IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 22 July 2010   (all times are UTC)

00:02
<alkisg>
[12:22] [ananke] can lts.conf options be set via kernel options? i'd like to have different pxe boot entries for different window managers ==> usually no, but you can drop a script in ltsp_config.d which reads /proc/kernel and sets the lts.conf settings you want appropriately.
00:05
*/proc/cmdline
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03:28
<dekelev>
Hi. does anyone here have experienced LTSP with HP Thin Clients ?
03:29* alkisg has an HP T5000
03:30
<dekelev>
I got T5540
03:30
<alkisg>
But sure, many here have tried HP clients.
03:30
<dekelev>
how do you adjust ltsp so it wil support this via chipset well
03:30
?
03:31
sound will stop working after couple of seconds
03:31
<alkisg>
? I didn't need to do any configurations, it works fine.
03:31
Which distro/version?
03:31
<dekelev>
ubuntu 10.04
03:31
<alkisg>
Same here.
03:32
<dekelev>
I got some problems which doesn't exist with other regular computer clients:
03:32
my sound card will vanish from the system after trying to use it with twinkle
03:33
lts.conf has resolution setting for example that doesn't apply to this thin client (800x600)
03:33
isn't it weird?
03:33
<alkisg>
Is twinkle using pulseaudio? Or is it trying to use alsa directly?
03:34
And, what does xrandr give you on the client?
03:34
<dekelev>
it using alsa's pulse plugin and runs as a localapp. It also had the same problem when running as a server app
03:35
xrandr? I haven't try this. what's that?
03:36
<alkisg>
It displays the available graphic modes, it's a console command
03:36
<dekelev>
I'll try this right now
03:41
well, I was wrong about the resolution. got confused by login screen resolution
03:41
it on 800x600
03:42
but sound still making problems. I just tried to make a call and sound card doesn't respond until the next boot
03:42
<alkisg>
To force the login screen resolution you can use XRANDR_MODE_0=800x600 in lts.conf
03:42
I'm not using alsa/localapps on this client, so I can't help with sound...
03:43
<dekelev>
I'v tried it with couple of programs and two different T5540 clients
03:43
<alkisg>
It works fine with pulseaudio from the server though.
03:43
(for me)
03:43
<dekelev>
with twinkle?
03:44
<alkisg>
No, with other programs, I don't use twinkle
03:44
<dekelev>
which one do you use?
03:45
<alkisg>
Firefox :)
03:45
(I'm not using a voice communications program, if that's what you mean)
03:45
<dekelev>
:) well I'll give it a try with firefox just to get the idea of where the problem resides
03:46
<alkisg>
Try media players or sound players as well
03:46
totem, rythmbox, vlc etc
03:46
<dekelev>
ok, i'll do that. thx a million
03:47
<alkisg>
Np
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10:56
<dekelev>
hi guys. do any of you experienced with HP T5540 thin clients + ubuntu 10.04? sound is working but mic doesn't work. when I try to use it, sound card is vanished from sound properties until I reboot
10:56
ALC1200 - Onboard HD azalia Audio Controller
10:57
I tried setting many things in alsa-base.conf but nothing helps
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11:33
<Mip5>
Morning Folks!
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11:51
<Mip5>
I'm running ltsp on 10.04, dual 3 GHz xeons with 8 gigs of ram. I recently rebuilt the client, and am running firefox with the flash plugin as per this howto: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSPKarmicLocalAppsFirefox
11:53
FF launches pretty slowly (takes about 20 secs to show up, even when there are no other clients booted), and youtube videos have stuttering video. I wish I didn't need have flash, but these are student machines, and the teachers often want students to view video.
11:54
I should also mention that chromium-browser doesn't launch at all. It appears to start (shows up in the bottom menu), but then never materializes.
11:55
<alkisg>
Client specs? (cpu + ram)
11:56
<Mip5>
diskless workstation 1420 1 gb ram, but I can't recall the cpu offhand. FWIW - I've used this same server/client combo with 9.04, and localapps ran much better
11:58
<alkisg>
chromium-browser doesn't like sshfs, which is used by default in localapps. It works with nfs though.
11:58
Did you try the hdparm command locally?
11:59
<Mip5>
not yet - would I launch a terminal in the client to do that? I haven't modified anything (lts.conf?) to allow me to boot into a client.
