IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 5 April 2012   (all times are UTC)

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07:08
<markit>
hi, with my setup script I write /etc/resolv.conf, but now in 12.04 I get the error, when I restart dnsmasq: resolvconf: Error: /etc/resolv.conf isn't a symlink, not doing anything.
07:09
seems that this stuff has changed quite a bit (same error if I just run resolvconf from prompt)
07:09
I've read a little around with google, but did not got the reasoning behind that
07:09
any idea? how change nameserver statically without triggering problems?
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07:11
<alkisg>
markit: http://www.stgraber.org/2012/02/24/dns-in-ubuntu-12-04/
07:15
<markit>
alkisg: thanks, but "argh!"
07:16
<alkisg>
markit: I filed a bug report about it, you can put your "argh!" there :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/959037
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07:17
<markit>
:))
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07:18
<markit>
btw, I do remove the network manager package, don't you?
07:19
<alkisg>
markit: " Reducing the priority since we won't look at this until Precise+1 and there aren't many reports about such issues."
07:19
So if more people compain, they'll take the matter more seriously, now they think that people don't use dnsmasq
07:19
No, I don't remove network manager, I leave it for nm-applet
07:19
From there the teachers can see if the cable is disconnected,
07:19
the IP settings, can do VPN connections etc
07:20
<markit>
I see.. btw dev are forgetting that GNU is not about desktop only like win or mac
07:20
they are removing piece by piece the multiuser capabilities
07:20
<alkisg>
It's our responsibility to remind them, so let's see if you comment on that bug report :)
07:20
<markit>
X-Window, a lot of "desktop stuff" that makes run ltsp harder and harder
07:21
alkisg: ok, let me finish read it and see if I understand properly the issue involved
07:21
<alkisg>
markit: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~alkisg => 93 bugs, https://bugs.launchpad.net/~markit => 0
07:21
So no more complains here until you start complaining in bug trackers first ;) :D
07:22
<markit>
you are right, even if I was an active bug repoprer long time ago but got disgusted by programmers reactions
07:22
but this is another story :)
07:25
<alkisg>
If in https://bugs.launchpad.net/~alkisg you click "advanced search" and check "Fix released" only, you'll see 217 bugs there
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07:25
<alkisg>
So even if e.g. 21 bugs won't be fixed, that's still just 10%
07:25
In other words, it's worth it to file bugs
07:30
<markit>
alkisg: I do agree with you, but even reading your bug I see you repeating the same obvious statements over and over, they are just "defending their code"
07:30
if you read Alan Cooper books about interaction desigh, you find this situation well described, for instance :)
07:30
<alkisg>
markit: no, I think you're the one avoiding to spend time fixing bugs
07:30
<markit>
but yes, is the only thing we can do to improve the situation
07:31
<alkisg>
For all I know that person in the bug report is right; I'm the only one affected by the bug
07:31
So there's no big reason for him to fix it
07:31
<markit>
even if it breaks default behaviour? mmm
07:31
but let me finish reading the report
07:31
<alkisg>
Default, for people installing dnsmasq
07:32
<markit>
yep, isn't enough?
07:32
<alkisg>
Apparently not, since I'm the only one affected
07:32
<markit>
let's drop dnsmasq package then, no one uses it
07:32
<alkisg>
Maybe people that use it haven't tried 12.04 yet
07:32
Or maybe they don't use network manager
07:32
Or maybe they didn't find the bug report to comment on it
07:33
Or maybe only a few people are using it, not enough to fix it
07:33
<markit>
yep, so they take that risk so lightly? let's break some random stuff when we release ltsp and wait for compnains after release?
07:33
but don't worry, I will post some "grrr" :)
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07:43
<alkisg>
markit: since you don't have network manager installed, we don't have the same problem
07:44
They are both related to the same change, yes, but not the same problem
07:44
<markit>
I see
07:44
<alkisg>
Your problem is that uninstalling network manager leaves resolvconf in a bad state
07:45
Or it might be that your script changed /etc/resolv.conf and made it a file instead of a symlink
07:45
In any case, it's another problem...
07:45
<markit>
more likely, I rewrite it (but should not write to the simlynked file? If I open a simlink and write on it, should affect the linked file...)
