IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 11 March 2012   (all times are UTC)

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07:52
<knipwim|vacation>
/nick knipwim
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07:52
<muppis>
Too long in vacation? ;)
07:52
<knipwim>
clearly
07:53
getting used to the keyboard interface
07:53
<muppis>
Good starting point.
07:58
<alkisg>
Welcome back :)
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08:13
<srdjo>
good morning all
08:15
is there a directory that is visible on ltsp clients and ltsp server at the same time without special mounting ? I would like to put some config files there to use on client without rebuilding the image
08:16
<alkisg>
Since you're not using NFS, no, there isn't
08:17
Some alternatives are the tftp dir, localapps_extramounts, ssh_followsymlinks and /home, etc
08:17
Or you can stop using squashfs, so that you don't have to run ltsp-update-image on each change
08:18
<srdjo>
what would be the best place to keep few config files for my cups printers script ?
08:18
<alkisg>
The best place would be to implement a script that does what you want,
08:18
and then use new lts.conf parameters for each client
08:19
E.g. CUPS_PAGE_SIZE=xxx, CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True/false etc
08:20
If you do that, attach it to your bug report so that some developer considers it for upstream inclusion
08:21
Now if you don't want to do that, then just do what X_CONF does, which is also what Hyperbyte adviced you: put all your cups.xxx.conf scripts in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/somewhere
08:22
And just implement a CUPS_CONF=xx lts.conf directive
08:22
<srdjo>
what I did is create a two part script - first part is run on client after all printers are set and it copies all the files to the home/user/cups dir - the second part is run on the server and it copies the files back to chroot creates script files and runs ltsp-update-image
08:22
<alkisg>
That's not a good solution though
08:23
The best method is to have a script run on the client before cups runs at all
08:23
So that when it starts it already has the configuration you specify with lts.conf
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08:23
<srdjo>
and it all works fine but I thought about creating a general script that could get user.cups.conf from server, and if it exists it uses it
08:23
<alkisg>
In other words, a script that can modify cups.conf
08:24
<srdjo>
cupsd.conf is not the problem - the printers.conf is
08:24
<alkisg>
Gettting user.cups.conf wouldn't be a good solution either
08:24
<srdjo>
i meant client.cupsd.conf
08:24
<alkisg>
It doesn't matter which configuration file you want to have modified, the idea is the same for all of them
08:25
"modify them before the service starts, based on parameters provided in lts.conf"
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08:28
<srdjo>
it is not problem for me to do that, but I want to make a script that anyone can use - the idea is that one boots the client, sets the cups settings he want, installs all the printers he wants, runs ltsp-cups-save (all files are saved) and when he reboots everything works again - i just need a proper place to store the files
08:29
and I would need only one variable - CUPS_CHECK=True
08:31
<alkisg>
Why should he need to chroot, update image etc just to share his printers?
08:31
Wouldn't it be much easier to put CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True in lts.conf?
08:32
Please read the lts.conf man page for the X_* related settings
08:32
What I'm saying is that for most cups settings, we could use the same method as XRANDR_MODE_0 etc, without need to modify the chroot at all
08:32
<srdjo>
but what about printers - samsung printer wont reinstall automatically at reboot
08:32
<alkisg>
And in special cases where indeed cups.*.conf needs to be modified, we would resort to CUPS_CONF=path
08:32
Like X_CONF
08:32
Again, see the lts.conf manpage for X_CONF
08:33
<srdjo>
no mater the sharing settings
08:33
ok - will see it now
08:33
<alkisg>
The place to put X_CONF files are in the chroot /etc, like we've been telling you all along
08:33
The same would be for CUPS_CONF files too
08:34
Also I think that a CUPS_PPD=file directive would allow installing many printers that don't get installed automatically
08:35
<srdjo>
then my logic is blown away :) - the idea was to keep it simple - one command - one variable
08:36
<alkisg>
Would it be simple to tell people to create several different xorg.conf files instead of just using XRANDR_MODE_0=1024x768?
08:37
When someone has an HP printer and wants to share it, why would he go through the trouble of copying cups.conf files and updating chroots when he could just do CUPS_SHARE_PRINTERS=True ?
08:38
<srdjo>
cups is ok, but the printers.conf file is the problem
08:38
<alkisg>
Again, it doesn't matter which configuration file it is, I'm discussing the general idea.
08:38
<srdjo>
when he boots that HP is not there :)
08:38
<alkisg>
Why?
08:38
<srdjo>
it is not auto installed
08:38
<alkisg>
Why?
