hours, 5 minutes, and 2 seconds ago: <warren> I think it is already set by something else
13:08
<julius>
:) cool
13:08
<Gadi>
hmm
13:08
<julius>
heheheh
13:08
<Gadi>
thats not gonna help atm
13:09
<julius>
there's no huge hurry. I'll get ready for work and try again in an hour or so.
13:09
<Gadi>
can you try mounting /opt/ltsp/i386 from another computer via nfs?
13:09
<julius>
I'm just a bit stuck :)
13:09
um
13:09
<Gadi>
or from localhost
13:09
<julius>
I'll trylcalhost
13:09
<Gadi>
try, as root:
13:09
mkdir /tmp/mnt
13:10
mount -t nfs 172.31.100.100:/opt/ltsp/i386 /tmp/mnt
13:10
and see if that works
13:10ltsppbot has quit IRC
13:10
<Gadi>
if you still get Bad file descriptor, then it sounds like nfs is not exporting properly
13:11
and you may (if you can) want to go ahead and reboot the server
13:11
<julius>
mount -t nfs localhost:/opt/ltsp /mnt/cdrom
13:11
mount.nfs: Unknown error 521
13:11
<Gadi>
or check that the chroot (/opt/ltsp/i386) got created properly
13:11
<julius>
(great :))
13:11
<Gadi>
sounds like the nfs server
13:12
can you reboot the entire system?
13:12
<julius>
yeah... weird, I've never really had trouble with nfs before
13:12
oh yeah no worries
13:12
<Gadi>
try that
13:12
if the problem persists, try rebuilding the chroot
13:12ltsppbot has joined #ltsp
13:14
<julius>
cool thanks for the help
13:16vagrantc has joined #ltsp
13:20Lns has quit IRC
13:21
<sbalneav>
laprag: Ragnar!!!!!!
13:21
<jammcq>
where?
13:22
<sbalneav>
Isn't laprag ragnar?
13:22
<jammcq>
ah
13:22
yeah
13:22
laprag: pong
13:22
missed the ping
13:22
i'm hoping he's pinging me to tell me he bought his plane ticket to BTS
13:22* sbalneav hopes Ragnar is coming
13:23* sbalneav hopes Ragnar brings Line Aquavit
13:23
<jammcq>
heh
13:23* sbalneav should stop talking in the third person
13:23nubae has quit IRC
13:23* sbalneav is eaten by a grue
13:24
<laprag>
hey
13:24nubae has joined #ltsp
13:24
<laprag>
yep
13:24
<jammcq>
hey laprag
13:24
<laprag>
got it booked
13:24
<jammcq>
yep, as in yer coming?
13:24
<laprag>
:)
13:24
<jammcq>
AWESOME !!!
13:24
where are you flying in to?
13:25
<laprag>
atm Boston, but could be NYC
13:25
I'll get there Friday pm at the latest
13:25
<jammcq>
we gotta get you up to Maine then
13:25
hmm, friday?
13:25
<laprag>
don't worry, i'll figure that out
13:25Blinny has quit IRC
13:25
<sbalneav>
\o/ for Ragnar!
13:26
<laprag>
can't have you drive always :)
13:26
hey Scotty!
13:26
<jammcq>
laprag: I'll have the ltsp bus with me
13:26
<laprag>
heh
13:26
ltspmobile
13:27
sbalneav: hey, i'll make sure i bring that ;-) but leave me out of the emptying of it ...
13:28
<sbalneav>
I'm not usually one for spirits, and stick to beer and wine, but I REALLY liked that Line Aq. that you brought to Montreal
13:28Lns has joined #ltsp
13:28
<sbalneav>
And the shame is, I can't get it here in Canuckistan.
13:28
<laprag>
sbalneav: gotcha
13:28
how bout some mik chocolate?
13:28
milk
13:28
<sbalneav>
Well, chocolate's good too.
13:28
<jammcq>
count me in
13:28
<laprag>
smoked salmon maybe?
13:29
<sbalneav>
Caviar?
13:29
<laprag>
champagne?
13:29
bah, we'll have fun
13:29
<sbalneav>
That we will.
