IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 8 November 2012   (all times are UTC)

00:01
<kev_j>
so I probably screwed something up, but nothing has changed
00:02
about to put up a paste of the issue
00:04
http://pastebin.com/Q6CxdW71
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00:15
<lee>
in kiosk mode, how do you get firefox to take up the full size of the desktop? I see there's something called devilspie that's in there by default, but it doesn't seem to actually work...
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00:25
<vagrantc>
kev_j: all your clients are 64-bit?
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00:28
<kev_j>
hey, sorry, finally able to restart the server
00:28
and yes, all but one
00:28
..so far
00:28
<vagrantc>
so you're just retiring that one?
00:29
<kev_j>
no, working off fat-ish clients
00:30
<vagrantc>
ah.
00:30
<kev_j>
sorta making our way through the details of getting them up and working
00:31
and what we want to go with later, so to get used to the system and I can run through troubleshooting they're using desktops until we decide on a thin client system
00:32
oh snap, thank god, it need to restart, I'm guessing the libc changes hadn't taken effect
00:32
?
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09:43
<johnsonmlw>
Stupid question... with an obvious answer I would think. Sorry. How do I sudo ltsp-chroot into a chroot sitting at /opt/ltsp/test ?
09:51
<muppis>
ltsp-chroot --help should you give aoptions to do that. IIRC, it goes like -a test
09:53
<johnsonmlw>
Ah. I'd looked at that and the manual. -a does work, thanks. Obviously 'test' isn't an architecture, so I was confused! Thank you!
09:54
<muppis>
:) No problem.
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10:26
<johnsonmlw>
Anyone help troubleshoot hanging poweroff issues with clients?
10:29
Ubuntu 12.04 - I've tried earlier kernels (3.2.0-23-generic), I've tried appending acpi=force. Any other ideas?
10:30
<gvy>
maybe reboot=a,w
10:30
(still that rather applies to reboot troubles, dunno if related to poweroff as well -- tells to use acpi warm)
10:38
<johnsonmlw>
I'll look it up. Thanks.
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17:48
<kev_j>
Has anyone had much luck getting VirtualGL to play friendly with LTSP?
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17:50
<lee>
never tried, sorry
17:51
<kev_j>
I've tried a little bit, and found a few things, but nothing that helped figure things out
17:52
<lee>
I have spent the day trying to get onto the console of a kiosk machine via vnc, and I think I just made some progress
17:53
<kev_j>
I did find a video of a Russian video game cafe that uses LTSP and VGL (pretty well from the looks of it) but the explanation is, of course, in Russian
17:53
<lee>
doh
17:53
how long is the video?
17:53
<kev_j>
congrats on that, I haven't messed around with the vnc thing yet
17:53
not long, mebbe 3 or 4 minutes
17:53
<lee>
this will sound ridiculous
17:54
but have a look on fiverr.com for someone who'll translate russian, for $5
17:54
<kev_j>
the explanation is on a different page in text
17:54
thats kind of cool actually
17:54
I didn't bother to check it with google or anything because I'm pretty sure the nuances would be lost in translation
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18:01
<kev_j>
Do the video drivers need to be installed on the server or in the chroot?
18:01
<alkisg>
chroot
18:02
<kev_j>
thanks
18:05
<lee>
well this is kind of working, but I'm not sure I should be poking ltsp in these places
18:05
<kev_j>
eh?
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18:06
<lee>
x11vnc runs now, and I can connect with a client, and input from the client appears on the server, but the client just sees a black screen
18:07
<alkisg>
Open an xterm and run xrandr
18:09
<lee>
well, I can ssh in and run xrandr -display :7, but what am I looking for?
18:10
<alkisg>
Put the output to pastebin
18:10
!pastebin
18:10
<ltsp>
pastebin: the LTSP pastebin is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebin, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
18:12
<lee>
can't c&p, so typing it in, brb...
18:12
<kev_j>
yuck
18:14
<lee>
http://pastebin.com/fbscPAyY
18:19
<vagrantc>
!disable-screensaver
18:19
<ltsp>
Error: "disable-screensaver" is not a valid command.
18:19
<vagrantc>
!screensaver
18:19
<ltsp>
Error: "screensaver" is not a valid command.
18:20
<vagrantc>
!gnome-screensaver
18:20
<ltsp>
Error: "gnome-screensaver" is not a valid command.
18:20
<vagrantc>
meh.
18:20
anyone remember the docs to disable screensavers on ubuntu, in particular 12.04?
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18:22
<lee>
(this is a kiosk machine in case that matters)
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18:30
<alkisg>
lee: and in vnc you're seeing the browser running normally?
18:31
vagrantc: I don't have it handy, but you can start with this one: $ gsettings list-recursively org.gnome.desktop.screensaver
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18:43
<kev_j>
Does running ltsp-update-image unmount proc in 5.4.2-2?