11:59
<alkisg>
[Default]
11:59
SCREEN_02=shell
11:59
SCREEN_07=ldm
11:59
You'd also need to install hdparm to the chroot and update the image
12:00
<Mip5>
That's right - I remember that now. I'll do it and brb. Thanks
12:01
While I'm in there (lts.conf), do I need to add hdparm to localapps menu itmes?
12:01
<alkisg>
No
12:01
After installing, updating the image and booting the client, you press alt+ctrl+f2 to get to a local root shell
12:02
(ltsp-localapps don't give root access)
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12:11
<Mip5>
weird - the display on the console is unreadable
12:13
<alkisg>
Try replacing "quiet splash" with "nomodeset" in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
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12:13
<Mip5>
I'm going to run down the hall and try this on a different client (a diskless workstation1520)
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12:28
<Mip5>
alkisg: Interesting results. The 1520 ran flash fine w/out jitter, and the console worked, which leads me to believe I have issues on the client i was using as a test.
12:29
alkisg: Results of hdparm -tT /dev/nbd0 cached reads: 391.85 MB/sec, and buffered reads: 10.81 MB/sec
12:34
<alkisg>
Your nbd disk speed is ok. Did firefox load significantly faster in 9.04?
12:35
(video speed doesn't really matter for firefox loading time)
12:38
<Mip5>
I *think* it did. I'm going to time it in both locations to be sure. As long as flash works better (and it appears to now), the slower load time isn't as much of an issue. I might even configure it as a start up item
12:39
<alkisg>
For flash + video speed in general, the graphics card + driver plays a big role. Which card is that? (the one with the delay)
12:40
Mip5: ah, another different in 9.04 vs 10.04 is the nbd disk compression
12:41
By default, in 10.04 it's not compressed, so it's size is about double ==> half speed to load the same things from the disk
12:41
You can reenable the compression from /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf - this will probably lower the firefox loading time by a few secs...
12:49
<Mip5>
I think the firefox loading is actually okay. It's about 7 seconds the first time, and shorter the next time.
12:50
<ananke>
do any of you folks deal with CA certs for firefox? i'd like to import our own CA in some global/central location on the ltsp server, but can't seem to figure out the proper method
12:51
<Mip5>
The machine with the delay can't pull up a console display (but I think it used to be able to - it's been a while). That machine is a 1420. It's still under warranty, so I might send it back to see what's up. I also have a few old Dell optiplexes that I use as clients, and they can pull up the console. Interestingly on those, the cached read times are nearly twice as fast as the diskless...
12:51
...workstations. That said, they are in a different room, and have fewer network hops.
12:53
<Gadi>
ananke: try: /etc/ssl/certs
12:53
<Mip5>
alkisg: is there any downside to reenabling compression in /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf? I don't mind if it takes longer to update the image. I noticed that it *is* quite a bit faster in 10.04, but that speed savings isn't as important to me as a snappier feeling thin client.
12:53
<vagrantc>
Gadi: i thought firefox didn't respect that?
12:54
<Gadi>
vagrantc: really?
12:54
hmm...
12:54
I thought that was the general spot
12:54
<vagrantc>
maybe it is...
12:58
<Gadi>
perhaps better to place the cert in /usr/share/ca-certificates and run "update-ca-certificates"
13:00
<ananke>
ahh, now that's a step i was missing. i've already discovered ca-certificates dir for my distro, but didn't know about update-ca-certificates command
13:02
<Mip5>
If I want to reenable compression on the nbd disk, would I just comment out the line in ltsp-update-image.conf that reads: NO_COMP="-noF -noD -noI -no-exports"
13:02
then rerun update-ltsp-image?
13:09
<alkisg>
Mip5: yes
13:09
Mip5: no downsides really, except if you use ltsp-cluster and want session roaming and stuff like that
13:10* alkisg believes compression should only be disabled by default if ltsp-cluster is used...
13:11
<ananke>
argh. silly firefox doesn't seem to accept it
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13:15
<coordinador>
hi
13:16
suddenly my vnc viewer in ltsp5 stopped worling
13:16
*Working
13:16
i need some guidance, please
13:16
<Mip5>
alkisg: cool - I think I'll try it. I'm looking more at this 1420, and it's not right.