13:30
<laprag>
should i bring a laptop?
13:30
<sbalneav>
jammcq: Hey, does your car's audio take a iPud?
13:30
<laprag>
prolly no need to bother
13:30
<sbalneav>
laprag: If you want, but bringing YOU is the most important.
13:30* laprag blushes
13:31
<jammcq>
sbalneav: it's got a little headphone type jack on the front that we can plug anything in to
13:31
<laga_>
that was sweet.
13:31
<sbalneav>
Bonus
13:31X0d_of_N3d_ has joined #ltsp
13:31
<laprag>
sbalneav: 's long as you play that miles davis album
13:31
kind of blue
13:32
<sbalneav>
I've got that.
13:32
It will be played.
13:32
<laprag>
jammcq: what time are you passing by Boston?
13:32
sbalneav: great!
13:33
<sbalneav>
I also have 3 albums of some of your neighbours
13:33
Vrttin
13:33
<laprag>
sbalneav: ummm, what might that be?
13:34ogra has quit IRC
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13:36Q-FUNK has quit IRC
13:37
<jammcq>
laprag: not sure. we're leaving Detroit area around 5:30pm on wednesday evening
13:37bobby_C has joined #ltsp
13:38
<laprag>
jammcq: right, but you're stopping somewhere on the way then?
13:38
<jammcq>
laprag: prolly somewhere in upstate NY
13:39
then thursday we'll finish the journey. not exactly going through boston, but definately through Mass. If you happened to be at BOS and needed a ride tho, i'm sure my car would know how to get us there
13:39
<Gadi>
laprag: what are we drinking? I had some good 107 proof stuff yesterday
13:39
<laprag>
ok, currently i have a ticket that says BOS ETA around 1pm.
13:40
<jammcq>
for thursday?
13:42
<laprag>
yes
13:43
<sbalneav>
laprag: http://www.varttina.com/
13:43
<laprag>
but, as i said, it's not a final routing, i might have to go to nyc for a meeting thursday. will keep you posted
13:43
<sbalneav>
Sorry, spelt it wrong
13:43
<Gadi>
laprag: I will most likely drive up from NY on Thursday
13:44
let me know if you need a lift
13:44
<jammcq>
ooh, there's an option too
13:44
<laprag>
sbalneav: don't tell me you bought that record for the music ...
13:45
Gadi: oh, thanks! might be a possibility. i won't bore you with all the permutations though.
13:45
<Gadi>
no worries
13:45
<sbalneav>
laprag: Sure, it's neat
13:45* Gadi looked into renting a hybrid - but only Hertz in NYC has them
13:46
<sbalneav>
"Eclectic"
13:46
<laprag>
sbalneav: :-) thought it might be for the pictures
13:46
<Gadi>
if I do it, maybe I'll meet you in NYC
13:46
<jammcq>
laprag: well, you could call me, even on thursday afternoon, and we could swing by and get you, if need be
13:46
<laprag>
Gadi: that would be great. are you in nyc itself?
13:47
<Gadi>
30 min north
13:47
I can take the train in
13:47
<laprag>
jammcq, gadi: great, thanks for the offers. I'm sure I'll make it to Southwest Harbour this year too :)
13:48
<jammcq>
well then, we officially have our selves a BTS then, eh?
13:48* Gadi will try to have only 1 shot of the 107 proof stuff, so I can remember the name and pick up a bottle
13:48
<laprag>
Gadi: heh, gas prices getting to you? drill baby drill, that'll fix it ;)
13:49
jammcq: well, thanks for organising it! we only show up!
13:49
<Gadi>
heh - well, if the election aint a reason to drink, I don't know what is
13:49
<jammcq>
perhaps we'll have something to celebrate
13:52
<laprag>
here on the dark fringes of civilisation we have our favourite
13:52laga_ has left #ltsp
13:52
<laprag>
but we don't get to vote
13:52
in your race
13:55
<vagrantc>
with any luck, most people here won't get to vote either
13:55
<laprag>
oh? why is that a good thing?
