IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 31 January 2008   (all times are UTC)

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02:03
<lns>
sup jammcq
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03:16
<Nubae>
good morning
03:16
ogra r u there?
03:21
well if you read this... I'm wondering about messagebus and haldaemon and whether they should be created normally in the postinst, because I dont have them when in /var/lib/dpkg/info, looks like it was just gdm that was created in ldap
03:52
right, good news is, its all working now... but... I get "Authentication Failed" on the gdm welcome screen
03:55
must be something to do with /etc/pam.d/gdm
04:11
heh... turns out apt-get install edubuntu-desktop didn't pull everything through first time... had to do it again, only gdm was properly installed... but at least everything goes through, even gdm login
04:12
no wonder ltsp-build-image was so fast
04:12
lol
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08:55
<whizzer>
I have just installed ltsp in ubuntu 7.10 server via apt-get install ltsp-server and ltsp-build-client. I set up the dhcp server, the thin client boots to a graphical login, however I cannot log in with any user it seems. help please?
08:57
it doesn't look like nfs is set up or running
08:58
that could be a problem i suppose...
08:59
<nikok>
well.. according to my knowledge it has to be up and running 'cos the ltsp clients works... nfs shares the / to you client machines... slap me if i'm wrong
09:00
<whizzer>
i see. i thought that might be part of the tftp image
09:00
but i only started reading about ltsp yesterday, so i am no expert
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09:01
<cliebow_>
whizzer no nfs necessary
09:01
<whizzer>
okay
09:02
<cliebow_>
gutsy uses a squashfs and nbd
09:02
<whizzer>
what is nbd?
09:02
<cliebow_>
probably you need to ltsp-update ssh-keys and ltsp-update-image..if you return to login
09:03
probably you need to ltsp-update-ssh-keys and ltsp-update-image..if you return to login
09:04
<whizzer>
i think i have done that, but will do again now to make sure
09:04
<cliebow_>
you DO get to a login screen?
09:05
<whizzer>
yes
09:05
i type in credentials and it goes black for a second, then back to login screen
09:05
<cliebow_>
yeah..sounds like your ssh keys
09:05
<whizzer>
at console login i get Login incorrect
09:06
do i run those commands in the chroot, or on main server?
09:06
<cliebow_>
main server with sudo
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09:07
<whizzer>
sshkeys after image? or does order matter?
09:07
<cliebow_>
does matter..first fix your keys..then rebuild the image
09:08
it Will take a bit
09:08
<whizzer>
okay, i ran update keys and it's working on the image
09:08
do i need to reboot or anything?
09:08
the client
09:09
<cliebow_>
let us know..shouldnt need a reboot..except for the client
09:09
<whizzer>
okay, perhaps that is the thing. i rebuilt keys before, but didn't reboot the client
09:10
<cliebow_>
you have to rebuild the image before the change will take effect..
09:10
<whizzer>
okay
09:10
gotcha
09:11
hmm. still no dice
09:11
<cliebow_>
do you get anything in auth.log on server?
09:12
!seen sbalneav
09:12
<ltspbot>
cliebow_: sbalneav was last seen in #ltsp 1 day, 23 hours, 14 minutes, and 34 seconds ago: <sbalneav> someones sent folder didn't come a cross.
09:12
<cliebow_>
let him out!!
09:13
<whizzer>
Jan 31 10:06:33 HFSNM037000010 chage[11605]: changed password expiry for statd
09:13
Jan 31 10:15:16 HFSNM037000010 sshd[11960]: Accepted password for whizzer from 172.26.47.10 port 36290 ssh2
09:13
Jan 31 10:15:17 HFSNM037000010 sshd[11962]: pam_unix(ssh:session): session opened for user whizzer by (uid=0)
09:13
that is the thin client ip in the last two entries
09:13
or second to last at least
09:13
<cliebow_>
perhaps ogra will chime in...
09:14
ohhh.he'd say check your .Xsession-errors
09:14
for that user..
