IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 4 April 2011   (all times are UTC)

00:00
<alkisg>
muppis: ls /usr/lib/locale/fl_FI.utf8/
00:01
<muppis>
Doesn't exists. Only locale-archive exists under /usr/lib/locale/
00:02
<alkisg>
Ah it was changed from 10.04 to 10.10
00:02
Wait let me check on a 10.10 system
00:04
ls /usr/share/i18n/locales/fi_FI
00:04
<muppis>
Fresh installation done 31. 12. 2010 and this started (surprise) at Friday..
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00:05
<alkisg>
I think there was a recent change from utf8 to UTF-8 in libc or something
00:05
Maybe that's what affected you, not sure, I'm using 10.04 with a greek, not english, default system locale
00:06
Btw if you just want an english UI, why don't you have finnish as your default system locale, and only select english in gdm?
00:06
$ egrep 'LC_*|LANG*' /etc/environment /etc/default/locale
00:06
/etc/default/locale:LANG="el_GR.UTF-8"
00:06
Check that you don't have anything weird in those 2 files
00:07
<muppis>
/etc/environment:LANGUAGE="fi_FI:en"
00:07
That sounds odd.
00:07
<alkisg>
That was deprecated since some years ago
00:07
The lang info was moved from environment to default/locale
00:07
<muppis>
It's same there.
00:08
<gnunux_>
hi
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00:09
<alkisg>
hi gnunux_
00:10* vagrantc sighs
00:11
<vagrantc>
looks like we can't rely on /boot/vmlinuz being a symlink to the appropriate kernel :(
00:11
guess this will force me to revamp the pxelinux.cfg/default generation to be more clevererer
00:11
<alkisg>
vagrantc: as managed in ltsp? or in general?
00:11
<vagrantc>
alkisg: both
00:12
<alkisg>
We currently have problems in ltsp, e.g. if I install a kernel and then remove it, I'm left with an unbootable chroot because of the wrong symlinks there
00:12
<vagrantc>
sure
00:12
<alkisg>
In general, I don't see /boot/vmlinuz in my Lucid box
00:12
I see /vmlinuz, maybe managed by some post-kernel hook?
00:13
*post-install kernel hook
00:13
<vagrantc>
in debian, it's not usual to have a symlink at all unless requested
00:13
but they're dropping support for those symlinks...
00:13
<alkisg>
Ah. In Ubuntu, /vmlinuz always showed the last kernel version for me. But I don't have that in the chroot, I'm probably missing some package that maintains the symlink
00:13
<vagrantc>
(in LTSP we request them)
00:14
<alkisg>
Ouch. If they're dropping support, we should copy that code in ltsp
00:15
<vagrantc>
they've introduced a "linux-version" helper that we can use to sort the available versions
00:15
so we can put the most recent version on top and such
00:15
it's about time we tackled that code, anyways...
00:15
<alkisg>
How about generating a pxelinux.cfg/default with labels for *all* the kernels? And if we ever come up with a menuing system, we can show a menu for those labels to the user. Otherwise pxelinux just uses the first==most recent label
00:16
<vagrantc>
yeah, something like that
00:16
i'd really like to have some sort of hooks like grub2 does ...
00:16
so we could more easily plug in memtest86+ and such
00:16
<alkisg>
Indeed. I think the linux package provides such hooks, right?
00:17
<vagrantc>
not quite like /etc/grub.d
00:18
i know the syslinux/extlinux maintainer was working on something similar to /etc/grub.d ... which would obviously be co-optible for pxelinux
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00:19
<alkisg>
Aaah you meant hooks for pxelinux. Yeah that'd be cool
00:20Nick change: gnunux_ -> gnunux
00:23
<alkisg>
vagrantc: can we rely on linux-version being there? Or should we use dpkg --compare-versions? Or can we just use "sort" which would work on most, but not all, of the cases?
00:23
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it will be available in newer versions of debian at least... no idea if ubuntu will follow suit
00:24
<alkisg>
Which package contains it?
00:24
<vagrantc>
linux-base
00:25
<alkisg>
Doesn't exist in natty, let's hope it's there on newer versions
00:25
<vagrantc>
it just hit sid recently
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00:30
<viks>
my ltsp booting is giving me java compatibility error
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00:33
<viks>
how to solve java error in ltsp boot
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00:34
<vagrantc>
viks: could you be more specific?