13:56* vagrantc forgot <sarcasm> tags
13:56
<laprag>
ah
13:56mikkel has quit IRC
13:59_UsUrPeR__ has joined #ltsp
13:59mikkel has joined #ltsp
13:59
<Lns>
So I just installed Flash 10, and uninstalled libflashsupport, and sound still works... does that mean adobe got it right this time?
14:00* vagrantc wonders if the president of diebold promised any elections this year
14:01_UsUrPeR_ has quit IRC
14:01_UsUrPeR__ is now known as _UsUrPeR_
14:02
<loather-work>
vagrantc: of course they did
14:03
<vagrantc>
loather-work: i forgot to say "in public speeches"
14:03* vagrantc is forgetful today
14:03
<loather-work>
oh, haha
14:03
<Lns>
vagrantc: of course, they even get to choose who becomes president!
14:04
<loather-work>
yeah, i'm not looking forward to this year's election
14:05
<johnny>
21 days...
14:05
why can't it be tomorrow .. so we can get it over with..
14:08* Lns wishes the US still believed in power going to the state
14:10
<johnny>
well. depends on the level.
14:10
civil rights?
14:10radoeka has joined #ltsp
14:11
<Lns>
I think we'd all be better off if all the states became their own countries :p
14:11radoeka has left #ltsp
14:11
<johnny>
not if all
14:11
<Lns>
That way California could rule all!
14:11
<johnny>
i'd say groups of states
14:11
<vagrantc>
new mexico is poor and has a *lot* of nukes.
14:11Q-FUNK has joined #ltsp
14:11
<vagrantc>
very dangerous combination.
14:12
<Gadi>
don't forget salsa
14:12
<Lns>
lol Gadi
14:12* Gadi wonders why the whole state hasn't exploded
14:12
<Lns>
Sharks in the salsa. Our shark.
14:12
<Gadi>
hehe
14:13
<Lns>
Anyone using Flash 10 that was released yesterday with their ltsp setups?
14:15
<nubae>
> Are you a programmer? A lot of people seem to think I am, but that's just good acting on my part. :)
14:15
lol sbalneav
14:16
Lns: might as well put a stick of dynamite in the server
14:17
<pscheie>
johnny, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nine_Nations_of_North_America
14:19
<Q-FUNK>
nubae: they make the same asumptions about anyone who uses a non-windows OS
14:19julius has quit IRC
14:19
<nubae>
:-)
14:21
Q-FUNK: hows the job search coming?
14:22
<Q-FUNK>
nubae: so-so
14:25
<nubae>
things are doing good here... the ministry has agreed on a years contract with the xos and I'll get to present the thin can sometime next week... I'm desperately trying to get sugar to do collaboration properly over LTSP... lots of bugs to work through, but its looking good
14:26
the idea is everyone runs sugar, ltsp, or xo based... and the 2 coexist happily
14:28
<_UsUrPeR_>
nubae: with most of sugar being collaboration software, what problems in particular are you running into?
14:29
<Lns>
nubae: hehe, why do you say that? did you have a bad experience?
14:29
<nubae>
there are issues with Network Damager
14:29
under ubuntu the latest 0.7 isnt compatible with the latest sugar... typical... the damager strikes again
14:32
_UsUrPeR_: right now, the terminals see each other just fine, they see when another activity is being shared, but when one starts up the desired app, the other terminal's activity locks up
14:32
<_UsUrPeR_>
ahh
14:32
huh
14:32Q-FUNK has quit IRC
14:34
<_UsUrPeR_>
which ubuntu release are you running?
14:34
<nubae>
but it will be such a bonus for this to work...
14:34
intrepid
14:34Egyptian[Home]1 has quit IRC
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14:35
<_UsUrPeR_>
oh. Did you have any lick with hardy and sugar?
14:35
or is this your first attempt?
14:35
<nubae>
didnt really try... the latest stuff is all being done on intrepid right now and the same issues that plague intrepid will plague hardy too
14:36
went through several bug fixes today with sugar guys... and the same will probably be true in the coming days/weeks... but hopefully by the time intrepid launches, it will all work
14:37FuriousGeorge has left #ltsp
14:40
<_UsUrPeR_>
Which client are you using for the deployment?