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18:46
<lee>
alkisg: in the kiosk client I can see e.g. the mouse moving, but in the vnc client I just get a black screen
18:46
that sounds confusing
18:47
<kev_j>
or I guess the better question would be if proc wasn't unmounted when ltsp was run, could it cause a kernel panic when booting from the network
18:49
<lee>
what I am trying to achieve is running x11vnc on kiosk clients, so that I can see and control their sessions. I am running xtightvncviewer elsewhere, which is connecting, but shows a black screen. input (mouse movements, etc) is being sent, I just can't see it from the viewer
18:54
maybe it's an x11vnc problem rather than an ltsp problem
18:57
ahhh
18:57
PEBKAC
18:58
-EUSER_IS_RETARDED
19:01
<kev_j>
this is the problem I had after running ltsp-update-image with proc mounted http://tinypic.com/r/148x7r/6
19:05
I had to restart to fix it yesterday, couldn't umount proc from the chroot
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19:07
<lee>
sorry kev_j, no clue...
19:12
<kev_j>
it seems like there would be something I could kill or a service I could stop, but I can't find it if it's there
19:14
<lee>
I'm only using kiosks I'm afraid
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19:31
<kev_j>
is there any way to enable or require that proc unmount before running ltsp-update-image? I guess I could just do something simple like write out umount /opt/ltsp/amd64/proc && ltsp-update-image and throw it in bin
19:32
but that seems silly
19:33
<vagrantc>
it should "just work"
19:33
<kev_j>
I don't know... it did before I upgraded, but now it definately has it in my mount list
19:35
If I could have screwed it up somehow I probably did though
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19:51
<ball>
Anyone heard of a terminal emulator called "tiny term"? A previous employee seems to have installed it on an old desktop PC that's being used as an RDP terminal.
19:52
Ah, my mistake, it's called "Thinstation"
19:52
...think the boss called it "tiny term"
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19:56
<vagrantc>
thinstation ... isn't that HPs thin-client OS?
19:56
no, that was thinpro
20:00
<ball>
vagrantc: It's running on a tatty-looking Dell desktop
20:00
<kev_j>
I think I had tried that before ltsp but couldn't get it to work right
20:03
<ball>
I'm starting to understand this now: I /think/ it's booting from a CD
20:03
...and storing its config on a floppy disk
20:03
:-o
20:04
<||cw>
I tried thinstation some years ago
20:04
yeah, default it can boot off cd or usb, but I htink it can be converted to PXE
20:05
<ball>
I think I have it working now, but I'll see if I can't make this netboot too.
20:06
Perhaps I can use it to get ltsp in the door.
20:07
<||cw>
ball: http://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/thinstation/index.php?title=TSoM
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20:13
<ball>
Now I have this working, I'll ask the boss' boss whether I can have a Linux VM
20:14
brb, heading back to my own desk.
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20:15
<lee>
aha, I think that's it
20:15
it's ALIVE!!!
20:16
not sure if I should have altered the files I have altered, but it is working...
20:17
all seems to boil down to the .Xauthority not getting created
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20:23
<lee>
so today I've mostly been trying to get some kind (don't really care which) of vnc going, so that I can vnc into any given kiosk. turns out, all I really need is the x11vnc package (and its deps) installing, but, I have to edit /opt/ltps/i386/usr/share/ltsp/xinitrc.d/I00-xauth and change XAUTHORITY=`mktemp -u /var/run/xauth-$DISPLAY-XXXXXXXXX` to XAUTHORITY=$HOME/.Xauthority, otherwise x11vnc can't find .Xauthority (and there is no /var/run/xauth-* - on boot there ...
20:23
... was a 10-15 second hang whilst xauth timed out trying to create it, probably permissions at a guess)
20:24
then I created an I99-x11vnc script in the same dir, telling it to use display :7, and all is right with the world (or at least this very small piece of it). now, how do I find out if I a) should have done that and b) if it's likely to break something? :P
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20:51
<Guest40637>
halo ..
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21:00
<kev_j>
when someone gets a chance can you take a look at my xsession-errors log http://pastebin.com/ELcbsQ6G and let me know if there are just a lot of things I have screwed up or if it is a little more straight forward.... I am sure this will be a pain in the ass though, so... yeah, thanks in advance whether you look or not
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21:06
<alkisg>
kev_j: can you sum up your problem? You run ltsp-update-image with chroot/proc mounted, ok, but then I assume you created a new chroot, right?
21:07
*a new image, with ltsp-update-image without /proc mounted..
21:07
<kev_j>
eh?
21:08
<alkisg>
(09:01:12 μμ) kev_j: this is the problem I had after running ltsp-update-image with proc mounted http://tinypic.com/r/148x7r/6
21:08
(09:05:53 μμ) kev_j: I had to restart to fix it yesterday, couldn't umount proc from the chroot
21:08
<kev_j>
sorry, I haven't had that happen again yet.. earlier it did, but after about an hour it let me umount it
21:08
<alkisg>
And did you run ltsp-update-image with proc unmounted?
21:09
<kev_j>
yeah, and it worked perfectly fine
21:09
<alkisg>
So now what's your actual problem?
