IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.libera.chat (webchat)
Channel log from 17 October 2011 (all times are UTC)
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| 12:55 | <RobL> Does anyone have experience troublshooting NBD? Since upgrading to ubuntu oneiric (11.10), I'm getting an error nbd0: Wrong magic (0x25609513) mounting the squashfs image
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| 19:16 | <JoshMalone> So, "Thank You" to all LTSP folks for making my job SO much easier last week :)
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| 19:18 | Saved me from having to commit to imaging 32 optiplexes for multiple meetings
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| 19:22 | <Hyperbyte> :)
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| 19:23 | And to pay the community back, you are of course going to write documentation, or contribute code, or donate to the developer meeting? ;-)
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| 19:26 | <JoshMalone> Happy to contribute my internal docs for setup of my k12linux server and chroot
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| 19:26 | Does the "community" get anything back from sales of thin clients from diskless?
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| 19:27 | (just curious)
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| 19:29 | <stgraber> we get a free dinner at the hackfest ;)
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| 19:36 | <Hyperbyte> JoshMalone, you're using Fedora? Or RHEL?
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| 20:00 | <JoshMalone> Sorry - meeting
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| 20:00 | We use RHEL
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| 20:05 | <vagrantc> knipwim: i see you tagged an ltsp version ... i didn't know gentoo used versions :)
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| 20:15 | <stgraber> hmm, I'm wondering how many bugs we got reported on the distro side because of people setting LDM_XSESSION when they should indeed change LDM_SESSION...
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| 20:16 | I'm planning on porting ldm from gtk2 to gtk3 at the hackfest, might as well drop LDM_XSESSION from the code at the same time, to make sure whoever really wants to change it as to do it in the shell code
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| 20:20 | <JoshMalone> ack! I don't think RHEL supports gtk3? Unless I'm wrong
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| 20:24 | <alkisg> How much time do we have at the hackfest for actual coding?
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| 20:24 | (aside from talking, planning etc... :))
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| 20:26 | <JoshMalone> how would a company go about sponsoring something for the hackfest?
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| 20:27 | <pscheie> JoshMalone, I think you would want to talk to jammcq about that, but he's not here right now.
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| 20:30 | <stgraber> alkisg: as much as we want :) we don't really have a schedule. We usually end up doing a bit of planning and talking on the Friday morning, the rest is usually coding/talking/eating/drinking/walking outside
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| 20:30 | <alkisg> Sounds relaxing ;)
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| 20:31 | <stgraber> JoshMalone: I don't think it does but it's not really a big concern for me as an upstream for ldm. The maintainer can still backport any fixes they want.
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| 20:31 | JoshMalone: if we have to wait 7 years every time we want to change something upstream, we'd be kind of stuck :)
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| 20:31 | <JoshMalone> yeah
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| 20:31 | * JoshMalone knows the pain of living in a 5 to 7-year-old distro | |
| 20:34 | <stgraber> I'll just make sure any distro that ships with LTSP will have gtk3 in their next release, but I'm pretty sure it's the case, at least for Ubuntu, Debian and Fedora. I'm guessing Gentoo has gtk3 too and I don't really care about OpenSUSE.
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| 20:36 | <JoshMalone> I actually switched to a Mac rather than continue dealing with RHEL anymore
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| 20:37 | <dberkholz> yeah, gentoo's had it in our main repo since march
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| 20:37 | <vagrantc> stgraber: isn't LDM_XSESSION used because it's in a different location on every distro?
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| 20:37 | <stgraber> perfect, then there won't be any issue for the port
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| 20:38 | <vagrantc> stgraber: hrm?
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| 20:38 | ah, gtk3
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| 20:39 | <stgraber> vagrantc: hmm, doing a grep for LDM_XSESSION doesn't show us setting different value depending on the distro
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| 20:39 | vagrantc: we have a fallback in the screen.d script that goes through every possible location and guess the right one
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| 20:39 | vagrantc: I'd keep that one as it's, just drop the ability of overriding it from lts.conf
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| 20:39 | vagrantc: so whoever really really really wants to do it will have to change the screen.d script
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| 20:40 | <vagrantc> ugh.
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| 20:40 | <stgraber> where we can put a big scary warning ;)
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| 20:40 | <vagrantc> just because of a bug that some users are spreading misinformation about?