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13:16
<alkisg>
Mip5: did you try nomodeset and still no console?
13:17
coordinador: which vnc viewer? vinagre?
13:17
<Mip5>
coordinador: I don't know too much about this, but I once disabled vnc by trying to enable iTalk
13:17
alkisg: No didn't do that. Where would I find that?
13:17
<coordinador>
alkisg, yes, is vinagre
13:17
<alkisg>
Mip5: see above, I told you a while back
13:17
<coordinador>
i use ubuntu
13:17
and ltsp5
13:18
Mip5, i dont use italk
13:18
<alkisg>
coordinador: ltsp isn't related to vinagre. What do you mean that it isn't working?
13:18
<coordinador>
alkisg, in client, the terminals didnt appear
13:18
<alkisg>
Mip5: (08:13:09 μμ) alkisg: Try replacing "quiet splash" with "nomodeset" in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
13:18
<Mip5>
alkisg: you posted while I was away, and it scrolled away. I'll try it.
13:18
<coordinador>
alkisg, before, the terminals appeared in vnc server list
13:19
<alkisg>
coordinador: I'm not sure I understand your terminology. Where is the "vnc server list"?
13:20
<coordinador>
alkisg, when you open Vinagre, there is a list of the vnc servers avaliable in the network
13:20
<alkisg>
You mean the bookmarks in the left panel?
13:20
<coordinador>
alkisg, yes
13:21
<alkisg>
So, you put each client manually there?
13:21
<coordinador>
alkisg, ill try.. how can i know the address of each terminal?
13:22
when i do ltsp-locallapps xterm and then ifconfig, the command doesnt exist
13:22
<alkisg>
coordinador: I'm not telling you to do something, I'm just asking because I don't understand your problem
13:22
Try /sbin/ifconfig
13:23
<coordinador>
alkisg, oh, actually the servers just were detected automatically
13:23
but now it doesnt happen
13:23
<alkisg>
Wow, vino-server uses avahi? I didn't know that...
13:23
<coordinador>
ill try that command
13:24
<alkisg>
No, don't try it
13:24
I'm still asking, not proposing anything...
13:24
<coordinador>
oh but you said "try /sbin/ifconfig"
13:24
<alkisg>
Ah ok I thought you said about avahi :D
13:24
Yes, try /sbin/ifconfig
13:25
<coordinador>
yes, i got the ip :)
13:25
<alkisg>
OK, here's another command: sudo netstat -nap | grep vino
13:25
<coordinador>
ill try if putting manually the ip of the terminal i can connect to it
13:25
<alkisg>
See (on the server) what that tells you
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13:25
<alkisg>
coordinador: wait, vino runs locally on the clients?
13:25
<coordinador>
alkisg, no
13:25
<alkisg>
vino normally runs on the server, as all user processes run on the server..
13:26
So, to connect to a terminal you'd give e.g. 127.0.0.1:5901
13:26
<coordinador>
alkisg, oh, so, what about if i put the username@server_ip ?
13:26
<alkisg>
VNC needs a port, not a username
13:27
coordinador: try that command: sudo netstat -nap | grep vino
13:27
and put the results to pastebin...
13:27
<coordinador>
alkisg, ok
13:27
<alkisg>
!pastebot
13:27
<ltspbot`>
alkisg: "pastebot" :: The LTSP pastebot is at http://ltsp.pastebin.com. Please paste all text longer than a line or two to the pastebot, as it helps to reduce traffic in the channel. Don't forget to paste the URL of the text here.
13:29
<coordinador>
alkisg, http://pastebin.com/stLMnD79
13:31
the usernames are from alumno01 to alumno10
13:31
<alkisg>
coordinador: so, to connect to the clients, connect to localhost:5900 through 5907
13:32
<coordinador>
ill try
13:32
omg is working!
13:32
:D
13:33
alkisg, thank you very much! now, why the system didnt detect automatically now?
13:33
<alkisg>
vino-server is supposed to publish the service in avahi
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13:34
<alkisg>
So, if you ran `avahi-browse -at` you should be seeing the clients there
13:34
For some reason (bug? I don't know) it isn't doing that.
13:34
<coordinador>
i will try avahi-browse -at
13:35
omg its true
13:35
the clients are there
13:35
what if i reinstall vino?