08:38
<srdjo>
he has to press the add printer button
08:39
I dont know why, but for samsung printers it is so
08:39
<alkisg>
In many many cases, no
08:39
In some cases where the exact printer model isn't specified, yes
08:39
(in the printer configuration files)
08:39
<srdjo>
lexmark printers are auto installed
08:39
<alkisg>
So a single lts.conf line would help there
08:39
HP too
08:39
Many HP printers are
08:42
<srdjo>
I solved my problem, and I could just quit, but I want to resolve this for everyone - I have spent 10 days on this and I want to spend few more to do it right
08:42
<alkisg>
I understand, that's why I'm spending time to try to point you to a method that could be accepted upstream
08:43
The cups problem is very similar to the xorg.conf problem, so it would be solved in a similar way
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09:05
<Hyperbyte>
srdjo, why don't you just expand on the earlier solution I gave you?
09:06
I.e, you had one correct default cupsd.conf, one correct stampac cupsd.conf, why not just create a third, fourth or fifth cupsd.conf for other clients as well?
09:09
<Llama_be>
hey knipwim, had a good vacation? I got my ltsp clients to boot with SCREEN_01
09:10
SCREEN_01=xterm and start xfreerdp from there. So the dependency on server for xorg is not needed. However, I have not yet managed to boot them completely autonomous into xfreerdp
09:17
<srdjo>
Hyperbyte, I wanted to do it like that but alkisg has a different approach
09:17
<alkisg>
Many cupsd.conf is similar to many X_CONF= files that I was saying
09:17
But that's not enough
09:18
<srdjo>
now I am trying to build printers.conf file on boot for every client
09:18
based on the CUPS_FAT_PRINTER variable
09:19
later I will divide it to have more options like
09:19
CUPS_FAT_PRINTER_PAPER_SIZE
09:19
and so on
09:22
think that is the right way to go - I will also leave 2-3 empty CUSTOM variable for printer specific options as that might be needed for someone
09:28
<alkisg>
srdjo: commit the "FAT" from the variables... CUPS can be used from localapps too
09:28
*omit, not commit, sorry
09:29
<srdjo>
using localhost as server ?
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09:29
<alkisg>
Whatever server
09:30
E.g. one may want a localapps firefox in a specific thin client to print to a specific cups server to the other room
09:30
So he'd put [mac:address] CUPS_SERVER=the-other-room-pc-ip
09:31
<srdjo>
yes, and that is why I added the FAT in name to distinguish then - the script wont be run for them
09:31
as they dont read the printers.conf file
09:31
it is on specified server
09:31
<alkisg>
They should, localapps should behave the same as fat clients
09:31
No need to have different cups options for them
09:32
<srdjo>
not if CUPS_SERVER is not localhost
09:32
they are connecting to other server having its own cupsd.conf and printers.con
09:32
conf
09:33
<alkisg>
I think that if CUPS_SERVER is not defined, client.conf should be left empty,
09:33
thus showing all published printers on the local network
09:33
If it's defined, it should behave the same for localapps and fat clients alike
09:34
If CUPS_PAPER_SIZE is defined, it should modify the client printers.conf or whatever conf file it needs
09:34
Again, without caring if localapps or fat clients are used
09:35
<srdjo>
yes, but if you specify CUPS_SERVER=10.0.0.100 then there is nothing to edit - we dont have access printers.conf no mater if its FAT or LocalApps
09:36
<alkisg>
So?
09:36
Does that change anything?
09:36
Also, you may use CUPS_PAPER_SIZE on client01, and then put CUPS_SERVER=client01 to the other client02
09:37
<srdjo>
so the CUPS_SERVER variable should be the trigger for my script - if it is not localhost just exit
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09:38
<alkisg>
If it's empty, it should still be reading the local configuration
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09:39
<srdjo>
Ill try it now just to be sure
09:39
<alkisg>
(I think that currently it uses LDM_SERVER so it's broken)
09:40
But I don't think that you should care about CUPS_SERVER, if someone defined any of those CUPS_* vars your script should do its job without caring about the server
09:41
In an extreme case, suppose I'm working on client01 and I want to always print on client02 (color printer there) while the person working on client02 wants to always be printing to my client01 printer
09:41
In that case, we'd both have CUPS_SERVER=the-other-pc
09:41
...we'd still want the paper settings to take effect on our printer though
09:42
The cups client part shouldn't care about the server part
09:42
<srdjo>
yes, but it would only have effect on client01 as the printer is connected there
09:43
<alkisg>
There are two printers in this example, color printer on client02 and black/white printer on client01
09:43
<srdjo>
whatever changes the client01 makes are auto translated to client02
09:43
<alkisg>
In lts.conf you'd put: [client01] CUPS_SERVER=client02
09:43
and [client02] CUPS_SERVER=client01
09:43
<srdjo>
no, you would use CUPS_SERVER=localhost on both and enable sharing on both
09:43
<alkisg>
Now if you wanted to specify the paper size on client01, why shouldn't you be able to?
