IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 18 May 2011   (all times are UTC)

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00:11
<gnunux>
hi
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00:35
<html_inprogress>
hi
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00:41
<vlt>
alkisg: Yes, LDM_DIRECTX=True is set and works (there's traffic on the x11-7 ports). The clients have at least 128 MB of RAM.
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01:00
<alkisg>
vlt: 128mb ram is low, you might want to disable compcache and enable a big nbd_swap
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01:25
<vlt>
alkisg: nbd_swap is 512 MB already. Why does the client need much RAM (now)?
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01:27
<alkisg>
vlt: to disable compcache, put "nocompcache" as a kernel parameter in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
01:28
The clients need RAM mostly for local X bitmap caching
01:28
E.g. if you visit a site with large images, or if you use openoffice, you might need some hundred MB RAM just for bitmap caching...
01:31
<html_inprogress>
can you make a linux cluster ?
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02:15
<vlt>
alkisg: Wouldn't it be better for real thin clients to do all the rendering and calculating on the (powerfull) server instead of putting more and more load to the client? I thought that was the whole point in having a terminal server infrastructure.
02:16
<alkisg>
vlt: They do. That's just caching. It's a method that X offers to speed up drawing the same images over and over again.
02:25
<Hyperbyte>
Hey alkisg, good morning. :-)
02:25
<alkisg>
Hello
02:26
<Hyperbyte>
We have a travel group in Crete at the moment. :)
02:26
Immediately thought of you, heheh.
02:26* Hyperbyte works at a touroperator for disabled people
02:26
<alkisg>
Crete... best beaches I've ever seen
02:27* alkisg wants to go there again this summer
02:27
<Hyperbyte>
Never been there actually...
02:27
But I process most of the travel pictures we receive, for online publication, so I know exactly what you're talking about. :)
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02:28
<markit>
hi alkisg :) I've been reading https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/FatClients and got frightened by a note at the end of the page, about KDE problems! Any news about those issued?
02:29
the "primary / elementar / 6-10 age" school I'm going to setup will have necessary fat clients (sound, animations, etc.)
02:29
<alkisg>
I don't know, some people use the wiki like it's a bug tracker, and I got tired of deleting their entries...
02:29
Others had problems with the kiosk plugin and wrote them there too
02:29
(which is completely unrelated to fat clients)
02:30
<markit>
"I am currently working on fixes for these, but any help would be greatly appreciated." seemd to be by the author of the page or one ltsp programmer
02:30
<alkisg>
See the history, I bet it isn't
02:30
<markit>
mmm so I have to test myself, hope is already fixed
02:30
<Hyperbyte>
Always nice when people don't ~~~~. :-)
02:30
<alkisg>
I guess they're just problems that the specific user had
02:30
<markit>
any info about 11.04 kubuntu? I mean, better use 10.10?
02:30
<alkisg>
Because of misconfiguration or other issues
02:31
<markit>
alkisg: oh, yes, the story... btw I tried to edit the wiki time ago, but did not worked, don't remember if I was unable to get an account or what else, will try again in the near future
02:32
I've seen ltsp-chroot mentioned, that eases the work a lot
02:32
<alkisg>
I deleted the KDE paragraph
02:32
But this page has changed radically since I wrote it, I don't recognise it anymore...
02:33
<markit>
lol, hope it deleted the problems also :)
02:33
alkisg: mm scaring, since your knowledge is fare above average
02:33
<alkisg>
What is scaring?
02:33
<markit>
that people could have put wrong or misleading info there
02:33
<alkisg>
I mean that the page changed, not that the implementation changed
02:33
<markit>
(in good faith, I mean)
02:33
<alkisg>
Yeah that's part of the wiki culture :(
02:34
<markit>
important wiki are "supervised", I guess
02:34
you should have your own blog/wiki :)
02:34
I would rely on it instead of ubuntu one
02:35
<Hyperbyte>
I would rely on alkisg instead of *.
02:35
<markit>
any known problems wiht _buntu 11.04?
02:35
(related with ltsp, of course)
02:35
<alkisg>
Haha that's not feasible, I only wrote 10 pages or so, but the wiki has hundreds
02:36
I don't know about 11.04, I'm sticking to LTS
02:36
<markit>
better have 10 pages of knowledge than 100 of confusion
02:36
<alkisg>
That's unfair, many of those are good pages
02:36
But you're right that there might be incorrect info there
02:36
<markit>
sure, but how can I know if has been "improved" in a wrong way?