00:35
LTSP doesn't use java, so it's hard to guess what your error is about
00:38
<viks>
vagrantc : ya actually i am booting client in kiosk mode......n opening a web page .....that need java
00:38
so can u tell me exactly where to install
00:38
and also let me know how to upgrade firefox with 3.6
00:43
<vagrantc>
you'll want to search for packages that provide a firefox plugin for java
00:43
by search, i mean with your preferred package manager
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01:13
<viks>
#ulteo
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01:23Nick change: alkisg1 -> alkisg
01:23Possible future nick collision: alkisg
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01:32
<muppis>
alkisg, now getting: bash: warning: setlocale: LC_ALL: cannot change locale (fi_FI.UTF-8)
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01:34
<alkisg>
muppis: does it work now if you manually set LC_ALL, like it did before?
01:35
<muppis>
alkisg, gives same error.
01:36
<alkisg>
muppis: troubleshooting via irc is very slow sometimes, and I'm kinda busy atm, do you want to remotely share a console so that we can try to troubleshoot it together?
01:38
<muppis>
alkisg, well. I'm no in rush and I'm behind strict firewall. I'll try figure it out by myself.
01:38
<alkisg>
ok (firewall is not a problem, but better for me ;))
01:39
<muppis>
I meant, even I can, I'm not allowed to open ssh nor any remote access inside this network.
01:39
<alkisg>
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/Troubleshooting/socat-screen
01:40
Erm, something like that - no need for a full script
01:40
Just a command, it makes reverse connections
01:40
<muppis>
Ah..
01:40
<alkisg>
We do it frequently here to support greek teachers behind nat
01:41
The technician needs to have an open port, the teacher in the ltsp lab doesn't need anything special at all
01:41
And since it's screen sharing, not ssh, the teacher sees what the tech does so he doesn't worry
01:41* alkisg curses nvidia for not supporting vanta in recent kernels/xorgs and goes on to creating a hardy chroot :-/
01:42
<muppis>
Vanta? Isn't that ancient chipset?
01:43
<alkisg>
Yup, trying to put ltsp in a lab of 12 PCs with 128 ram/vanta chipsets
01:43
And nouveau is very slow and buggy on that chipset
01:43
<muppis>
Good luck.
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01:54Nick change: knipwim_ -> knipwim
01:57
<sh4rk>
hello fellow ltsp users. I'm relatively new to this and am trying to get my head around what config files affect which part of the system. Currently trying to setup LDAP auth and have been editing the relevant ldap/pam/nsswitch.conf files in /opt/ltsp/i386/ which seems to give me a degree of success but i find it weird tailing the auth.log file in /var/log/ instead of /opt/ltsp/i386/var/log/auth.log. Is /var/log bind mounted? Where can I look to find out?
02:05
<alkisg>
sh4rk: I've never had an ldap setup, but I believe you only need to do that on the server, not on the chroot
02:05
LDM (the ltsp display manager) uses ssh to the server to authenticate the users
02:05
So as long as you're able to ssh with ldap on the server, it'll work with ltsp too
02:09
<sh4rk>
alkisg, thanks. I was wondering about that. I kept seeing errors about unable to open an sftp connection ..
02:09
not sure why its using sftp
02:09
instead of ssh that is
02:11
<alkisg>
Start with being able to login on your server with ssh/ldap from another client
02:11
Then undo any changes you made to your chroot
02:11
And if the problem persists, we can try to troubleshoot it then
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04:59
<andygraybeal>
has anyone here used zentyal? (it's ubuntu server bundled nicely to be a 'small business server' with a web interface) i'm wondering because i want to integrate it with ltsp, they say they are working on a module, but i don't know how far along that module is, and i figure someone has already done implemented ltsp with zentyal in here.
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05:20
<sh4rk>
alkisg, soo....
05:20
alkisg, got this working
05:21
alkisg, the "problem" was actually keyboard layout
05:21
<alkisg>
:)
05:21
<sh4rk>
man that sucked
05:21
any ideas where to change this?
05:21
/opt/ltsp/i386/etc/lts.conf ?
05:21
<alkisg>
sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 dpkg-reconfigure console-setup
05:22
if that's debian-based, that is..
05:26
<sh4rk>
ok cool
05:26
do i need to run ltsp-update-image each time i change something in that folder?
