IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 22 November 2013   (all times are UTC)

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03:38
<ternarybit>
Do I understand correctly that an LTSP client will PXE boot into whatever system the server is running? E.g. if the server is running Debian/LXDE w/ Chromium, all that will be available to the client?
03:40
<Fenuks>
ternarybit: Yes, if it is a thin client. I think it's default for ltsp on ubuntu and debian
03:41
<ternarybit>
Fenuks: thanks. So, if I were to later add (say) LibreOffice, all the clients would then have access to it as well?
03:42
<vagrantc>
ternarybit: think of it as extra monitors, mice and keyboards for the server.
03:42
<Fenuks>
ternarybit: Yes, no need to reboot the clients
03:42
<ternarybit>
Very nice. So I must ask: what about persistence?
03:43
<Fenuks>
yes, as vagrantc said, thin clients are just like terminals, translating image from server and sending your keyboard and mouse actions to server
03:43
<vagrantc>
files will still be there
03:43
<Fenuks>
files will be stored on server by default, although you can mount local storage, like usb-flas drives
03:43
<vagrantc>
but you can disconnect from a session and reconnect with all your applications in the same state ...
03:43
by default.
03:44
<ternarybit>
very nice. So if I have 5 unique users on the server, their files just stay in /home like normal.
03:44
<vagrantc>
there was some support for that using xrdp on the server and rdp from ldm, but i haven't tested it in ages.
03:44
ternarybit: yup.
03:44
ternarybit: you *need* unique users.
03:45
<ternarybit>
Of course
03:45
<vagrantc>
well, in theory you wouldn't, but code is written poorly these days.
03:45
many applications behave unpredictibly. use unique users.
03:47
<ternarybit>
I assume I could even sync user accounts from AD and map their /home folder back to their existing CIFS share
03:47
<Fenuks>
ternarybit: Firefox and open/libreoffice will refuse to launch more then once under same user. So, if you have 2 people connected as same user, only one of them will be able to use those programs
03:48
<ternarybit>
Well that's great. Sounds pretty straightforward. As I read on wikipedia quite suited for education, where I am considering deploying it
03:50
<Fenuks>
Yes, it is. I use it in my university. You need good network, though, as traffic is pretty significant
03:50
<ternarybit>
we have gb core switches and clients are either 10/100 or gb
03:53
How do you manage user accounts? Just straight from the server or do you have a different backend?
03:53
<vagrantc>
i've mostly added them to the server, but you can use whatever backend you want.
03:54
ternarybit: as long as it allows the user to ssh into the server.
03:58
<ternarybit>
Very interesting indeed.
03:59
So If, somehow, I was able to get Debian joined to AD and synced with the user accounts via samba4, I could then install LTSP and potentially have all my users straight away
03:59
<vagrantc>
maybe.
03:59
they *are* computers, something is bound to go wrong. :)
04:04
<ternarybit>
You're kidding, right? :P
04:05
well thank you all very much. Enjoy your evening :)
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04:25
<alkisg>
vagrantc: gbit did translate https://translations.launchpad.net/ltsp/ldm-trunk/+pots/ldm/pt_BR/+translate, but his translations need reviewing...
04:25
I'm not sure if he can review them himself, if we can/should do it, or if we should let someone from his loco team do it...
04:26* vagrantc doesn't know either
04:27
<vagrantc>
any brazilian portuguese speakers available to review ltsp related translations?
04:28
<alkisg>
Hmm on second look, the translation suggestions are by "André Gondim on 2009-01-28", years ago, I suppose he's not gbit...
04:30
<vagrantc>
heh
04:30
<alkisg>
Maybe he downloaded the .po and he did them locally...
04:30
<vagrantc>
oh.
04:34
<alkisg>
Or maybe he only translated the ltsp.po, 5 hours ago... https://translations.launchpad.net/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/+pots/ltsp-login/pt_BR/+filter?person=gb-7
04:36
<vagrantc>
alkisg: would be good to allow whatever translations in that have been reviewed
04:37
i'm really hopeing to tag and upload this weekend.