07:47
in any case, debian does not have this change, I think (I run sid), so ubuntu is diverging and that's not good for me
07:47
<alkisg>
No, sed doesn't do that
07:47
It creates a file instead
07:47
<markit>
ah!
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08:50
<wim_>
hi, we have ltsp-server-standalone (5.3.4 - wheezy) up and running with LTSP_FATCLIENT=True. Since a few days we get a connection error (endpoint not connected) and the user home directory is disconnected. The user has to reboot his client to reconnect his home. Has someone got this issue or any idea?? txs
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10:27
<andygraybeal>
good morning
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10:46
<markit>
alkisg: forgive my ignorance, but in 12.04 I've epoptes 0.5.0, you mentioned me time ago the "dev" repositories where grab "the latest and the greatest", could you please remember me them?
10:47
<alkisg>
markit: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=epoptes
10:47
Just update :)
10:47
<markit>
oh, lol :)
10:49
mmm seems I've some networking problem let me check
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10:51
<markit>
squid3 was down, so strange
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11:06
<markit>
squid3 main process (1253) killed by HUP signal
11:10
alkisg: sorry to bug you, but seems a bug to me, and I know you use squid as well
11:11
<alkisg>
markit: some teachers here use squid, but not me
11:11
<markit>
oh, so bad (for me), I've found and old bug maybe is now back
11:13
wondering if removing dnsmasq could fix it
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11:54
<markit>
dirty trick, added service squid3 start in rc.local :(
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12:07
<markit>
ehm, /etc/ltsp is not present... has config files been moved somewhere else? also ltsp-build-client.conf is nowhere
12:08
<alkisg>
There's no /etc/ltsp by default
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12:08
<alkisg>
In some versions ubuntu used to ship /etc/ltsp/ltsp-update-image.conf, but that's no longer needed
12:08
As compression=on by default now again
12:08
<markit>
so my script was already broken, lol
12:09
I "forced" [LOCALE="it_IT.UTF-8" there
12:10
<alkisg>
Well you can run `mkdir -p /etc/ltsp` if you really want to
12:11
Otherwise make a package that ships plugins in /usr/share/ltsp/plugins/ltsp-build-client etc
12:12
<markit>
sure, just wondering how things have changed
12:12
btw, I fear NFS will not use acl I've defines for homes, I'll see (I know nothing about this subject)
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12:38
<ncd209>
hey there :)
12:40
I just moved our server.. and I am getting PXE/TFTP E11 on my work stations.. i think i forgot a configuration file ..to do with tftpd any one know what I am looking for
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12:43
<ncd209>
/etc/dhcpd.conf == done ... /etc/lts.conf == done .. every thing else is set to the new ip ranges afaik... do i need to ... update-rc.d ltsp defaults
12:43
\???
12:44
<markit>
just blind shots (I'm not expert): have you rebuild NBD image? recreated ssh keys? ltsp-update-sshkeys
12:45
are services listening?
12:45
look at the logs... maybe tftp is not correctly started
12:45
nmap localhost
12:45
are clients getting the IP (is dhcp working fine?)
12:46
ncd209: I've no more ideas at the moment :)
12:46
<ncd209>
ok ill check into all what you mentioned
12:47
i did do the ltsp-update-image -a i386
12:47
<markit>
is it just my impression, or ltsp-build-client ignores packages already present in the "host" and downloads them again?
12:47
<alkisg>
It is so, unless you run it with --mount-package-cache
12:48
<ncd209>
markit, dhcpd is giving out the correct ips
12:49
<markit>
alkisg: not found in the manual (maybe I'm blind)
12:49
<ncd209>
sorry its been a while since i dabbled with ltsp ... my brain is operating 0.05 thoughts/per second :)
12:50
<alkisg>
markit: ltsp-build-client --extra-help
12:51
<markit>
so RTFM has to be changed in RTFM--extra-help
12:51
better use as default in my scripts, or there are drawbacks I'm not aware of?