09:14
<whizzer>
nothing is written to the home directory in the chroot
09:14
<cliebow_>
on your server
09:15
<whizzer>
hmm
09:15
<cliebow_>
since your xsession is there
09:15
<ogra>
cliebow_, sshkeys tell your "this workstation is not authorized" as error message nowadays
09:15
whizzer, dod you install on top of ubuntu-server ?
09:15
<cliebow_>
thank you ogra
09:15
<ogra>
*did
09:15
<whizzer>
ogra: yes, and i do not have x on the main server, is that the issue?
09:15
<cliebow_>
ohhh..no x?
09:15
<ogra>
whizzer, you dont need X but a desktop
09:15
<whizzer>
i thought it was only in the chroot that it was needed
09:15
interesting
09:16
<ogra>
ltsp5 operates via ssh ... essentially it does ssh -X user@server /etc/X11/Xsession
09:16
so there doesnt need to be any X on the server, but a desktop environment of any kind to log in to
09:16
<whizzer>
i see, so what should I apt-get install on the server?
09:17
gnome or some such?
09:17
<cliebow_>
like edubuntu-desktop?
09:17
<ogra>
ubuntu-desktop would be the fully fledged ubuntu desktop
09:17
<whizzer>
sorry i'm so uninformed
09:17
okay
09:17
<cliebow_>
this all new formost of us
09:18
<whizzer>
i am pretty familiar with general linux, but i am fairly new to ubuntu and completely new to ltsp
09:18
<cliebow_>
it Rocks..
09:19
<whizzer>
i like it alot so far :-)
09:19
apt-get is working on ubuntu-desktop now. i assume that will take a few minutes at least
09:20
<cliebow_>
oh yeah..
09:20
<whizzer>
i'm running the ltsp server on a vmware esx server virtual machine :-)
09:21
we have a gigantic vmware environment at my work
09:21
multi terabyte san storage backend, etc
09:21
<maginot>
there are any special treatment for the dhcp server on the ltsp to set the gw ip to an ip address like 192.168.0.1 then it own host name ? My server is giving dhcp not only for the clients, but for the entire network but the other clients are having trouble with some connections and I saw that the default gw settled in the clients are ltsp-server.domain and not 192.168.0.1, even having seted in the dhcpd.conf "option routers 192.168.0.1"
09:21
<whizzer>
fun stuff
09:21
<cliebow_>
i have dedicated machines in my schools...never got anywhere in vmware
09:22
maginot:two nic setup?
09:22
<whizzer>
cliebow_: vmware is mostly worthless besides for training exercises unless you buy hefty hardware and esx
09:22
<cliebow_>
esx?
09:22
<maginot>
cliebow_, no.. only one gigabyte
09:22
<whizzer>
honestly, i'd prefer to use xen probably if work would allow
09:22
vmware has had 3 main product offerings
09:23
the desktop vmware software that you install on xp or linux
09:23
<cliebow_>
maginot:wont option routers define your gateway for machines?
09:23
<whizzer>
gsx server which allows for remote console connections but still isn't their flagship product
09:23
and esx server, which only runs on server class hardware and is it's own operating system
09:24
<cliebow_>
oh i see..a commercial product of sorts?
09:24
<whizzer>
(they say it is their own operating system at least, but it looks ever so much like redhat)
09:24
yes
09:24
<maginot>
cliebow_, Im using "option routers 192.168.0.1" but the clients are geting ltsp-server.domainname
09:25
<cliebow_>
use pastebot.ltsp.org to paste your dhcpd.conf//so all can have a look at it
09:25
<maginot>
cliebow_, the thinclients are working everything, but the other standalone ubuntus I had are browsing the web but not being able to use msn and things like this
09:25
ok will paste
09:26
<whizzer>
ogra: what does ltsp5 use the chroot environment for if it basically uses the account on the main server?
09:27
via ssh
09:27
for the graphical login?