04:38
<alkisg>
I can enable "translation commits" again today if we want it... it should then pushed whatever's have been reviewed
04:40* alkisg wanted to do the "user pulseaudio" commit yesterday, but it wouldn't launch... I saw some symlink issues from /home/username/.pulse/* to /tmp/pulse*, due to SSH_FOLLOW_SYMLINKS=false for /home, but it wouldn't launch even with HOME=/tmp/user start-pulseaudio-x11, maybe it has dbus issues...
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05:06
<alkisg>
vagrantc: should I enable translation commits for both ldm and ltsp? Are you going to upload both?
05:08
Whoops, ldm translation commits were enabled already
05:08
...hence the last 50 commits :
05:09
OK, I enabled ltsp commits too, ping me to disable them when you upload
05:10
<vagrantc>
alkisg: does it essentially queue up changes?
05:10
<alkisg>
Yes
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05:11
<alkisg>
So if we enable them 1 day before releases, and disable them afterwards, we're ok
05:11* vagrantc wonders about a cron job that enables it for maybe 1 hour per day or something.
05:11
<alkisg>
That would then do daily commits to trunk, we wouldn't want that until we fix the ldm.pot bug
05:11
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/1112122
05:14
<vagrantc>
ideally, i would like to batch commits weekly by default or something.
05:14
anyways...
05:14* alkisg would like daily commits whenever there are actual changes
05:15
<alkisg>
That would be the default once our intltool/ldm.pot is addressed
05:15
*bug
05:17
<vagrantc>
ltsp is fine?
05:17
<alkisg>
Yes
05:17
<vagrantc>
but we've disabled them?
05:18
<alkisg>
Let me look at the ltsp translations commits before I disabled them...
05:18
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/changes
05:18
They appear to be OK, maybe we can always have them enabled...
05:22
bbl
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05:59
<karan_>
hello everybody
06:01
is there another device that is connected to clients
06:01
<vagrantc>
are you asking how to access devices conected to clients?
06:02
<karan_>
how devices are connected to ltps server
06:02
through switch
06:04
<vagrantc>
thin clients?
06:04
<karan_>
are these are extra hardware
06:04
<vagrantc>
yeah, the thin clients are connected to the server through an ethernet network
06:04
which is usually a switch
06:04
<karan_>
how much these devices cost
06:05
<vagrantc>
it depends... you can buy fancy new ones for hundreds of dollars, or use old recycled computers for free...
06:05
although older computers tend to use more electricity
06:06
<karan_>
can you exactly explain to me with diagram if possible.......
06:06
<vagrantc>
!ltsp-docs
06:06
<ltsp`>
Error: "ltsp-docs" is not a valid command.
06:06
<vagrantc>
!docs
06:06
<ltsp`>
docs: For the latest community documentation, see the LTSP wiki at http://wiki.ltsp.org/ For a PDF with official documentation, see https://sourceforge.net/apps/mediawiki/ltsp/index.php?title=Ltsp_LtspDocumentationUpstream
06:06
<karan_>
can you also tell me vendors name, from whom we can borrow these devices
06:07
<vagrantc>
karan_: http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Concepts
06:09
karan_: disklessworkstations.com
06:09
<karan_>
im from india
06:12
<vagrantc>
karan_: i don't know a vendor in india specifically
06:14
<karan_>
k...
06:15
it is better to use thin client
06:15
how much does it cost from diskless
06:19
<vagrantc>
you'll have to ask them.
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09:01
<alkisg>
vagrantc:
09:01
# Allow more simultaneous ssh connections from the local network.
09:01
if [ -f /etc/ssh/sshd_config ]; then
09:01
sed 's/#MaxStartups 10:30:60/MaxStartups 20:30:60/' -i /etc/ssh/sshd_config
09:01
fi
09:01
I'm doing this in sch-scripts.postinst, do you think we can request to put it in the debian packaging of sshd?
09:02
E.g. "in LTSP, there are cases where many clients can autologin simultaneously at the same time... please apply that change..."
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09:33* alkisg filed http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=730176
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10:42
<gbit>
alkisg: I have done translating.
10:43
But still in english, should I rebuild the image?