12:52
<ncd209>
ah i think i see the problem :( .. there is a dhcp server behind ours and its jumping on that
12:52
and its not like we ask them to turn it off lol
12:52
we can ^^
12:53
<markit>
ncd209: there are news with dnsmasq, can act as proxy and provide only tftp boot info
12:53
proxy-dhcp: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
12:54
see dhcp-range=10.160.31.10,proxy
12:54
(all this knowledge is only thanks to alkisg mentoring me yesterday, lol)
12:57
<ncd209>
oh no its not .. i am just getting confused here lol
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13:03
<ncd209>
hm
13:03
Starting HPA's tftpd: in.tftpd/usr/sbin/in.tftpd: unrecognized option '--address'
13:05
atftp-0.7 (server)
13:05
not sure how this has come about
13:06
I am guessing aftp is wrong ... the --help does now show --address as a option
13:07
<alkisg>
atftp is another program than tftpd-hpa
13:09
<ncd209>
weird it was not installed at all which does beg the question how on the earth was the server booting its workstations for the last 6 months or more cause that was the last time i saw it
13:10
<alkisg>
Maybe you installed something which installed atftp which conflicted with tftpd-hpa
13:10
aptitude why atftp will tell you
13:13
<ncd209>
no reason to install atftp
13:15
<alkisg>
atftp-0.7 (server) ==> where does that come from?
13:15
If you have atftp installed without reason, maybe you removed the other package inbetween
13:15
Or maybe you indeed installed it manually
13:15
In any case, remove it and stick to the defaults, for easier support
13:15
<ncd209>
it is possible i might of... i do like to try things
13:16
i /forgotted ;)
13:16
but yep its removed and back to the real
13:16
in.tftpd --version
13:16
tftp-hpa 5.0, with remap, with tcpwrappers
13:17
now i get tftp..... 5 dots and then E32
13:17
unable to connect
13:17
<alkisg>
!tftp
13:17
<ltsp>
alkisg: tftp: Here's a page to help you troubleshoot TFTP problems in Ubuntu: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/Troubleshooting/TFTP
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13:22
<ncd209>
tnx
13:22
tftp dgram udp4 wait nobody /usr/sbin/tcpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd --tftpd-timeout 300 --retry-timeout 5 --mcast-port 1758 --mcast-addr 239.239.239.0-255 --mcast-ttl 1 --maxthread 100 --verbose=5 /srv/tftp
13:23
i think that might be the problem..
13:29
well .. that is strange
13:29
tftpd-hpa is claiming to be running
13:29
<alkisg>
srv/tftp ==> var/lib/tftpboot
13:30
<ncd209>
pwd
13:30
^^ it is the real location i have it defined so in /etc/defaults too
13:31
i just tried to use the tftp-hpa client to get it directly and it just gets stuck
13:31
<markit>
alkisg: your suggestion to use i386 (pae) for the host is really envaluable when it comes for bandwidth save. Wondering if is possible "downgarde" my _64 servers without reinstall
13:31
or if there is a simple way to "backup users and restore in a new install"
13:31
<alkisg>
markit: afaik, no, it's not possible
13:32
To backup+restore users I use a sch-scripts tool
13:32
<markit>
I'll dig the source, strange there is nothing "official" in the repository about this issues (everyone reinventing the wheel)
13:33
<alkisg>
Yeah :(
13:33
In a couple of months we'll have a new "users management" utility ready
13:33
...because none of the existing fits our schools' needs
13:33
<markit>
ehm, need a translator? :)
13:34
<alkisg>
Yeah, we'll possibly start it i18n from the start
13:34
And only keep a "greek-settings" package in greek
13:34
<markit>
that would be wonderful
13:35
<ncd209>
alkisg, getting from 10.51.46.21:/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 to pxelinux.0 [octet] <<-- its stuck like a pig
13:36
<alkisg>
ncd209: since you're using /srv/tftp, check if the /srv/tftp/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 file exists or not
13:36
bbl
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13:41
<ncd209>
well i am royally stuck
13:41* ncd209 runs to get a coffee
13:43
<vmlintu_>
alkisg: what kind of user management tool are you working on?
13:46
<ncd209>
nahahha
13:47
it was because inetd was not running lol
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13:55
<ncd209>
woot :D
13:56
Houston we have lift off
13:56
ltsp is so awesome
13:56* ncd209 performs a lude act on himself
13:57
<ncd209>
;)
13:58
markit, i thanks and if you can pass my thanks to alkisg as well when he comes back
14:10
<markit>
ncd209: np :)
14:29
<ncd209>
man 100,0000s of workers in this place are raping the coffee supply
14:30
having a go at getting ltsp + sound to work now markit
14:31
<markit>
I'm not an expert, just collected a tons of suggestions, but I have scarce autonomy in troubleshooting. Here sounds works "out of the box"
14:31
ncd209: btw, are you with 12.04 and latest and greatest LTSP or just resurrecting an old installation?