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09:28
<ogra>
booting, X, login manager, sound and localdevice support
09:29
<whizzer>
i see
09:29
so you don't need any user accounts in the chroot at all, besides the default ones
09:29
<ogra>
there are no default ones :)
09:29
root is locked and there are no other accounts you could use ...
09:29
<whizzer>
well, i meant for devices and daemons and such
09:30
right
09:30
<ogra>
right, system accounts are created
09:30
but there is no way to log in to a client locally by default
09:31
(you can switch that on easily though if needed i.e. for debugging)
09:31
<whizzer>
cool stuff
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09:31
<Nubae>
ogra should I be doing ltsp-update-kernels? or is that done automatically with ltsp-update-image?
09:31
<maginot>
cliebow_, when I was going to paste I saw the problem, I have to routers entry ... one pointing to the ltsp server and other to the network route .... but now came to me another question ... there are anyproblem to set the route to the clients directly to the network router ?
09:32
<ltsppbot>
"maginot" pasted "dhcpd.conf" (102 lines) at http://pastebot.ltsp.org/433
09:34
<cliebow_>
maginot, for what it is worth your range should prob not incluse your static addresses
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09:35
<cliebow_>
if your router is 0.1 prob you should comment the 250
09:35
and restart dhcp
09:36
<maginot>
cliebow_, but Im using deny unknown-clients; and setting every ip with a mac address
09:38
<cliebow_>
i see it..then prob dont even need a rangehuh..
09:40
<maginot>
hmmm yeah .. probably ...
09:44
<whizzer>
so nbd is net boot daemon or some such? runs the tftp server?
09:45
<Nubae>
network block device
09:45
<ogra>
whizzer, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWithoutNFS
09:45
<cliebow_>
no..network block device...mounts the squashfs image made from /opt/ltsp/i386
09:45
<ogra>
Nubae, if you changed anything in the initramfs setup you should run ltsp-update-kernels ... else you wont need that
09:46
<Nubae>
initramfs setup? like what
09:46
<ogra>
modules etc
09:46
you shouldnt need it
09:47
<Nubae>
ah ok, no then... I think I'm going to try this with a smaller chroot, maybe a non desktop fat chroot first, because this is impossible to debug
09:52
<whizzer>
ahh, so the chroot is what get's built into the squashfs image, so it isn't really a chroot... just a stepping stone to creating the squashfs image
09:54
<cliebow_>
yes yes
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09:54
<whizzer>
nifty :)
09:55* whizzer taps fingers while ubuntu-desktop continues to install
09:55
<cliebow_>
ogra's brainchild
09:55
<whizzer>
seem like very forward thinking decisions imho
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09:57
<Nubae>
weird... ltsp-build-client doesn't allow the shortcuts, but ltsp-build-image does :-)
09:58
<cliebow_>
whizzer, things were slow with nfs..so ogra dreamed this up
09:58
<Nubae>
so for ltsp-build-client you have to use --arch or --base and for ltsp-build-image you just use -a or -b
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10:03
<whizzer>
cliebow_: who *really* wants to use NFS anyway :-)
10:03
<cliebow_>
yeah...i do..because i'm stuck in 4.2
10:05
<Blinny>
whizzer: It's my only real choice for multi-homed setups.
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10:06
<jammcq>
g'morning kidz
10:06
<whizzer>
i'm not saying it isn't the only viable option in some circumstances
10:06
<Blinny>
jammcq: Mornin!
10:06
<whizzer>
just saying who wouldn't leave it behind if they could
10:06
<Blinny>
whizzer: But you're right. If I could avoid it I would.
10:07
<cliebow_>
Hey jammcq!!!
10:19
<whizzer>
well, i can login at the console now
10:19
rebooting client to try desktop again
10:21
hmm, still no dice at the graphical login :|
10:25
<Blinny>
I received a strange error this morning when I tested booting my LTSP1225 box on an Ubuntu 64-bit Gutsy server.
10:25
four identical lines: "7.8.12000 request_module: runaway loop modprobe binfmt-464c"
10:26
<whizzer>
ogra: besides installing ubuntu-desktop, is there any further server configuration I need? an .xinitrc or something in the user's home dir?