09:44
I don't want client01 to be able to print in his printer
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09:45
<alkisg>
Anyway, /me goes back to coding, bbl
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09:49
<srdjo>
Hyperbyte, take a look at a script I made from our talk yesterday http://pastebin.com/qrrU7K9J
09:51
it has two parts - client runs the first one when he sets up everything and the other part on the server to create /usr/bin script, copy files to chroot and update client
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10:09
<Hyperbyte>
srdjo, look at it in a bit
10:09
Question though - CUPS_PAPER_SIZE... how are you going to set that in the CUPS config?
10:09
<srdjo>
it is not set in cupsd.conf but in printers.conf
10:09
<Hyperbyte>
Ah, the default paper size for print jobs.
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10:10
<Hyperbyte>
srdjo, this means you have to run cups configure for every user?
10:11
<srdjo>
only for the users that have local printers
10:11
<Hyperbyte>
srdjo, wouldn't it make more sense to do it based on clients, like we did before?
10:11
So you configure the local printer for the client, and not for the user?
10:11
<srdjo>
yes - just using home to store file temporarily
10:13
<Hyperbyte>
Where and how is the cupsd.conf and printers.conf generated?
10:13
<srdjo>
in the chroot of the booted client
10:13
and then copied to home
10:13
and from server back to image
10:14
<Hyperbyte>
I mean specifically.
10:14
Where in the chroot of the client, and how?
10:14
<srdjo>
the cupsd.conf is in /etc/cups/
10:15
and printers.conf is generated only when printer is added
10:15
<Hyperbyte>
Ah - so you're creating the cupsd.conf and printers.conf by hand?
10:15
<srdjo>
(in the script I am working on with alkisg i will use lpadmin to add printer and generate printers.conf)
10:16
when client boot and add printer
10:16
<Hyperbyte>
I still don't see the purpose of this script.
10:16
You either take one of two approaches:
10:16
1. Create a pre-determined cupsd.conf for each client, and copy it over the cupsd.conf on client boot
10:17
2. Set configuration variables for the client, and run lpadmin on boot to pass those to cups
10:17
This back-and-forth of files between server and client is confusing
10:17
You seriously need to stop abusing /home/ for this, it makes things confusing.
10:17
If you want to move files from client to server, or vice-versa, use scp.
10:18
What I would do, is one of two cases:
10:18
<srdjo>
this script is replacing manual work for your step 1
10:19
<Hyperbyte>
1. Create two scripts. One called "ltsp-save-cups" and one called "ltsp-restore-cups"
10:19
"ltsp-save-cups" would scp the cupsd.conf and printers.conf to the server, and place them under <chroot>/etc/cups/<mac address>/
10:20
And then another script called "ltsp-restore-cups" which runs during boot, and copies /etc/cups/<mac address>/ files over cups config, if they exist.
10:20
Then you set it per-client, and not per-user.
10:20
Or two
10:21
<srdjo>
that is the same thing I am doing - just did not know about scp
10:21
so I used home
10:21
<Hyperbyte>
2. Create configuration variables CUPS_PAPERSIZE, CUPS_PRINTER, etc, whatever you need... and create an LTSP or LDM startup script, which runs the correct lpadmin commands to configure CUPS accordingly.
10:23
srdjo, I don't see yours based on mac-address. Also, one script on client and one on server is confusing. Use ssh and scp from the main script to execute remote commands, and copy files - that way you also get rid of the required 'running the script as root'
10:23
<srdjo>
the first way is easier to do - in what /etc/cups directory should I copy the files to ? server or chroot ?
10:24
<Hyperbyte>
If the client needs access to something during boot, it has to be the chroot.
10:24
The files on the server only come into play once a thin-client user logs in to LDM, or with remote apps from a fat client.
10:24
<srdjo>
so that also means running ltsp-update-client
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10:25
<Hyperbyte>
Yes, that means doing that.
10:25
<srdjo>
I will focus on the second way as you and alkisg suggested
10:25
<Hyperbyte>
One of the disadvantages of using NBD vs NFS
10:26
Second way is definitely the most robust solution.
10:27
<srdjo>
but is also harder to make :) - will make it now and be back with results
10:32
<Hyperbyte>
Well, yeah... but if you get something that works -very- good, it could possibly be included in LTSP by default... :)
10:32
Think of all the fame! The lobster dinners! ... the chicks! :-D
10:33
<srdjo>
possibly ??? :) when I make it right it must be included :)
10:34
<Hyperbyte>
Well I'm not a developer, so I don't decide about that. :P That's why I said 'possibly'.