14:32* markit has unable to have dhcp working... then discovered that the cable was plugged on the wrong port of the server
14:36
<ncd209>
just resurrecting an old one
14:36
hehe
14:36
<markit>
mm I've to edit my message in launchpad and don't know how to do, if even possible (I wrote "at" instead of "add")
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14:59
<markit>
I'm clueless... I get "bad or missing pxe menu and/or prompt information"
15:00
but I've no pxe-service defined
15:00
(I don't even know that is about... never used.. maybe is needed?)
15:01
let's try to add it
15:03
mm yep, now the next error, lol
15:04
<ncd209>
heh i just had the same
15:04
with ltsp-sound.sh
15:04
fixed the syntax error
15:04
but I do not know what to do next
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15:12
<markit>
syntax error? I've been able to rech ldm login
15:12
I've dnsmasq though
15:12
waiting for alkisg to explain this new stuff
15:12
or some other volunteer here? :)
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15:34
<markit>
pxe-service=X86PC, "Boot from local hard disk", 0
15:34
does not work, it reboots with pxe and returns to menu
15:36
<||cw>
markit: where are you putting that?
15:37
<markit>
at the end of the file, below pxe-service=X86PC, "Boot from network", /ltsp/i386/pxelinux
15:37
in dnsmasq.conf
15:37
the menu appears, but if I select "boot from local hard disk" I'm rebooted in pxe boot (and pxe menu again)
15:37
<||cw>
do you have a dhcp-boot=pxelinux.0 in dnsmasq.conf?
15:37
<markit>
I've dhcp-boot=/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0
15:37
<||cw>
or is this not the standard dnsmasq package?
15:38
<markit>
otherwise pxe was unable to find the pxelinux.0
15:38
<||cw>
what do you have for tftp-root=?
15:38
<markit>
||cw: standard package with ltsp settings :)
15:38
tftp-root=/var/lib/tftpboot/
15:38
"as usual"
15:38
I could add the /ltsp/i386 there?
15:38
<||cw>
well, mine's not standard. I have dnsmasq on a seperate system than the ltsp
15:38
<markit>
wondering why "old" setup does not work
15:39
I had all that dhcp-boot=net:pxe,/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 etc stuff
15:39
<||cw>
tftp-root=/var/tftpd and dhcp-boot=pxelinux.0, you can adjust your paths as needed
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15:39
<markit>
let me try
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15:39
<||cw>
just keep in mind that all paths in all pxelinux stuff will need to be relative to your tftp-root= path
15:40
also, do you have tftp-secure enabled?
15:40
if so, make sure you adjust file ownership, or disable it
15:41
<markit>
mm now path is also took from pxe menu option, lol
15:41
don't like to have pxe-service=X86PC, "Boot from network", /ltsp/i386/pxelinux <----------- another path setting!!!
15:42
and why "pxelinux" and not "pxelinux.0"? I've no clue about all this stuff
15:42
I'm just shooting in the dark
15:44
<||cw>
I dont' know what that setting is, I have nothing like it
15:44
<alkisg>
Yes it's plain pxelinux without .0, that's how the protocol defines it
15:44
markit: if you have problems, put your config to pastebin
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15:45
<markit>
alkisg: thanks, let me do it (I would love a) don't need this added menu stuff b) be able to choose if boot from local disk)
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15:46
<alkisg>
markit: are you using gpxe, or the NIC's boot rom?
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15:46
<markit>
nicks
15:46
<alkisg>
It should work then, paste your dnsmasq config
15:46
<markit>
I've followed some online example and removed old stuff
15:46
<||cw>
I don't have any pxe-service lines, is that even needed?
15:47
<alkisg>
||cw: only if you want a pxe menu
15:47
<||cw>
I have a menu
15:47
<alkisg>
That's a new functionality provided only by dnsmasq
15:47
There are pxe menus and pxelinux menus
15:47
<||cw>
new since?