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| 20:40 | it seems like a bad way to disable a feature
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| 20:41 | <stgraber> well, disabling it is the easy way of avoiding weird distro bugs, another alternative is to rename it to something that actually tells the user what it's
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| 20:41 | currently we have LDM_SESSION and LDM_XSESSION. The first one is fine, the second one should never be touched
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| 20:42 | and the difference between the two isn't really clear
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| 20:42 | maybe renaming LDM_XSESSION to LDM_XSESSION_SCRIPT or something similar would be better than disabling the feature entirely
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| 20:43 | that'd make any existing hack fail and be hard enough to guess so people have to go look at the doc
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| 20:43 | <vagrantc> LDM_XSESSION should be legitimately used if the client and server being logged into have different Xsession script locations
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| 20:43 | not that that's a common use-case, but it exists for a reason
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| 20:44 | whatever happened to the idea of having ldminfod display the appropriate session?
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| 20:44 | <stgraber> kind-of. We could deprecate it by moving that code to a X9* script and have it check for the X11 location using the ssh tunnel
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| 20:45 | which would work even if the chroot and target don't run the same distro
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| 20:45 | * vagrantc feels deja-vu | |
| 20:46 | <stgraber> I'm guessing we didn't move it to ldminfod because we try not to depend on it. You should still be able to login on a server that doesn't have any ldm/ltsp packages installed
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| 20:46 | <vagrantc> all this has happened before
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| 20:48 | <stgraber> based on a very quick check of the code, the current LDM_XSESSION guessing code has been introduced in r870 (2008-05-04) when we pretty much didn't have any rc.d script (only S01-setup-xauth)
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| 20:48 | and certainly didn't have the X9* scripts where we have the guarantee that we have an ssh master socket that we can use to poke the server
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| 20:49 | so my guess is that back then we would have either done it in screen.d/ldm as we currently have it or would have moved that code into ldm's C code which would explain why we ended up having it in screen.d/ldm (trying not to move everything in C)
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| 20:50 | <vagrantc> sounds feasible.
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| 20:50 | i haven't checked ~/.dmrc in a while ... is that broken too?
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| 20:50 | <stgraber> might be worth asking Scotty, he appears to be the one who wrote that code and also the one who introduced most of the ssh magic :)
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| 20:51 | last I tried the .dmrc code it was working fine, but that was a while ago. I'm actually wondering if lightdm/gdm3 may have broken their use of .dmrc and so broke our parser...
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| 20:51 | <vagrantc> gah
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| 20:52 | <stgraber> because .dmrc should be a valid desktop file, and the one on my machine doesn't have a Exec or TryExec entry which would likely fail with our parser (and isn't spec compliant IIRC)
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| 20:53 | <alkisg> stgraber: it appears that lightdm writes the locale in the user's ~/.profile!
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| 20:54 | It doesn't read or write dmrc, with a quick test I did with oneiric
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| 20:54 | <stgraber> alkisg: fun...
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| 20:54 | <alkisg> Ah sorry no that was gnome-language-support, ignore me
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| 20:54 | gnome-language-support writes to ~/.profile
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| 20:54 | <stgraber> http://paste.ubuntu.com/711336/ is my dmrc here
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| 20:54 | <alkisg> And lightdm doesn't write/write .dmrc I think
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| 20:55 | <stgraber> mine got change 6 days ago, which matches my last session open time
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| 20:55 | *changed
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| 20:56 | and I only have lightdm on this laptop, so apparently it at least touches it
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| 20:56 | now whether or not it writes something useful and valid in it is a completely different question :)
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| 23:26 | <cliebow> yo ho ho
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| 23:27 | <andygraybeals> heya cliebow
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| 23:27 | <cliebow> heyhey!
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| 23:27 | whats up down your way
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| 23:28 | or whatd going down up your way..
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| 23:28 | <andygraybeals> ah man, things are good. oils bubblin' up on my land so mebbe i'm rich, maybe not. we'll see. what else.. i'm trying to edit some dhcpd.conf in pfsense and trying to get some help with zarafa resources in zentyal
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| 23:29 | <cliebow> goog old mstik1 is still staying handy..
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| 23:29 | <andygraybeals> that's what i've been working on today;
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| 23:29 | <cliebow> holy crap i have no idea what that means
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| 23:29 | i forget where you are
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| 23:30 | <andygraybeals> yea, same. i'm in southeastern ohio, how about you?