10:34
<srdjo>
lets first make it :)
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12:15
<markit>
hi ppl :) alkisg, you use x11vnc with -noshm option, "man" says "be careful this can use large amounts of network bandwidth"... is something can be avoided when providing remote assistance (through adsl and not local net)?
12:16
<alkisg>
No
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13:26
<srdjo>
alkisg, I dont thing this can be done the xorg way. I tried multiple printers, and only the ones that can be installed by plug and play work, but there are the ones that need download plugins (HP p1005) and new ones that are not yet supported without manufacturer drivers (that should also be in chroot). I am running out of options.
13:27
thing/think
13:28
<alkisg>
srdjo: so it's not possible to isntall hp p1005 in a e.g. ubuntu desktop pc without internet connection?
13:30
<srdjo>
it asked to download a new firmware from internet or select it from file
13:31
but once the firmware is upgraded it is auto installed
13:32
<alkisg>
Installing drivers or firmware to the chroot is not ltsp's responsibility
13:32
If one needs to install the nvidia drivers, he just installs them
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13:33
<alkisg>
Don't compare xorg.conf with printer drivers, compare the nvidia drivers with printer drivers
13:35
<srdjo>
yes, but in order for my script to work, printer must be installed, and i thought of using lpamin to install and configure it on boot. but it it wants some response, how to handle that ?
13:35
lpadmin
13:35
<alkisg>
lpadmin would download the firmware over the internet?
13:35
I think you're mixing too many parameters in your questions... maybe focus them on one thing at a time?
13:36
For missing drivers and firmware, I don't think LTSP should do anything
13:36
If the firmware is there, you say that the printer is automatically installed
13:36
What happens with e.g. lexmark printers? I thought those needed manually selecting a .ppd file?
13:37
<srdjo>
V120 auto installs
13:37
e232 also
13:37
<alkisg>
OK, so in which case could ltsp help with installing a new printer?
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13:38
<alkisg>
(not talking about the next CUPS_PAGE* or other stuff, just the installation for now)
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13:38
<srdjo>
I mean e120 - just need to know how to handle installation problems in script - lets say there is no driver - how to detect that ?
13:38
how to handle it ?
13:42
should I just exit or is there a way to report there is an error in installation ?
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13:44
<alkisg>
srdjo: I don't understand why your script needs to care about the CUPS_SERVER, if printers are installed etc
13:44
Can I see it?
13:45
Isn't it enough to modify the cups configuration files even before cups is started?
13:46
And I also don't understand what your script has to do with driver installation, installing drivers shouldn't be an ltsp problem
13:54
<srdjo>
If printer is auto installed, there is no problem, but if it is for example Samsung ML-1910 that is supported but not auto installed, I need to find its ID using lpinfo and add it using lpadmin. printers.conf file is then created and i can modify anything once I have a file. Or I could just write out printers.conf file from the script. But if it is not supported, what should I do ? Do I just exit or is there a way to report to user that the driver needs to be
13:54
installed. From GUI he can see that there is no printer in the list, and this way he doesn't know what to do. Maybe I care to much...
13:55
<alkisg>
"I need to find its ID using lpinfo and add it using lpadmin" ==> I think that's the root of the problem
13:55
For pci-ids, there's a file that matches pci-ids to certain drivers
13:56
There should be something similar for printers too
13:56
So, instead of doing lpinfo, lpadmin etc, you should just add the id to that mapping file, wherever that is
13:56
And report it to upstream so that it's automatically installed next time
13:57
For pciids, the file is there: /lib/modules/3.2.0-18-generic-pae/modules.pcimap
13:58
Don't know where the mappings are for printers, but that's what you should be looking
13:58
<srdjo>
but then we would have to run ltsp-update-image wouldnt we ?
13:58
<alkisg>
Can you give me an example of lpinfo/lpadmin usage?
13:58
Yes, until they were added upstream so that they'd be automatically detected in any distro, not just ltsp chroots
13:59
Or you could make an ltsp script to add the known mappings
14:02
<srdjo>
ok - didnt think there would be so many problems - i will write a script now and put it on pastebin when I'm done
14:07
<alkisg>
Last year I wrote a patch that allowed ltsp clients to reboot/shutdown from the gnome menu, instead of having to logoff to ldm first
14:08
It wasn't accepted, because they thought that the implementation method wasn't good enough
14:08
(even though it was what we use ltsp, no other option available)
14:08
But I understand their point, that adding hacks that don't solve the problem in its root cause, is just making the code unmaintainable
14:09
The solution here would be to find what needs to be done so that the printers are automatically installed, no?