15:47
<alkisg>
Those are different
15:47
<||cw>
ah
15:47
I have pxelinux menus
15:47
<alkisg>
Since May '09, I think :D
15:47
Yes, that's PXE menu, handled by the NIC ROM
15:47
Before even pxelinux.0 gets loaded
15:48
<||cw>
k. how's it more useful?
15:48
<markit>
http://pastebin.com/1Zw5V891
15:48
alkisg: I did not wanted the menu, but without that line I got the error:
15:48
"bad or missing pxe menu and/or prompt information"
15:49
<alkisg>
markit: why do you define "listen-address"?
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15:49
<markit>
I've a 2 nick setup
15:49
better have dhcp bind to clients
15:49
<alkisg>
# dhcp-option=17,/opt/ltsp/i386 ==> put that one back
15:50
It's needed by certain clients (depending on their nic rom)
15:50
dhcp-boot=pxelinux.0 ==> change that to /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0
15:50
And comment out both pxe service menus, if you're not using proxydhcp
15:51
||cw: the pxe menu items can be collected from various servers on the network
15:51
pxelinux can't do that, broadcast its menus
15:51
<markit>
let's see if I get the error or not
15:51
<alkisg>
But for simple setups, sure, everything that pxe menus can do, pxelinux does as well, even graphically with vesamenu
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15:52
<markit>
I've again the error of the missing menu
15:52
that started all this nightmare :(
15:52
(yes, I've restarted dnsmasq)
15:54
<alkisg>
markit: egrep -v '^#|^$' /etc/dnsmasq.conf /etc/dnsmasq.d/*
15:54
And again pastebin :)
15:55
<markit>
http://pastebin.com/j7Hmxhu0
15:58
<alkisg>
It should be working... but anyway try to give it a menu: pxe-service=X86PC, "Boot from network", /ltsp/i386/pxelinux
15:59
You're sure that the correct dnsmasq is running (and not the other ubuntu one), and that your don't have a proxydhcp server in your network?
15:59
E.g. if the client is booting from another dnsmasq server in proxydhcp mode, it might show that message...
16:00
<markit>
I've a 2 nic setup, clients on that nick and dnsmasq is binded there
16:00
how can I tell if there is the "ubuntu" dnsmasq running also?
16:00
<alkisg>
ps aux|grep dnsmasq
16:00
<markit>
dnsmasq 3100 0.0 0.0 5396 924 ? S 17:51 0:00 /usr/sbin/dnsmasq -x /var/run/dnsmasq/dnsmasq.pid -u dnsmasq -r /var/run/dnsmasq/resolv.conf -7 /etc/dnsmasq.d,.dpkg-dist,.dpkg-old,.dpkg-new
16:00
<alkisg>
Yes that's the correct one
16:01
<markit>
mmmm
16:01
<alkisg>
And on that switch you don't have another dhcp server running, correct?
16:01
<markit>
yep, is for experiment, I've the switch dedicated to server and only one client
16:01
<alkisg>
OK, try that menu line above
16:01
<markit>
yes, it should work, I was able before
16:02
but what I dislike is that in the menu I've to specify a path again
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16:02
<markit>
(/ltsp/i386/pxelinux)
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16:02
<alkisg>
Yeah it's for a different thing
16:02
The first is for a normal dhcp boot, the second for a pxe service
16:03
But of course in that simple case both are the same thing...
16:03
<markit>
yep, but is another item to check if something is wrong...
16:03
in any case, is strange... and also if I do have to have that menu
16:03
I would love to see if works for local (hd) boot
16:03
but it does not
16:04
<alkisg>
Try pxelinux menus instead of pxe menus, chain.c32 can even select which partition you want it to boot
16:05
<markit>
ok, boot from lan works, lan boot menu appears and the only choice is used
16:05
ii dnsmasq 2.59-4
16:06
"Try pxelinux menus instead of pxe menus" means?
16:08
and all the "old" stuff like dhcp-boot=net:pxe,/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 dhcp-boot=net:etherboot,/ltsp/i386/nbi.img and dhcp-boot=net:ltsp,/ltsp/i386/lts.conf can be skipped or is needed for OLD pc?
16:08
(or gPXE)?