14:41laprag has quit IRC
14:41
<nubae>
which thin client?
14:42
<sbalneav>
With the thincan, have the video issues been all fixded? I've got a DB61
14:44
<cliebow>
laprag:i bet you could stand out front of the airport and catch the Concord bus t Portland..Jsaammcq HAS to drive thru there...
14:45
<nubae>
sbalneav: mine works just fine
14:46
u mean drivers?
14:46
in intrepid works out of the box
14:47
<sbalneav>
Coolio
14:48
<nubae>
eeepc doesnt though
14:48
still needs atl2 module installed by hand
14:49
<_UsUrPeR_>
sbalneav: I have a DBE61
14:49
works great
14:49
<sbalneav>
Hmmm. So, I'm playing around with KVM
14:49
<_UsUrPeR_>
nubae: yeah, which thin client?
14:49
<sbalneav>
Trying to install intrepid under a hardy host
14:50
<_UsUrPeR_>
sbalneav: though I wa using it on an acer 22" flatscreen, and it made the output look like crap.
14:50
wa = was
14:50
but with another 1920x1200 screen, it looked great
14:50
<sbalneav>
ubuntu-vm-builder kvm intrepid
14:50
...
14:50
Error: "intrepid" is not a supported suite
14:51
It only supports up to hardy.
14:51
Sooooo, how would I do that, I wonders
14:51
Or, do I have to install the VM from an ISO?
14:52
Suppose I could install a hardy VM and upgrade...
14:52
<nubae>
_UsUrPeR_: well probably whatever is installed in the schools at the moment, that and Artec thincans
14:52
maybe even XOs as thin terminals...
14:53
<ogra>
nubae, atl2 ?
14:53
nubae, hey, ltsp isnt a wireless shop
14:53
i'm pretty sure eee wired works
14:53
<nubae>
:-/
14:53
kernel panic if atl2 isnt mentioned in modules
14:54
<Lns>
ogra: i've got an eee and tried it with stock hardy chroot, no go..lemme test it in mine real quick here
14:54
<nubae>
verified by many people...
14:54
<Lns>
you're prolly talking about intrepid thou
14:54
<ogra>
Lns, yeah
14:54
<nubae>
same thing in intrepid...
14:54
have to recreate initramfs with atl2 module
14:55
<Lns>
damn atheros chipsets
14:56
<nubae>
yah, wonder if turning it off in bios will bypass the error
14:56
doubt it though
14:56
<_UsUrPeR_>
nubae: yeah, the thincans are pretty cool :)
14:56
<nubae>
I'm actually most impressed with the asus eeepcs as thin terminals... fast as hell
14:57
<Lns>
nubae: i <3 my eee 701 (1st model).. i even had compiz working in the default install after some simple hacking, it flew
14:57
yea...no surprise, doesn't boot in updated hardy
14:58Gadi has left #ltsp
14:58
<Lns>
Flash 10 seems to work fine on my client so far...streaming a radio station for a couple hours, going to homestarrunner.com...
14:59
<nubae>
you logging mem and cpu activity?
15:00
<Lns>
no, why does it have a leak ?
15:00
<nubae>
not sure... just wondering
15:00
<Lns>
cpu sitting at 10% (i'm the only client)
15:00
I've got one school site on it testing it out, they had a bunch of kids in using flash sites, she said it seemed to be working fine
15:00
of course it was ~20min only testing it out, time will tell
15:00
<nubae>
hmmm nice
15:00cliebow has quit IRC
15:01
<nubae>
well if it works for an entire class without the server turning into a snail...