14:09
Once this is found, then integrating it to ltsp is the second step
14:14
<srdjo>
if you think that my lpinfo/lpadmin way is not good should I go with it or try to "invent" something else ?
14:15
<alkisg>
(04:09:09 μμ) alkisg: The solution here would be to find what needs to be done so that the printers are automatically installed, no?
14:15
I.e. so that no script is needed to add the printer
14:17
<srdjo>
but I think its cups problem - cant do much about it - is there a need for me to go on with this ?
14:17
<alkisg>
If you can solve the cups problem, of course
14:17
That would help all linux users, not just ltsp users
14:17
Even if you just pinpoint the problem it would help too
14:20
You're trying to solve this problem by "what can I do to create a script to install the printer"?
14:20
And I'm saying, "better find a way sothat the printer is automatically installed without scripts"
14:21
<srdjo>
ok - for now I will get back to my original script, review it once again and make it public as a workaround until permanent solution is made. It will most certainly help everyone using local printers on fat clients
14:22
<alkisg>
OK, once I find some printer that is not automatically installed I'll try to find out why
14:24
<srdjo>
I will also try to find it out myself - since I have a printer in front of me - I will give you the script for review once I complete it
14:24
<alkisg>
OK, thank you. Time to go, bb :)
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17:17
<uskerine>
hi, i have installed LTSP in lubuntu, but dhcp3 seems to fail to start, i am getting "no subnet declaration for eth0". I attach syslog output, dhcpd.conf and ifconfig info, could someone please help? thanks in advance; http://pastebin.com/dmH9itz3
17:18
<Mava>
uskerine: what dhcpd file have you edited ?
17:19
.. where is it located in ?
17:19
<uskerine>
"/etc/dhcp/dhcpd.conf"
17:19
<Mava>
ach
17:19
<uskerine>
i also see another dhcp directories, such as /etc/dhcp3
17:19
where should i put my dhcpd.conf?
17:19
<Mava>
try to check if you can find something like
17:19
/etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
17:20
<uskerine>
yes i can
17:20
<Mava>
for my best knowledge that is the dhcpd conf which overrides the default dhcpd file in /etc/dhcp3/
17:20
so edit that under the ltsp and you'll be just fine =)
17:21
<uskerine>
no error now, i will check
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17:24
<uskerine>
mava, it works now
17:24
however, the thinclient does not boot
17:24
<Mava>
öerh
17:25
<uskerine>
i can see in syslog the DHCPDISCOVER and the DHCPOFFER
17:25
for the thin client MAC Address
17:25
but i get PXE-E53: No boot filename received
17:25
<Mava>
ahaa
17:25
<uskerine>
in the thin client screen
17:25
how could i further troubleshoot?
17:26
<Mava>
your dhcpd file is missing...
17:26
wait a sec
17:26
or a min.. got to dig those old dhcpd files up somewhere =)
17:26
<uskerine>
but the system is offering an IP (the one of the dhcpd.conf pool) to the thin client
17:27
the thin client seems to keep asking for IP
17:27
<alkisg>
You can see an example dhcpd.conf at /usr/share/doc/ltsp-server/examples/dhcpd.conf
17:27
<Mava>
uskerine: check this out
17:27
http://pastebin.com/fBW840DK
17:28
there is my old dhcpd.conf what you are missing is the filename and option root-path from the conf
17:28
at least
17:28
<uskerine>
ok
17:28
i will check thanks
17:28
<Mava>
then also check that where is your tftp root pointing at at the moment
17:28
cheers, hopefully these helps =)
17:32
<uskerine>
it is progressing mava, now i get ip but it can't find the file, i am double checking paths and files
17:34
<Mava>
ls /opt/ltsp/
17:34
<uskerine>
http://pastebin.com/MiBvT9Hf
17:35
i have the "root environment" in /opt/ltsp/i386/
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17:36
<uskerine>
i got from the thin client:
17:36
TFTP.
17:36
<Mava>
aa
17:36
<uskerine>
PXE-T01: FILE NOT FOUND
17:36
PXE-E3B: TFTP ERROR - FILE NOT FOUND
17:36
<Mava>
got it.. that filename should not point to 386.img but to pxelinux.0
17:37
<uskerine>
i don't have any 386.img
17:37
sorry
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17:37
<uskerine>
i mean pxelinux.0
17:37
<Mava>
you sure ?
17:37
<uskerine>
i am "find"ing it
17:37
find / -name "pxe*"
17:38
"/opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0"
17:38
should be that one Mava?