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| 23:30 | <cliebow> maine..bar harbor area
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| 23:30 | <andygraybeals> nice, we live right near that big river. :)
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| 23:30 | <cliebow> i think the group is coming up next weekend..jim scottie..alkisg ogra
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| 23:31 | <andygraybeals> actually 2 junctions up.. ohio meets the hocking meets jordan run creek
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| 23:31 | aah nice man
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| 23:31 | <cliebow> you get out boating at all?
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| 23:31 | <andygraybeals> nawp man, i can't afford that.. but i'd like to get me a canoe
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| 23:32 | <cliebow> i have a 500.00 thirteen foot whaler for myself..and skipper a bigger boat where i actually get paid
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| 23:32 | half time
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| 23:32 | <andygraybeals> oh nice man, your professional mariner?
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| 23:33 | 13ft is damn huge up on the harbor.
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| 23:33 | <cliebow> well..going on forty years..but i am more or less full time at school..use up my vacation time doing the boat
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| 23:33 | <andygraybeals> nice man, what profession... sport fishing?
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| 23:34 | <cliebow> only chance to get head above water when can log 12 hour days
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| 23:34 | ohh excursion boat in cadia national park
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| 23:34 | <andygraybeals> explain what excursion means?
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| 23:34 | nat.parks rule :)
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| 23:34 | <cliebow> we take people out past the lighthouses..osprey nest..seal ledges
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| 23:35 | <andygraybeals> ah joy riding
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| 23:35 | that's nice man, to get paid for that!
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| 23:35 | <cliebow> in to Islesford to the musrum..then up the former fjord
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| 23:35 | dinner boat evenings to slesford dock restaurant
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| 23:35 | <andygraybeals> sounds like a nice way to get a look at things.
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| 23:36 | <cliebow> nice meld with the it job..
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| 23:36 | <andygraybeals> yea, we just bought 19 acres... and found out we got oil
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| 23:36 | <cliebow> my ltsp went by the wayside when the schools went one to one with apple
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| 23:36 | <andygraybeals> it's mostly woods and we got two big hills, huge rocks, plenty of copperheads.
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| 23:37 | <cliebow> Wow..that is pretty cool
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| 23:37 | i thought you were pulling my leg
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| 23:37 | <andygraybeals> naw, i'm never serious, so it's rightful thinking
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| 23:37 | <cliebow> hehehe
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| 23:37 | <andygraybeals> btu for real, it is happening
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| 23:38 | so you work at a school?
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| 23:38 | <cliebow> so yuo sysadmin at a school?
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| 23:38 | <andygraybeals> naw, i work at a restaurant and we use ltsp caues it's cheap and i'm lazy
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| 23:38 | cheap, as in cost, not as in quality; hardly so.,
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| 23:39 | <cliebow> yeah i am senior guy in rsu24..most of hancock couny..an hour one end to the other..
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| 23:39 | firewalls.. vpn
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| 23:39 | <andygraybeals> it's a workhorse.. and the people i work with are too strung out to learn anything worth knowing, so i can spoon feed them to some degree easy enough with ltsp
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| 23:39 | nice
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| 23:39 | <cliebow> yes.. having reimaged 1600 laptops three times this summer when one instal with ltsp would do the same thing
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| 23:40 | so i had to go to the dark sde and get apple certified
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| 23:40 | so icould replace the screens the little bastards break
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| 23:41 | like 100 since christmas
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| 23:41 | more than that now..
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| 23:41 | <andygraybeals> i used to wokr for the state; rehab and correction... delt with like 16 prisons in this quadrant of the state... god fed up with it when they wanted me to start takin' piss tests.. then left for california to get a sysadmin job that signed me a waiver saying all is good even if i had marijuana related felonies.. then got to strung out on the fun to be had there.. and came back here.. got the job at the restaurant.
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| 23:41 | omg apple certs.
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| 23:41 | aah technician certs.. okay.
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| 23:42 | <cliebow> yeah.. i have to do random drug tests for my captains licens..do t and all
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| 23:42 | <andygraybeals> thta's cool man.. my dad is cert'd in dell and ibm.. (lenovo)
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| 23:43 | <cliebow> i tried to get my boss interested in getting us dell certified..but she has too much on her plate..they run her raged
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| 23:43 | ragged
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| 23:43 | <andygraybeals> ragged... and raged :)
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| 23:43 | <cliebow> i dont know how she copes..and with three kids under 10
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| 23:44 | <andygraybeals> oh man, she sounds like a saint
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| 23:44 | <cliebow> good natured..though not well versed in IT..