05:27
<alkisg>
yes
05:27
if you're on ubuntu
05:27
<sh4rk>
k
05:28
does ltsp-update-image grab everything in /opt/ltsp/i386 and create a NBD image of it?
05:30
<alkisg>
Yes
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05:33
<mgariepy>
good morning everyone
05:33* highvoltage would've made a TSA joke right now if the coffee kicked in properly already
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08:31
<matrix3000>
anyone know why users may get a random logoff with error message "user id not found"
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12:14
<thunsucker>
i'm having an issue testing the kiosk screen script, using ubuntu 10.04. testing with a vbox client has no issues, booting up a normal client and I get an X error
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12:22
<thunsucker_>
i'm having an issue testing the kiosk screen script, using ubuntu 10.04. testing with a vbox client has no issues, booting up a normal client and I get an X error
12:22
<alkisg>
What error?
12:24
<thunsucker_>
alkisg: just a sec bootikng up a test client
12:24
<Roasted>
Is there official commercial support for LTSP?
12:24
<thunsucker_>
alkisg: fatal server
12:24
crap it refreshed just a sec
12:25
<alkisg>
Roasted: I think disklessworkstations.com can provide commercial support
12:25
<thunsucker_>
fatal server error
12:25
invalid arguemtn for -config
12:25
<Roasted>
alkisg, to the actual LTSP package or just go their own gear? I noticed they sell actual thin client boxes, etc...
12:25
<thunsucker_>
*invalid argument for -config
12:26
<alkisg>
Roasted: not sure, you'd have to ask them for the details
12:26
<thunsucker_>
for non-root users the file specified with -config must be a relative path and must not contain any ".." elements. using default xorg.conf searchj path
12:26
ddxSigGiveup: Closing Log
12:28
alkisg: the same setup works on my laptop, a different dell laptop, a a lot of random desktops, but there there are several that have that error
12:30
<alkisg>
Roasted: also revolutionlinux should provide support, and probably for code too. stgraber?
12:33
<thunsucker_>
alkisg: i think it's something with the video driver
12:33
<alkisg>
thunsucker_: sounds like something related to ltsp-trunk/client/screen-session.d/XS90-set-x-conf and to the fact that kiosk runs as a user (while e.g. ldm runs as root), but I can't imagine what goes wrong there
12:33
More specific troubleshooting would be needed to pinpoint the bug
12:34
<thunsucker_>
alkisg: you have any suggestions?
12:35
<alkisg>
Nothing specific, sorry
12:35
<thunsucker_>
ahhh I just found a bug report
12:35
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/572974
12:35
same bug report that told me how to fix kiosksession
12:35
<alkisg>
Roasted: if you're looking for something specific, e.g. "adding fat clients to a domain", maybe you can also send a mail to the mailing list asking for paid support. Maybe someone will have a few hours to solve your problem
12:36
<Roasted>
alkisg, That's a good thought. That wasn't why I was thinking of it though, but it's a good idea. I was just curious because sometimes commercial support being available helps move open source projects in our environment easier.
12:37
alkisg, for the time being though since I'm in a bind I'm moving everybody to thin clients to get around the issue. I'm not convinced it's an easy fix to get fat clients to play nice with a windows domain just yet.
12:37
<alkisg>
Roasted, btw, ltsp is in "main", so it's supported by canonical too
12:37
<Roasted>
so canonical support = ltsp support?
12:37
<alkisg>
So if you buy support from canonical, it'll also cover ltsp afaik
12:37
<Roasted>
nice, nice
12:37
good thought
12:37
I'm not sure how much they'd care about windows domains though.
12:37
<alkisg>
Not sure about any of these, they're just thoughts, you'd need to verify them
12:37
<Roasted>
But it's the cards I have to play to make LTSP work, so... *shrug*
12:38
<thunsucker_>
Roasted: you still having issues with your windows domain+ltsp ?
12:38
<Roasted>
fat clients, yes
12:38
thin clients, no
12:38
<thunsucker_>
whats wrong?
12:38
time?
12:38
<alkisg>
(10:37:02 PM) Roasted: I'm not convinced it's an easy fix to get fat clients to play nice with a windows domain just yet. ==> I don't believe it would take more than a day for someone that know their stuff to fix that problem
12:38
<Roasted>
no
12:38
<thunsucker_>
whats wrong?