17:38
<Mava>
yah
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17:40
<uskerine>
MAva, i changed /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
17:40
with "/opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0"
17:40
in filename, but still same error
17:40
i restarted the dhcpd3 (isc-dhcpd...) service
17:41
i also have
17:41
"/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0"
17:41
i will try that one
17:42
<Mava>
try that also
17:42
<uskerine>
no way
17:42
these are all the pxe* files i have
17:42
<Mava>
to be honest can't remember and atm. not running any ltsp environment
17:43
<uskerine>
http://pastebin.com/wtEuj2VZ
17:46
<Mava>
uskerine: /opt/ltsp/i386/boot/pxelinux.0 this seems to be correct one
17:46
but, you must change it in the dhcpd.conf to point in lets say.. /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0'
17:47
because the tftp root is different than your servers filesystem root
17:47
<uskerine>
understood
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17:51
<uskerine>
Mava, it works, i am logged in :)
17:51
thank you very much indeed, you saved me lot of time
17:51
<Mava>
really ?
17:52
<uskerine>
the desktop is not seen exactly as in the PC, but i guess it will be a matter of playing a bit with it
17:52
yes it works well
17:52
<Mava>
yeah, anycase congrats uskerine, that's great =)
17:52
then it must be a good time to have a coffee break ->
17:52
<uskerine>
indeed
17:53
i will fine-tune the desktop wallpaper, screen resolution and fonts used later
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19:52
<knipwim>
alkisg: why is the fat client autodetection (in ltsp_config.d) based on a .desktop file?
19:53
<alkisg>
knipwim: the idea is that people should be able to have fat client chroots without ltsp-build-client
19:53
I.e. normal installations with only the ltsp-client package afterwards
19:54
So since /etc/ltsp_fat_chroot was generated with ltsp-build-client, I couldn't count on that being there
19:54
<knipwim>
i can agree with that, only, the clients are fat by default now (on gentoo)
19:54
<alkisg>
And in Debian/Ubuntu/Fedora all available sessions are there
19:54
Hmmm
19:54
Why would you have sessions there?
19:54
(on thin chroots?)
19:54
<knipwim>
at least, xinit installs a .desktop file
19:55
<alkisg>
Maybe we can blacklist that? What's its name?
19:55
<knipwim>
in /usr/share/xsessions/Xsession.desktop
19:55
<alkisg>
Can you think of a better way to separate between thin chroots and fat chroots on Gentoo?
19:56
Suppose someone builds a thin chroot
19:56
And later on installs a whole desktop in the chroot, wanting it to be fat from then on
19:56
He shouldn't be required to manually touch an /etc/ltsp_fat_chroot file
19:56
<Llama_be>
hi knipwim. Did you see my message in here earlier today?
19:56
<alkisg>
So, maybe blacklisting Xsession.desktop is the way to go?
19:56
<knipwim>
alkisg: thinking
19:57
Llama_be: no
19:58
alkisg: kernel commandline option?
19:58
<Llama_be>
knipwim: basically, the setup without X on the server works :p I've had (and have) some issues, but as far as I can tell, they're not the fault of having no xorg on the server
19:59
<alkisg>
knipwim: That part is just for setting the default, of course one can still set LTSP_FATCLIENT=False
19:59
Either from ltsp_config.d or from lts.conf
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20:00
<knipwim>
Llama_be: cool
20:00
what did you remove from your setup again? xdm, pulseaudio and xorg-serveR?
20:01
alkisg: blacklisting Xession.desktop sound like the best bet
20:02
<Llama_be>
knipwim: something like that yes. Want me to do a diff on the overlay ?
20:02
<knipwim>
indeed, if a fat client chroot want to switch back, LTSP_FATCLIENT=False would have to be set
20:03
Llama_be: sure
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20:07
<knipwim>
Llama_be: or just the ebuild you used
20:07
<alkisg>
knipwim: can you try if this works? if [ -n "$(find /usr/share/xsessions/ -not -name Xsession.desktop -name '*.desktop' 2>/dev/null)" ]; then
20:07
<Llama_be>
knipwim: http://pastebin.com/J8RjXE1D
20:09
so basically I removed x11-base/xorg-server, x11-apps/xdm and media-sound/pulseaudio from the net-misc/ltsp-server ebuild
20:15
I now just run into an issue that while the virtual machine I was testing with boots perfectly, the actual physical box it should run on doesn't. It has a kernel panic because it says my real /dev is missing files required to boot (console and null)
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20:23
<knipwim>
Llama_be: thanks
20:24
can i refer to your real name mentioned in the diff?
20:24
<Llama_be>
sure
20:25
<knipwim>
Llama_be: how did you copy the virtual machine to a physical one?