02:36
exactly
02:37
<alkisg>
That's what sbalneav thought too, and has the ltsp upstream docs in docbook instead of wiki
02:37
<vlt>
alkisg: Is there a way to disable this behaviour? From my 400 MHz/110 MB client, for example, I can work really fast on the server when running just vncviewer, so my local X nearly doesn't have to do anything (plus: I can reconnect to my session from everywhere).
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02:37
<alkisg>
vlt: did you disable compcache?
02:38
X isn't slow, it's faster than VNC
02:38
But compcache compresses RAM and it wastes a lot of CPU cycles compressing/decompressing it
02:38
<vlt>
alkisg: Ok, I'll try that. Thanks.
02:40
alkisg: To the "kernel" line or the "append" line?
02:43
<Hyperbyte>
<alkisg> vlt: to disable compcache, put "nocompcache" as a kernel parameter in
02:43
/var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.cfg/default
02:44
Sorry, append.
02:44
:)
02:44
Misread you for a second there.
02:44
Kernel specifies name of the kernel to use (has to be correct filename, else no boot)... append specifies parameters.
02:48
alkisg, there's something that's been bugging me... Warren was talking about Gnome 3 being problematic with LTSP, because of some client hardware that doesn't support compositing
02:48
Which made me curious... why would the client need to support compositing, if the whole desktop runs on the server?
02:48
<alkisg>
Compositing runs on the x server
02:49
Which is on the client (afaik, I'm relatively new to linux, no X expert)
02:49
I guess he means gnome-shell, not the whole gnome 3 framework
02:50
So the old UI or unity-2d should still work
02:53
<Hyperbyte>
So what exactly is Gnome-shell?
02:54
<alkisg>
Canonical has unity as the gnome 3 interface, while upstream gnome has gnome-shell instead
02:54
It's the framework for the base UI. Windows, notifications, system menus etc
02:54
*window decorations, I mean
02:54
<vlt>
alkisg: I disabled compcache but there's no speed improvement instantly noticable. The main problem seems to be working with OOo. Sometimes you can write two words in a document before they appear on the screen.
02:54
<alkisg>
vlt: run this:
02:54
ltsp-localapps xterm
02:55
On the xterm that will open, run:
02:55
ps aux > output
02:55
Paste the output to http://pastebin.com
02:55
<vlt>
alkisg: On the client or server?
02:55
<alkisg>
Client
02:55
That's to see the ram usage
02:55
<vlt>
alkisg: Does it have to be xterm or os a remote ssh connection fine, too?
02:56
<alkisg>
If you have remote ssh to your clients, sure, you can use that
02:56
<vlt>
alkisg: ok
02:56
<alkisg>
But not ssh to the server. To the client.
02:56
<vlt>
alkisg: Yes, the client
02:57
<alkisg>
With 128mb ram every MB counts. So I wouldn't install sshd to clients with such little ram.
02:58
compcache takes 25% of free ram, so it should instantly improve things
02:58
But you should also disable anything else that's not really needed to run in the client
02:58
<vlt>
alkisg: http://pastebin.com/QPQ4M9Rg -- That's on a 256 MB machine.
02:58
<alkisg>
vlt: disable nbd-proxy too
02:59
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp/+bug/589034
02:59
Need to go, bb all
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03:01
<Hyperbyte>
vlt, how much ram are your clients trying to use?
03:01
Just out of curiousity.
03:04
<vlt>
Hyperbyte: http://pastebin.com/QPQ4M9Rg is the output of `ps axu` on a 256 MB client
03:05
<Hyperbyte>
How long has the client been running?
03:05
<vlt>
Hyperbyte: Only a few minutes (after disabling compcache).
03:06
<Hyperbyte>
Run a free -m
03:06
How many megabytes are under used for "mem" and "swap" ?
03:09
<vlt>
Hyperbyte: RAM: 204 of 228 used. SWAP: 0 of 512 used.
03:10
<Hyperbyte>
So you need to shave off 80 MB ram.
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03:13
<vlt>
Hyperbyte: What does your calculation look like?
03:14
Hyperbyte: (and what does "shave off RAM" mean to you?)