21:09
<kev_j>
but for the time being I don't want to try to get the error again until employees that would complain are gone
21:10
right now I can't get nautilus to work, and have issues with the package updater...
21:11
and I think there are other things, but I can't understand everything that is in the xsession-errors file
21:12
I possibly test the proc thing again in about an hour, but this is the second or third time I have had it happen since updating to wheezy
21:12
and updating the ltsp-server package
21:13
info says I am on 5.4.2-2
21:14
<vagrantc>
xsession-errors does tend to be verbose ...
21:15
<kev_j>
yeah, I'm not sure which ones are important and which are red herrings and whatnot
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21:18
<kev_j>
I have to run into a meeting but I should be back soonish
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21:27
<alkisg>
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2012-November/msg00009.html
21:27
"I'm writing to inform you that the release team discussed https://live.gnome.org/ThreePointSeven/Features/DropOrFixFallbackMode yesterday. We've come to the conclusion that we can't maintain fallback mode in reasonable quality, and are better off dropping it."
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21:27* vagrantc cheers on LXDE!
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21:29
<highvoltage>
:(
21:30
lxde is great but it's not so nice on laptops when you often plug in external displays
21:30
I guess it's better that they drop it instead of having something broken around though
21:30
<alkisg>
It still worked though, even with some missing features or bugs
21:31
<highvoltage>
yep. I still use it.
21:31
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: free software *can* be improved, i hear :P
21:31
<alkisg>
Half of the schools here lack 3d support or cpu power for software rendering, so we'll have to use something else in 14.04
21:32
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: I already don't get to all the things I'm supposed too (I haven't even gotten one commit to LTSP directly yet)
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21:33
<vagrantc>
highvoltage: yes, but gnome not working on a variety of hardware might provide the impetus to improve the alternatives
21:33
<alkisg>
highvoltage: what happens with lxde when you plug in an external monitor? No xrandr support there? Or you're just missing the display settings dialog?
21:34
vagrantc: did you have any major complains with lxde so far?
21:34* vagrantc has generally used lxrandr to add displays pretty easy
21:34
<highvoltage>
alkisg: there is an lxrandr tool, but you have to launch it manually and set up your displays every time
21:34
alkisg: where gnome is generally good at guessing what I want without me having to touch anything
21:35
<vagrantc>
if gnome was good at guessing what i want, it'd exit.
21:35
<alkisg>
:D
21:35
<highvoltage>
vagrantc: heh
21:36
<vagrantc>
heard a lot of problems with GNOME3 with LTSP, anyways...
21:36
will need to recommend a different desktop environment for wheezy+1
21:37
<alkisg>
Another thing that I noticed that LXDE lacks is logout inhibitors (e.g. programs with unsaved documents can't cancel logouts), but those things are minor compared to having a completely non-working DE...
21:38
<vagrantc>
but LXDE does actually support logout/reboot from LTSP by default in wheezy :)
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21:39
<alkisg>
And another good thing there is that Ubuntu doesn't mess with it so much, like it does with gnome/unity :)
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21:54
<kev_j>
has anyone taken a look at my error file or is it not a good time?
21:55Parker955_Away is now known as Parker955
21:57
<vagrantc>
kev_j: sorry, haven't had a chance
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22:06
<kev_j>
ok, well I think I put it on an hour long post thingy, so I will post it for longer and whenever, if, you or someone else get around to it, it will actually be there
22:08
http://pastebin.com/tiCWrqts
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22:34
<kev_j>
so, stupid question, but what is ltsp-update-kernels for? I'm looking at the man page but I don't really understand.. is it for updating the boot kernels for pxe or something else?
22:35
<||cw>
kev_j: yes, that copies the kernel and initrd that the chroots are setup for to the pxe/tftp
22:37
<kev_j>
does it do anything with the lts.conf file if it is in the tftpboot dir or is that looked at when the computer boots? (or at some other time, like when you logout and it sorta reloads)
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22:38
<||cw>
some of those warnings might be "normal". some seem to imply that the clock is way wrong, or that a library is failing and making it look like the clock it wrong. is this from the client or on the server? can you login locally ok?
22:39
shoudn't need to mess with lts.conf to update a kernel
22:41
<kev_j>
I didn't particularly mean that in conjunction with the first question but I probably phrased that in a weird way.. when does it actually look at the lts.conf file if it's in the tftpboot dir?
22:43
and when would I need to run ltsp-update-kernels? would it be when I do updates to the chroot along with ltsp-update-image? or just when I want to do something like change from nbd to nfs?
22:43
<||cw>
you should be able to see it transfer in your tftp log
22:43
if you have a high enough log level
22:43
<kev_j>
ok, I should raise my log level then
22:44
<||cw>
durring the "starting ltsp..." phase if I had to guess, but I've never gone looking
22:45
<kev_j>
what about the second part (about when to run ltsp-update-kernels)?
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22:49
<kev_j>
oh, nevermind, I kinda found something on bootpolish.net... I think I get it a little better
22:50
thanks for the help and info
22:51
<||cw>
you'd run it when you update the kernel in the chroot
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