12:38
<Roasted>
thunsucker_, they just require to be authenticated. ALL of the time.
12:39
I log in. I try to hit a file server - requires authentication.
12:39
<thunsucker_>
Roasted: and the time is syncing correctly now?
12:39
<Roasted>
I save a doc in openoffice to the share - required authentication
12:39
yes
12:39
It's just obnoxious, so I got extra RAM for the server and I'm moving that lab to thin, as our other thin client setup works 100% flawlessly
12:39
<thunsucker_>
what time source are the fat clients sycning to
12:39
<Roasted>
to our server
12:39
<thunsucker_>
please be specific
12:39
which server
12:39
<Roasted>
our time server
12:39
<thunsucker_>
windows time server?
12:39
<Roasted>
yes
12:39
via IP
12:39
<thunsucker_>
is that time server a dc?
12:40
<Roasted>
it's a backup dc
12:40
but yes
12:40
<thunsucker_>
fair enough
12:40
<Roasted>
we have 2 in case one tanks
12:40
<thunsucker_>
cool
12:41
do you have the fat clients in the same OU as the thin clients? meaning are the same policies and etc. being applied to both OU's?
12:41
<Roasted>
yep
12:41
it's the same setup
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12:41
<Roasted>
I can set up a thin client test environment here right now, it'll work fine. I've set up about a dozen so far for testing purposes.
12:41
yet each time I go fat.. issues
12:41
<thunsucker_>
ahh
12:41
maybe something to do with auto mounting
12:42
<Roasted>
someone else here said it best, I think
12:42
<thunsucker_>
on the thin clients are there any changes to /etc/fstab to auto mount the windows shares?
12:42
<Roasted>
no
12:42
fstab is default on both
12:42
someone else said it like this...
12:42
<thunsucker_>
thats one route you coudl take
12:42
you could auto mount a windows share on bootup
12:42
<Roasted>
with a fat client, it only authenticates once - during login. after that it simply forgets who you are, that's why each time you go to a file server it s like, whoa, who are you, please authenticate
12:42
<stgraber>
alkisg: I don't work for them anymore ;)
12:43
alkisg: but yeah, they can probably do it
12:43
<thunsucker_>
Roasted: ahhh I see
12:43
<Roasted>
with thin clients, different story. the server RETAINS that connection somehow and allows it to pass-through to the clients
12:43
<alkisg>
stgraber: for revolution linux? wow, I didn't know that :)
12:43
<stgraber>
alkisg: started working for Canonical on Friday
12:43
<Roasted>
since evidently thin chroot is more "a part" of the server than the fat chroot, or something
12:43
<alkisg>
Cool
12:44
<Roasted>
thunsucker_, I'm not sure if fstab is the route to go either, because we'll have about 12 users a day logging in per box, so that would be 12 users per boot. fstab is a per boot thing.
12:46
<thunsucker_>
yea
12:46
<Roasted>
either way, it'll require more testing. thin clients just make more sense...
12:46
<alkisg>
Roasted: I'd go with remoteapps + mounting on the server, as it happens now with thin clients. sshfs or nfs would then get that on the fat client
12:47
<Roasted>
alkisg, I've never explored the avenue of remoteapps, so I know literally nothing about it.
12:47
<alkisg>
Thin clients == just 1 pc, the server. A lot simpler. But also lot worse performance.
12:47
<Roasted>
fat clients = a headache, unable to sync with the domain properly, frustration.
12:47
I'm using what works.
12:47
<alkisg>
Roasted, agreed, so maybe contacting revolutionlinux wouldn't be such a bad idea. Maybe you'd have the solution within a day.
12:48
<Roasted>
I don't have the money to do that, as I can't make those decisions. I was just curious if support existed.
12:48
<alkisg>
OK
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12:50
<Roasted>
I certainly hope there's not a performance degrade when I swap this lab to thin clients this week.
12:50
Our other thin client lab is JUST as fast as the fat client lab.
12:50
similar setups between the two
12:51
<thunsucker_>
Roasted: you could always go a different route with windows authenication and not use likewise
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12:51
<Roasted>
I'm not sure there's anything else as user friendly as likewise.
12:51
In fact I have no clue how I'd even join a pc to the domain without likewise. I've read through samba docs but it just doesn't make much sense.