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03:28
<Hyperbyte>
My calculation looks like 204 used, 128 available on clients... 204 - 128 = ~80
03:28
Heh
03:29
And "shave off" means disabling things that use up RAM, like the SSHD you have running
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03:35
<Hyperbyte>
See what happens when you put X_COLOR_DEPTH=16 in lts.conf
03:35
Decreases color depth from 24 bits to 16 bits... might bring X memory usage down a little
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04:32
<nesusvet>
hello guys, when i use ltsp and try to ssh on the target server, and try to read some log file during that ssh session, the session is hanging on
04:41
<Hyperbyte>
What is the command you use to read the log file?
04:41
<nesusvet>
less
04:41
But sometimes is works, sometime it does't work :)
04:42
<Hyperbyte>
And it freezes completely?
04:43
<nesusvet>
not completely.
04:43
I need relogin after that
04:44
But it seems totally strange, because this is high load network server, and other servers working properly
04:45
Hyperbyte,
04:47
<Hyperbyte>
Be patient please. I'm at work. I don't mind giving some of my time to you, but I do have other things to do. :)
04:48
Could it be that there's some binary data in the logfiles that messes up your terminal?
04:48
<nesusvet>
hmm, i am definitely patient :).
04:49
No, it could't because i am trying take a look just into the syslog file for example
04:49
and some time I can do that on that machine
04:50
we uses ubuntu server kernel on the ltsp clients
04:52
Another issue which we have found out, that when JVM process is working, some process trying to use CPU time, and JVM start lagging :)
04:53* markit thinks java is a pain in the a..
04:54
<nesusvet>
heh :), I also think so, but it work stably on other servers also.
04:54
But one server has a strange behavior which i described above
04:56
I double checked server on some network collisions and other network errors, and it seems roots of fails grows from another place.
04:59
<markit>
sorry, my english is poor... what do you mean with "it seems roots of fails grows from another place"?
05:00
<nesusvet>
my english is poor also :)
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05:38
<Ghidorah>
Does anyone know where the Terminal logs on LTSP-CLuster Control Center are stored?
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05:56
<nesusvet>
Thanks
05:57
everyone
05:57
:)
05:57
it seems we found out the reason of fails
06:09
<Hyperbyte>
Do share. :)
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06:37
<markit>
nesusvet: we are curoius
06:38
<nesusvet>
Yes, but i am a little busy like Hyperbyte
06:38
:)
06:40
well, first, i found out the reason lack on the JVM machine, the was that NFS server always losted connections.\
06:43
But i still can't find the reason why i can read files via ssh sessions
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07:13
<Hyperbyte>
So what happens exactly?
07:14
Do you have to quit the 'less' process with ctrl+c, or do you have to kill the process, or?
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09:27
<Gadi_eeepc>
mgariepy: ping
09:44
highvoltage: u there?
09:46
<highvoltage>
Gadi_eeepc: yep
09:47
<Gadi_eeepc>
hey, is there a command I can run against an lstp-cluster-lbagent to check if it responds?
09:47
(like a wget or an nc or some such)
09:48* Gadi_eeepc is trying to figure out why the windows lbagent is not responding
09:49
<highvoltage>
it uses xmlrpc, I think there's a test script somewhere that you can use to test it...
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09:50
<highvoltage>
stgraber: do you remember off-hand whether there's something available to test lbagent with?
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09:51
<highvoltage>
Gadi_eeepc: did you try telnetting it on port 8000?
09:51
(I think that's where it's supposed to listen)
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09:51
<Gadi_eeepc>
yeah, it is lisstening
09:52
I want to try and query it for values
09:52
I try the wget against the lbserver, but it comes up empty
09:52
so, I wanted to try it directly
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09:55
<Gadi_eeepc>
found it
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09:55
<stgraber>
highvoltage: wget http://localhost:8008/ -O - -q
09:55
<Gadi_eeepc>
yeah, Ive done that
09:55
<stgraber>
oh, lbagent
09:55
nope, though it should log something
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09:56
<Gadi_eeepc>
"can't encode character u'\xae' in position 9: ordinal not in range
09:57
does that error sound familiar?
09:57
that's in the log
09:57
ah... that's in the DISTRO value
09:58
<stgraber>
looks like an utf8 issue
09:58
or similar encoding problems
09:58
<Gadi_eeepc>
u'Microsoft\xae Windows ....
09:58
hmm...
09:59
have you guys used this on W2k8r2?
10:01
looks like the error is in the code that updates the db
10:02
"Error updating node"
10:03
<mgariepy>
hey Gadi_eeepc i'm here now !
10:03
<Gadi_eeepc>
mgariepy: hey hey
10:04
have you used lbagent on w2k8r2?