13:36
<alkisg>
coordinador: they are?
13:36
(as a vino service, not as workstations...)
13:36
<coordinador>
alkisg, yes, when i do avahi-browse -at , the clients appear
13:36
<alkisg>
coordinador: can you put that to pastebin as well?
13:36
<coordinador>
ok
13:37
http://pastebin.com/ds7zysxA
13:37
...alkisg.
13:38
<alkisg>
coordinador: no, vino server is not there
13:38
<coordinador>
oh
13:38
<Mip5>
alkisg: that command did indeed allow me to see the boot process in great detail (I like that), but didn't make alt-ctrl-f2 show a readable console.
13:38
<alkisg>
It was supposed to say "remote desktop for computer *name*" or something like that, not workstation. Workstation is another service.
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13:38
<alkisg>
coordinador: when was the last time that this was working?
13:39
Mip5: (08:39:51 μμ) alkisg: Which graphics card is that? (the one with the delay)
13:39
<coordinador>
alkisg, like 2 weeks ago
13:39
<alkisg>
coordinador: and that's ubuntu 10.04?
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13:40
<coordinador>
alkisg, 9.04
13:42
<alkisg>
Weird. Anyway, that part is not ltsp related, so maybe try asking in #ubuntu or in #gnome?
13:43
<coordinador>
humm ok, thank you very much
13:43
i will ask there
13:44
<Mip5>
alkisg: Integrated AGP 8x Graphics Core - 64MB, as per the site: http://www.disklessworkstations.com/200108.html
13:44
Is there another way to get that info - like lspci?
13:44
<alkisg>
Mip5: run lspci on a localxterm
13:44
ltsp-localapps xterm, and then lspci
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13:45
<alkisg>
Mip5: also, try with XSERVER=vesa, maybe that will give you a local root console
13:45
<Mip5>
alkisg: ATI - Rage XL (rev 27)
13:46
<coordinador>
alkisg, what about if there is no in the same domain? (i know that everything runs locally but when i put "local" in vino search i got nothing)
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13:48
<coordinador>
alkisg, when i see the old entries in "host" field, i see: "alumno01@biblioteca" where biblioteca is the name of the server
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13:49
<alkisg>
coordinador: I don't know why vino isn't publishing the service in avahi...
13:49
Mip5: try with vesa
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13:52
<Mip5>
Firefox crashed on me and kicked me out of ltsp.
13:59
alkisg: you recommended I try: XSERVE=vesa - is that a line I add to lts.conf or my pxelinux.cfg/default file?
13:59
<alkisg>
lts.conf
14:02
<Mip5>
alkisg: still no console on the screen 2
14:03
It seems strange that screen 07 works well, but the console doesn't. That said, the machine does seem slower than both the other thinclient (1520) and the old Dell.
14:05
<alkisg>
Mip5: did you try XSERVE=vesa or XSERVER=vesa?
14:06
(lspci -k tells you the driver currently in use)
14:08
coordinador: still here? I think I found the problem
14:09
Do you have a non-english locale? E.g. spanish?
14:10
<coordinador>
alkisg, yes
14:10
alkisg, yes, i use spanish
14:10
<alkisg>
Sit on a thin client, and try those commands:
14:10
killall vino-server
14:10
<coordinador>
:o
14:10
<alkisg>
LANG=C /usr/lib/vino/vino-server
14:10
<coordinador>
ok
14:10
<alkisg>
Then, open vinagre again
14:11
<Mip5>
alkisg: I *did* use XSERVE=vesa
14:11
<alkisg>
Mip5: that's not written correctly
14:11
It misses an R
14:12
<Mip5>
Wow - okay - edited and rebooting the client as I type this
14:12
<coordinador>
alkisg, you mean in a local terminal? i did in a local terminal and i get "no process killed"
14:12
<alkisg>
coordinador: in a gnome-terminal, inside a user session
14:12
Not a local one
14:12
<coordinador>
alexqwesa_, ok
14:12
alkisg, ok
14:13
<Mip5>
alkisg: BINGO! That did it.
14:14
<alkisg>
Mip5: vesa is usually a worse driver than the ati driver, but see if it makes things better in some cases.