12:52
<thunsucker_>
probably not
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12:52
<thunsucker_>
which version of the CIFS server are you using 5.x or 6.x
12:53
<Roasted>
whatever is in 1010
12:53
not too sure offhand
12:53
<thunsucker_>
as of january the cifs was at 5.6
12:53
saw a post to manually compile and raise to version 6.0
12:53
<Roasted>
is there anything with 6.0 that would benefit me?
12:54
<thunsucker_>
not 100% sure but it would be worth a try to see if it helped with auth
12:55
<Roasted>
I hate to sound like this
12:55
but I hate to not use likewise
12:55
likewise is becoming "the" standard to integrate mac/unix/linux in a windows domain
12:55
<thunsucker_>
i know
12:55
<Roasted>
it has made things so much easier
12:55
<thunsucker_>
i'm not an expert on likewise
12:55
<Roasted>
if I can't use that, I'm not sure I'm even interested in using linux in this environment
12:55
<thunsucker_>
but likewise uses cifs
12:56
<Roasted>
well I have the latest version of liekwise. not sure if that makes a difference.
12:56
<thunsucker_>
so you upgrade cifs and likewise might have the fucntionality you need
12:56
<Roasted>
I'll look into that
12:56
I'm setting up another test server here to use as a fat client server
12:56
so I can see what can be done
12:56
<highvoltage>
Roasted: on the brightside, it certainly sounds like you've learned a lot recently
12:56
<Roasted>
so far, it's thin or bust. :P
12:56
highvoltage, that aint no joke. my head hurts. :(
12:57
<thunsucker_>
Roasted: ahhh thats when you know you're leqrning :P
12:57
alkisg: cheer, ty for your help with the kiosk. that bug report solved the issue
12:57
<alkisg>
thunsucker_: cool, put some comment there so that the fix gets commited sometime
12:58
<thunsucker_>
alkisg: will do
12:58
Roasted: in the name of ltsp and all thats good, I'll do some research to see if there is an easy fix for the windows auth
13:02
<Roasted>
thunsucker_, your help is appreciated.
13:03
I'm just hoping a pair of xeon dual core proc's and 12gb of RAM will push 30 thinnies
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13:03
<Roasted>
if so, that's our ticket ot ride out the end of the year with flying colors
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13:21
<Roasted>
hahaha
13:21
I was browsing the likewise forums and there's a user at the same stage I am. Windows domain, Edubuntu 10.10, LTSP clients, Likewise Open.
13:21
Looks like I may have an ally to discuss this Windows issue with. :P
13:22
It's quittin time, guys. Thanks for the help, as always.
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13:25
<highvoltage>
take care Roasted
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14:01
<roasted_>
Ya know... I wonder something...
14:01
In regard to me trying to implement multiple LTSP servers on the same network with a Windows DHCP server, I wonder if it would be easier to just seclude a network switch for each lab and use servers with 2 NICs - One DHCP (LTSP handling DHCP) to the switch/clients, and the other being static with external access.
14:02
I just wonder if those scenarios would allow the clients on a 192 network to still communicate to the file servers on our 10.52 network without issue.
14:02
With the server as our middle man, I would THINK it'd be okay?
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14:09
<alkisg>
roasted_: sure, that would work. Otherwise you'd just have to separate the clients by their mac addresses, not very hard either.
14:09
<roasted_>
hm
14:10
did anybody suggest that earlier and I just not pick up on it?
14:10
<alkisg>
No idea, wasn't looking
14:10
<roasted_>
I mean, I would THINK even though the networks are independent that they would communicate.
14:10
After all, our VOIP system is 192.168
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14:10
<roasted_>
besides I would think it would be smart to segregate traffic for thin/fat labs to be on the SAME switch so they're not hopping everywhere
14:12
<alkisg>
That's what switches are for (vs hubs)
14:12
<roasted_>
yeah man
14:12
I hear ya
14:12
well Im gonna get a bike ride in here. first 70*F+ day we've seen so far.
14:12
keep it real alkisg
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20:29ry (~ry@static-71-183-64-28.nycmny.fios.verizon.net) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
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21:46Nick change: Mobe_ -> Mobe
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22:16
<viks>
sometime m getting kernal panic error on ltsp boot
22:16
how to solve this
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00:00--- Tue Apr 5 2011