15:01
<Lns>
Plus, it seems that the "flash over all other stuff" was fixed, as well as not needing libflashsupport anymore
15:01
<nubae>
cool
15:01
<Lns>
nubae: maybe no more a snail than w/9
15:04pscheie has quit IRC
15:05
<nubae>
Lns: really getting into the 2 ssh instance story eh? :p
15:05
<Lns>
ugh
15:06
don't get me started
15:07* ogra shudders every time he hears the word hardening :)
15:07
<Lns>
lol
15:07
<ogra>
if you have to "harden" something its wrongly designed
15:08
<nubae>
ogra prefers limp servers :p
15:08
<ogra>
its either standing on its own or you need viagra
15:08
<Lns>
That whole thread reminds me of the development cycle of Microsoft products
15:08* ogra prefers no blue pills on his servers
15:09
<Lns>
Put a band-aid on software that already works fine because the admin is incompetent at learning how to configure things
15:09
and apparently incompetent at having his users put in strong passwords
15:10
<nubae>
well if they really wanna do something they should probably use SOTP or something
15:10
<Lns>
I dunno...i don't even know why i'm getting so infuriated over the suggestion
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15:11
<Lns>
nubae: Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants ? =p
15:11
<nubae>
would SOTP work with the internal?
15:11
hehehe
15:11
One time passwords
15:11
<Lns>
ah
15:11
<_UsUrPeR_>
you guys need to sotp that
15:11
<ogra>
lol
15:11* Lns loves the humor in #ltsp
15:12
<nubae>
simple one time passwords it stands for
15:12
http://www.nardol.org/2008/9/12/as-old-as-good-one-time-passwords
15:13
its actually very neat stuff... end of brute force
15:18
<_UsUrPeR_>
this is the beginning of brute force: http://www.elcomsoft.com/edpr.html
15:18
It just makes me want to acquire passwords... for something
15:19sepski has joined #ltsp
15:20
<nubae>
I'd like to see it crack a pgp key
15:22
<_UsUrPeR_>
I have two geforce cards... the problem would be getting the software
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16:02
<nubae>
heh, that must be the longest thread in months....
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16:09
<julius>
hi, just wondering, is there any documentation about setting up a guest account that would be wiped each time the account logs off?
16:10
<sbalneav>
I've so far resisted wading in with opinions. I've just posted something, though. I wanted to point out that ltsp doesn't modify the sshd config at all.
16:10
julius: I actually modified the pam_mkhomedir module some time ago to do just that.
16:10
hmmm, where was that:
16:11
<julius>
:) 'd like to be able to customise the desktop, then have it tidied up on logout.
16:12
is there a way to have it auto login as the guest account after booting?
16:13
<sbalneav>
ah, here we go
16:13
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LtspPersistentHome
16:13
Well, you'd have to modify gconf defaults.
16:14
the patches to pam_mkhomedir then create the home directory on log in, and blow away the home directory on log out.
16:16
Heading home for the day. Be on later tonight.
16:16
<Lns>
damn i was about to say thx for your response sbalneav
16:16
<zoredache>
I have always wondered why someone doesn't use unionfs to do something like that. Each time a user logs in, you create a clean temp filesystem, mount the source home dir as ro, and the tmp fs as rw
16:16
<Lns>
seems sane enough
16:18
I only fear Mr. burness wants this "solution" simply because he is lazy and doesn't want to learn how something works that he wants to modify directly.
16:18
burgess*
16:19
<julius>
Thanks sbalneav. I'll see if I can understand it.
16:23
<johnny>
i personally just delete it at the end of the night
16:23
copy in new .ssh and whatnot
16:23
kill all the processes
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17:14
<stgraber>
yeah, just got our new demo server for ltsp-cluster. CoreQuad 2.5Ghz + 4GB RAM + 2xGigabit (100% intel hardware), I'm just waiting on 2x500GB HDD now
17:15mccann has quit IRC
17:15
<vagrantc>
stgraber: don't you need more than 1 server to test ltsp-cluster?
17:16
<stgraber>
not really, we have an openvz setup on it
17:16johnny has quit IRC
17:16
<stgraber>
so we can actually show how it works as everything is separated as it'd be in a real deployment
17:16
<vagrantc>
ah.
17:16johnny has joined #ltsp
17:16
<stgraber>
(of course you don't get high availability then :))
17:17
<vagrantc>
"watch- we pull the electricity and your servers ... oh."
17:17
<stgraber>
yeah :)
17:17
<vagrantc>
do you have a way of similating a crash in openvz?