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14:16
<Mip5>
Yeah, that was my guess... the results of lspci: VGA compat controller ; VIA Technologies, CN700/P4M800 Pro/P4M800 CE/VN800 [S3 UniChrome Pro] (rev 01)
14:16
<alkisg>
Ah, so ATI was the one on the server?
14:16
<coordinador>
alkisg, i got weird messages, i will pastebin
14:16
<alkisg>
coordinador: does vinagre now autodetect the client?
14:17
<Mip5>
yeah - I ran that terminal on the local client, but since it wasn't a localapp, it gave the server specs.
14:17
<alkisg>
Right, that's why I told you to run it after running `ltsp-localapps xterm` first
14:18
<Mip5>
Yeah, I was slow on the uptake on that one. I started going down that road before I asked about it
14:18
<coordinador>
alkisg, http://pastebin.com/pY8QkM7k
14:18* alkisg thinks Mip5 is missing half of alkisg's lines :D
14:18
<alkisg>
coordinador: those look ok, does vinagre now autodetect the client?
14:20
coordinador: or, try `avahi-browse -ta`, you should be seeing lines like the following:
14:20
+ eth0 IPv4 alkisg's remote desktop on alkis VNC Remote Access local
14:20
<Mip5>
Yeah - I hate when I do that! Your help is fantastic, though. Don't let my carelessness make you think I don't value it. I've been trying to think how I can buy a beer (or 3) or some coffee!
14:20
<alkisg>
:D
14:20
<coordinador>
alkisg, it doesnt detect
14:21
and didnt appeared that when i do avahi-browser -ta
14:21
<Mip5>
So - do you think there's nothing wrong with my 1420? other than it's just a little weak?
14:21
<coordinador>
what if i restart session or some in thin client?
14:21
:
14:21
:S
14:22
<alkisg>
coordinador: no - what I think is that vino-server doesn't publish the service on locales other than english. But I wonder why it didn't work for you... did you close that terminal, or is the `LANG=C /usr/lib/vino/vino-server` still running?
14:23
<coordinador>
i killed all vino-server processes
14:23
i will run again LANG=C... command
14:23
as root? or as user?
14:24
the user of xsession is alumno02, i will run as this user
14:24
<alkisg>
As user
14:24
But keep it running
14:24
Then, open another terminal
14:24
<coordinador>
ok
14:24
<alkisg>
And run: avahi-browse -ta | grep VNC
14:25
You should be seeing something like: + eth0 IPv4 alkisg's remote desktop on alkis VNC Remote Access local
14:25
And vinagre should be autodetecting it..
14:25
<coordinador>
i got nothing after "avahi-browser..." command
14:26
now i got another thing after "LANG-C ..." command
14:27
http://pastebin.com/Lkd8T8fS
14:27
what is "kamotini.kinghost.net" ?
14:28
...alkisg.
14:28
<alkisg>
I don't know
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14:28
<Mip5>
alkisg: This 1420 is really seeming like a dog. I check the memory, and it's got 256 mb of ram. The other clients have 1 gb, or in some cases, 512 mb. I think it *used* to work better, but maybe I'm don't remember.
14:28
is it under powered as a client for 10.04
14:29
<alkisg>
coordinador: So avahi-browse doesn't return anything for VNC? OK, some other bug then, that LANC=C line works for me, while when running it with my normal greek, it doesn't.
14:30
<coordinador>
maybe im being hacked... kamotini.kinghost.net is a brazilian server according to google. and i dont have anything related with them
14:30
<alkisg>
Mip5: yeah I have an HP thin client with similar specs and I don't like it at all, it's too slow.
14:30
Firefox in 256 RAM ==> sucks
14:30
So maybe for that client, you should disable localapps...
14:31
<Mip5>
That's a good idea. I'd specify that by using teh mac address in lts.conf, right?
14:31
<alkisg>
Yes
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14:32
<Mip5>
okay - I'll give that a shot. Thanks again for all of your help. I can't imagine running this stuff without all the help i get from ltsp channel.
14:34
<alkisg>
You're welcome
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14:38
<Mip5>
Gotta run - take care y'all.
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14:39
<thafreak>
Are there any hardware thin clients compatible with LTSP in the ~$200 range?
14:39
I saw some from HP, but they seem to be more for RDP and vmware/citrix VDI
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