IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 20 July 2009   (all times are UTC)

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02:20
<ogra>
vagrantc, argh ! /srv/tftp
02:21
<vagrantc>
ogra: ?
02:21
<ogra>
see your bugmail
02:21
tftpd-hpa changed both of its defaults, startup trough inetd and it defaults to serve from /srv/tftp now
02:27* vagrantc likes atftpd better anyways
02:27
<vagrantc>
ogra: i think our scripts already support multiple tftp dirs ... so it shouldn't be hard to add another
02:27
<ogra>
i'm just scared about upgrades
02:27
changing both defaults at the same time is error prone
02:27
<vagrantc>
upgrades should be handled properly by the package, otherwise it's an RC bug.
02:28
<ogra>
beyond tha fact i'm not thrilled by /srv usage of package defaults
02:28
*that
02:28
<alkisg>
dnsmasq ftw! :D
02:28
<vagrantc>
alkisg: yeah!
02:29
<alkisg>
vagrantc: so you're in our time zone now?
02:29
<vagrantc>
really, dnsmasq rocks, handles tftp, dhcp, and you get DNS caching proxy as a bonus :)
02:29
<ogra>
sadly no option :(
02:29
<vagrantc>
alkisg: yeah
02:29
<alkisg>
Spain?
02:29
<vagrantc>
alkisg: si
02:29
<alkisg>
Heh... it's nice to see you in the morning :)
02:30
<vagrantc>
alkisg: you have all day to pester me with crazy ideas :)
02:30
<alkisg>
ogra: there was a MIR whatyamacallit to put dnsmasq into main, and it wasn't turned down, but I don't know what happened in the end...
02:31
<ogra>
alkisg, its very unlikely that it moves to main
02:31
we have that "no duplication if possible" rule
02:31
and dhcpd is used in enterprise setups
02:31
as well as bind
02:32
<alkisg>
ogra, sure, but if some functionality isn't offered by dhcp, then isn't it ok for dnsmasq to go into main?
02:32
E.g. tftp, proxydhcp..
02:33
*i meant "offered by dhcp3-server"
02:33
Let me find the MIR...
02:33
<ogra>
alkisg, i'll happily help switching ltsp if it goes to main
02:33
but i dont decide about MIrs
02:34
<alkisg>
Sure, I understand, it's just that there *already* was such a MIR, and I though it was going well...
02:34
damn, where was it? ...
02:35
<ogra>
if archive reorganization is in place it might be easy for it to go to main
02:35
since then main doesnt necessarily mean suported anymore
02:36
though it will still be not easy to get it on the CD i guess
02:36
<alkisg>
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionDnsMasq
02:37
..and the bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dnsmasq/+bug/190905
02:37
I was talking about this comment: "For the record, kvm was approved and promoted a while ago, so dnsmasq should be fixed soon."
02:37
<ogra>
oh, its filed by zul (member of the server team)
02:37
then chances are actually good :)
02:38* ogra reads pittis comment and lols
02:38
<ogra>
seems i was right about my assumption
02:39
dnsmasq is in main already according to that bug
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02:39
<alkisg>
Heh... (10:39:20 πμ) ubottu: dnsmasq (source: dnsmasq): A small caching DNS proxy and DHCP/TFTP server. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.47-3 (jaunty), package size 12 kB, installed size 112 kB
02:39
<ogra>
weird
02:41
<alkisg>
And now with dnsmasq 2.49 (=proxydhcp) in Jaunty ltsp with external dhcp servers is *really* easy to set-up...
02:42
<ogra>
<StevenK> ogra: The source is, the binary isn;t
02:42
<pitti> ogra: dnsmasq-base is in main, the full dnsmasq binary isn't
02:42
<alkisg>
So if a choice was to be presented in the alternate cd (i.e. i386/amd64 chroot) then another choice would be also welcome (dhcp3-server / dnsmasq)
02:42
<ogra>
no option
02:42
<alkisg>
Ah, that's fine too :)
02:42
<ogra>
its one or the other on the CD
02:42
<alkisg>
No option? I thought there was some talk to allow amd64 CDs to download the i386 chroot from the internet...