20:26
<Llama_be>
copy? they should be thin clients, they boot from the network... :)
20:27
the server is staying the same. It was just easier for testing to have a virtual machine as the thin client
20:28
<knipwim>
so the installed chroot doesn't have a /dev/null ?
20:30
<Llama_be>
it does, the physical machine just complains it can't find it. but the virtual machine still boots without problems
20:32
<knipwim>
alkisg: it works, i used:
20:32
for xsession in $(find /usr/share/xsessions/ -not -name Xsession.desktop -name '*.desktop' 2>/dev/null); do
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20:33
<alkisg>
knipwim: for + break instead of if?
20:34
Or another loop plus the existing if?
20:34
Ah, you mean your local test?
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20:35
<knipwim>
alkisg: ah check, was working on the 5.3.5 instead of the latest revision
20:35
the if also works :)
20:35
<alkisg>
Ah, ok, yeah I thought the single liner was more reusable
20:36
knipwim: Llama_be tried "init=/bin/bash" and he didn't get a bash, so I'm just wondering, why didn't it work on Gentoo?
20:36
(considering we're trying to switch to init=/sbin/init-ltsp...)
20:42
<knipwim>
alkisg: Llama_be: it's working here
20:42
<alkisg>
OK, ty
20:42
<Llama_be>
I might have made errors :)
20:43
but I added init=/bin/bash at /var/lib/tftpboot/pxelinux.cfg/default at the end of the APPEND line
20:45
and I did that again, and I still get my rdesktop that boots up (in my virtual machine netbooting)
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20:49
<knipwim>
how does this relate to the missing /dev files?
20:51
<Llama_be>
it doesn't :) it was just something alkisg told me to do yesterday when I was resolving other issues (I have to edit the lts.conf in the chroot, because I can't get it to update over tftp, which I thought was how it should work)
20:52
<knipwim>
Llama_be: about the tftp issue, have you seen http://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/LTSP#lts.conf_not_downloading_at_client_boot ?
20:54
<Llama_be>
ah yes, but those files mentioned, they don't seem to exist on my system.
20:55
<knipwim>
not in the chroot?
20:55
you should have $chroot/etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup
20:55
aerm
20:55
sorry, it should be init.d indeed
20:57
<Llama_be>
ah ok, that explains :)
20:58
and simply replace the tftp command with curl then?
20:59
<knipwim>
ehm, checking now
20:59
realising that should be in the wiki as well :)
21:01
replace (echo "get ${TFTPPATH}"|tftp ${SERVER} >/dev/null 2>&1) by (curl "tftp://${SERVER}${TFTPPATH}" -o lts.conf >/dev/null 2>&1)
21:05
<Llama_be>
indeed, that works
21:06
is it normal I don't have that other file?
21:08
<knipwim>
yes
21:09
it's only part of ltsp-client-5.3
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21:26
<uskerine>
hi
21:26
how can i configure the screen resolution of my thin clients in ltsp?
21:26
i am stuck at 1024x768 maximum, but my thin client supports more than that
21:28
<alkisg>
What's the output of `xrandr` on that thin client?
21:29
<uskerine>
how could i run that command?
21:29
i mean, all the commands are ran on the server right?
21:35
pastebin.com/CkZUjhNH
21:36
<alkisg>
uskerine: how is the monitor connected? plain vga cable? some converter?
21:36
<uskerine>
VGA
21:36
DVI to VGA converter
21:37
<alkisg>
I think that's the problem... Hyperbyte do you have any quick fixes for that, or should he resort to X_HORIZSYNC/X_VERTREFRESH?
21:37
<knipwim>
Llama_be: new ltsp-server ebuilds with optional X and pulseaudio USE flags are pushed
21:40
<alkisg>
uskerine: I think that if you don't use a converter, your graphics card will autodetect all the available resolutions, but if you can't do that, then you can use those lts.conf variables I mentioned above, see the lts.conf manpage
21:41
<uskerine>
ok i will do that thanks
21:41
tje lts.conf is located in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
21:41
right?
21:42
<Llama_be>
knipwim: is there a git command that cleans my overlay, so that layman -S works again (now it complains I have local changes that it doesn't know what to do with...
21:42
<alkisg>
uskerine: yes
21:47
<knipwim>
Llama_be: i just delete and add it again, layman -d ltsp && layman -a ltsp
21:48
<Llama_be>
just before I saw your answer, I did a git checkout . and layman -S and that seems to have worked :)
21:50
running emerge world -uDva now, and ltsp-server does not pull in any new dependencies, as expected on my server
21:51
<knipwim>
nice :)
21:54
<Llama_be>
is it normal the quickstart.profile has changed a lot?
