IRC chat logs for #ltsp on irc.freenode.net (webchat)


Channel log from 18 October 2017   (all times are UTC)

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04:51
<alkisg>
sbalneav1, vagrantc, what's the last status on libpam-external? This repository is empty: https://github.com/sbalneav/libpam-external
04:52
Do I remember correctly that we're supposed to use libpam-external and libnss-external?
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05:09
<vagrantc>
alkisg: i think the latest development didn't use it, instead using libpam-python and libnss-extrafiles
05:09
<alkisg>
ah
05:10
<vagrantc>
sbalneav had a bit of trouble getting one of the *-external modules working correctly, and so explored re-using more existing code :)
05:11
well, i think extrafiles was a concession, as it lacked some feature
05:11
but good enough to start moving forward ... which i really should do, now that stretch is released
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18:46
<Hyperbyte>
Hi alkisg, you around? :-)
18:50
<alkisg>
Hey Hyperbyte
18:51
<Hyperbyte>
How's it going?
18:51
<alkisg>
Life, fine! LTSP, not so much :D
18:51
How are you?
18:51
<Hyperbyte>
I have an issue with ltsp-update-kernels not honoring my latest changes to /etc/ltsp/update-kernels.conf. Is there some cache somewhere?
18:51
I'm great. Why LTSP not so much?
18:51
<alkisg>
No funding, so no coding, so... you know
18:51
Is that ltsp-pnp?
18:52
<Hyperbyte>
Nah, regular.
18:52
It seems problems went away when I actually installed a new kernel on the client.
18:52
<alkisg>
That's inside the chroot, right?
18:52
It goes like this
18:52
<Hyperbyte>
I guess it's cached somehow on a per-kernel basis?
18:52
<alkisg>
Edit update-kernels.conf in the chroot
18:52
Run /usr/share/ltsp/update-kernels in the chroot OR install a new kernel, which runs it
18:53
This then updates $CHROOT/boot/pxelinux.cfg
18:53
<Hyperbyte>
Ah
18:53
That step I missed. :-) No doubt.
18:53
<alkisg>
Then, ltsp-update-image/kernels outside the chroot, copy that pxelinux.cfg in TFTP
19:02
<Hyperbyte>
Right
19:02
:-)
19:02
Well that helps.
19:02
Hey what's this about no funding?
19:03
No more funding for Greek schools?
19:03
<alkisg>
Yup, since 2015
19:03
<Hyperbyte>
Oh wow
19:04
But you guys are still using LTSP en-masse right?
19:06
<vagrantc>
we've got to fix this...
19:06
:)
19:06* vagrantc just uploaded ltsp-manager 17.08.1 to debian experimental
19:06
<vagrantc>
hopefully it will pass review this time
19:08
<alkisg>
(10:04:02 μμ) Hyperbyte: But you guys are still using LTSP en-masse right? => well, for example most schools are still using Ubuntu 12.04 because noone supports or develops it anymore
19:09
In my small region where I'm maintaining around 80 ltsp installations, I've upgraded them to 16.04, but with local changes, not pushed upstream...
19:09
Let's hope for the best, yeah :)
19:09
People are still trying to convince the ministry of education to support it agian
19:09
*again
19:10
vagrantc: yey! let's hope it has a long life! :)
19:12
<vagrantc>
alkisg: indeed!
19:14
<Hyperbyte>
ltsp-manager?
19:14
<quinox1>
is it foolish of me to be using LTSP on 17.10 in about 2 months ?
19:14
<vagrantc>
!ltsp-manager | echo Hyperbyte
19:14
<ltsp>
Hyperbyte ltsp-manager: LTSP Manager is a GUI tool that makes LTSP maintenance easy. It's the recommended way to install LTSP in common setups. More info: http://wiki.ltsp.org/wiki/Ltsp-manager
19:15
<vagrantc>
quinox1: it's foolish if you don't test it first :)
19:15
<quinox1>
I suppose
19:15quinox1 is now known as quinox
19:15
<vagrantc>
it should be in moderately ok shape, as i think it's synced from debian, but debian's missing a few things too
19:16
<alkisg>
quinox: I don't think anyone checks non-LTS Ubuntu releases, so most likely a few small things will be broken and will need workarounds
19:16* vagrantc hopes to update ltsp in debian this coming week
19:19
<quinox>
I guess it should be entirely doable to make a VM server, and get some clients to boot from it since I already use my own DHCP setup
19:21
<-- happily using LTSP for 7 years now, A+++ would buy again
19:22
it might have been longer, I inherited this network setup
19:23
<Hyperbyte>
I wonder how long I've been using LTSP.
19:24* vagrantc switched ~2006-2007 and was using lessdisks before that
19:24
<vagrantc>
although i haven't had any real-world deployments since 2016 :/
19:24
er, 2015
19:24
<Hyperbyte>
First deployment in October 2008.
19:25
Now I maintain 3 deployments. Two thin and one fat.
19:25
One radio station, one radio & tv station and one touroperator office. :-)
19:30
<quinox>
with hardware getting cheaper and cheaper, what would be a reason to run thin clients?
19:33
<Hyperbyte>
For one it's budget related. Existing thin client setup with Windows/Citrix that broke down and turned out to be illegal software.
19:34
For other one it was budget related, but now we kinda like the cool and quiet office. Plus we've had the setup for almost 10 years now and it works.
19:36
<quinox>
cool
19:36
<vagrantc>
quinox: there's not much reason to run thin clients anymore ... which is why we've been recommending LTSP fat clients lately
19:36
quinox: still has the advantage of centralized management and network booting, but also takes advantage of modern client hardware
19:36
<quinox>
yeah
19:37
but indeed, no need to let existing hardware go to waste
19:37
<vagrantc>
and by modern, i think that means anything produced in the last 8-10 years
19:38
certainly anything 5+ years
19:39* vagrantc originally got involved with thin clients at a computer recycling organization
20:00
<Hyperbyte>
vagrantc, still, now that I have thin clients running smoothly at this specific office, if I'd have budget for new clients, I'd much rather just buy a new server with that. Would still be cheaper as well, but aside from that I like having as little as possible hardware under the desks. Less targets for accidents, failures or cleaning.
20:01* alkisg doesn't think fat clients have more hardware than thin clients :)
20:02
<alkisg>
Also, it's possible that wayland won't work very well with thin clients, so fat there has its benefits
20:02
<vagrantc>
Hyperbyte: same amount of hardware
20:02
<Hyperbyte>
Clients I have currently won't support all our software fat.
20:02
<alkisg>
And, many software stacks don't care about remote Xorg anymore, eg. gl, compositing, desktop environments...
20:02
<Hyperbyte>
1.5ghz / 1gb ram. It's not enough. So I'd have to buy new ones.
20:03
<alkisg>
Yeah, talking about the next purchase
20:03
My advice to schools is, use thin clients when you have them, but never buy new thin client hardware
20:03
<vagrantc>
Hyperbyte: basically, the technology that makes thin clients work is being deprecated, partly by accident, and partly by intention
20:04
<Hyperbyte>
alkisg, that I agree with. These are ~8 year old clients still running fine. If I would need to replace them, I might go different route.
20:04
vagrantc, yeah, I know. But still... it ain't broken yet. :-)
20:04
<vagrantc>
indeed
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