17:23
<stgraber>
vzctl stop <server>
17:24
or just ifdown eth0 in it :)
17:24
but the demo server is more of a way to show the various components than to actually demonstrate the high availability and load balancing part
17:25
<vagrantc>
that's the part i'm most interested in :)
17:33
<warren>
what happens if a server is knocked off the ntework only temporarily?
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17:36
<stgraber>
warren: it'll get removed from the loadbalancer (if it's an application server) or another server will do its job (if any other service). Then when it's back it'll get added to the loadbalancer again (if it's an application server) or continue doing what it used to do (any other service).
17:36
<johnny>
nubae, you about?
17:53
<nubae>
yeah
17:54
<johnny>
http://chat.localmomentum.net/room/chat/
17:54
that's speeqe.. :)
17:54
kinda laggy on the initial connection tho
17:54
it took me awhile to get all the pieces together
17:54
and alot of bugs fixed
17:55
but now it works
17:57
<nubae>
what's your end aim with it? online jabberers?
17:59
<johnny>
yeah..
17:59
for my group of people who work @ red emma's
17:59
<nubae>
cool
17:59
<johnny>
there are some folks who can't install stuff on their work computers..
18:00
and we wanted to do some chatting together
18:00
<nubae>
right, or are blocked by firewalls
18:00
<johnny>
yeah
18:00
<nubae>
so can it do groups?
18:01
<johnny>
groups of what?
18:01
<nubae>
well, for example, the xos work with groups that are named something
18:02
instead of having everyone in one room...
18:02
<johnny>
for example?
18:02
<nubae>
spanish, english, literature, french
18:02
<johnny>
you mean rooms?
18:03
<nubae>
I guess they're rooms yeah
18:03
<johnny>
then yes it can
18:03
it can even do external rooms
18:03
<nubae>
cool
18:03
<johnny>
ones not hosted at my server
18:03
<nubae>
and linking to irc?
18:03
<johnny>
yes
18:03
<nubae>
nice
18:03
<johnny>
but.. you'll be limited by the amount of connections the server allows from the number of ips you have
18:04
<nubae>
ok, how many connections per ip?
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18:04
<johnny>
that's up to the server admin of the server you are connecting to
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18:04
<nubae>
ok, the XS is currently experimenting with 6000 concurrent connections :-)
18:05
so what runs behind it, ejabberd?
18:05
<johnny>
yes
18:05
thing is.. many irc servers limit the number of connections to stop flooding of all types
18:05
<nubae>
well, thats actually pretty neat... there would be less latency if it was internal to the school for example
18:06
<johnny>
you see alot of latency?
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18:06
<johnny>
afaics.. the only latency is on initial connect
18:06
after that.. it seems fast enough
18:06
<nubae>
welll requires testing I guess, but its gonna be slower than on an internal network with thousands of users
18:07
<johnny>
well sure
18:07
but you could also keep the parts of it local
18:07
and the rest remote
18:07
if you were trying to network em all together
18:07
<nubae>
yeah thats where it becomes interesting, connecting servers together
18:07
<johnny>
run the bosh component local
18:07
and have it talk to a server somewhere else
18:08
constant stream, not a bunch of stateless http connections
18:10
<nubae>
whats the memory footprint for each connection?
18:11
<johnny>
not sure how to figure that how
18:12
<Lns>
nubae: you mentioned SOTP..I read that article, i've got a question
18:12
Doesn't SOTP pretty much require you to keep the list of passwords somewhere on your person?
18:12
<nubae>
no, thats opie
18:13
<Lns>
oh
18:13
<nubae>
pam sotp just means u use your regular pass
18:13
<Lns>
so what's the difference?
18:13
<nubae>
but it scrambles it with a irreversible factoring
18:14
<Lns>
scrambles your regular pass?
18:14
<nubae>
let me see if I can find something that explains this better than I :-)
18:14
<Lns>
k
18:14
=p seems real interesting
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18:17
<nubae>
the client generates the key from the password u enter
18:17
then feeds that to the server
18:17
who also generates it from its key... this generation is always different
18:18
if u were to print on paper, I guess u would need a set of keys... since u cant generate it unless your ssh has that built in
18:19
<Lns>
hmm
18:19
<nubae>
http://www.cavecanen.org/cs/projects/pam_sotp/doc/0.3.3/manual.html
18:19
<Lns>
but the password you enter is static
18:19
<nubae>
right but its actually not stored anywhere
18:20
<Lns>
"This list of one time passwords (OTP list) is typically stored in print form and stored in the user's wallet or in electronic form in the user's PDA or cell phone."