10:44
<alkisg>
gbit: you didn't translate ldm :)
10:44
You only suggested a few ltsp translations
10:44
You didn't review them so they're not even committed
10:44
Let me help you a bit...
10:45
https://translations.launchpad.net/ltsp/ldm-trunk/+lang/pt_BR
10:45
<gbit>
Oh sorry, I will check it
10:45
<alkisg>
Go there, and *review* all translations
10:45
So that it's all green, not red
10:45
Then ping me to continue with the next step
10:45
<gbit>
OK I did the login part only
10:45
got it
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10:46
<alkisg>
The last translation there is "2013-01-13", you didn't do anything there
11:06
<gbit>
alkisg: Looks done to me now
11:06
<alkisg>
gbit: nice, now, can you also do this? https://translations.launchpad.net/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/+lang/pt_BR
11:06
<gbit>
Sure
11:07
<alkisg>
Then on the next commit you can get the ldm.po and ltsp.po files, i.e. tomorrow, if you're not in a hurry
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11:29
<alkisg>
Wow, 14.04 has a /run/user directory for all the weird things like sockets etc, great! sshfs and maybe even samba home dirs could be trouble-free now...
11:41
<gbit>
alkisg: its done translating
11:44
<alkisg>
https://translations.launchpad.net/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/+pots/ltsp/pt_BR/+translate?show=new_suggestions
11:44
There's 1 suggestion left
11:44
Tomorrow you'll be able to download the .po files from http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ltsp-trunk/files/head:/po/
11:45
<gbit>
OK it's done, sorry for that
11:45
<alkisg>
...and from http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ltsp-upstream/ltsp/ldm-trunk/files/head:/po/
11:46
<gbit>
OK than I should copy it and rebuild ltsp?
11:46
<alkisg>
Then you copy them to /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/locale/pt_BR/LC_MESSAGES, yeah
11:46
<gbit>
ok thank you again
11:46
<alkisg>
You're welcome
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11:53
<sid_>
hi there
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11:58
<gbit>
There is one more question in my head, there is any way to let the user change his password in the ltsp login screen? Because when the password is expired, is impossible to log in.
11:59
<Hyperbyte>
sid_, hi
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14:20
<gbit>
I dont see any error to " Your password has been exipired ". How can I suggest it to developers?
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15:43
<sbalneav>
Morning all
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15:59
<gvy>
sbalneav, good evening :)
16:00
<cliebow>
sbalneav:Scottie!!!
16:01
sbalneav, got a sec for an smbldap question?
16:03
<sbalneav>
cliebow: Sure, shoot.
16:05
<cliebow>
i hosed my fileserver hooked to openldap..reinstalled debian and mounted the home drive..
16:06
having trouble getting authentication working.../home/user seems to get group but not person ownership
16:06
getent poasswd enumerates ldap usersd
16:06
secrets.tdb ius set.
16:07
net getlocalsid emulates the old server numbers
16:07
on fileserver
16:07
transferred original smb.conf to new install
16:12
<sbalneav>
Is nscd running on the machine?
16:12
ps -ef | grep nscd
16:13
<cliebow>
nscd is running
16:13
root 2505 1 0 09:53 ? 00:00:00 /usr/sbin/nscd
16:14
<sbalneav>
ok, try this:
16:15
as root
16:15
nscd --invalidate passwd
16:15
nscd --invalidate group
16:15
then stop and start samba
16:15
When samba started, it may not have had the updated passwd list from nscd yet.
16:15
Worth a shot to try.
16:16
<cliebow>
k
16:17
pdbedit -Lv gives sid S-1-5-21-846242501-288479505-2846662936-21955 does not belong to our domain
16:19
<bennabiy>
is ltsp-build-client repeated run-parts itterations, with a change in --arg ?
16:26
<sbalneav>
cliebow: No other output?
16:28
You haven't got TLS turned on for the ldap server, do you?
16:28
And no credentials in samba?
16:28
<cliebow>
afraid not..trying to work it out inmy head here.sure hope my configs will passfrom older ubuntu to debian..in ldap i have sambaDOmainName records for the same machine twice..with different sids
16:30
we do tls enabled in ldap
16:30
have
16:31
but it worked fine with this config in ubuntu 11.04
16:32
ldaps Is turned on.