10:04
<mgariepy>
nop
10:04
<Gadi_eeepc>
starting to see that :)
10:04
well, consider this a bug report
10:04
:D
10:04
<mgariepy>
LOL
10:05
in lbserver
10:05
do you have logs ?
10:06
<Gadi_eeepc>
yeah, but that's the only interesting part
10:06
<mgariepy>
what does it say ?
10:06
<_UsUrPeR_>
Gadi_eeepc: sort of related question pertaining to win2k8r2: have you attempted to authenticate against Windows AD without using Likewise yet?
10:06
<Gadi_eeepc>
Error updating node: can't encode character u'\xae' in position 9: ordinal not in range ....
10:06
<_UsUrPeR_>
I am having problems finding proper documentation on the process
10:06
<Gadi_eeepc>
and when I run the test_comm.py against the agent
10:06
I see the unicode characters in the DISTRO key
10:07
_UsUrPeR_: before yo u go down a rabbit hole, contact likewise and have them send you the latest revision
10:07
of version 6
10:08
version 5 has issues on a multiuser system
10:08
<_UsUrPeR_>
Gadi_eeepc: The reason we are bypassing that, is because it seemed to have sporadic login failures. Is that something you had experienced?
10:08
<Gadi_eeepc>
_UsUrPeR_: ah *without*
10:08
I read too quickly
10:09
yeah, the agent would freeze
10:09
<_UsUrPeR_>
specifically, likewise appeared to truncate the set domain name occaisionally during an LTSP client login
10:09
<Gadi_eeepc>
and bring not only new logins but the whole system to its knees
10:09
<_UsUrPeR_>
precisely
10:09
<Gadi_eeepc>
but, they claimed to have addressed it
10:09
in recent versions of 6
10:09
<_UsUrPeR_>
the user attempting to login would have his info sent to the Windows server as such: dude@place.thing.
10:10
<Gadi_eeepc>
but, I have not tried it since I had egg all over my face
10:10
:)
10:10
<_UsUrPeR_>
ok, well I appreciate the heads up. Perhaps I should do some testing on this process.
10:10
with likewise...
10:10
still, I think that bypassing likewise all together is going to be required. Have you seen anything pertaining to a manual process?
10:11
<Gadi_eeepc>
has anyone tried rdesktop 1.7 with session broker?
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10:12
<Gadi_eeepc>
_UsUrPeR_: you mean windbind, samba, kerberos and the like?
10:12
<mgariepy>
Gadi_eeepc, does it works ?
10:12
freerdp is supposed to work with session broker no ?
10:12
<Gadi_eeepc>
mgariepy: it is supposed to have improved performance
10:12
freerdp is supposed to work, too
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10:13
<Gadi_eeepc>
but, I am having trouble making a deb from git
10:13
and the latest deb 0.8.2 has issues that were fixed
10:13
<_UsUrPeR_>
Gadi_eeepc: I am focusing just on authentication right now. No Samba, nothing pertaining to the extraneous features you get with AD
10:13
<Gadi_eeepc>
_UsUrPeR_: you need samba for auth
10:14
I think
10:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
ORLY
10:14
<Gadi_eeepc>
I think windbind looks in smb.conf
10:14
for the user id mapping
10:14
<mgariepy>
ls
10:14
oops :)
10:14
<_UsUrPeR_>
huh. What's the purpose of Kerberos in this equation of Samba is used for auth?
10:14
<Gadi_eeepc>
mgariepy: if you have a freerdp deb, Ive got a screen script
10:15
:)
10:15
_UsUrPeR_: kerberos auths the computer
10:15
samba auths the users
10:15
<_UsUrPeR_>
ahh, gotcha
10:15
<Gadi_eeepc>
oh, and dont forget ldap
10:15
:)
10:16
there's a likewise competitor, too
10:16
I forget the name atm
10:17
otavio: you wouldnt happen to have a deb of freerdp from git trunk, would you?
10:17
<otavio>
Gadi_eeepc: I don't
10:17
<Gadi_eeepc>
:(
10:18
I had issues with dpkg-gensymbols
10:18
<otavio>
Gadi_eeepc: specially because it has changed a lot since 0.8.2
10:18
Gadi_eeepc: so it needs fixes on the packaging side
10:18
<Gadi_eeepc>
ok
10:19
maybe I'll just build it in the chroot for now
10:19
though, I hate doing that
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00:00--- Thu May 19 2011