21:55
<knipwim>
between ltsp-servers? could be, depends on the upgrade
21:56
a lot of quickstart profile info has been put into the portage profile in the overlay
21:57
<uskerine>
alkisg
21:57
i changed lts.conf, selected the right horiz and vert syncs
21:57
disabled xrandr
21:57
and forces x_mode_0 to 1280x1024
21:57
but still i am stuck at 1024x768, is there any log i could look?
21:57
i realize that cliclinkg alt+ctrl+f1 i get a console
21:57
whichi password should i use?
21:58
<alkisg>
uskerine: what's your current lts.conf like?
21:58
<uskerine>
let me paste it
21:59
<alkisg>
!pastebin
21:59
<ltsp>
alkisg: pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
22:00
<uskerine>
pastebin.com/nH4jDjia
22:00
i know lts.conf is being read because the keyboard layout was switched from US to ES
22:01
<alkisg>
uskerine: remove XRANDR_DISABLE, change X_MODE_0 to XRANDR_MODE_0, and replace 76 to 100
22:02
<uskerine>
76 is the right frequency for the monitor i am using
22:02
but i will try it
22:02
<alkisg>
87 is for 1024x768
22:02
There's something different in how xorg calculates timings vs how cvt or the monitor manuals do
22:03
<uskerine>
wow
22:03
did not know that
22:03
that would explain many hours configuring xorg.conf
22:03
<alkisg>
I haven't found documentation to explain it, but that's what my tests had shown
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22:05
<uskerine>
still 1024x768 :(
22:06
<alkisg>
Meh. What graphics card?
22:06
!localxterm
22:06
<ltsp>
alkisg: localxterm: Any applications that you launch on a thin client actually run on the server. However, if in a client you run 'ltsp-localapps xterm', a local xterm will open, and any commands that you enter there will be executed locally on the client.
22:06
<alkisg>
...and in that, lspci -nn -k | grep -A 2 VGA
22:07
<uskerine>
pastebin.com/fBPPscnr
22:07
it is a quite decent thin client
22:08
<alkisg>
And xrandr still lists 1024x768 as the maximum resolution?
22:08
<uskerine>
yes
22:09
i ran it in the "local" xterm
22:09
<alkisg>
And the output of `getltscfg -a` on that localxterm?
22:09
<uskerine>
but it says
22:09
Screen 0: minimum 320x200, maximum 4096x4096
22:09
i see what we configured in lts.conf
22:10
<alkisg>
What resolution do you want? Can you use cvt, xrandr --newmode, xrandr --addmode and xrandr --mode to set it?
22:10
<uskerine>
pastebin.com/QGwEtajn
22:10
i will investigate how to use that, xrandr is new for me
22:10
i would like 1280x1024
22:11
which is what is supported by my monitor
22:11
<alkisg>
xrandr --newmode "1280x1024_60.00" 109.00 1280 1368 1496 1712 1024 1027 1034 1063 -hsync +vsync
22:12
xrandr --addmode VGA1 "1280x1024_60.00"
22:12
xrandr --output VGA1 --mode "1280x1024_60.00"
22:12
<uskerine>
ok let me try, thanks
22:12
<alkisg>
109.00? I wonder if you should increase X_HORZSYNC to 110...
22:13
<uskerine>
i will try that firts
22:18
alkisg
22:18
increasing horiz sync to 110 did not work
22:18
however, adding the new mode as you described
22:18
worked perfectly
22:18
how could i "fix this configuration"?
22:18
<alkisg>
Hmmm we really need new XRANDR_CMD_[0-9] lts.conf options
22:19
Until that's fixed upstream, the only ways I can think of are using a custom xorg.conf or a custom ldm rc.d script
22:19
<uskerine>
ok, where should i put my "custom" xorg.conf?
22:20
<alkisg>
If you remind me tomorrow, I can commit the change upstream so that you download that fixed script
22:20
<uskerine>
i will do, i am glad to help to improve ltsp, so far i am quite impresed about it (last time i "used" ltsp it was just a linux howto) :)
22:21
<alkisg>
:)
22:21
<uskerine>
where should i "put" the xorg.conf?
22:21
<alkisg>
In the chroot, see the docs for X_CONF
22:21
!lts.conf
22:21
<ltsp>
alkisg: lts.conf: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/lts.conf
22:22
<alkisg>
Or just wait until tomorrow
22:22
You won't need a xorg.conf then
22:22
<uskerine>
"/opt/ltsp/i386/etc..."?
22:22
ok
22:22
thanks a lot
22:22
<alkisg>
yup
22:28
'night all
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