10:29
there is no /etc/X11/Xsession if ltsp5 attempts ssh -X user@server /etc/X11/Xsession
10:29
like you said earlier
10:30
<Nubae>
blinny, sounds like its loading the image from the wrong nbd port
10:30
I run 64 bit, and have seen that happen before
10:31
<whizzer>
lol, i should have started with installing the desktop version of ubuntu instead of server i suppose :-)
10:31
<cliebow_>
xsession-errors??
10:31
<whizzer>
cliebow_: there are no .x* files in the home dir
10:31
<Blinny>
OK Nubae, thanks!
10:33
<cliebow_>
whizzer:you might have to do a server reboot??
10:33
<whizzer>
i can't imagine why
10:34
<Blinny>
whizzer: To get X started
10:34
whizzer: I'd say 'init 5' but ubuntu does everything at 3 I think
10:34
<Nubae>
is there some way to get the pxelinux to display verbose (not just take out quiet and splash)
10:34
?
10:34
<whizzer>
okay, i'll reboot
10:35
<Blinny>
whizzer: I have trouble with the server-first or desktop-first idea too. My thought is 'server first' so you get longer LTS support.
10:37
<cliebow_>
Blinny..make that a 2..iirc
10:37
<Blinny>
cliebow_: I only remember thinking 'why in the hell...?' when I finally figured out why my services at runlevel 5 weren't starting (;
10:38
<cliebow_>
hehe!!
10:39
<whizzer>
i don't think i got xorg, just the desktop
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10:41
<whizzer>
perhaps i need to install xserver-xorg
10:41
ogra: seemed to say not though
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10:50
<whizzer>
that was it
10:50
i needed ubuntu-desktop and xserver-xorg. plus i need an .xsession file in the user's home
10:52
now i need to find out what goes in .xsession, lol
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10:54
<cliebow_>
it should create on the fly
10:57
<whizzer>
should schmood
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11:05* whizzer does apt-get install gnome
11:05
<whizzer>
:|
11:05* whizzer chants "work, work, work!"
11:07
<whizzer>
at least i get .xsession-errors now
11:07
<cliebow_>
boy..that is being a pain
11:07
<whizzer>
Xsession: X session started for whizzer at Thu Jan 31 12:11:08 EST 2008
11:07
Xsession: unable to start X session --- no "/home/whizzer/.xsession" file, no
11:07
"/home/whizzer/.Xsession" file, no session managers, no window managers, and no
11:07
terminal emulators found; aborting.
11:09
i'm confident that if i would have started with the desktop ubuntu install ltsp would have worked out of the box mostly
11:09
but this way i guess i learn what makes it work out of the box
11:09
so not all bad
11:10
baby steps
11:10
hehe
11:15
<cliebow_>
whizzer, you are getting a gui login screen now on server?
11:15
<whizzer>
i have been getting the gui login from the beginning
11:16
just nothing after i enter credentials
11:16
now i get the message i pasted from .xsession-errors on the screen when i log in
11:18
<cliebow_>
i was thinking..on the server itself..
11:18
<whizzer>
whew
11:18
got it now
11:18
<cliebow_>
what did you do??
11:19
<whizzer>
apt-get install ubuntu-desktop didn't help at all, but was the first thing i did
11:19
apt-get install xserver-xorg got me error messages saying no desktop found
11:19
apt-get install gnome got me logged into a desktop environment
11:21
<cliebow_>
i dont get it...but what the heck do i know..
11:21
<whizzer>
heh
11:22
i think ubuntu-desktop just adds a bunch of x apps that ubuntu likes to bundle with the desktop, but doesn't actually provide a desktop itself
11:23
i think ltsp needs Xorg in the main server environment, which is why adding it got me enough past the login to at least see error messages
11:23
<cliebow_>
that "should" be one-stop shopping..ubuntu-desktop should have pulled in all dependencies
11:23
<whizzer>
then when i added gnome, Xorg finally was able to find a desktop to load
11:23
yah, it wasn't though
11:23
i looked in /usr/bin after each. no xorg after ubuntu-desktop
11:24
<cliebow_>
ogra will want to know..