16:36
<gvy>
sbalneav, a friend of mine was a few millimeters away from being shot by a terrorist sniper in Syria yesterday: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhBnXjI_qOM -- don't shoot, friends!
16:37
<sbalneav>
gvy: Holy crap, that was slightly more graphic than I needed.
16:41
bbiab, workping
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16:53
<gvy>
sbalneav, erm, sorry for omitting the warning -- I help them with subs and sort of got used to...
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17:04
<vagrantc>
gbit: password expiry is a known bug that is very hard to fix the way LDM currenty works
17:04
gbit: we're working on an alternative that should help with LTSP6
17:05* alkisg is trying to troubleshoot the issue with ldm.pot being regenerated on each build, instead of only when there are actual changes, does anyone know what generate_locale_list.py is for?
17:06
<gbit>
vagrantc: great, the only solution that I found, was to have ssh on another screen, then user can log in, change password and come back to the graphical screen again.
17:07
<vagrantc>
gbit: on the LTSP server i've set up some pop-up warnings at login that warn about upcoming password expiry
17:08
<gbit>
vagrantc: can you give me a clue?
17:11
<vagrantc>
alkisg: it generates a list of valid locales at build time... i don't exactly remember why
17:11
alkisg: ah, it is used to display the locales in the LDM drop-down menu
17:12
<alkisg>
Ah ok, unrelated to the .po files then, nice
17:12
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i.e. en_US -> English (United States)
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17:12
<vagrantc>
gbit: i thought i did :P
17:13
gbit: could you give me a clue as to what you don't understand?
17:23
<gbit>
vagrantc: how to make the pop-ups
17:24
<vagrantc>
gbit: i put a file in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/ using zenity or gdialog that checks how soon it will expire and gives them a warning, and reduced the warntime to nothing
17:25
<gbit>
vagrantc: thanks
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17:32* alkisg wonders if we should just remove ldm.pot from the source tree, since intltool regenerates it and deletes it on each build
17:33
<alkisg>
And if that would fix the launchpad daily commits issue...
17:33
<vagrantc>
i guess that would work.
17:34
i think we left it in the tree for translators to have something to work with, but since launchpad handles it now...
17:34
<alkisg>
For translators, the last message here lists the needed commands: http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.handhelds.linux.openinkpot.devel/305
17:35
OK, I'll remove it, wait a couple of days to see if that fixes the launchpad issue, and if not, we can revert it...
17:36
Meh removing ldm.pot breaks debuild -b -tc somehow...
17:37
Sorry false alarm, I linked to ltsp-debian-packaging instead of ldm-debian-packaging :D
17:38
<bennabiy>
alkisg or vagrantc: is run-parts being use to iterate the ltsp-build-client?
17:38* alkisg hasn't used ltsp-build-client in ages, sorry, no idea
17:40
<alkisg>
Pushed...
17:42
vagrantc: Phantomas was asking if you'll be available to upload the new epoptes version this weekend, or if he should try to do it himself instead... (he's able to, since he's marked as an uploader, right?)
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18:06
<bennabiy>
Does anyone know an easy way using awk or sed to take every field in a line (being read from a file) and apply each field to a variable?
18:06
I am have to run each variable as its own awk call right now.
18:07
brb
18:08
<vagrantc>
alkisg, phantomas: i'd like to get epoptes in too.
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19:08
<alkisg>
bennabiy: pastebin your current code
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19:35
<bennabiy>
alkisg: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/3655023
19:35
<alkisg>
bennabiy: first, cat | while read var has an issue which you might not be aware of,
19:36
<bennabiy>
not exporting variables?
19:36
<alkisg>
the commands at the right side of the pipe run in a subshell, so the variable values are only valid until the end of the loop
19:36
<bennabiy>
yes. That is the hope
19:36
<alkisg>
Now, for a better code,
19:37
while IFS=: read v1 v2 v3 v4; do
19:37
commands
19:37
done < "$config_file"
19:38
<bennabiy>
great...