18:20
<nubae>
yeah
18:20
<Lns>
k...well i guess you can't have complete security anyway =p
18:20
<vagrantc>
how does the server generate the one-time password without knowing the password itself?
18:20
<Lns>
that would be a good use case for mainly online-based attacks
18:21
I'll probably always vow to the holy grail of authentication - multifactor (something you are, something you have, something you know)
18:22
<nubae>
That is not so secure, since you can loose the paper and be doomed… Luckily there are lots of small softwares that does this generation for you. Some you can use from your Palm or from some J2ME-enabled phone (such as N95). Some your can use from another (trusted) computer. Some are even online, written in javascript!
18:23
<Lns>
I still don't get how this makes it more secure..you still need something to "hash" right?
18:24* Lns doesn't think he fully understands how sotp works
18:24
<nubae>
hell, I read about it a little while ago in linux magazine, and understood it then, but thinking about it now, I'm confused too
18:25
lets see if I can find the article online
18:25
<Lns>
hehe
18:25
someone's been shmokin doobies ;)
18:26
<ogra>
vagrantc, it asks GOD !
18:26
<nubae>
ok got the magazine in front of me
18:26
<ogra>
one of them at least :)
18:27
<vagrantc>
well, that's probably useful as a random number generator...
18:27
<Lns>
lol
18:27
I can see how it could prevent bruteforce, but wouldn't it also do a pretty easy DOS given that you can just hammer auth until your list runs out?
18:27
oh, it doesn't invalidate passwords that are incorrect... nm
18:28
<nubae>
One time password system consists of a server and generator. users are required to authenticate aganst the server and the generator calculates the one time password for this purpue
18:28
purpose
18:29
hash functions of irreversible algorithms do the work
18:29
the server adds a seed to the user defined password
18:29
and hashes the resulting string n times
18:30
the server then stores the username, the seed and the figure n+
18:30
#user is then sent a challenge from teh place hes logging in from
18:30
inlcuding seed
18:30
<vagrantc>
so the server doesn't store the password... it just uses that to generate one-time passwords
18:30
<nubae>
the local generator helps the user calculate the one time password
18:31
<Lns>
so...if someone got your static password, they've effectively gotten your list of OTPs since you can generate them yourself using any number of devices/methods
18:31
<nubae>
it changes constantly, but yes, the idea here is that burte force no longer works
18:31
<Lns>
that makes sense
18:32
<nubae>
like a scrambler in the middle I guess
18:33
anyway theres a whole other part about how the server decodes the key, but I wont bore u with the details :p
18:33
<Lns>
Kinda makes me wonder though, if you have to keep a list of huge, complex passphrases..why not just make your real password a huge, complex passphrase... i'm sure brute-forcing a 20-character password would take a long time. ;)
18:34
<nubae>
the generator creates the password, u just have to remember one string
18:34
and u need a generator with u of course
18:34
<Lns>
right
18:34
but it generates it based on a static password
18:34
<nubae>
yeah right, which hopefully u dont write down anywhere
18:34
<Lns>
i agree it's definitely more secure as far as brute force goes
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18:35
<nubae>
even if someone got your generator, still wouldnt help much
18:35
or got the password without the generator
18:36* Lns wants thin clients with integrated retina scanners
18:37
<nubae>
theits also good with packet sniffing
18:37
since the password is only valid for one session, its kinda useless to store it for an attacker in the middle
18:38
http://www.cs.umd.edu/~harry/jotp/
18:40
<zoredache>
Lns: what happens once someone has a scan of your eye? Replacing your is kinda difficult
18:40
<nubae>
heh, u can use a photocopy or picture of yourself and the retina scanner wouldn't do too much good
18:41
<Lns>
zoredache: yeah..they'd pretty much need your actual eye
18:41
<nubae>
kinda like thumbprints and facial recognition, silly hackable technology
18:41
<Lns>
which, if they get it..well, you'll have more important issues to worry about ;)
18:41
no
18:41
<nubae>
could make a contact lens with your retina image
18:41
<Lns>
wait..have you guys heard about actually using scanned images for your eye?