02:42
<ogra>
a) adding questions to the install process is forbidden
02:43
b) no dulication of funtionallity on the CD
02:43
<alkisg>
OK then dnsmasq could replace tftp :P :D
02:44
Right! :) (10:43:39 πμ) ubottu: dnsmasq-base (source: dnsmasq): A small caching DNS proxy and DHCP/TFTP server. In component main, is optional. Version 2.47-3 (jaunty), package size 216 kB, installed size 656 kB
02:45
<vagrantc>
the one problem with dnsmasq is it does DNS by default... which is kind of ironic
02:45
being that that was it's original purpose ... it doesn't make it easy to turn off if you want to run a real DNS server.
02:45
<alkisg>
port=0
02:45
In /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp.conf
02:46
(or in the command line)
02:49
Also, by putting a tftp-root line there we can continue to use /var/lib/tftpboot
02:50
<ogra>
does dropping files into /etc/dnsmasq.d/ suffice to configure it or do you need to touch any of its defaults to make ltsp.conf override ?
02:51
<alkisg>
Dropping files is all that is needed
02:51
<ogra>
thats neat indeed
02:51
<alkisg>
Yeah, saves a lot of configuration headaches
02:52
<ogra>
well ...
02:52
it adds some as well
02:52
<alkisg>
E.g.?
02:53
<ogra>
if you ship that file in the ltsp package it becomes a conffile automatically
02:53
<alkisg>
So?
02:53
<ogra>
so changing a single setting anfocres a debconf propmpt on upgrade if the user ever touched the file
02:54
it gives you more freedom in some areas but takes as much in others
02:54
<alkisg>
If the user comments out #port=0, debconf will prompt him? I don't think so, it only does that if it can't patch the file... right?
02:54
<ogra>
no
02:54
<alkisg>
Other user configuration can go to his own file, e.g. dnsmasq.d/user.conf
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02:54
<ogra>
if the user comments out #port=0 *and* we for example change the dhcp config in the package
02:55* alkisg thinks he tried that and didn't get a prompt :(
02:55
<ogra>
denconf prompt sare issued when a three way merge is required
02:55
*promts are
02:55
bah
02:55
<alkisg>
Heh
02:55
<vagrantc_>
not a debconf prompt ... dpkg conffile handling
02:55* ogra goes to a typing class :P
02:55
<vagrantc_>
unless you use ucf ... which is a bit tricky to get right
02:55
<ogra>
vagrantc_, err, right
02:56
in any case you get a prompt or go into ucf hell
02:56
<vagrantc_>
but conffile handling is ... clunky at best ... easy to implement from a packaging point of view, but kind of challenging for the users
02:56
<ogra>
its definately harder to make a single change
02:56
yeah, thats my point
02:57
not that we dont have that problem solved in todays setup though :)
02:57
but making a change to a sigle service is easier in the modular setup
02:57
alkisg, do you know if dnsmasq can merge configs ?
02:58
<alkisg>
Not sure what you mean there
02:58
<ogra>
using /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp-tftp.conf + /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp-dhcp.conf + /etc/dnsmasq.d/ltsp-foople.conf ...
02:58
<vagrantc_>
i.e. 00.conf is overridden by 01.conf
02:59
<alkisg>
ogra: yes, vagrantc_ no :)
02:59
<ogra>
would that be automerged to a single confg ?
02:59
<alkisg>
ogra: it just reads everything in dnsmasq.d
02:59
<vagrantc_>
ogra: you can do includes
02:59
ogra: from each of your dnsmasq.d snippets
02:59
<ogra>
ah, then there is no need for a single file
02:59
<alkisg>
So yes, youo can have a single line file with port=0
02:59
<vagrantc_>
right
02:59
<ogra>
that would prevent the prob
02:59
<vagrantc_>
what's port=0 do?
02:59
<alkisg>
turns off dns
03:00
<ogra>
tells it to not serve dns
03:00
<vagrantc_>
oh! great!