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| 23:44 | <andygraybeals> yea, the service docs you get access to when your cert'd .. man i wish they had those open to the public, it's so sad. life could be better. it's like they don't want us to get ahead.
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| 23:45 | <cliebow> but classroom vet..the service docs are awessome..and drop me a line if you need a hand with macbooks
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| 23:45 | cliebow at rsu24.org
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| 23:45 | <andygraybeals> yea, awesome man
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| 23:46 | <andygraybeals> you heard of zentyal? it's trying to be the linux version of MS Small Business Server
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| 23:46 | <cliebow> i have not..iam so far out of the loop
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| 23:47 | so smaba server dhccp..
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| 23:47 | <andygraybeals> tries to integrate a bunch of different services... all tied to the auth of a ldap server
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| 23:47 | <cliebow> oooh.. i am opeldap guy
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| 23:47 | <andygraybeals> yea, asterisk, jabber, firewall
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| 23:47 | it's got the email postfix/dovecot and you can run groupware like zarafa.. or just the webclient, roundcube
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| 23:48 | zarafa gives you the 'outlook' feel
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| 23:48 | <cliebow> wow..zarafa roundube.. i havnt a clue..so far out of the loop
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| 23:48 | <andygraybeals> i'm hapy it ties it all together with ldap.. cause it makes things so much easier. they got big plans for the project too. it doesn't feel all that mature yet.
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| 23:48 | oh man, roundcube is just like squirrelmail on steroids
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| 23:49 | <cliebow> you mean zentyal?
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| 23:49 | <andygraybeals> zarafa is like... outlook gone linux web interface.
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| 23:49 | yea, i'm gtalking about zentyal.
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| 23:49 | that's what i meant when i mean it's not totally mature yet
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| 23:49 | <cliebow> i Really need to get back in the loop
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| 23:50 | we are stuck with firstclass..nothing sexy there..
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| 23:50 | <andygraybeals> like.. i can't get resources to work in the calendar.. so if i wanted to use a 'meeting room' or a 'projector' .... i can't get that configured.. zarafa supports it in the ldap.. but i don't know enough how to configur it into zentyal.. and no one has answered any of my questions yet on the forum in regards.
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| 23:50 | ah, tell me about firstclass?
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| 23:51 | <cliebow> proprietary mail clint collaborative software
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| 23:51 | <andygraybeals> ah evil
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| 23:51 | <cliebow> yep..
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| 23:51 | <andygraybeals> does it support atleast mbox or mailbox format?
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| 23:51 | *support
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| 23:52 | well i guess it's more important just to be able to back things up :)
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| 23:52 | <cliebow> i built both of my openldap servers..one for citrix and a new one for printing
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| 23:52 | <andygraybeals> and hope they don't screw you in the future.
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| 23:52 | damn man, that is hot.. i wish i could have them skills. one day :)
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| 23:53 | <cliebow> it is very expensive..but that is not my call..i presented zimbra but they didnt take the hook
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| 23:53 | <andygraybeals> tell me about the one for printing? is it an auth?
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| 23:53 | <cliebow> strictly auth mechanism for
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| 23:53 | err
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| 23:53 | papercut
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| 23:53 | to track orinting costs
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| 23:53 | <andygraybeals> nice man
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| 23:54 | what printers do you guys got?
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| 23:55 | <cliebow> the papercut only auths via an attempted bind to the database with the credentials..no bind..no authentication..stupid that way
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| 23:56 | bosslady just signed a contract with acopi and kyocera..so ten schhols with kyocera..ripped out all the hp4200
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| 23:56 | <andygraybeals> aah.. hmm...
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| 23:56 | i don't know kyocera, i would be scared without HPs
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| 23:57 | actually i just got sick of HP and bought a brother... both are crap
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| 23:57 | we'll see which one lasts longer.
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| 23:58 | the cheaper equipment they sell to small businesses is really crap (printers)
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| 23:58 | <cliebow> i am..we have little chips..rfid..you swpe em..it reads a nimber and jobs are released based on the nimber
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| 23:58 | <andygraybeals> that sounds neat :)
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| 23:59 | <cliebow> would be if i d had a complete list of users..we are chasing are tails getting the last of them in the openldap server
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| 23:59 | I CAN T PRINT..Jesus i am tired of hearing that
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| 23:59 | <andygraybeals> omg.. concurrent accounting!!!!
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| 23:59 | nightmare
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