18:41
<nubae>
there are always ways around it
18:42
<zoredache>
Lns: only in the movies
18:42
<nubae>
I have for facial recognition...
18:42
<ogra>
it would have to be hologram but you can surely do it
18:42
<Lns>
ah.. yes, and i heard about fingerprinting being pretty easy to dupe off of a door knob
18:42
<nubae>
off anything
18:42
fingerprinting is totally insecure
18:42
<Lns>
well, multifactor would make it insanely hard to get all of that ;)
18:43
<nubae>
dna printing
18:43
<Lns>
my bank's online portal likes to ask random personal questions
18:43
<vagrantc>
and when people have absolute faith in the authentication method, if someone compromises it they get all the goods.
18:43
<Lns>
"who's your mother's mother?" "When is the last time you went to the bathroom?"
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18:44
<nubae>
happened with the card system in holland which is used for all publix transportation
18:44
<zoredache>
Lns: look how well that worked out for Palin
18:44
<Lns>
vagrantc: very true
18:44
<ogra>
Lns, "how did your last defecation go ?"
18:44
<vagrantc>
"there's no possible way someone could have possibly done X, Y AND Z!" "but they did."
18:45
<Lns>
ogra: yeah, i was wondering why there was an ethernet cable hooked up to the toilet
18:45
<nubae>
card got cracked and leaked to the net, all cause it was a closed system which no one tested
18:45
<ogra>
bowl cam !
18:45
<Lns>
lol
18:45
<zoredache>
didn't you see the google internet?
18:45
<ogra>
now that would be real safety !
18:46
<Lns>
What I view as the closest we'll ever get to complete security will have to do with trust
18:46
as in PGP/GPG keys with trust factors
18:46
<nubae>
yeah pgp is about as good as it gets
18:47
<ogra>
anyway
18:47
<nubae>
but computers get faster and people get smarter, so who knows...
18:47* ogra calls it bedtime
18:47
<Lns>
night ogra
18:47
<nubae>
yah me too.. its almost 2 am here
18:47
<Lns>
hehe
18:47
<ogra>
come on 13min to go :)
18:47
<Lns>
almost 5pm here.. i still have a lot of nothing to do =p
18:48
<nubae>
heh
18:50keithclark has quit IRC
18:54* Lns waves to chan
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20:38
<petre>
warren, ping
20:38
<warren>
petre: pong
20:38
<petre>
I just sent the announcement
20:38
sorry for the delay, but I've been kinda swamped
20:39
<warren>
thanks for taking care of this
20:39
I'm a bit swamped myself
20:39
<petre>
at least you have bragging rights about being in Japan for your swampedness ;-)
20:40
on k12linux.org, can there be a Download at the same level as News, Meetings, etc.?
20:40
I thought I had a login for the wiki, but if I did, I've forgotten it
20:40
was planning to add a download section
20:40
I see the link in the latest News item, but that's pretty easy to miss
20:41
<warren>
petre: wiki is the same as fedora account
20:42
petre: http://admin.fedoraproject.org/accounts/ you can request to reset password here
20:42
<petre>
tx, that's what I need
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20:56
<petre>
warren, what version of k12linux are we calling this?
20:57
besides the rc1, I mean
20:58
<warren>
petre: err... officially K12Linux Terminal Server F9 RC1
20:58
petre: but no big deal, we'll fix it for RC2
20:59
<petre>
warren, wiki now had downloads section
20:59
<warren>
ok
20:59
I have to leave soon
20:59
<petre>
I was thinking there I would use the full name, whatever the full name is
20:59
not urgent
21:00
<warren>
maybe we should drop "Terminal Server" from the name
21:01
it is clear enough to call it
21:01
K12Linux F9 RC2
21:01
K12Linux EL6
21:01
etc.
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22:53
<sbalneav>
Evening all
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