03:00
<ogra>
as i understood above
03:00
<vagrantc_>
i bet resolvconf will still configure /etc/resolv.conf to use 127.0.0.1 by default, though
03:00
so probably need to disable that, too ...
03:01
<ogra>
??
03:01
we're talking about the server
03:01
or do you see 127.0.0.1 on the client with dnsmasq ?
03:02
<vagrantc_>
when dnsmasq and resolvconf are both installed, dnsmasq takes over /etc/resolv.conf with nameserver 127.0.0.1
03:02
so if you disable dns on dnsmasq, and there's no other dns server ... it will likely break
03:02
<ogra>
who uses resolvconf nowadays ?
03:02
<vagrantc_>
well, it's just a use case to be aware of ... it is used by some people
03:02* ogra didnt see that anywhere since years and years
03:03* alkisg didn't understand the problem. Dnsmasq takes over /etc/resolv.conf when it doesn't serve dns?
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03:03
<ogra>
apart from an antique comment in the /e/n/i manpage :)
03:04
alkisg, no, resolvconf (as evil as it is) decides you must be a DNS server if dnsmasq is installed locally
03:04
<alkisg>
Eeeek :)
03:04
<ogra>
so points your /etc/resolv.conf entry to localhost
03:05
<alkisg>
Hrm maybe then file a bug against resolvconf? :)
03:05
<ogra>
though i would consider that a resolvconf bug
03:05
snap :)
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03:36
<vagrantc_>
dnsmasq's original purpose was to be a caching DNS proxy server, so it's a very reasonable default to have it automatically configure your machine to ... make use of one of dnsmasq's primary features.
03:36
dhcp was added fairly early on, and tftp recently...
03:37
<ogra>
well, but blindly pointing to localhost is simply wrong
03:37
resolvconf should at least ping the port
03:37
<vagrantc_>
well, it works with the defaults ...
03:37
if you're changing the defaults, you need to change it
03:38
ideally, the resolvconf hooks are smart enough to figure out that it's not running DNS, and not trigger the resolvconf updates.
03:38
i haven't verified if they are or not, but my *guess* would be that they're not that smart.
03:39
<ogra>
ah
03:40* vagrantc_ is looking at them now
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04:22
<vagrantc_>
ogra: the qemu-arm-eabi stuff rocks!
04:22
ogra: i got a qemu-system-arm thin client booting... although X failed to configure
04:24
<ogra>
yeah
04:24
X uses a log of PCI probing
04:24
*lot
04:25
might be the versatile board doesnt expose PCI
04:25
<vagrantc_>
yeah, it had something to do with PCI...
04:25
there was only a single something on PCI ... so i'm guessing it just couldn't figure out where the video card was
04:26
<ogra>
it should use xfbdev though
04:28
check if xserver-xorg-video-fbdev is installed in your chroot
04:28
(and note that fbdev doesnt have any xrandr support at all)
04:30
<vagrantc_>
ogra: it's installed ... should i configure it through lts.conf?
04:31
<ogra>
try that
04:31
it should work automatically though
04:31
<vagrantc_>
XSERVER=fbdev ?
04:31
<ogra>
yep
04:31
it works here on all real HW i have
04:32
wihout having to specify
04:36
<vagrantc_>
qemu occasionally has x86-isms with the other emulators, i've found ...
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04:38
<ogra>
heh
04:38
well, you are insane using emulators like onions anyway :)
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04:40
<vagrantc_>
ogra: that did it!
04:40
<ogra>
:)
04:40
<vagrantc_>
though i didn't really network boot it
04:41
but hey, LTSP on debian's armel port
04:41
<ogra>
yeah
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06:26
<nubae>
can one use more than 1 mirror with the --mirror switch?
06:33
anyone?
06:34
<ogra>
no
06:35
ltsp-build-client has a --help switch for that ;)
06:35* ogra wont telly you that there is an --extra-mirror option without pointing you to that :P
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06:39
<gekkos>
vagrantc_: Hi, Gadi told me that you are working to get local device support in a rdp session working. Can you help me with some more information about this. we are using lenny and localsupport for linux clients is working fine. many thanks
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06:53
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: hi. yeah, i can look into it a bit.