16:08
I've no idea of their meaning, sigh
16:08
<andygraybeal>
i'm having probs with updating or installing java in chroot. any advice?
16:08
<||cw>
markit: it means don't use pxe-service, instead setup menus using the pxelinux.cfg/ files
16:09
<andygraybeal>
i'm using the ltsp-chroot script too. i'm in ubuntu 10.04
16:09
<||cw>
andygraybeal: what kind of problems?
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16:11
<andygraybeal>
||cw, here is a pastie: http://pastie.org/3733801
16:11
<alkisg>
markit: you can send /ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 to all clients, I don't think you'll be able to find etherboot clients that use nbi.img anymore
16:11
<andygraybeal>
||cw, dependency issue.. of which i never understand enough to untangle myself from!
16:12
<alkisg>
andygraybeal: don't use upgrade, use dist-upgrade
16:12
<andygraybeal>
alkisg, okay
16:12
thank you
16:12
<alkisg>
That doesn't mean "upgrade to a new distro version", it just means "I allow packages to bring new dependencies"
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16:12
<andygraybeal>
happy-time-dance!
16:13
thank you t hings are back to normal now.
16:13
<markit>
a
16:13
<andygraybeal>
i'm always so scared of 'dist-upgrade' it soudns so evil.
16:13
<markit>
alkisg: thanks :)
16:14
<andygraybeal>
alkisg, does this include the kernel?
16:14
or is that seperate and i should run it separately too?
16:14
<alkisg>
andygraybeal: it includes the kernel too
16:14
(07:13:32 μμ) andygraybeal: i'm always so scared of 'dist-upgrade' it soudns so evil. ==> no, "upgrade" is evil, it breaks installations :D
16:17
<andygraybeal>
okay crazy.
16:17
thank you
16:18
if 12.04 comes out, will dist-upgrade try to get me to go to it?
16:18
<alkisg>
No
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16:20
<andygraybeal>
okay, this is not confusing :)
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16:55
<markit>
urgh, 12.04 does not have "admin" but "adm"???? is it a bug?
17:00
<alkisg>
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseNotes/UbuntuServer
17:00
Until Ubuntu 11.10, the Unix group for administrators with root privileges through sudo had been admin. Starting with Ubuntu 12.04 LTS, it is now sudo, for compatibility with Debian and sudo itself. However, for backwards compatibility, admin group members are still recognized as administrators.
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17:47
<markit>
alkisg: yep, reading, thanks
17:47
so really I'd better test deeply all what I can
17:50
alkisg: wouldn't be lovely have in ldm login, near hostname and IP, a "F" for fat or "T" for thin?
17:50
<alkisg>
markit: no, it would be better to have all available sessions in "preferences"
17:51
Fat client session : Ubuntu, locally
17:51
Thin client session: Ubuntu-2d, server
17:51
etc etc
17:51
So fat or thin wouldn't matter until after you login
17:51
<markit>
I see, just an idea to help me know imediatly the situation
17:52
<alkisg>
There would be no difference in this case, there would be no fat or thin client
17:52
Just fat or thin "sessions"
17:53
<markit>
btw, i've a problem with printers
17:53
if some error occurs, they go in "waiting mode"
17:53
until you start them again
17:53
and that is really hard for teachers
17:53
wondering if is something you can configure somewhere, and if you have already solved
18:00* vagrantc loves the idea of fat/thin sessions
18:07
<alkisg>
We only need to move pulseaudio to ldm rc.d, and an init-ltsp.d script that puts all the available remote sessions in /usr/share/xsessions/ltsp-something.desktop, with Exec: ltsp-start-remote-session server session
18:08
<ogra_>
sounds like you all are in danger ofdeveloping a bad yo-yo effect
18:12
<andygraybeal>
ogra_, explain yo-yo effect to an idiot, pls!! (i'm the idiot)
18:13
<ogra_>
getting fat because you did to many diets ;)
18:13
<andygraybeal>
oh hahahahaha, okay i get it
18:13
geesh, that was awful
18:13
i thought it was a legit programming problem
18:15
i'm excited for 12.04, i don't care what the haters think. i've been looking forward to it the whole time.
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18:39* markit is no more able to make kde4 get defaults from /etc/kde4 in 12.04
18:41
<Hyperbyte>
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