11:24
<whizzer>
and no session managers
11:24
not that i could find
11:24
now i have a gnome desktop running gimp for kicks, working well it looks like
11:24
<cliebow_>
cool!'
11:24
<whizzer>
where do files get saved when created through the thin client?
11:24
or are they not saved in any permanent fashion?
11:25
<cliebow_>
Ohhh..we forgot to WOOT!!! when it worked
11:25
<whizzer>
__ _____ ___ _____ _ _ _
11:25
\ \ / / _ \ / _ \_ _| | | |
11:25
\ \ /\ / / | | | | | || | | | | |
11:25
\ V V /| |_| | |_| || | |_|_|_|
11:25
\_/\_/ \___/ \___/ |_| (_|_|_)
11:25
11:25
<cliebow_>
WHoa1
11:25
<whizzer>
:)
11:25
i should be kicked for that prolly
11:25
hehe
11:25
<cliebow_>
careful you
11:26
dont want to be on anyones short list..
11:26
<whizzer>
true that
11:27
time for lunch, and thanks for starting me in the right direction
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11:27
<cliebow_>
mistik1 will holler "Ohh my eyes!"
11:27
me too
11:27
be out for a while
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11:57
<maginot>
is there any way to prevent a user to overload the server ?
12:00
<cyberorg>
maginot, ulimit, or preferably kick them hard
12:01
<johnny>
it's not on purpose tho
12:01
firfox itself will do it
12:01
for everybody
12:01
here
12:06
<maginot>
johnny, my clients uses java application, that is what in the most part of time occupies the top of processing ... but there are times when the java_vm process goes high and uses about 80 to 100% of cpu...
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12:07
<maginot>
and I started to fear that some user my have the power to crash the server
12:09
<PerfDave>
That sounds like Java to me ;)
12:09
maginot: You could look at something like auto-nice daemon?
12:09
<maginot>
PerfDave, first time Im heard about it ...
12:10
will take a look ...
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12:10
<maginot>
PerfDave, have you noticed any other issue with java taking the cpu usage to the limit ?
12:12
<PerfDave>
maginot: It's Java, it's what it does. It eats your CPU and memory and then falls over.
12:13
<sutula>
maginot: Any user can consume the CPU by writing a program that does nothing and burns CPU...I don't think this is necessarily a Java-only problem
12:13* sutula has no love of Java, though
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12:18
<maginot>
I will study more about ulimit and implement I think it can help in the cpu usage problem
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12:51
<maginot>
there are any special thing to do to make ulimit work, like recompile kernel or something similar ?? The man page doesnt says to much... Im using inside a file that i created at /etc/initscript rebooted the machine but the ulimit -t 50 isnt working ...
12:52* sutula thinks that's a distro-specific question
12:52
<maginot>
Hmmm
12:52
<johnny>
you want it to work for all users?
12:52
<maginot>
johnny, yep
12:52
<johnny>
well there's autonice daemon and something else
12:53
and is old tho
12:53
there's got to be a more recent solution
12:53
atm.. my systems have a real user at the desktop..
12:53
<maginot>
hmm I just heard the ulimit from here =D
12:53
<johnny>
thinking about getting another machine..
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13:21
<whizzer>
ogra: just as an added note, installing ubuntu-desktop xserver-xorg and gnome on ubuntu server 7.10 still did not get gnome connected up with metacity (although metacity was installed). So the thin client login leads to a gnome desktop but with no window manager running
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19:30
<tonyb2008>
Can I make debian ltsp use XDMCP instead of ssh -X
19:34
<lns>
tonyb2008, i *think* that's what the lts.conf option 'DIRECT_X = true' is for (might have the syntax wrong on that)
19:36
<tonyb2008>
hmm
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21:31
<jammcq>
evening gents
21:38
<jcastro>
hi jammcq
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