06:53
gekkos: actually, i'll be going to lunch soon
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06:55
<_UsUrPeR_>
morning all
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07:02
<gekkos>
vagrantc_: hi thanks i would like to test it, i have a test server where i can play around. can you tell me what I need to try it. the ltsp server is a lenny distro
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08:34
<MicroMole>
I appologize in advance if this is a stupid question...
08:34
I have upgraded a server that has a few thin clients from Fedora 10 to Fedora 11, but the clients are still PXE booting with the old Fedora 10 kernel.
08:35
This is not a big problem but I still want to know whether there is an easy way to upgrade the ltsp kernels as well.
08:35
The name of the script ltsp-update-kernels sounds like it could be useful but the –help message is not very detailed, no man page, and after much googling I'm still quite lost.
08:35
Should I just let it be and forget about this or is there some howto that explains upgrading ltsp kernels ?
08:38
<_UsUrPeR_>
MicroMole: the updates you have made to your server will not be transferred to your client without updating the image
08:40
the ltsp image should be perceived as an independent operating system residing on your server, which must be updated separately.
08:40
On that note, here is what I would recommend:
08:40
instead of changing your current ltsp image, you should just build a new client image, while backing up the one that currently works
08:40
so here's what you do:
08:41
mv /opt/ltsp /opt/ltsp.old
08:41
ltsp-build-image --arch i386
08:41
The first command will move your old ltsp software to a backup directory
08:42
<ogra>
its -build-client :)
08:42
<_UsUrPeR_>
the second command will build a new client image from scratch
08:42
<ogra>
not -image
08:42
<_UsUrPeR_>
*whoops*
08:42
I normally type "ltsp-b<tab>" ;)
08:42
<ogra>
yeah, with b that works ... u gets tricky :)
08:43
<MicroMole>
ok and that's it?
08:43
sounds too easy
08:43
<_UsUrPeR_>
MicroMole: yeah, that's about it!
08:44
<MicroMole>
then that's what I'll do
08:44
thanks
08:44
<_UsUrPeR_>
now, if you are doing this in a working environment (i.e. people are presently using the clients), you may want to wait until later
08:44
<MicroMole>
I will wait until tonight
08:44
<_UsUrPeR_>
because building a new client image can take upwards of two hours. It's mostly dependent on how fast your internet connection is
08:45
<MicroMole>
luckily most people are on vacation
08:45
<ogra>
yeah, thats the disadvantage of using NFS :)
08:46
in ubuntu you could theoretically do it in production
08:46
(not that i would recommend it ... working on production systems in use is generally a bad idea)
08:48
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: follow the instructions here: http://wiki.debian.org/LTSP/Howto/Lenny-With-Backports
08:48
gekkos: that will get you a version that can do the local mounting ... but i think there's some bugs yet
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09:28
<gekkos>
vagrantc_: I installed the lenny backports version and did some basic tests. When I login I have to choose which server I would like to access (is it possible to remove this). And logout hangs, with the lenny version logout was working normal. I will give rdp a try now. txs
09:29
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: the lenny version of ltsp?
09:30
<gekkos>
yes
09:30
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: so, before switching to the lenny backports, logout didn't hang, and after switching to lenny backports it did hang?
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09:38
<_UsUrPeR_>
hey, does anyone know how to get wakeonlan to broadcast from eth1 instead of eth0?
09:41
<gekkos>
yes that's true. And also before lenny backport I didn't had to choose a server
09:43
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: could you paste your lts.conf to the pastebot:
09:43
!pastebot
09:43
<ltspbot>
vagrantc_: "pastebot" is The LTSP pastebot is at http://pastebot.ltsp.org. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. A link to the content will be pasted in the channel.
09:45
<ogra>
vagrantc_, so it looks like qemu 0.11 will enter ubuntu before karmic releases ... meaning it has the eabi patches included ... i just need to roll a package with the maintainer scripts :)
09:46
i assume the ubuntu package will enter through debian (not sure though, since the work is tighly tied to kvm work done in ubuntu)
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09:51
<gekkos>
vagrantc_: nothing is configured yet in lts.conf. The message I get 'enter the name of the host you want to log in to'
09:53* ogra wonders if sdm sneaked back in :)
09:57
<vagrantc_>
ogra: nice!