19:41
so that will read each line and assign variables for eachfield in the line, do the commands on those variables, and then get the next line of code to run commands on?
19:41
<alkisg>
The next line of the file, yes
19:42
<bennabiy>
thank you so much alkisg
19:42
<alkisg>
np
19:42
<bennabiy>
I guess it is lest costly as well because of no awk calls
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19:43
<alkisg>
No awk and no cat
19:43
<bennabiy>
yes
19:43
<alkisg>
So no external programs at all
19:43
(except for the commands, of course)
19:43
<bennabiy>
so, which ate which.. did the 'awk swoop down on the cat, or did the cat pounce on the 'awk
19:44
either way, they both die()
19:44
<alkisg>
Heh
19:54
<bennabiy>
alkisg: Would that IFS change affect fields being passed to functions within that loop?
19:54
<alkisg>
no, it only affects the "read" command
19:54
<bennabiy>
thought so
19:54
ok
19:57
you can unset multiple variables by spacing them right? unset VAR1 Var2 etc
19:57
<alkisg>
man sh and search for unset ;)
19:57
(answer: yes)
19:58* bennabiy does man alkisg search
19:58
<alkisg>
Hehe
19:58
You can also keep the `cat file | while` construct if you care so much about the variables
19:58
That way you don't need to care if the variables had a previous value that you overwrote...
19:58
<bennabiy>
I have been staring at man pages and code so much , it is nice to just get an answer :)
19:59
It is just for the end of the program
20:02
If I have a variable in my shell, and then start a function, it can see those variables still, right?
20:02
for example, if there was a read -p "blah?"
20:03
<alkisg>
Yup
20:03
<bennabiy>
would $REPLY be readable in the function, or would I need to call the function and reset it like my_function $REPLY
20:03
My brain is fritzed right now, but I need to get this done within the hour :)
20:05
It is just variables the other direction, right? Like in my function, whatever is set in that, only exists within that function?
20:05
<vagrantc>
alkisg, phantomas: i'd like to get epoptes in too this weekend
20:05
<alkisg>
bennabiy: There's no visibility, scopes etc in shell, everything is global, unless of course if you have a subshell, $(), | etc
20:05
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i don't think phantomas can upload without a sponsor
20:06
<alkisg>
vagrantc: cool, both me and Phantomas will be around
20:06
We just need the release commit, otherwise everything is tested
20:06
(i.e. change the version)
20:06
<vagrantc>
ok.
20:07
alkisg: if i sign the upload, i'll want to test it myself, at least ... maybe epoptes will be the first thing i upload.
20:07* alkisg is testing the user pulseaudio thing, hoping he might be able to commit that before vagrantc uploads ltsp...
20:17
<alkisg>
Hmm it works if I add the user to the audio group, but we shouldn't have to... I wonder if it has to do with "policykit active seats" etc...
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20:40
<alkisg>
OK the issue was the sshfs symlink from .pulse to /tmp... but finding a good workaround will be a bit hard, since some systems (e.g. 14.04) appear to use /run/user/username/pulse nowadays
20:43
PULSE_RUNTIME_PATH could be the solution
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20:48
<bennabiy>
alkisg: would this work? while IFS=: read -p "Blah blah blah?" v1 v2 v3 v4; do with a manual entry of blah1:blah2:blah3:blah4 ?
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20:54
<alkisg>
bennabiy: read -p is not posix compliant
20:54
Better use echo instead
20:55
Also, -p "blah" is just the user prompt, blah isn't stored in the value of the variables..
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20:55* alkisg finds posh a good shell to test for posix compliance...
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20:56
<vagrantc>
we actually have a "read_p" function somewhere
20:57
read_prompt is in ltsp-common-functions
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21:19
<bennabiy>
alkisg: I think you misunderstood my question.
21:20
I was asking if the response to the read prompt (what is coming from stdin ) if it was : divided, would that work for applying whatever is between the : : : : to var1 var2 var3 (for as many as I set and have fields for)
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23:58
<PieOrCake>
Good morning all. I'm using Edubuntu on an IBM server with thin clients, and the kernel and initrd images are loading extremely slowly. Does anyone have ideas on what I may need to fix?