09:57
ogra: is it in 0.11 upstream?
09:57
<ogra>
vagrantc_, https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-virt/+archive/virt-daily-upstream
09:57
someone said it is
09:57
i'm just ytrying out the daily build
09:57
<vagrantc_>
you still need to do the static build of qemu-arm-eabi, no?
09:58
<ogra>
hmm, yes, might be
09:58
<vagrantc_>
gekkos: ok, read /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/ltsp/screen.d/rdesktop, which explains how to use it
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10:22
<ogra>
vagrantc_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu/+bug/401782
10:24* vagrantc_ hopes to see it in debian soonish, too.
10:24
<vagrantc_>
ogra: actually, you could link to the relevent debian bugs ...
10:25
<ogra>
file it in debian, link the debian one in LP
10:25
<_UsUrPeR_>
does anyone know how to change what NIC wakeonlan broadcasts from?
10:25
<ogra>
i know kirkland will discuss it with upstream too
10:25
<vagrantc_>
ogra: yeah, i'll dig up the two long-standing bugs in debian...
10:26
<panthera>
.oO(yay!)
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10:28
<vagrantc_>
ogra: how do i link bugs to debian?
10:29
<ogra>
also affects distribution
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10:29
<ogra>
pick debian in the pulldown and add the ful url at the bottom
10:29
*full
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10:31
<vagrantc_>
ogra: hrm. apparently i can only tie it to one bug.
10:32
<ogra>
you can do "affects distribution" multiple times i think
10:32
never tried that though
10:33
<vagrantc_>
i get an error: This bug has already been reported on qemu (debian).
10:33
<ogra>
ah, and there is no meta bug in debian ?
10:33
<alkisg>
_UsUrPeR_: wakeonlan -i <broadcast_address> <mad_address> ? Where broadcast_address = the broadcast address for the correct server NIC?
10:33
<vagrantc_>
ogra: there's one bug for the binfmt stuff, and one for the static qemu build
10:34
<_UsUrPeR_>
alkisg: oh nice. Ok. I'll give that a shot. Right now, my server is broadcasting magic packets on eth0, when all the thinclients are on my eth1 NIC
10:35
<ogra>
vagrantc_, hmm isnt one mentioned in the other at least ?
10:35
<alkisg>
_UsUrPeR_: I've never tried it, but it sounds like it should work...
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10:35
<vagrantc_>
ogra: yeah, one blocks the other ... so they're all linked
10:36
<ogra>
then its fine
10:36
ugh
10:36
thats a can of worms
10:37
they request the static builds for *all* arches
10:37
not sure kirkland wants to invest that much
10:37
but i guess once he builds an example deb for armel its easy to copy
10:39
<vagrantc_>
ogra: yeah, i'm adding comments on the bug.
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10:50
<gekkos>
vagrantc_: txs i have to leave now. Will test it tomorrow
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10:55
<RobertBerger2>
Does anyone have experience with ethtools and a Intel® PRO/1000 PT Dual Port Server Adapter and/or a Atheros L1E Gigabit LAN controller which resides on the motherboard?
10:55
I am planning to buy some server and want to choose the right components.
10:57
Concerning the Intel card I found in the sources of ethtool (e1000.c) that the 82571 chipset seems to be supported.
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11:26
<epsas>
hmm - what is a good way to send a message to all users?
11:27
<johnny>
hmm.. thin client manager thingy only lets you do it one by one iirc..
11:27
unless you can do select all and i didn't notice..
11:28
<ogra>
johnny, it did send to all selected ones when i wrote it :P
11:28
not sure it still does though :)
11:28
<alkisg>
epsas: italc does that
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11:30
<maginot>
good afternoon .. so ... something very odd is happening on my ltsp server, at least I have only seen this happening there... when I do a "ps -aux" to see the process that are running some users aren't being shown by name, but in the place of the user name is his uid, is this normal ?
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11:34
<Gadi>
maginot: that will happen for users with usernames longer than 8 characters
11:40
<maginot>
Gadi, Hmm good to know =) thanks
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12:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
alkisg: got it! :D
12:14
<alkisg>
was that it?
12:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
exactly like you said :)
12:14
just remember the broadcast address
12:14
<alkisg>
Nice, man pages do work! :P :D
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12:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
apparently 255.255.255.255 will only come out of eth0 :P
12:15
<alkisg>
Maybe it uses the default route
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12:54
<bieb>
CAN-o-SPAM: Alex you here?
12:55
<CAN-o-SPAM>
bieb: hi
12:56
<bieb>
CAN-o-SPAM: Got my boxes today..
12:56
thanks
13:07
<ogra>
http://lkml.org/lkml/2009/7/20/167
13:10
finally its possible ! virtual ltsp on top of windows terminal server :P
13:11
<CAN-o-SPAM>
can u believe MS is contributing to kernel
13:12
watch out google, some lightblubs might have went on at the monopoly shop
13:12
<ogra>
they just did
13:12
<CAN-o-SPAM>
ogra: are you at oscon? or just watching news feeds
13:12
<ogra>
someone forwarded it to me
13:12
is it OSCON time ?
13:12* ogra didnt follow it this year
13:13
<ogra>
i got a bunch of CFP and invitation mails
13:14
ah, its this week
13:14
somehow its not the same without portland around it :)
13:18
<CAN-o-SPAM>
hehe
13:18
if you use twitter, try following #oscon ... some sources won't be reliable, but you should get news first
13:19* Lns wonders if the gpl2 code released will stay in-sync with MS code, or if this is just another publicity stunt and soon it will break, making Linux look bad
13:20
<johnny>
doubtful..
13:20
their customers care about it
13:20
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Lns: i'm suprised ur not down at oscon
13:21
<Lns>
CAN-o-SPAM: it's in San Jose?!
13:21
<CAN-o-SPAM>
Lns: when your from michigan, cali = cali, we don't deal with that NoCal, SoCal stuff .... haha
13:22
<Lns>
CAN-o-SPAM: ?
13:22
I had no idea it was even here...
13:22
<CAN-o-SPAM>
oh ok
13:23
<Lns>
jeez it's like 2 hours from here. I should just go drive down =p
13:26
Holy crap that's kind of expensive to go.
13:28
I don't get why some things like this charge so much to hear tutorials, lectures, etc... 800 bucks for one day?? Come on...
13:35
<CAN-o-SPAM>
ya, that does get frustrating
13:35
Lns: i saw some people on twitter looking for day passes ... might be worth a try
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13:44
<_UsUrPeR_>
!s
13:44
<ltspbot>
_UsUrPeR_: "s" is Scotty!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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13:44
<_UsUrPeR_>
I have some questions sbalneav
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13:45
<_UsUrPeR_>
about Sabayon
13:45
<epsas>
okay - i wrote a script to send messages to all users
13:45
via notify-send... and it works
13:45
... a side-effect is the method for sending xeyes to people's terminals =D
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14:06
<epsas>
okay - /win 2
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15:19
<alkisg>
stgraber: dnsmasq-base *is* in main... does this mean that ltsp-server-standalone could be modified to depend on "dhcp3-server | dnsmasq-base"?
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15:43
<stgraber>
alkisg: probably so, will look at it tonight, I have to upload a new ltsp anyway
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16:13
<stgraber>
sbalneav: poke
16:14
sbalneav: any progress on that fix for ldm ? I plan on uploading ltsp today
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16:34
<MicroMole>
_UsUrPeR_: I followed your instructions for and ran ltsp-build-client
16:34
15 minutes later all was done
16:34
no problems
16:34
impressive
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21:42
<jdu>
Is this http://www.k12ltsp.org/mediawiki/index.php/GDM_auto-login_with_specific_users_to_specific_terminals the best way to accomplish autologin? Or is there a better method?
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22:40
<jammcq>
hey friends
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